WHAT IS IT with you people and CATS!?!

[Nevernose]

Yeah, I know, total flame-bait. But I've been asking myself this question for months. What the hell is it with the Lounge's obsession with cats? It's not natural, and I'm beginning to think it's not healthy.

[Liberal Veteran]

1. I BEG YOUR PARDON??????

:)

[Nevernose]

2. See? See what I mean?

I ask one little question and people start taking offense. Who, in their right minds, would own SIX cats? What, two or three cats shitting behind your couch and sleeping on your face isn't enough?

[Liberal Veteran]

5. Well let me see if I can explain.....

I originally arrived here with 2 cats. Mariko and Gizmo.

I got Mariko when I was 21. I am now 39.

Gizmo died last year.

When I got to this town 12 years ago, this poor skinny cat named Xantha was living in a dumpster in the store I worked at.

I adopted her.

My boyfriend brought Tonka home after he caught him wandering the streets in down town as a kitten.

Then Sybil was a stray that decided to wander into the yard and stay.

After Gizmo died, a friend at work asked if anyone could take in a cat, and that's how I got Logan.

Then two weeks ago I went to the shelter and picked up Mischief after it was apparent he would get put to sleep soon.

[iconoclastic cat]

9. I think Tonka is my personal favorite.

I bet he's a big mushball.

[jukes]

25. tonka

is a *great* cat name!

[yardwork]

49. How does Mariko feel about all this?

I don't currently live with any cats because my husband has these tedious allergies, but I grew up sharing my home with dozens of them, almost all strays, and I remember that older cats generally hate sharing the house with newcomers.

Also, I really like cats and I think people who have a problem with cats need to be watched carefully, even if they do have cool photos of musicians talking to Bill Clinton on their sig lines....

[ldf]

103. you are a wonderful person

seriously.

:loveya:

:hug:

[iconoclastic cat]

8. If your cats go outside of the litter box, there is a serious problem.

And the problem is usually the owner. I have five cats, all of which were wild when we caught them, and they have never urinated or defacated outside of their litter boxes.

As for the sleeping on the face part, yes, I could do without that.

[Nevernose]

13. I am a responsible pet owner.

I am a responsible pet owner, for the record. i kept the litter-box clean, and the other cats always went in the litter box. It is my firm belief that some cats just enjoy shitting where they're not supposed to.

I had one cat as a child, for instance, that shat in people's shoes or other personal possessions whenever it was mad at us. This particualr cat, named Grendel Squirrelbane, is the source of my belief that cats are at least as intelligent as humans are, though in their own way. They're also out to get us.

Haven't owned a cat in five, six years.

[iconoclastic cat]

22. Wow, that does sound vindictive.

You know, some cats can develop OCD. Maybe Grendel was ill.

[jukes]

32. sounds like

there's a great big hole in your life, then.

[Rhiannon12866]

92. I read an article in my ASPCA newsletter that has stuck with me

It was called "litter box as letterbox." The gist of it was, that if your kitty stops going in the box or exhibiting similar problems, then kitty is trying to give you some sort of message that you have to figure out. Cats cannot speak, so this is their only way of delivering a message. All animals are very special. I would suggest that perhaps you are really a dog person, but, having had many of both, I don't think so. Dogs are much more demanding than cats and demand much more attention and care. Having had dogs all my life, when I adopted two cats, I couldn't believe how much easier they were to care for. One of them was my perfect Rhiannon, love of my life.
:loveya:

[Flaxbee]

106. Lindakitty, who's been with us for about 3-1/2 years

-- she's probably 12 or 13, abandoned, no doubt, because of the tumor in her ear that produces nasty looking "ear boogers" -- REFUSES to poop in the box once it's been pooped in once. No matter how scrupulously I scoop the box, put down kitty-baking-soda-stink remover, remove pee-clumps, etc., she WILL NOT POOP IN THE BOX after she's gone in it once. Goes right next to it, though, on the tile. Doesn't bother me in the least, the other cats use the box (I change litter every 1-2 weeks, most of the time the kids go outside), but Lindakitty is just exceedingly fastidious. It's funny. I dearly love all my kitties.

[Rhiannon12866]

117. That's what I eventually found out was wrong with my Rhiannon,

a tumor in her ear that was inoperable. It took it awhile for it to grow large enough for her vet to see it. He had thought that her symptoms may have likely been caused by a particularly virulent ear infection. He had consulted with a neurologist and had a treatment plan in place the day he discovered the tumor. My Rhiannon was only seven.;(

My Catlin, who I lost in February, at age 13 or 14, also had a tumor in her ear. The growth was there when I rescued her, but was successfully cauterized. But then, it eventually started to grow and became malignant. What is it with these ear tumors?! I asked my vet what caused Rhiannon's and he said, in his experience, most likely a genetic predisposition. I could provide no clue, since all of my kitties were rescue.:shrug:

You deserve so much credit for rescuing these abandoned "valuable little lives," as my friend in animal rescue calls them. So many perfect kitties are hard to place. You take the imperfect ones and love them for who they are.:toast:

[ldf]

104. well, it's obvious it didn't like the name

you saddled it with.

