Can we have that marijuana v. alcohol discussion?

[Writer]

I haven't done any of the former but plenty of the latter. I have known a few folks who have smoked enough marijuana that I do notice a marked reduction in basic reasoning skills and attentiveness.

I have heard many, many folks who have done marijuana who say that it shouldn't be controlled because it isn't any more harmful than alcohol, but I just don't see that. To my eyes, the casual drinker seems to be able to recover and carry on with his or her day faster and better than the casual marijuana smoker. I also suspect that marijuana smoke coats the lungs like nicotine; whereas, the liver cleanses the body of alcohol.

Okay, humor me. What am I missing here?

[Ptah]

1. OK, I'll bite.

I have known a few folks who have consumed enough alcohol that I do notice a marked reduction in basic reasoning skills and attentiveness.


To my eyes, the casual marijuana smoker seems to be able to recover and carry on with his or her day faster and better than the casual drinker.


There is no nicotine in marijuana.

[Writer]

3. Even long-term?

I'm thinking about a friend of mine who is in his 50's who, to get his attention, you have to slam two pans together next to his ears.

He doesn't smoke anymore, but did aplenty when he was in his youth.

[WindRavenX]

5. remember, correlation does not equal causation

And with regards to memory, yes, there is some long term effects on the hippocampus region of the brain (deals with short term memory), but a study showed that full memory function was restored after 5 months of quitting smoking marijuana daily.

[Writer]

10. No way. The dude's permanently BAKED.

And is a semi-motivated software engineer.

[WindRavenX]

14. that's different

If he needs it to function,he is mentally addicted. THC is not a physically addictive chemical, but alcohol is, to a degree. The reason people get addicted to either (or anything, really) is that your happiness is very much tied to that particular substance.

[Writer]

16. Oh no, ref: what I wrote before. I don't think he still smokes. n/t

[WindRavenX]

18. ohhh

So he smoked a lot in his past, but no longer does, right?

I know a lot of people back home who are like that. Some have motivational issues, but then again, most had it before they started smoking-- it just made it easier to slack off.

But then again, the said can be said of alcohol.

To each his own, I say. Some people like a glass of wine at the end of the day, I like a bowl :smoke:

[Writer]

23. Can I ask...

are you younger? Older?

[WindRavenX]

25. Younger

21, Senior in college.

[Ptah]

11. And round and round we go.

:smoke: :toast:

[BarenakedLady]

12. I notice

All those bottles are empty.

Hmmmmm :rofl:

[Ptah]

20. And my stash is low.

:cry:

[Kali]

34. If he is in his 50's he may be suffering from the after effect of more

than chronic pot use. the 60's syndrome? :rofl: :hippie:

[WindRavenX]

2. well, besides the fact that your points are all pretty subjective...

...I'd like to counter them with my own subjective observations.

I smoke pot daily, sometimes a lot. I am a hard working, biology and english double major. Most of my friends are pot heads and are sucessful scientist or science related professionals.

Alcohol, from a scientific standpoint, does more harm to the liver than marijuana smoke to the lungs; there have been absolutely no observed cases of lung cancer caused by smoking marijuana-- on the contrary, there were several articles in medical journals this year that suggested THC not only is non-carcinogenic, but that it was actually an anti-carcinogenic agent that shrank tumors.

Alcohol and I do not mix. But I love my pot, and I am an intelligent, thoughtful, productive member of society. Marijuana isn't just a way to relax-- it is a medical plant of great benefit.

[idgiehkt]

13. alcohol is technically a metabolic poison.

thanks for this:
"Alcohol, from a scientific standpoint, does more harm to the liver than marijuana smoke to the lungs."

I don't do either drug, though I used to enjoy copious amounts of both, almost always simultaneously, so needless to say I wouldn't know whether I was stupid during those times because I was stoned off my ass or drunk off my keester.

I just think drugs are drugs, especially these two, but over the long term alcohol is far more harmful to the body organs than pot if consumed addictively.

http://www.bettyfordcenter.org/news/askdrwest/warticle.php?id=6

[WindRavenX]

15. Both of my parents are alcoholics. I partied and drank a lot Frosh year

But I hated it-- hated the taste, hated the way it made me feel-- but pot was, and is, great for me. Makes me very mellow and happy. Alcohol made me anxious.

But to each his own! Some like a scotch at the end of a day, I prefer a nice big bowl :smoke:

[idgiehkt]

31. my ex-boyfriend's

mom smoked a half a joint every night after work. That was her daily usage. It kills me that it's illegal, and yet people run around driving drunk killing people on a legal drug every day but everyone is so up in arms about marijuana.

[Writer]

35. Would that be because folks who smoke pot...

don't feel quite as compelled to do something active like drive a car?

