"I want you to go upstairs.... and kill the boy!"

[MissMillie]

Everyone remember that comedy bit from Bill Cosby. Well, it's exactly how I'm feeling.

I just got a call from my son's guidance counselor, Mr. Ward. He says that the English teacher wants to move Tim from an honor's class to a college prep class. She says he's not doing honors work.

I asked about Tim's grades. Mr. Ward said that report cards went out two weeks ago and asked if I saw it. "No, I haven't. In fact I've asked him about LAST YEAR'S report card, which I never saw." Mr. Ward asked if I got his letter. "No, sir. I never got your letter."

Well, it turns out there's a reason for all this. Mr. Ward was happy to fax over the stuff he wanted me to see.

Tim is getting D's in all his classes, except 3 (An incomplete in Math, a low C in Spanish and a B in Band). He has missed 13 days of school (I'm only aware of 5). I should add that I ask consistently if he has homework and the answer is always "no".

I am beyond livid. In fact, I've moved straight into "sick" and I mean "sick" in the literal sense.

I had some problems w/ this a couple of years ago, but we got it hammered out and I was pretty sure that would never happen again.

To think, just last night we were looking at cars to buy for him.

There will be no car. He's being suspended from his ROTC drill team (by ME) until he can get the grades back up. I've already talked to the commander and he says that if there are ramifications w/ his team-mates that this will be a good lesson for him to learn (that when they are counting on him, he needs to do all he can not to let them down).

His DBZ collection is being packed up and brought into my office storage so that it cannot be a distraction any longer.

I'm removing his TV, VCR, DVD, CD player and portable CD player from his room.

I'm confiscating his cell phone.

If need be, I'll bring the computer keyboard into work w/ me every day so that he can't spend all his time online at the card trading site.

There's part of me that says all of this is necessary, and part of me that says I should cool off before laying down this law.

Any suggestions?

[Richardo]

1. Rock on MissMillie! You're doing the right things...

...as difficult as they are. No one likes to have their trust messed with. He must know that there are severe consequences for this kind of behavior. I'm sorry for your sake that it became necessary for you to have to do these things.

You have MY support, FWIW.

[Rose Siding]

2. I wish I knew what to suggest

I did poorly when faced with a somewhat comparable situation.

My very best: Temper justice with mercy. Try for balance.

edit-Best wishes to you- It is so hard to love well and you obviously care so much.

[Richardo]

6. Sounds like she went for balance last time, apparently to no avail...

Dropping the big one will let him know she's serious. And none of her sanctions are necessarily permanent -- they can be ratcheted back for good behavior.

[NewGuy]

3. How could it ever get this far

When my kids were young enough to be in school we got report cards and official information via the US mail system so our youngsters could not mess with the stuff. Even if we hadn't, I like to think we would have made sure we got periodic feedback on their performance.

[MissMillie]

4. Youngsters can hide the mail

And I wish I had been more adamant about getting feedback. But with him so gung-ho into his ROTC drill stuff, it didn't occur to me that he would do anything to endanger that, so I trusted him.

Yep, a big mistake, for sure.

[5thGenDemocrat]

5. Your kid would be getting off light

My dad found out I skipped 51 straight days of school in seventh grade.
I got my ass tanned. I don't mean metaphorically -- I mean dad tanned my ass. That was a different time, and would be child abuse today, but I understand why dad flipped out.
Anyhow, my only suggestion would be to have the school send all the report cards and other progress updates directly to you. I was pretty good at DXing bad stuff from the school long before mom and dad could ever see it. And I could forge either of their signatures with some proficiency. I suspect Sonny Boy is doing the same.
John
Also, is grounding a child still an option?

[felonious thunk]

7. Just make sure that he's slacking

and that he's not just overwhelmed. If he's trying his best, and just feels like he's not able to do it all, then you won't want to punish him hard. Restrict his time a little and encourage him. But if he's just being lazy and blowing it all off, then do what you got to.

[Capn Sunshine]

27. One can assume that being in an "honors" class

means he's intellectually capable of the work assigned.

Sometimes, young boys have a hormone problem that causes temporary insanity. In the parents, I mean.

In a culture that places little emphasis on consequences, this seems to be the best lesson you can give him.

It would be important to find out , beyond lazyness, why there is so little motivation for school at this point in his life. Sometimes there is another pursuit that minimizes the importance of school, such as using and obtaining really good pot, or other mind expanding substances (think ecstacy or acid ). Use of these substances is highly entertaining, and stimulative in a mind expanding way that adolescent boys particularly appreciate. Thus, the encountering of cosmic realities while under the influenec of these substances seems quite intellectual in its pursuit, and worthwhile in its possible consequences. The net effect is the rank hypocrisy of the educational system becomes very apparent and the general reaction of many young people is to blow it off, or just not participate beyond an absolute minimumn as a form of rebellion. Rebellion is absolutely necessary and essential to testosterone-addled adolescent young men as they struggle for their own separate identity away from their family unit.