:-)

[Eurobabe]

121. what about a young male cat who urinates outside box?

my mom's cat, he's 4, has pissed everywhere around her house. Welly is one of two males - the older cat is very territorial (he's 10). They tried to put the younger cat on a tranquilizer, but it made no difference. Any suggestions? She has tried EVERYTHING...

[wildeyed]

124. Neutered?

Un-neutered cats (and dogs) mark territory by pissing all over the place.

[Rhiannon12866]

125. Have you tried Feliway?

It's a synthetic cat facial pheromone that calms cats in stressful situations. That's the reason that I got it for my cat, a terrified stray that it took me ages to bring in from outside, but its primary use is to eliminate urine spraying. You just spray it on surfaces within the cat's territory. I never detected it, myself. They include instructions and the schedule you should follow. It's supposed to be 90-some percent effective, but I have never tried it for this. This is also much safer and better for the cat than narcotics. You don't have to send for it. I got mine at PetsMart. Good luck!:hi:

http://www.feliway.com/

[RoyGBiv]

58. Never had that problem...

Cats can be trained not to "sleep on your face," if, in fact, it becomes such a problem you need to do so. It's just a security issue with them.

As for using something other than the litter box for their toilet, I've never had that problem either. Keep it clean, and they'd much rather use a litter box than some other hidden place. Health problems (including mental problems) can cause erratic behavior, but this is true of all animals. Hell, I know a human who refuses to use an indoor toilet. Weird individual. Anyway, in all, I've had far greater problems with dogs and toilet training.

[BlueJazz]

107. Ha! I have scientific proof that people who like cats....

...are not as smart as the folk who don't like Cats.

[CatWoman]

3. le pant...................le mew......................le meow.............

[amerikat]

4. The cats don't like it when you talk that way .

;)

[lachattefolle]

Some People Love Cats

I personally am the proud mama of five cats and two dogs. The dogs sleep in bed with me and my husband. They weigh 50 lbs each. Before we got them, the cats slept with us. Believe me, the cats smell better. I can't speak for other cat owners, but all of my cats, as well as the dogs, were adopted from the animal control shelter because some irresponsible person set them loose and they were picked up as strays. I would love to only have a few pets, but without those of us who love animals, what chance do these pound critters have otherwise?
For the cat lovers out there, please cross your fingers for my baby Billy. He is a tawny kitty who is currently in the hospital for pneumonia. I don't know where he got it from since the other four cats are fine, and he doesn't have FIV, but he does indeed have pneumonia as the xray showed. The vet says he is doing better and may be able to come home tomorrow.
I could never just put him to sleep while there was a chance of saving his precious life.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

14. I'll say prayers for Billy

:hug:

[lachattefolle]

15. Thanks. From Your Lips to God's Ear

[jukes]

31. lachattefolle

love your nick. quite definitive. truly hope billy gets better soon.

:hi:

[lachattefolle]

34. Thanks, juke. I think youth is on his side-he's only 12 months!

[Cybergata]

37. Hang in there with him.

All of us on DU will send him our love. I feel so sad thinking about the the poor guy. I hope he comes through.

:hippie:

[lachattefolle]

67. Thanks, Cybergata, yesterday after looking at his xrays it

looked pretty grim, but the vet seems optimistic today. It's amazing and humbling to observe the grace and dignity with which animals conduct themselves when they are ill. No moaning and crying, just stoicism. And the love and loyalty they give you, cats too, not just dogs, for treating them with common decency. I have to admit my heart belongs more to animals than to people!

[Rhiannon12866]

47. Welcome to DU, lachattefolle!

You are among kindred spirits. There has to be a special place in heaven for people like you and jukes, for saving and caring for these valuable little lives.O8)

I have had seven dogs and three cats in my life and they also all have heart-breaking stories. BTW, both my dogs sleep with me, as well, as did my remarkable cat, Rhiannon. Yesterday I was awakened by that horrible noise that dogs make when they are about to whoops and I grabbed my little guy and ran for the bathroom. We didn't make it and it ended up on me. What a wonderful way to start the day.:puke:

I will keep Billy in my thoughts. I have been there so many times, so know exactly what you are feeling. Keep us posted.:hug:

on edit:
Meneken


Sara


Catlin


Rhiannon

[lachattefolle]

69. Love your pics!

Looks like there's a special place in heaven for you too!O8)

[Rhiannon12866]

91. Thank you. My problem is that I cannot save animals, I keep them

I have friends in animal rescue who save and place animals. I could never do that. I would just be worried to death about the quality of their care. They are, as well, but I couldn't live with the worry. As I have told jukes, if you are on DU long enough, you will probably hear the stories of all my guys. I have had too many and feel as if I am the Typhoid Mary of pets. My vets tell me that this is because I take older animals that may not have had the best of care. But that doesn't help me. I feel guilt and miss them terribly when I lose them, just the same. One more. You must meet the dog of my life, my Barney. I adopted him at age 10 or 11 and lost him just over a year ago, at around 18. I miss him everyday. Thanks for the kind words and welcome to DU.:-)

