I worry about the self-esteem of the men of this country

[WindRavenX]

Everyone can agree that there is a serious crisis for the self-esteem and body image of America's women and young girls; we are told by society to be as small and slim as possible and to dress in ways that objectify us as mere sex dolls for males.
But not a lot of time is given to this same problem for men. I see non-stop ads for Enzyte/Viagra/ Cilaris/Levitra and I cannot help but think this must be tremendously damaging to male self-esteem. IMO, as a woman, it is sending a clear message to men that the only way you can be a true man is if you have a large penis- is this not the same way that females are objectified? They are reduced to a mere "thing" that is desired. As a feminist, I find this to be extremely troubling. I want both sexes to appreciate their bodies.

[Dookus]

1. well

Enzyte/Viagra/Cilaris/Levitra aren't penis-growing drugs. They're for erectile dysfunction.

[WindRavenX]

4. Oh I know that, but the point is this:

It still makes men insecure about their penis. Look, the medicine for erectile dysfunction does some good, I'm not denying that, but overall, there is just such tremendous pressure on men to have the perfect sense of "maleness" and these medicines really seem to be saying to men "if you have problems down there, no woman will want you again".
Enzyte really is marketed to "enhance" penis size, whether or not it actaully is MADE for that is missing the point. Men are made to feel poorly about their penis, and that is very troubling to me.

[JVS]

33. I thought Enzyte was for "Male enhancement"

You sure it's for ED?

[Colin Ex]

2. Men have been considered "things" long before Viagra came around. nt

[WindRavenX]

5. of course they have

But have you NOT noticed the number of ads for said products lately? It's ridiculous.

[izzie]

26. You sound young so a little story

About 10 years ago I lived in Saudi and not in a compound but more or less in their society. All the western men thought the Saudi women were very sexy and they were covered from head to foot. I would ask why and they said it was their eyes, and the wonder of what was under the robes.I found that very interesting because the Western women thought many of the Saudi we were sexy because they were so handsome and cover also. The men were very good looking and so were a lot of the women, even if you did not see their bodies.In our society it is hard to get away from raw sex even if it does not mean much in the low term. Hard to get that to people as they are forever trying to change what they look like, men as well as women. Men seem to have it a little better because money and power also helps them.

[DavidDvorkin]

3. Large and rock hard

Yes, it's exactly the same kind of damaging thing that's done to women.

I don't think there's any kind of sinister plot involved. Rather, corporate America knows what buttons to push for both men and women, how to get both in their shaky self-esteem, in order to sell product.

[Marvelous_Smarty]

9. Well,

I ride 170 mph motorcycles, drive a Hummer, have participated in martial arts for over 20 years, was a Ranger in the Army, buffed up nicely in prison (74 months), am an accomplished archer and a proud bearer of an average (on a good day) sized penis.

No self esteem problems here regarding my manliness.

[NuttyFluffers]

15. i can needlepoint.

touche'

[wickerwoman]

31. Someone pointed this out on another thread, I think.

(One of the Schwartzenegger girlie man ones)

You might want to take stock of the fact that your definition of manliness seems to be tied entirely to physical prowess, risk taking and penis size.

I think the point of this thread is that there is a lot more to being a man than that, but those are the only things we see TV, films and magazines praising.

[ChocolateSaltyBalls]

6. My feeling is that the sudden proliferation of...........

Enzyte, Viagra, Cilaris, etc. is directly correlated to the number of aging male baby boomers who because of normal physiology simply cannot 'get it up' like they used to.

It just seems to be human nature to want to stay young (and hard) forever.

[WindRavenX]

8. Perhaps

I dunno, even then, I just see a rise in male insecurity and it bothers me :dunno:

[Radical Activist]

17. you "see a rise" in male insecurity

hehe
don't mind me, i'm just having a junior high moment.

[Donkeyboy75]

7. Not me!

I have a huuuuuge penis and huuuuuge pecs! I'm the ideal man! I also have straight pearly white teeth.

:silly:

[LSU_Subversive]

10. Ever read Stiffed, by Susan Faludi?

It's an interesting exploration of masculinity today. I don't agree with everything and I certainly feel that women are subjected to much more pressure to be "perfect," but informative nonetheless.

[Columbia]

12. I got my copy of Stiffed signed by her

:evilgrin:

[LSU_Subversive]

16. I am soooo jealous. But happy for you too. If not me then who else?

[Columbia]

18. My fiancee has her copy of Backlash autographed too

:)

[LSU_Subversive]

21. Okay, if you insist I'm happy for her too :)

[Kanary]

11. Men are quite capable of taking care of themselves

[Fleshdancer]

13. The marketing of these drugs sure have changed over the years

Remember when Viagra first came out? It was advertised as an important drug to help certain men with the tragic symptoms of erectile dysfunction. I remember everything being so serious. Now all these drugs are advertised as giving all men a certain level of sexual confidence. Ad agencies are even using women now to talk about how much better the sex is after the husband started taking the drugs.

I read somewhere several months ago that the drug maker that produces Viagra will be giving away free samples.

sad really.

[WindRavenX]

14. That was my point

It is sad.

[Autobot77]

19. Great Post

This is kinda a dumb question WindRaven, but do most feminists you know feel the same way? Just curious. I'm going to bookmark this post so I can email it to the repukes who rant and rave about feminazis who are out to get men.