These same people generally get to college via the GED approach and two years of JC; so all is not lost.

But take it from me, as an employer , the MINIMUM requirement for any kind of career these days , is a 2 yr. AA. It has become what a HS diploma was to our generation.

[Nlighten1]

8. Your school needs a web portal.

I work for a consulting company. We implemented a web portal for one of the largest high schools in Indiana about a year ago and it is a huge hit with the parents. The students and parents get logins and they can communicate with the teachers and see their kids grades online.

[MissMillie]

10. this sounds marvelous

Are the assignments posted as well?

[dolo amber]

30. Yes

Everyday the classwork is updated. It's a fantastic thing to have access to. I have one of those "never have homework" kids myself; amazingly, as soon as her school got the info online, her bookbag got a lot heavier. ;)

[Nlighten1]

31. Yeppers

Schedules, events, lunch menu, or you name it.

[Bunny]

9. You are doing the right thing.

Hold firm, as hard as this is. It's for his own good and he WILL thank you for it someday. You are doing the right thing!

[Tyler Durden]

11. Do it ALL, and don't feel Guilty. If I may suggest...

I had problems with the oldest related to HA/ADD-Asperger's Syndrome, and I had to remove items as they became distrations, also.

But my suggestion is a MONITORING one. Get the EMAIL of EVERY TEACHER. Make a "boilerplate" Status Report they can just fill in and REPLY on. DO THIS EVERY WEEK, MORE IF NECESSARY. Reward compliance SLOWLY and one privelige at a time.

[liberalhistorian]

29. Exactly!

And hello fellow sufferer of a child with Asperger's Syndrome, it's quite a handful, isn't it?

[soleft]

12. I'd say do all the things you're doing and, if you can

find out why.

People always do things for a reason. I would be curious to know the underlying reasons for the behavior.

That doesn't mean excuse the behavior.

Lying to a parent, lying to anyone is a form of acting out something that isn't getting expressed appropriately.

Teach him to be ulimately responsible for his behavior - but also teach him to express what's going on in a way that does not cause so much self damage. In the end he's hurting himself.

[imax2268]

13. No suggestions...

I think you are doing just fine...if he doesn't want to respect your authority and do what he has to do then take all his little pleasures away from him until he can.
Back in the day we got ground for months at a time...no car...not tv...of course we didn't have all the stuff he has...and that's a lot of stuff...but what we did have was all we had to entertains oursleves...

Mom would disconnect the stereo and put it in the hallway, took my tv and put it in her closet, took my car keys away, and grounded me until my grades came up...

You may think it's harsh, but stay firm on him...he has to learn that you are the boss and most important...he needs an education these days...without it he will get nowhere...I thank my parents for being strict on my about my grades and keeping them up...If they hadn't...I wouldn't be making the kind of money I am today...!

[Lars39]

14. He's in ROTC? Is he politically aware? Is he depressed?

:shrug:

[IADEMO2004]

15. Let him know you love him and you are on his side.

and he has got hell to pay.

[fallow]

16. I have the same problems

2 boys, 13 and 15... wont do homework, wont take notes, grades are marginal at best. I have tried, over 2 years, to:

Make them sit at the table, 1 hour a night and do homework.
I checked their homework every night.
I monitored their grades daily (you should do that)
Restricted their activities until their homework was complete

All of this effort on my part resulted in a big NADA! They still continued to be unprepared for classwork and tests. They came to rely on ME to help them with their work. No more.

Now, I have taken away ALL of their privleges. No TV, no computer, no games, no phone calls, no freinds over, and going outside the house is limited to.....my mood!

As my 15 yo will be getting his drivers license in a few months, he has much to lose. And he is responding to the reality that he wont be driving ANYWHERE until his grades are acceptable.

My 13 yo has already lost all his privleges, and Im not sure he is interested in getting them back. I think he has done a cost/benefit analysis and found that its easier to just not "give a damn".

I have tried, pos reinforcement last year, which they used to get A's in PE and Pottery to bilk me out of money while getting D's in math. I have tried negative reinforcement by taking away some of their chores if they complete their homework which resulted in them rereading the same book (or staring at it while they listened to the TV) I am on to punishment now. I have already taken away all of their privleges, maybe its time to start throwing some additional chores at them.

[vi5]

17. Wow.....that sounds like me circa 16 years ago...

Man was I a slacker in high school. I would hide my grades and everything else from my parents and avoid studying so that I could play my guitar.