[lachattefolle]

108. I can't volunteer at the animal control shelter cuz

I know I would adopt more animals and I already have seven. My husband is still on active duty and we may move again. He loves animals but says it's already going to be difficult to transport seven. Obviously if he gets assigned overseas I am staying here in Arizona. He has been a soldier for 27 years and I thought we were retiring here, but now he talks of staying longer. He is a good and honorable man, as are most soldiers. He is also an agnostic and a liberal Democrat, even though Bush I says people like him can't be patriots and full citizens. There is an article on the web somewhere re what Bush said in an interview with an atheist reporter. I think how you treat animals speaks more about your heart and soul than what falls out of your mouth. Latest I heard was Bush II tortured frogs as a child and Frist *adopted* cats and then experimented on them. Horrible, hideous people in charge of this country.
Barney looks very beautiful in the picture. He's probably running around doggie heaven right now chasing a cat who he'll never catch :)

I am waiting for the vet to call back this morning re Billy.

[Cybergata]

116. I miss Socks, the first Cat

There was so much much wrong about dear Mr. Clinton, but I will always love the man. When I saw photos of Socks sitting on his shoulders, I knew I could use the cat angle while politicking for him.

I went to every cat chat room, BBS, etc I could find, and passed on photos and stories of Socks during Mr. Clinton's first run for office. I shared these with cat lovers I know. People will vote for worse reasons than voting for someone because a cat owns them.

I really miss having a photogenic, show off cat in the White House. It was pretty humorous how the reporerts spent so much time interested in Socks. He did make great press though. Even better photos.

:hippie:

[Rhiannon12866]

118. I feel the same way that you do. The lady in animal rescue who

saved Barney's life told me where the commercial kennel, aka puppy mill, that he came from was located. I couldn't go there because I knew that I would be featured on the news, driving to the Canadian border with 40 cocker spaniels in my backseat.

I admire you for your attitude. I adopted Barney after seeing him on the weekly pet segment of the Albany, NY, ABC affiliate. The chief meteorologist on this channel is a real animal lover and now has a pet up for adoption on twice as week. I cringe when he says a family couldn't keep an animal because they had "moved." Sorry, if I cannot take my pets, I'm not going anywhere, just like you. Home is where your family is and my little guys are family to me.

Have you ever seen the poem, "The Rainbow Bridge?" I was given it by Barney's vet's office when I lost him and also was sent this and a poem that he wrote himself, on the subject of losing pets, by the animal-loving meteorologist, who I kept in touch with, and who always remembered Barney. It says that our pets will be waiting for us to cross this bridge and meet us there and will be well again. It's a real tear-jerker, and I am an agnostic like your husband, but I'd really like to believe this.

As for Bush*, he only uses pets for photo ops. You must have seen the numerous posts on how his dog, unfortunately also named Barney, just runs away from him. He actually dropped the dog on camera!

Let us know how Billy makes out. He will be in my thoughts.:hug:

[Kathy in Cambridge]

6. Have you ever had cats?

then you would understand.

[Nevernose]

10. Yeah, I've owned cats

Ally, my cat from Jr. High through College, was the best friend I've ever had. She was also a professional killer. When we lived in the country, she took down an owl. That great horned owl picked the wrong soft and cuddly creature to eat, and I've often thought that our move to the city contributed to her deterioration. Without wanting to sound too morbid, I've often had the thought that of all the women I've known -- with the possible exception of my daughter -- she's the only woman who ever TRULY loved me. God, do I miss that cat.

That does not change the fact, however, that you people are obsessive weirdos. :evilgrin:

[CatWoman]

11. neener, neener

:P

[Cybergata]

45. Well, you could always ignore us,

but something tells me you secretly want to join us! ;-)

I have five cats because three of them simply moved in with me, and my other two came with the husband. I always found cats fascinating creatures, but cat social dynamics has added a whole dimension to my fascination. It is nice to find these beautiful creatures rolled up in a ball in the middle of my clothing, on the couch, etc. They are nice to have around.
:hippie:

[Nevernose]

51. It's like the Brady Bunch, but with cats

With these little monsters rolling around on your clothes and furniture, how much do you spend on lint brushes in a year? :evilgrin:

[Cybergata]

65. I decided along time ago....

that I would never be able to get all the cat hair off me, so I just live with it. I do try, every morning before I go to work, to get as much of it off as possible with a roller brush. I have ones I picked up at Costco that seem to last forever, and do a great job.

:hippie: "meow"

[Nevernose]

74. LOL

When I still owned cats, I finally just resorted to duct tape. :)

Ever see Mike Moore's movie The Big One? There's a good scene in it where Nike won't come to Flint, but eventually a lint brush manufacturer moves into town and hires a whole 15 people out of 100,000 unemployed.

