Okay Men - what the hell

[TNOE]

Since there was the thread on love I thought I'd check on this:

Had given up on relationships completely, didn't want one, didn't care, etc. Last week - the week before my only child (daughter) gets married I run into this guy at the store that I had known from church and we dated when we were like 13 - dating then consisted of sitting in church and maybe holding hands. He started talking to me, asking me how I was, etc., etc. I asked where he lived and when he told me I said well you better go have a beer or something because there is a big traffic jam and you've got a 3 hour wait in traffic. I then said "take care" and went about my business even though it looked like he wanted to talk more. I go outside and he is waiting and asks me if I want to go have a beer with him - so we did and then wound up talking for hours and having a great time. He's still gorgeous as hell, actually better looking now then when young. Divorced. Then we went out Saturday night, had a great time, he kept telling me how beautiful I am, that he wants to make me happy, called every day, went out the following week and then he invited himself to the wedding - once there he was kind of freaked out about it, ex-husband wasn't happy, but they talked and that went okay. God nothing but compliments and how he can't believe he's with me, etc. So after wedding came back to my place, had a great time, etc., etc. Then he said out of the blue he couldn't handle a relationship that he had to get his shit together. Then nothing, no call, no nothing.

I'm so pissed, I was ready to give up, he comes along, turns my world upside down - and then blam, gone. I don't get it. So what's your take? Is he a complete and total coward and got scared and ran away - or just a game player?? His self-esteem seemed to be in the toilet although I said really nice things about him constantly. He said I was out of his league.

[KG]

1. we are all dogs.

just the way things are... :eyes:

[TNOE]

6. DAMMIT - just as I suspected!

[aden_nak]

2. As a rule, game-players don't make dates at weddings.

Perhaps it actually WAS the event of a wedding that kind of freaked him out a little bit?

[TNOE]

14. See, that is weird isn't it??

He's the one that really wanted to be there - which I'm glad he was, but I do think it wound up freaking him out.

I'm really appreciating all the responses here - I have been a wreck now for 5 freaking days!

[aden_nak]

17. My advice would honestly be to give him a little bit of time.

As a guy I have gone through that impulse before. When I was younger I fled on it, and even now that I'm older I can't say for certain it never grips me. Because odds are he really doesn't believe he's being irrational. It's something checmical or instinctual. Hardwired into the human genome at a primitive level. I am not even sure if I can put into words the breadth of that instict without either breaking down into dismissive generalizations or trivializing the whole thing. But here's the rule of thumb.

If he's good enough to miss, then he's good enough to get over his kneejerk biology, no matter how powerful said biology might be,

[TNOE]

20. That's really interesting

I was thinking of the song "IRAN" - whoever that group was was on that freaking stupid show the other night - can't remember the name, hit wonders or something - but she was this or she was that and I
RAN, I RAN AWAY - yeah, he should be too old (45) to be doing that crap this late in the game.

[dhinojosa]

3. Wow, what a freak....

No way I'd be that flimsy.

[trotsky]

4. Depends on what "etc., etc." means!

Bluntly: If you had sex, and then he ran away - yeah, probably up to no good.

But if you didn't have sex yet, I'd say that he may indeed be scared, and afraid that he'd mess up a relationship with you. Guys are insecure in their own little fucked up way. :)

[TNOE]

8. He's a Scoporio

So no way could I resist so that answer is yes. He was really really very self-conscious, although I have no ideal why - it was pretty amazing. Of course it had been a really long time ago for me.

[trotsky]

11. Sounds like he got what he wanted, on to the next conquest.

Make an honest effort to talk to him and try to reassure him in case he truly does feel inadequate, but the warning signs are pretty blatant. As others have said, you deserve someone who thinks he deserves you.

[TNOE]

15. Don't you think men

can pretty much get laid anywhere, anytime? Why go through the buying me gifts and taking me out and saying all the crap? He's gorgeous, I feel sure he could pick someone up if all he were interested in was sex - or call an old flame maybe.

[trotsky]

18. Well, if you were a specific target

then it was just a game to see how much it would take to get you in bed. Once accomplished, the thrill is gone. Both sexes can do this, and it of course does not mean you are inadequate or wrong in any way.

[billyskank]

5. Sounds a little off his rocker to me.

If I were you, I'd handle him at a distance.

[radwriter0555]

7. If he said he's out of your league, then he's right. It takes a real man

to stand next to a righteous woman, which apparently you are.

If he's so timid and weak that he can't take whatever gifts you have to offer, then you're much better off without him.

So just keep your eyes open. Do what you're doing, and let the universe -- and other humans -- know you're open to a new relationship and it will come along.

You're doing great. This was just a practice run for the REAL one!