The thing is I was a good kid overall who neither drank, did drugs, or slept around or got in trouble at all.

And I went on to graduate college, get a Masters degree, see the country, get married, have a daughter, own a house, and have a succesful career.

So you have a right to be mad, just as my parents did. But if all things considered he is a good kid then please take that into consideration.

[Shakespeare]

18. You didn't see his report card LAST year?

And you never followed up with the school to ask about it?

:crazy:

[MissMillie]

19. I saw the 3rd term report card....

which of course had grades for terms 1-3... he was ok. So when I didn't see term 4 I didn't panic. He was on track.

[THUNDER HANDS]

20. I can only go by what my parents did to me

My dad, if he were a Bush spinmeister, would call it "Shock and Awww"

Basically he would punish the hell out of me for two days. Then relent.

I usually got the message.

[mikehiggins]

21. I guess it just comes down to what kind of a relationship

you want to have with your kid in ten years.

When he was sixteen, I spent quite a while fighting with my son over stuff like school and then one night I had a revelation. I was saying the same stuff to my kid that my father had said to me.

Going by past experience, I realised that nothing I said made any difference, or was likely to. I couldn't very well just quit my job and follow the kid around everyday to make sure he went where he was supposed to go, and do what he was supposed to do. The kid was going to do what he wanted to do no matter what I said or did. Period. His problem was that he was/is very inteligent (he tests out at Mensa levels), but not all that smart. Just like his dad.

So instead I sat him down, explained what I saw as being the likely consequences of what he was doing and simply told him it was his life and his decision. It'd be nice to say that conversation turned things around and he became a model student but that would be nonsense.

He continued doing poorly in school, dropped out and got a GED, spent some time in CUNY and then got into a construction union where he is currently an apprentice learning a trade. He isn't all that happy with the job but its better than selling clothes at the gap.

Experience is a hard teacher, but some people can't learn anyway else.

Would I have liked things to be easier for him? Sure. I would have loved for him to love school, like his sister, and get good grades and great references, like his sister, and be offered a high paying job at a Manhattan law firm, like his sister, but he is not his sister. He is his own man, and thick as a brick. Runs in the family. He's also a decent guy with a conscience and a pretty solid set of ethics in his dealings with other people. I'd like to think that runs in the family too.

He calls me up five or six times a month and we talk out what's going on with him, give him advice, listen to his problems, make suggestions and keep up a friendly, positive relationship. Maybe that would have happened if I had fought him tooth and nail to get him to fit in and do what everyone else does. I tend to doubt it.

Your mileage may vary but I suggest you look at this other human being as a person instead of as a child, and understand that all of the punitive measures you can take are going to have as much effect as doing nothing at all.

I wish you good fortune in your choices.

[regularguy]

22. I was him.

Mostly Ds in school. "No, Mom. No Homework tonight". Meanwhile everyone else is bringing home lots of books. I was smoking a hell of alot of pot (not saying he is) and now that I look back I was experiencing what I can now recognize as depression. My parents would punish me, but it didn't really matter to me.

I think the measures you've taken sound reasonable.

In my house there was so much screaming and negativity and (ocassional) violence, that I was baffled (and still am really) that *I* was the one who was bad. I'm guessing that your house isn't quite like that.

Anyway, I grew up ok, if bit weird. :) Even got a college degree, a job, a family, and a mighty fine hackey sack collection.

I think Tim will be fine. Good luck.

Cheers!

[texastoast]

23. What is the message you are sending him?

Seems like your son is smart (clever, devious??), but just not self-motivated. Will you always be there to punish him when he is grown so he will motivate himself?

Did he pay for all the possessions he apparently has, or have you done it for him?

Does he have a job to pay for his car, insurance, gas, etc., or do you do that for him?

IMHO, you are teaching him that you don't have faith that he can pull himself out of this without your punishment. When does he learn to fix his own messes? 20, 25, 30, while he is still living at home because he doesn't know how to maneuver in the world because you have done it for him all these years?

Perhaps you should listen to that voice that is telling you to cool off, then explain that you are sure he can figure a way out of his poor grades. Put him in charge of figuring a way out of the mess. Meanwhile, since you bought all of his stuff (right?), tell him that losing his stuff is a natural consequence of not making decent grades in school and his probable skipping of school (although this, in and of itself, will not bring his grades up--that would be studying). If he did in fact buy his stuff, you really don't have a right to take it away.

Support him. Does he NEED a tutor?

Also, dropping grades like this can also be a sign of depression resulting from drug use or vice versa. Search his room and stuff.

[FunBobbyMucha]

26. I read your reply expecting to pounce on you, Tex,

but instead I'd think you're on to something.