[Cybergata]

99. I've been a fan of Michael Moore for a long time

15 people isn't many people, but at least those 15 had jobs.

I read Ebert's review about Roger and Me, and immediately went to the theater to see it. I couldn't believe that such a subversive movie was in a regular movie theater and not the local art theater. I've made sure since, to see and read everything Michael Moore creates.

Did you catch the TV Nations? They were way too subversive for ABC, and amazingly enough FOX showed them for one summer season.
I think you need to get yourself a cat. It sounds like you had a great experience in your youth with them. Maybe, just maybe, your question about "What's Up With..." has to do with an inner longing for another cat. Now, done fling old duct tape at me....just think about it.

:hippie:

I'm not awake....excuse my grammar!

[ornotna]

7. You mean you don't know yet...

It's the other white meat. And it's Atkins friendly. :evilgrin:

[jukes]

43. notawol

how terribly droll! i've read that bumper sticker, too. usu on hand-painted camo p/up trux w/ an ax handle in the rack in the rear window, & a "stars&bars" flag decal.

[ornotna]

62. A little humor never hurts

even if it is odd. I don't see too many pick up trucks with the Stars and Bars decals.


Stars and Bars- the first confederate flag




Oh btw, these are my cats. I have no idea what they taste like.









Edit to show the cats

[Name removed]

77. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ornotna]

79. Of course :)

Here lets smoke a peace....









Ha! kidding again. :hi:

[TrogL]

84. How the hell did a cat thread get modded?

Nevermind, I dont' wanna know.

[Nevernose]

86. ROFLMAO

Peple LOVE their cats. I will NEVER question them about it again. I'm starting to regret ever starting this thread.

[Cybergata]

114. Don't regret it

I've enjoyed reading most of the posts. An aficionado of anything, can get heated up when questioned about what they love. I just saw your original post as something to stimulate discussion. AND it sure did. ;-)

:hippie:

[PartyPooper]

12. Cats. Hmmm. Wouldn't that make a terrific musical?

I wonder if anyone has ever thought of it.

:think:

[Nevernose]

16. TS Elliot was a pretentious hack

Hell, the man barely even know how to rhyme, a skill which he forgot as he got paid more and more for crap. If it weren't for "April is the cruelest month" and a couple of other good one liners, he'd be long forgotten.

[jukes]

40. T.S.E.

didn't even write any of the good stuff, except "prufrock". rhyming is WAY over rated, by the way. originally, poetry was alliterative, not rhyming.

after he had his muse confined, he became laureate and a complete toady hack.

there's a lot more to ash wednesday than "april...", just as there is more to poetry than "moon, tune, june"

metaphor, allusion, simile, symbolism, meter; all mean much more than being able to end each line w/ the same syllable.


i'm not offended by your misunderstanding of cats (& you don't, even though you've been around some) but take great offense @ your sophomoric over-simplification of poetry.

[Nevernose]

50. I don't appreciate most blank verse, it's true.

I actually used to sppreciate it when I was younger. Then I attempted actually writing some poetry that rhymed. What those old Romantics were doing sure as hell wasn't easy, lemme tell ya, though they all managed to contain "metaphor, allusion, simile, symbolism, meter" as well as rhyme. Rhyme takes a heck of a lot more skill than balnk verse does.

That having been said, I still enjoy the Beat poets. Ginsberg is the man -- he had an intersting way of putting words together (and I'm not just talking about his game that has become a staple of refrigorators and grad-student chalkboards).

I am well aware of the fact that poetry was origanlly alliterative, as "Beowulf" is my "desert island" book.

I still don't understand the weird obsession with cats, though.

[jukes]

61. my first publication

when *i* was a sophomore dealt with the communion references in the "gifstol" scene of the poem; a mere note length article. i did note your reference to grendel in a previous post.

ginsberg was adequate, as was warhol, but predominately unoriginal. "blank" verse, by the way, encompasses more than neglecting rhyme, it also avoids comprehensive meter. i find it effete, mere clumsy prose.

elliot (for the sake of clarity, although it's doubtful he penned the bulk of the work attributed to him) did not write in blank verse; the more scholarly term for that type of poetry is "free verse."

and i still don't understand *YOUR* weird obsession w/ my personal passion. i'm a retired cop. rescuing feral cats, dumped by unfeeling humans & allowed to breed in a feral state that we have bred their instincts away from, keeps me occupied & sane.

BTW, terms such as "weird" are personally insulting. i doubt you'd deign to use it in my presence, but you're safely ensconced behind a monitor, neh?

[Nevernose]

64. I apologize for offending you.

I apologize, sincerely, for offending you. It was never my intention to offend anyone, especially someone who rescues cats from the street or shelters, which all bear a horrible resemblance to Dachau.