[WindRavenX]

20. Yes

Nearly all of my feminist friends do not hate men- in fact, we love you guys (most of the time).
We want equality for all people regardless of gender- we do not want to be "superior" to men nor do we sit around commenting on how much men suck. And that is precisely why we are concerned with how men are being told how to behave in order to be considered "men". Look at the Arnold S. comments- calling the Democratic legislatures "girly men". That's the kind of stuff that pisses us off.

[LSU_Subversive]

22. I, too, think most feminists feel this way

I can't say this enough: I love men. I love women too. Men sure as hell piss me off a lot, but so do women, so what the hell. Doesn't mean that I'm not a feminist though.

[WindRavenX]

23. trust me, nothing gets me more riled up than to hear this:

"What? You LIKE men? WHAT WHAT WHAT???"
I even had this shocker:
"You have a boyfriend? But...you're a feminist!"
Yeah. I like men. And sex. Apparently, that means I can't be a feminist :eyes:

[Fleshdancer]

35. Definitely!

Personally, I am very concerned with how our society treats and portrays the American male all the way from birth to adulthood.

I don't understand our cultural affection towards circumcisions of our male babies.

I don't understand why we drug such a huge number of active boys with Ritalin. (disclaimer: I know there are serious cases of ADHD where drugs are necessary, but America is going overboard IMO)

I don't like the conflicting messages we send teenagers (this goes for both genders) about sexuality and for young men - masculinity.

I don't like the ridiculous TV sitcoms that feature a brain dead idiot husband and a wife who is forced to take care of everything.

This thread does a great job of spelling out the problems with the ridiculous penis pills...or as my friend calls them: peniscillin (ha!)

I don't understand why we market young female entertainers as sex objects then get mad at older men for wanting to have sex with these young women.

I'm sure there's more to add to this list, but you get the idea.

[jpgray]

24. Don't--I'm enough of a self-righteous egotist as it is (nt)

[nickgutierrez]

25. Good point

I think you're right when you point out that the struggle for perfection is not only aimed towards the females. The males have a different 'beauty' standard, but it works much the same.

Women have beauty magazines, men have body building magazines.

It is as important for a man to have a giant, functional penis as it is for a woman to have a nice set of breasts.

I've always been a small, skinny guy, without much physical strength, and it is an easy negative for people to point out. The insinuation that I'm somehow 'less of a man' because I'm not 7 feet tall and 300 pounds of solid muscle is frustrating, to say the least.

[jukes]

27. most of those ads

are bait. they want you to "opt out" to verify your email addy, then sell it to other scammers.

a bigger blow to male (& female) self esteem in this country is H'wood's focus on personal beauty for actors. british actors aren't nearly so restricted by perfexion. none of us real people can afford to have gourmet health meals prepared by nutritionist chefs, spend 6 hrs a day w/ a personal trainer, or all the cosmetic surgery.

comparing ourselves to these plastic icons is our personal tragedy.

[dawg]

28. Thanks for the concern, WindRavenX.

You know, most women are so bitter for the way most men objectify them that they are not willing to have sympathy for the "other side". This post shows that you are very empathetic.

I mostly worry about the younger guys and the way this affects them. A young inexperienced guy, even one who is average-sized or larger, can really get stressed out over this. IMO, its not so much the Viagra, Cialis, etc. as it is the Enzyte and the stuff they try to sell in the back of Rolling Stone. Also, people joke around about things like this too much. I can still remember being a teenager and wondering how I stacked up and whether or not I could please a woman. It can be pretty intimidating.

[truthspeaker]

29. How about all the portrayals of men who can't operate a washing machine

or cook a simple grilled-cheese sandwich. In 99% of advertising, and quite a lot of sitcoms and other pop culture, men are ill-mannered sex-crazed doofuses who only care about boobs, beer, and sports.

When's the last time you saw a commercial where the father knows what kind of cough medicine to give to his sick kid or where the father cleans the kitchen floor?

It actually bothers me quite bit.

[GOPisEvil]

30. An excellent point!

There are plenty of men, myself included, who know quite a lot about domestic duties. Quite simply, if I don't do these things, they won't get done.

[SpaceCatMeetsMars]

32. I always wonder too why they portray people in such obnoxious ways.

You are right, the men are portrayed as unbelievably stupid and childish and the women are these smug, prissy "mom" characters. Why do such characters appeal to people?

[Tiberius]

36. This is definitely the case

It's like we've decided that it's funny to make fun of men now, thinking, "hey, they're the beneficiaries of a partriarchal society and therefore an easy target".

The ads are the worst. As a football fan the endless Coors Light commercials drive me bananas. It's like it's not even considered a possibility that you could be a sports fan and not be an "ill-mannered sex-crazed doofus".

[JVS]

34. I've always held that these products, even if they work, won't make...

unhappy men happy.

If you are unhappy with your marriage, turning your member into a raging monster isn't going to make up for the fact that you no longer love your wife.

[mongo]

37. There's so many worse examples of men in our society.

TV portraying men as incompetent boobs, for example.

For the 40 and over crowd, these drugs are a miracle. It is like being 16 again. When your sexual prowess peaked at 18, and your spouse's is peaking now, it is a great thing.

Viagra is the greatest recreational drug of the 20th century.

And the self-esteem part comes into play not from being able to walk around the block with a huge boner, but by being able to please and satisfy our wives/girlfriends.

I have a store full of sex toys, and most of them are for use on women. Mostly, they are bought by men. I think most women do not realize that most men just want to make women happy.