[Downtown Hound]

40. People drive stoned all the time

You just don't know it because they rarely cause accidents. Most studies that have focused on the effects of driving and marijuana smoking have concluded that the only time marijuana seriously impairs your ability to drive a car is when a complex situation arises that requires quick and decisive judgment. This reason alone is reason to steer clear of a car when under the influence of weed, but in the overwhelming majority of cases stoned drivers do just fine on the road.

Alcohol, on the other hand, seriously impairs your muscular coordination, hence why there are many alcohol-related accidents and very few marijuana ones.

[Writer]

42. Driving without the ability for "quick and decisive judgment" is okay?

I dunno. I'm not sure how many drive high versus how many drive drunk, but neither sounds like a good thing to me.

[Downtown Hound]

44. Did you miss the part where I said that that is why people should steer

clear of a car when under the influence of weed? My point was that it isn't as bad as alcohol. That's not giving a green light for people to go ahead and do it.

[Writer]

46. Wait... hold on (I'm chuckling now)...

are you saying that people should steer clear of a car with a DRIVER under the influence of weed, or that someone under the influence of weed should steer clear of cars?

If it's the latter... how in the hell can a person avoid other cars if he or she is driving on weed?

[Downtown Hound]

49. What have you been smoking?

:smoke:

[Writer]

50. I don't know, friend, but...

need a bag of fritos, friend?

[Downtown Hound]

51. No thanks. Got my own.

:evilgrin:

[idgiehkt]

43. I don't know

I didn't lose consciousness when I was stoned only. When I drank, I was frequently in black-outs. I would come to at various times behind the wheel, I guess you would call it brown-outs. Like the time I almost ran over this guy in a gas station parking lot (I 'came to' sitting behind the wheel and he was braced against the hood of my car), I remember that moment after I hit the brakes and then nothing after that until I 'came to' again on my bedroom floor hours later. I'd much rather someone be half-comatose in the basement than out driving the mountain highways like I did.

[RevolutionaryActs]

4. Oooooh

:popcorn:




Sorry, someone had to do it. :hi:

[WindRavenX]

6. I'm defending the good plant!

The plant has been a GODSEND for my anxiety the last 2 years.

[RevolutionaryActs]

9. As you should, my child.

:patriot:


I'm definitely on your side. :7

[Writer]

17. Hey, now.

I posted this thread for enlightenment, not argument. Can I have some of that popcorn? I think I have the munchies.

[RevolutionaryActs]

21. Contact high?

:rofl:

[Writer]

24. Yup. From secondary marijuana posting...

or something like that. Yup.

[Ptah]

37. And, now I'm enlightened. Thanks.

[Writer]

38. Is that the sun...

or is that an egg just fertilized? I can't tell.

Sorry. It's the bupropion hydrochloride. :P

[Ptah]

39. Here's a close-up.

[Writer]

41. Whoa... now I'm REALLY confused.

I think I've seen that when I study my nostrils in the mirror. :shrug:

[Ptah]

45. So, youre nostrils are green from drinking?

:shrug:

[Writer]

48. Yes.

It's a combination of Tequila, half and half, and Comet. It's quite a rush.

[Kali]

27. ...

:popcorn: and :beer: = mmmmmmmmm

add a little :smoke: and :thumbsup: :hi:

[RevolutionaryActs]

29. bwhaha! Hell yeah, now you're talking!

:bounce:

[NNadir]

7. You're not missing anything.

I've been there and done that and my advice about marijuana: Don't.

[Writer]

8. Can you elaborate on why? n/t

[NNadir]

26. First of all, you are inhaling smoke.

This is obviously bad for you.

Second of all you are seeking to place your mind in an alternate state. Frequently people contend - without much external support - that this is a superior state. However they are making this "judgement" in an impaired state.

Pot made me foolish, boorish, lazy and impeded my ability to use my mind to it's optimal state. After a while life on pot became normal and life without pot became exotic and exciting. The people with whom I found myself interacting while on post were waste cases. After quitting pot, life became exciting and thrilling and interesting.

I smoked pot frequently, several times a day, for about six or seven years. Then I quit cold turkey. I look back on my pot smoking years as dissolute and wasted. One of the things I would do if I had my life to do over again would be to not pick up my first joint. It was a waste of money, time, potential and good health.

[Writer]

30. But do you drink?

And do you think casual drinking long term would have affected you differently?

[NNadir]

33. I used to drink a lot.

This was around the time I smoked pot.

Occassionally now, I'll have a beer or a glass of wine. I almost never drink hard liquor. I avoid getting drunk. I will confess that I have been in business situations where drinking was more or less required. I hated that, and changed my line of work.

This isn't an either/or thing, though. One is not compelled to do one or the other.

I would say that I have observed in my more than 5 decades on the planet that out of control drinking causes more damage than out of control pot smoking. That said, I think one can recover more quickly from one beer than one can from one joint. A joint makes you stupid all day in my opinion.