The original post was meant entirely as a lighthearted ribbing of the numerous cat lovers on DU. I do not now, nor have I ever, bear animosity towards felines of any sort.

I will post this as well to the public Lounge and beg forgiveness there.

[lachattefolle]

73. One thing we all can do: click on animalrescuesite.com

every day. One click provides food to a rescued animal. It's a quick, free thing to do for the animals every day. Please visit www.animalrescuesite.com

[jukes]

78. gratefully accepted

i enjoy a healthy flame war as well as the next, but please be more circumspect in your use of trigger words. lets let it go, maybe in some other thread we'll find a topic we agree on, & you can count on me catching your back.

we're cool.

[Nevernose]

87. Right on (n/t)

n/t

[TrogL]

54. Have you actually studied...

The Wasteland?
The Hollow Men?

I mean actually studied - done your research?

The poems need an owner's manual.

[HuckleB]

101. Now, you've gone too far!

:evilfrown:

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

119. Cats...Theatre for people who know NOTHING about theatre

I have yet to work with anyone who has liked Cats (or at least found a redeeming quality to the show). It always makes me wonder what it was like to actually work on that show.

[GHOSTDANCER]

17. Don't make the Kittys MAD!!!!!!

<>

[Nevernose]

19. Cat posts -- guaranteed to bring out the lurkers

Welome to DU! :hi:

[jukes]

46. hi, GHOSTDANCER

welvcome to the catacombs!

:hi:

[Nevernose]

53. PUNS? Must we resort to PUNS?

Aren't cats bad enough!?!
:)

[jukes]

63. puns?

i used a colorful metaphor, w/ historic allusion to the early xians, perhaps the original "underground".

a pun is the misuse of a word that sounds like another. but w/different meaning. johnson, and his sycophant boswell, detested puns, but they were 16th century pedantic pricks. i have no objection to them, but do object to mislabeling. again, sophomoric.

[Nevernose]

71. It's still a pun, even though it's also a clever metaphor.

OED:
a. The use of a word in such a way as to suggest two or more meanings or different associations, or the use of two or more words of the same or nearly the same sound with different meanings, so as to produce a humorous effect; a play on words.

CATacomb? Clearly "a play on words," whatever trophic values it may hold. Were you three centuries dead, I could base an enitre dissertaion on whether or not you intended a pun or a combination pun/metaphor.

[TrogL]

18. Ctash

[NightTrain]

20. Cats are good people, dammit!

For that matter, dogs are too.

[Bat Boy]

21. It's not just cats....

For some reason you've managed to piss off my badger.



Apparently he's fond of cats too.

[iconoclastic cat]

24. One of those things lunged at my neighbor as he worked in his garden!

It took a 4X4 and a shotgun to kill it! They scare me.

[Bat Boy]

27. He did WHAT?

And you wonder why the badger/human wars rage on. We take one of theirs, they take one of ours...

[iconoclastic cat]

42. Okay, I was in the pool, and my neighbor was working in his garden.

I was just floating along, starting at the sky, when I heard him screaming. I slipped out of the tube and swam to the side of the pool. He was yelling curses and swinging a 4X4 down onto something on the ground in his patch of beans. I couldn't see what he was hitting, so I climbed onto the edge of the pool and jumped to the ground. At this point, my neighbor waddled quickly into his shed, rummaged around, and came back out with a large, single-barreled shotgun. He stomped up to his garden, took aim, and fired down into the beans. I ran across the yard to see what had happened, and there was this huge, bloody badger, twitching in the dirt. My neighbor said, "Son of a bitch!" and stormed back into his shed. I ran back to my house and told my parents what happened. They did not seem surprised.

[NJCher]

23. big hug to lachattefolle

and liberal_veteran for adopting Mischief.

{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{HUG}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}


Cher

[lachattefolle]

36. Thanks, NJCher. I'm sure all the positive thoughts and

prayers will have Billy up and running in no time.

[TrogL]

26. It may have to do with introverts and extroverts

Dogs are extroverts. They live for socialization. "Wanna go out" puts them into ecstasy.

Cats are introverts. They live for the quiet life. "Wanna go out" - "fuck you".

Conservative extroverts hate to think. They will do anything to avoid thinking. They socialize to avoid thinking. Their socialization often consists of "parent"-style "isn't it awful" strokes.

Liberals tend to think about things, hence tend towards introversion, hence tend towards cats.

Meow

[Nevernose]

29. I own goldfish

In the last couple of years I've become allergic to both cats AND dogs. I own goldfish now, and am mad at the world that I can't own real pets. Allegra costs too much.

Though now that you mention it, my conservative friends (I have two, and they're married to each other), are exclusively dog-owners. Mayber there IS something in the psyche of a dog -- which will do anything for someone who speaks nicely to it on occasion -- indicating a tendency towards conservatism.

No, I wasn't questioning the inherent merits of cats, or cats versus dogs, but rather the obsession people here have with their cats.

[yardwork]

55. See, there it is.

....and am mad at the world that I can't own real pets. Allegra costs too much.