[TNOE]

10. You're probably right

the weird thing is through the years when I've gone to psychics (been a long time ago though) - they ALL said the man you would wind up with is someone you already know. They ALL said that - so I was thinking maybe he's it. In running our horoscopes astrogically - we've got Sun conjuct Venus - which as I understand it is - love, pure and simple. All I know is he rocked my world.

But deep down I know what you're saying is right.

[LastKnight]

9. i wouldnt say its limited to men.

its something PEOPLE do. they tend to get scared some times... give him a few days to cool off then give him a call just to talk. see where it goes.

that is... only if you want to, anyway.

[TNOE]

12. No, I've called once

and no way am I going to again. I told him he was in control of what he wanted to happen. Although it pisses me off because I NEVER said I wanted a relationship, I never said I wanted anything - although I did say what the psychics said - probably was my big mistake. God, a thought is in my head and out my mouth.

[LastKnight]

13. in that case...

theirs probably better things/people to spend your time on.

[Redstone]

16. The only thing I can tell you about men is that

you're a hell of a lot better off without that particular one.

Redstone

[TNOE]

19. Really - is it so unusual?

Man, when there's a ton of passion and conversation. I truly just don't get it. Is it rare or common that men initially get scared and run?

Although - he did have a Bush/Cheney sticker.... which normally had I not already known him, that might have been enough for me - but then again, he's very beautiful, but he doesn't seem to think so.

[retread]

24. I was going to ask a couple of questions earlier, but read this first.

I am glad I did!! You answered my question. A Bush-Cheney sticker turns a handsome prince into a dog turd!

[neuvocat]

21. I can't answer that because I had women do the same to me.

They'd show a total interest one day and then as soon as I started to reciprocate (sp?) they were practically impossible to contact. I don't think its a gender-based behavior. Sorry.

[TNOE]

22. Thank's all

have I said how much I love DU this week? I LOVE LOVE LOVE DU - I feel a lot better already, just needed to vent a minute.

[crispini]

23. Never, EVER, EVER attend a wedding with someone

too early in the relationship. By which I mean, prior to your OWN actual engagement. Weddings of any kind just bring out people's issues. I'd bet a nickel that's it.

And if his self-esteem seemed to be in the toilet, then I hate to say it, but you're probably better off without him earlier rather than later. The REALLY insecure ones will pull that kind of stunt every time.

[TNOE]

Well I sure didn't know that

or ever hear it - I mean it was my daughter's so it was a HUGE deal for me, but I wasn't going to invite him until he invited himself!! So what could I say - NO, I don't think you should come? That seems rude. But what's done is done - and I think the comments here are probably exactly right - I would definitely continue to have problems with his insecurity - so I just need to let it go and quit wondering - the what ifs? It just pisses me off - I didn't even want to meet him in the first place - but if nothing else, it has inspired me to look forward to the future and not just shut myself down like I was preparing to do!

[jobycom]

29. I don't think the wedding was it

He would have been more moody after the wedding, rather than how he was.

I wouldn't dwell on him, but keep in mind his insecurity may be over one issue. I mean, he may be just an insecure mess, and that might lead to him doing the yo-yo thing, in which case you're better without him. But he could be insecure about something specific, and could work it out and be quite fine afterwards.

I still wouldn't wait for him. Just, if he comes back, don't judge him by advice from people who have never met him. One of us on this thread is probably right, but there's no telling which one.

[crispini]

32. Well, this is my personal theory, but think about it...

Weddings... especially if you've been divorced -- they have a lot of meaning and nuance to them, you know. They make you think about your own wedding, about other people's weddings, about getting older, about LOVE and MARRIAGE in general, that kind of thing. I mean, yes, it's my own theory, but all I know is that I personally attended a wedding with someone early on in the relationship and it melted down pretty pronto after that.

[jobycom]

25. You sure he was divorced?

I can think of three possibilities: One, as you say, he's a player, got what he wanted, and moved on. Two, he really was afraid of what was going on, thought he might hurt you or get hurt, and bailed out. Three, he was hiding something. "Get his shit together" sounds an awful lot like "I'm trying to leave my wife but haven't yet."

For the record, two and three don't have to mean he's a jerk. If he's married, he's lying, and that's bad, but it could be something like a complete long-time separation that he calls a divorce. When he finally did the "etc" with you, maybe it bothered him, and he felt like he was cheating you or someone else, and wanted to get the marriage over with before he went on. Or it could be that he wishes he is divorced, lied, and then felt like a cheat for doing it (that would make him a jerk, although there are really bad marriages, I promise you). Just a possibility.

My own guess is he's not a player. He spent some time trying to get you, and then he got you. I think he'd hang around a bit longer in that case. Guys who want a one time thing don't spend that long getting it. And his insecurity doesn't sound like a player. But it's still possible he is.