I spent my rocky and embarassing 20's trying to figure out how to be a grown-up, partially because my mom's resigned theory on raising me was "It's easier to do it myself."

Learning about laundry at 20. Never having more than 20 bucks in my checking account and being fine with that. My first years of marriage were basically just a transfer of custody from the folks to my wife, who was, thankfully, much more resilient than I. A waste of space in many ways.

Your son is capable of piloting his own ship, he just needs you to show him where the big wheel-thingy is. In the meantime, I would still take all that extraneous crap away (we give our kids too many toys these days anyway, IMHO). Develop a means of earning stuff back based on changed behavior--I hate to dip back into my Psych days, but yes, a token chart of some sort. If you don't supply him with the means to get back to what he considers his 'normal' life, he might just give up and stay angry, especially if, as Tex alludes, there might be some depression going on.

I don't envy the confrontation or the next few days (and at Thanksgiving! Goddamn! Make sure you tell Grandma, etc to butt the hell out and not rescue him!), but wish you and Tim the best.

[alphafemale]

24. Go! Go! Momzilla!

:yourock:

The part that he lied is where you should let him know that you are saddened and disappointed.

[Booberdawg]

25. I was thinking of the Cosby skit when I saw your title

I don't have any advice but you have my support. I say kick some butt!

[liberalhistorian]

28. My 12-year-old son is very

bright, and off the charts in every single subject as far as testing is concerned, but he has Asperger's Syndrome (high-functioning autism) and has to be dragged into doing his homework (unless it's something he's really interested in) and nagged until it's done and has to be nagged to do every little thing, such as picking up, putting clothes away, etc.

He also has no sense of organization at all, and never brings home things from school he's supposed to. The band teacher and his drum teacher say he's one of the most talented drum players they've ever seen, but he got an F in band because he isn't bringing home his practice sheets that are passed out every week or doing his other assignments for it.

If he had his way, he'd just sit and watch TV or play the computer all the time. He thinks because he is very smart that he doesn't have to do the work to get the grades, that they'll just automatically be good, when I know he's capable of straight A's in everything. Every day is a never-ending battle with him to get him to do and/or organize ANYTHING. I ask if he has homework, what happened in school, what's due tomorrow, if he has anything that I need to sign, etc., etc..

Then I find out he's forgotten something or hasn't written homework assignments down, and he then gets mad at me for "not trusting him" when I have to double-check everything with his teachers and principals. The only thing that really gets through to him is taking away his "stuff" and his privileges, or making him sit in a chair and do nothing for an hour.

So I think you did absolutely the right thing, and you should stick with it. I know it's really tough, but it's the only thing to do in your situation. Hang in there and good luck!

[Cleita]

32. Getting rid of the distractions should be a start.

How much time can you spend with him? Forcing him to sit at the kitchen table doing his homework and studies at a certain time each day while you are there might get him back on track. Kids have the attention span of gnats sometimes and often it take the adults to ground them into a routine.

Also, could you afford to send him to a psychologist? There may be something deeper going on.

Good luck and I hope you find a solution before it affects his future.

[MissMarple]

33. Cooling off is always a good idea. I know exactly how you feel.

We have a problem like this with our son. Although now it is usually in one or two classes. We have a tutor for one, his sister, which is working OK except I think he is still in denial about how much work this class really is. We don't take everything away, just what means the most to him. As in no snowboarding this weekend. And of course no going out on school nights unless it's a school event. And what he hates the absolute most is for me to talk to his teachers every week. I think that is the biggest motivator. Don't let it ruin Thanksgiving, though.

The deception thing is a bit different and needs a separate consequence. Maybe "volunteer" work at a soup kitchen or food bank, and an essay on integrity might be the ticket.

Good luck, and hang in there, be calm, he'll probably turn out just fine. Just like the guys who posted above have said. :D

[Kamika]

34. Make sure he goes to school

I cut ALOT of school when I was in hs, and unfortunately parents believe alot of stuff you say.

Like he might say he got the morning off and he starts after you and your husband are gone off to work.

[Rowdyboy]

35. Someday, you'll both look back on this

and laugh. I put my poor mom through hell but, after 6 or 7 years, I realized she wasn't so stupid after all. Later on, I discovered she was actually quite bright. In fact, I eventually realized that growing up I was both a dumbass and an asshole and she was pretty much a saint.

Now that I'm all grown up, I have a dog. They return your love, generally obey, eat whats put before them and you save thousands on school clothes and college.

[PapaClay]

36. Hell, according to my Mom,

I'm still grounded...and I'm almost 54.

Cooling off is always a good idea, period. Your actions don't seem unreasonable to me. I raised two and it is an adventure. My revenge is my grandkids and the fact that I am enjoying my second childhood.

Hang in there.