You hate us for our freedoms!

Except mine. I can't live with cats or dogs either. We have gerbils, one hamster, and two birds. None of them are as good as a cat or a dog.

[jukes]

68. i only observe one obsessive in this thread

and you're really not very good @ it. all you seem capable of is a sad pseudo-intellectuality, based on a dismal education, & tossing about inappropriate invectives that you can't seem to back up.

love and obsession are not the same. i love my cats (my own allergies notwithstanding). i'm not obsessed w/ them & have many other interests. interests that i have educated myself in, since i'm not a dilettante or phony.

i suppose some must live w/in their limitations, but pretense is hollow & rude.

[jukes]

28. Arg

*NEVER* claimed to be healthy. if you can't dig cats, it's your loss.

cats are liberals. no offense to dog-lovers, i have 4, but any1 can handle a dog, they're pack animals, looking for an alpha. if you can't dom a dog, you're a wuss.

cats, however, are individuals i've known & loved more than i can safely mention; never met any two alike. if you gain a cat's trust & affection, you've accomplished something.

bonding w/ a feral is an absolute achievement.


BTW, human's are pack animals. it's not natural to be so attached? it isn't natural for humans to be liberal.

rise above those scripted limitations, myman.

[Nevernose]

33. Humans are only pack animals in a very technical sense

We have individualistic elements of high-end predators such as big cats, but also show symptoms of being pack animals, such as wolves (even liberals).

Liberals can be said to show part of a herd-mentality as well (though it's an admittedly insulting term), in that we are concerned with the good of the whole as well as being concerned with the good of the immediate self. Conservatives sure as hell ain't going to circle up and work as a whole to fend off the predators.

My issue isn't with cats, it's with the weird O/C disorder I see accociated with them.

[jukes]

52. humans are primates

primates are pack animals. all primates live in hierarchal tribes, dominated by an alpha male.

liberals eschew the pack, & think for themselves. "herd-mentality does *not* refer to a social consciousness, all herds will sacrifice a weak individual for the benefit of the herd. conservatives will appsitively circle up the wagons; that's what "plausible deniability" is all about.

*MY* issue is w/ judgmental people who think others should emulate their lifestyle.

you know. you can just ignore us & huddle w/ your own kind.


BTW, what was your major in (sic) College? sure wasn't literature, nor anthropology or sociology. BA in business, perhaps?

[yardwork]

56. Actually, I think some primates live in female-dominated tribes.

As humans may have done in more enlightened times. Grin.

[jukes]

70. occasionally, yes

the exception that qualifies the rule.

[Piltdown13]

76. Yep...in fact, female bonding is the main glue of many monkey societies

Of course, in lots of those societies, the males are dominant to the females. (I'm specifically thinking of baboons, though what's interesting about them is that in at least one species, the male's status is based on the status of his mother.)

:hi:

[Nevernose]

59. Don't know nothin' about no stinkin' buisness. And are humans primates?

English education, with a minor in English Lit.

Have you not read my other posts, in which I discussed both my love of cats and my previous owenership of them? Have you not yet ascertained that my original thread was founded upon multiple levels?

And when I mentioned herd mentality (which I said was an insulting term), I was thinking more along the lines of animals which circle around one another, kicking out at predators, not berserking gazelles, fleeing from the closest fright.

And are humans primates? While we do follow many of the behaviors associated with primates (or, rather, are associated with us), human society seems to draw upon a variety of theriophilic archetypes.

[Name removed]

75. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Piltdown13]

80. More specifically, humans are apes...

(Disclaimer: not attacking you in any way, just adding some more info.)

Many primate societies are male-dominated, though there's often a lot of female manipulation going on behind the scenes, as it were. What's really interesting, though, is the diversity of social arrangements among the apes. You've got gorillas, who represent the classic example of male dominance (single-male, multi-female groups, without a real hierarchy among the females, who tend to be unrelated); chimpanzees, where males do have a dominance hierarchy but band together to defend the group; orangutans, who, with the exception of mothers and dependent offspring, spend most of their time alone; gibbons (lesser apes, to be sure, but still apes), who pair-bond; and bonobos, whose social structure in terms of group composition is similar to chimps' but whose day-to-day lives are much less marked by dominance displays and the like. Quite an impressive amount of social diversity among our closest relatives!

All this diversity makes it especially interesting for folks like me, who study human evolution. We tend to use the chimps as the best modern analogue for some of the earliest hominids, but it's also quite possible that a gorilla-style social organization would be a better model. Whichever it was, we've definitely traveled a pretty considerable distance from it since then.

[roguevalley]

30. If you have to ask ...

[Mordecai]

35. I've been wondering that too.

I don't even like cats.

[jukes]

57. Mordecai

not a requirement here, but it *is* rude to intrude if you have nothing to contribute.

if you don't like cats, it's because you don't understand; that's your loss.

i've often wondered about insecure males that dislike cats because they've been programmed into thinking they're "womanly".