[ghostsofgiants]

19. I don't drink or smoke, but I'd much rather hang out with my friends while they're high than drunk.

[Redstone]

22. All I will say is that I have known more than one persho who would NEVER think

of drinking a shot of whiskey before going to work in the morning, but would smoke a doob on the drive in.

Not a great attitude.


Redstone

[Kali]

32. Depends on the job.

:evilgrin:


I am sort of kidding, but I do know one of those too. (and no it's not me. Unfortunately I can not handle pot much at all anymore. Shame cause it smells so good and I would love to be riding and be able to take a break and roll one and smoke it while eying the scenery like some movie cowboy. If I were to do that I would instantly lose a couple dozen IQ points and odds are high I would get paranoid - and I HATE that, I have to be well alcohol-lubricated to enjoy weed any more)

[Redstone]

47. I can't stand the smell of it, even though I smoke cigs. People are welcome to fire up

a doob or a pipe at my house (as long as the kid isn't around), but they (including Mrs R) have to do it outside.

Of course, I don't smoke cigs in the house myself, so I guess that's a fair rule for me to have.

Redstone

[mainegreen]

28. It's totally 100% relative to the user. People react differently.

Some people should never do any drug, some people can do some drugs, some people get really addicted to drugs, some people just don't seem to have the addictive personality. The whole drugs are evil/drugs don't hurt people argument has no answer or many answers depending on how you look at it.

[Kali]

36. pretty good answer, actually

[MadAsHellNewYorker]

52. cigarettes and alcohol beat ecstasy, LSD and cannabis, according to

new scientist magazine and The UK Science and Technology Select Committee

http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg19125633.100-drugdanger-league-table-revealed.html

When it comes to danger, cigarettes and alcohol beat ecstasy, LSD and cannabis, according to a league table of the harm they cause.

The UK Science and Technology Select Committee, which advises the government, commissioned an assessment of 20 legal and illegal stimulants to examine the actual social and physical harm they cause based on scientific evidence.

[some guy]

53. I used to smoke marijuana, I still drink alcohol

I gave up marijuana because I enjoyed it too much. :smoke:

I always vote for decriminalizing or legalizing marijuana, though I kind of wonder how tempted I would be if I could go to the liquor store and buy marijuana...

I can keep a bottle of whiskey around for weeks or months at a time; marijuana was something that if I had it I smoked it at least daily.

[Zookeeper]

54. I enjoy good wine and good beer....

although I don't enjoy feeling drunk. When I was a teen, and the only pot available was really weak, bright green leafy stuff (kind of like dried parsley), I thought it was mildly amusing. However, when I tried the really gunky, brown "good stuff" I hated it. I'm fairly hyper and don't like feeling sedated. Caffeine is my drug of choice along with dark chocolate and crossword puzzles (mental masturbation).

Being around people who are stoned is more boring than being around people who have had a drink, but are not drunk. (IMHO)

[Starbucks Anarchist]

55. Like them both, but I'd choose pot if I had to pick one.

:smoke:

[Blue_In_AK]

56. Writer, I'm 60 years old

and have been smoking pot almost daily since 1967, sometimes a little more, sometimes a little less. According to my physical last month, I'm in perfect health. I never get sick, not even the sniffles, people tell me I look like I'm in my 40s, and I feel younger than that. Motivation has never been a problem for me - I graduated from college, I've always worked hard, and I still do. I raised three great daughters who are doing well now on their own. My life has been an adventure, and I'm still having a great time.

I guess what I'm saying is that, yes, there are burn-outs -- we all know some -- but every person is different and how they react to marijuana, or alcohol, is different. But over the years, the alcoholics in my life have caused me a LOT more heartache than the pot smokers. So I'm sticking with the stoners.

:hippie:

[XemaSab]

57. I think people react VERY differently to MJ,

notsomuch to alcohol.

I know people where pot makes them motivated and focused, and I know people who are total waste products when high. Personally, I get super paranoid. :shrug:

[Blue_In_AK]

59. I have a very close friend who is like you that way...

It always seemed kind of funny to me, because she was a big coke head when she was younger, but the cocaine didn't seem to make her paranoid at all, unlike most people. I have no use for cocaine ... it does nothing for me, it doesn't even get me buzzed.

Everybody's chemistry is different, but I think the urge to alter one's consciousness is pretty much universal. People just choose different means of getting there.

[XemaSab]

60. I believe in the doors of perception

but pot just never opened them for me. :shrug:

[buzzard]

58. Two Canadian College Professor's Win Right To Smoke Pot On Campus

http://www.allheadlinenews.com/articles/7005518406

I have to say from personal experience the alcoholics I have known have caused more damage to themselves and others than the pot smokers I know. Also as far as this article is concerned I do know that some people find pain relief from pot. I tried it but it didn't help me however if it allows someone to get through the day easier then it is fine with me,