I'd say either track him down and demand an answer, or forget him immediately. Any other solution puts you on his timetable, and there's no point being there. I say that, I wouldn't do it, either. :-)

[TNOE]

27. Its not that big of a town

so yes, I know he's really divorced and his ex is remarried. Although he did readily admit to me that he has never been in love before and had cheated on his ex - twice. He said "people don't think it hurts the man, but it really does". I asked why in the hell did he do it then - and something about he worked with them and a friendship, attaction developed and one thing led to another. That was a big red flag - but again, he is a Scorpio. Although he did say "it was when he was younger" and he got married at age 18. So somewhat understandable I suppose. I honestly don't know how a man is married for nearly 30 years to the same person - who he admits he isn't in love with, and not cheat. But that sort of does maybe make him a "player".

I don't think i'd get a sufficient answer, so I'm just going to forget it unless he should happen to call and then we'll see. I haven't had that much fun in years, so I'm sure that is what is bothering me - it was just so much fun and so exciting - it was like a tornado blew threw my house and blew right out. Basically - I think discussing it here like this - I think it boils down to he is just terribly and I do mean terribly insecure, and I'm pretty outspoken, independent minded - he wasn't the 1st I've scared away, just the first in a long time.

[jobycom]

34. Married 30 years to someone he didn't love. Cheated twice

If he's telling the truth about that, he's NOT a player. The insecurity is what's going on.

[retread]

26. Sorry, if he had a Bush-Cheney bumper sticker he was NOT gorgeous.

He was ugly.

[TNOE]

28. Oh but he was

I was planning on converting him. He was a FOX news watcher - which I wouldn't allow at my house. CSPAN only. He was receptive to that - although I told him I was going to rip off his bumper sticker and he just laughed - but I was actually serious. I didn't want to be riding around in anything with a BUsh/Cheney sticker.

[retread]

35. OMG!! A Bush-Cheney sticker and a Faux News watcher. What happened

makes sense now!

[beam me up scottie]

30. He turned your world

upside down in one week ?

Look, if a guy seems to good to be true, he probably is.
Not always, but I've had plenty who found out what I liked and then tailored their act to fit.
Women do it too.
Chalk it up to a learning experience and move on.

[TNOE]

31. Well actually 2

but I lead a very dull boring life - I'm empty nesting majorly since my daughter left. Been divorced for 22 years, lots of relationships, but none that were this damn exciting.

[beam me up scottie]

33. There are

a lot more like him out there.
TRUST me, I found out the hard way.
Better you find out now then possibly discovering a trail of lies later.

[MadHound]

36. Could be that you should take his statement at face value

That perhaps, indeed he does need to get his shit together. Perhaps he is having financial difficulties, and doesn't want to get into a relationship until they're cleared up. Perhaps the notion of being in a loving relationship after thirty years in a loveless one is freaking him out, and he doesn't want to go any further until he stops freaking out. Perhaps he has some other issues he has to deal with before he is willing to procede. Hell, he might have another woman out on the wire, and he wants to cut her loose before he goes any further with you.

I would suggest that you casually meet up with him at a neutral place and see if you can find out what is going on. If you show a willingness to be open and nonjudgemental he will open up to you, and you can find out what is going on. Men aren't always love 'em and leave 'em types. Sometimes there are some real issues that we have to deal with before we get into a serious relationship.

[retread]

37. The guy had a Bush-Cheney bumper sticker and watched Faux news!

NOTHING he says can be taken at face value. His behavior was consistent with the clues she had, but ignored because he was "drop-dead gorgeous."

[MadHound]

38. Ooo, stereotye much there?

Sorry, don't pull that shit with me. I live in Missouri, quite the red state, an if want to get Dems elected around here, you have to talk with the RW like they're real human beings, which they are. Just because somebody voted for Bush and watches Faux news doesn't make them evil or dishonest, foolish and easily gullible perhaps, but certainly not evil or dishonest. Hell, I got a good friend of ours staying the night tonight, a dyed in the wool Bush supporter, and probably watches Faux also. Doesn't mean that we won't have a good time, hell we'll even have a fun political conversation. Everytime we talk, I do a little more persuading, hopefully by the time '08 comes around, there will be another Democratic or Green voter in Missouri.

So drop it with the stereotypes and profiling. It is ugly when the RW NeoCons do it, it is even uglier when a Dem or liberal does it, for we're supposed to know better.

[retread]

40. I live in Florida, the home of Jeb Bush. Used to live in Butler, Mo.

You are a better person than I. For me life is too short to f*** Republicans!

[beam me up scottie]

42. .