BTW, welcome to DU (really!), i'm sure we'll agree somewhere down the line. :hi:

[Mordecai]

83. What?

Where did you get that cats are womanly? When did I ever type that?

Why do you have this idea I'm insecure?

I don't like cats because they're annoying as hell. The shed all over the place. They stink all the time. They scratch the hell out of everything.

And I'm not intruding on discussion. Last I checked, this is a public discussion board where everyone can participate.

[opihimoimoi]

38. My Poody Cat is up in claws... tone it down man.

[Nevernose]

39. What does that mean, anyway?

Opihimoimoi? I've wondered for a long time, and I'm assuming that it's Hawaiian/Polynesian?

[opihimoimoi]

48. Opihi is a limpet, a mollusk which clings to rocky shorelines

eating their curds and whey, oops seaweed. moi moi is a play on Hawaiian words. Moemoe means to sleep, nap, doxe, crash, etc

Moi is a Royal Hawaiian Fish, Pacific Threadfin, Polydactylus Sexfiulis...which I used to rear and sell. I iz into aquaculture.

and now you know the rest of the story. Opihimoimoi, the sleeping limpet.

Come, thirsty already, we go drink.

[Khephra]

41. MEE---yow!

;-)

[BlackVelvetElvis]

44. I think this applies to most human/animal relationships

Animals are MUCH NICER than most people.
To alot of us on DU, a love for an animal demonstrates great compassion inheirant in the person.
My animals don't judge, nag or criticize me-unlike alot of humans.

[RodneyCK2]

60. Actually, that is not true...

I have had a few cats in my lifetime and two out of the bunch were crazy and mean. Mind you, I did not make them that way. I love all animals.

Anyways, one of them would wait in hiding when I came home from work and then attack my ankles, biting, scratching, and then run away. The next cat after that one finally died was just as bad. You would pet it and then all of the sudden it would wrap itself around my arm with all its claws dug into my skin like an Alabama tick. Damn, I hate cats, crazy bast*ards. Give me a cuddly, faithful dog any day.

[CatWoman]

66. What did you do to them?

[TrogL]

88. You don't need to do anything to them

One of my current cats was fine at the pound, cuddly and fell asleep in my lap.

Got it home and it's ignored me ever since.

[Bombtrack]

72. Thank you. It really bugs the hell out of me. Maybe a section for those

"types" is needed. Like a "Lifetime Channel" section of DU.

And then we could have like a politically incorrect/"man show" type section of DU for posting the things many of us get called sexist pigs for.

[Aftershock]

81. Cats suck.

Let's talk about dogs. :)

[NightTrain]

82. Rule of thumb: Never trust any person who openly dislikes dogs or cats.

It's a telltale sign that the person is petty, vindictive, and mean-spirited.

[jukes]

85. i want to apologize

to all in this thread, including argumentis, for my display of temper. i over reacted, & hope i didn't spoil the discussion for others.

[Nevernose]

89. No problem here

My handle, I suspect, turns off a lot of people here. I chose it so I could argue with people primarily about Israel and the South, places I felt were being deningrated frequently.

I've just kind of kept it ever since.

Oh, and I went to a very good school, by the way. Straight "A" student, too, although I was far from conventional. Yeah, I had to get in one last comment. ;)

[bratcatinok]

90. A house isn't a home without at least a couple

of cats residing in it. I don't know why this is true for me but it is.

I love my dog and I pay him alot more attention that I do the two cats but that's because he demands it of me.

My calico kitty is perfectly happy to share my computer time with me by draping herself over my right shoulder. My black kitty wants her quality time when I'm in the bathroom. She loves water and it doesn't matter whether it's shower water or toilet water. If there's a chance of her seeing either, she comes running and wants to be loved on.

Before my pup came to live with me I had my kitties. Something about walking into a room and seeing one of them curled up asleep or being a part of their owngoing war with each other is home and heartwarming. My house would be so empty without them.

[mopaul]

93. catfood.................

[blindpig]

94. my problem with cats

If people wish to keep cats in their homes, well that's their business, there's no accounting for taste. But when they run loose, that's a problem. Then they are an invasive species, highly efficient predators which our native species have not evolved to deal with. Millions of song birds are whacked every year by house cats along with countless small native mammals, reptile & amphibians. Down in Oz feral cats are suppressed with extreme prejudice as they are helping to drive many small marsupials to extinction. They are responsible for the extinction of several species of bird in New Zealand.
Dogs can be a problem too but they are usually less efficient and it is becoming unacceptable to let dogs run free.
If you love Nature keep those suckers in the house!