:rofl:

[TNOE]

39. Wow, this is some seriously excellent advice

I do think he was having "financial" issues - he mentioned that in passing several times - said he needed to make more money - but then I did a search on him :evilgrin: and he makes a hell of a lot more than I do. Although I'm a Leo so I can make shit look beautiful and know where to shop for great sales. My place is very very beautiful and I think that intimated him. He is letting his youngest daughter and her husband rent out his house and I got the feeling he was living in a dump somewhere. When he talked about his kids - I gotta admit, it was a pretty "melting" experience. He seems like one hell of a great Dad.



Thanks ALL VERY MUCH!!! This has been more helpful than you could ever realize. I really feel so much better. I'm off to Happy Hour and for the weekend.


:hugs: TO ALL!

[Kenneth ken]

41. self delete

I changed my mind.

[Bok_Tukalo]

43. Sounds like he may have made himself a miserable rut in which he lives

and is afraid he might be required to climb out of it. He would have to get his life together enough financially and materially and emotionally (like he has probably been telling himself he will begin doing any day now) so that he can properly feel like he has balance in any relationship.

[SarahB]

45. That's it.

Some people are more comfortable not moving then trying and taking risks. What's that line? "Nothing ventured, nothing gained." That's how life is. It's a good thing she found out quickly and it's ultimately he that will lose out far more. Some of us have much harder lessons to learn before we see it ourselves.

[Bok_Tukalo]

50. Ignoring the fact that he was unfaithful

(the worst thing an individual can do in a marriage and a good indication of a weak and undisciplined soul), it sounds to me like the guy just is not ready to deal with the world yet and needs to get tired of his self made coccoon.

[gardenista]

48. Ding Ding Ding!

I'll bet anything that's it.

[GoddessOfGuinness]

44. At least you found out

that you don't need to give up on relationships completely. Not caring whether you have one is probably good...it means you're independent. But it'd be a shame if you met a really super guy and dismissed him because you didn't want to get involved. That's kind of what this jerk did to you.

I'm sorry you were hurt. I wish people wouldn't play with other people's hearts... :hug:

[Sugar Smack]

46. I don't understand that kind of behavior, either.

I just don't, and there's nothing I can do. It happens constantly. The one person who refrains from it is the one you may be happy with. I wish you much luck.

[GreenPartyVoter]

47. Yikes. He sounds mental. *hugs* I will send out positive vibes for

a really decent guy to come and sweep you off your feet. *ohhhmmmmmm*

[lolly]

49. Run Like Hell

If he ever comes back--and I'm willing to put 50/50 odds that, once you've completely given up on him, he will make one more attempt to pull you back in.

Had a "relationship" like this once myself.

Met a guy walking across campus--he asked me out--on the first date, he was madly in love with me. Couldn't stop thinking about me all day. yada yada yada--for about 6 weeks it went on like this. I was very young, but my reaction was just like yours--a little weirded out, but flattered and a little swept off my feet.

Just when I started thinking this was for real, and started having fairly strong feelings for him, he started acting like I was the one in pursuit. Then I got the "I need some space" line (his version of "need to get my shit together")

Like you, I was left reeling. What the f**k?

After about 7 months of nothing, guess who shows up at my room out of the blue? I missed you, don't know what I'd do without you (oh, by the way, he'd gotten married, but was now thinking it was a mistake . . .)

So, stay away!!!

[u4ic]

51. Sounds like he may have been out of his comfort zone

I can't imagine anyone staying in a loveless marriage that long...I bet he had a lot of feelings he didn't want to experience, and kept on repressing or ignoring them. Then other feelings would come up and bite him (his two 'affairs', and you), they'd run away with him, and then quickly he'd feel overwhelmed and retreat.

Whatever the reason, it sounds like he has some emotional issues that he needs to deal with. I don't think it makes him a creep or a jerk, but I think it does make him a not very inviting relationship prospect.

I'm sorry you had your heart broken. :hug:

[Dogmudgeon]

52. No wonder he flaked out

This isn't criticism of TNOE. I'm griping about the peanut gallery.

Look at some of the reactions to the guy. You would think he was a criminal. He obviously didn't want to risk dating Yet Another Woman who would find fault with him like many of the people who post in DU sexuality/romance threads.

I've stopped dating on-line for mainly that reason. People -- not just men or women, but BOTH men AND women -- have impossibly high "standards" and will shit-can a potential friend for the smallest imaginable infractions of social propriety. It keeps them "safe" if they don't have to take a risk and can then cry Sour Grapes. "I'm glad I didn't get involved with him/her -- just look at those shoes! They're so 1998!"

We've been told all our lives "we can have it All!" But people aren't consumer products, nor are they service providers, they're people.

If you like him, don't just let him go away. Call him again and say hello. No obligations. See if he likes the no-pressure approach.

And the next time you ask for advice on DU, specify that you want GOOD advice!

:evilgrin:

--p!

[Skittles]

53. not sure what to make of this but I'm very sure of one thing TNOE

it is NOT YOU so I know it is tough but try not to obsess about it: the guy has issues.