[LWolf]

95. I love nature and I let my cats out.

I paid a high price for that in June. I lost my tomcat. :cry:

He was an adopted stray. I don't know how; he didn't come home after a night when the neighbors were shooting off firecrackers, or shooting each other, or something. There were 4 black and whites parked around my house at dawn, watching the empty acres next to my house, and Lucy never came home. Being that he was bold, aggressive, fearless, and quite demanding, I knew he wouldn't be "hiding." If he could have gotten here, he would have. He hunted that field next door. The only "songbirds" he ever brought down were house sparrows; he turned a couple loose in the house to fly around. He was great with rodents, though. Kept the premises clean of mice, rats, gophers, and squirrels. Left the hens alone. His last "gift" was a full sized jack-rabbit. How he got the damned thing into the house, I'll never know. He had to jump onto a 4 foot ledge and drag it through a little kitty door. People who live rurally have appreciated thier cats' hunting abilities for years; they are great barn managers. If you've never been overrun by rodents, you might not be able to appreciate it, though.

I think if I lived in a regular neighborhood, I would keep my cats contained. Even more important, imo, is to make sure that they are all neutered and spayed. If they aren't reproducing, you don't have feral populations gone wild hunting for themselves.

[blindpig]

105. I hate you lost your bud

but I think the value of cats as rodent controls is over balanced by the damage they do to wildlife. California has quite a number of small animals on the Endangered Species List. I live in the countryside and use Victor traps, baits, blowgun and the local snakes for rodent control.
In the situation of the classic small farm I can understand keeping cats around the barn, but that's getting to be history. If people didn't kill off snakes and managed their property to minimise opportunities for rodents they would have fewer problems.

[LWolf]

115. All true.

Or most, anyway. I'd recommend against using baits, as animals scavenging a bait-killed rodent can also be poisoned.

I've never killed a snake; I've removed a few from my house, though. Our snake population is under pressure from over-development, and around here people kill every snake they see, sure that they are all rattlers. :eyes:

I put hardware cloth "cages" under all planting beds, trees, etc. to protect them from the voracious gophers, and use other protection on things above ground to keep the rabbits off of the plants. Still, having cats and dogs that chase squirrels out of the place helps keep too many eggs from being stolen; the squirrels are notorious theives as well as garden pests. Right now I'm using traps in my garage and my tack room to control the mice. I believe you when you say there are places cats do damage to wildlife; in my area, (the desert), they tend to stick to controlling rodent populations. The wildlife is actually a risk to the cat; coyotes, hawks, owls, etc..

[ForrestGump]

112. Good point, but

loss of New Zealand's endemic birds was mainly the result of rats that the Maoris brought in and stoats and ferrets that the Brits brought with them.

[NMDemDist2]

96. it's cuz we're Dems, we need the cat herding practice

to work with our beloved party :smoke:

[MissMillie]

97. The cats keep our lives warm and fuzzy....

... when all the rest of the world is cold and hard.

[Nevernose]

110. Cutest. Thing. Ever.

[Name removed]

98. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[HuckleB]

100. One of Broadway's all-time worst musicals, no doubt. I agree!

:)

[ronnykmarshall]

102. Yous gotta problem wif da katz?

[DoctorWeird]

109. Cat Lovers aren't crazy...people who put clothes on dogs are crazy

I've done that too...

[OnionPatch]

111. As for the litter box problem...

My cat of 22 years passed away several years ago without having EVER gone on the floor (except in her last, feeble day when she had a hard time doing anything.)
My new cat peed on the floor so much he is no longer allowed in the house. He isn't sick, I had him checked. The litter box is scrupulously cleaned daily. I got him from the pound, so maybe he was already in the habit of going wherever he liked. I get tired of hearing people always blaming the owners. Animals are individuals just like people with a plethera of reasons for everything they do.

[Rhiannon12866]

120. Perhaps Feliway could help you and your kitty

I got it for mine, who did not have litterbox problems, but was just very scared, since I rescued her from the outside. It can help with inappropriate urinating as well as with kitties under stress, as mine was. You are very tolerant, which most people wouldn't be, and I applaud you.:toast:

http://www.moggies.co.uk/html/feliway.htm

[jdonaldball]

113. You should be grateful that cats tolerate humans

[Deja Q]

122. Ford Corporation kills cats for fun.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=105x1448480

[RebelOne]

123. I've heard that those commercials were computer-generated

[Name removed]

126. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Nevernose]

128. I've never requested a thread locked before.

Do I need to alert, or just post in the text of the thread?

BTW, by the time you'd asked me, it had dissapeared from the front page, so I was assuming it had gone away quietly, all by itself.

[jukes]

129. Thank you, Argumentus

I understand & accept your reason for not responding to my lock request. i'm personally grateful to you for responding now & hope your request to the mods will be honored.

i believe we have settled our grievances honorably w/ each other & hold no animosity towards you. i believe you made an honest mistake, one that i admit to having made before myself.

i look forward to meaningful discussions w/ you in the future, & working w/you to further our collective goal, regaining our country from the coup.

most sincerely,
jukes

EDIT: i believe you need to hit the alert button & post the request in the pop-up. thanks again!

[Nevernose]

127. MODS: Please lock this thread

It is offensive to people and seems to be unnecessarily inflammatory.