I hate to add another Anna Nicole thread, but I'm going to anyway

[belladonna]

I was too busy yesterday to even think about logging on to DU and I'm almost glad of it now. Some of the threads I've come across today just blew my fucking mind and NOT in a good way. I'm certainly not a huge Anna Nicole fan, but I've always felt vaguely sorry for her. Yeah, she was an adult and perhaps she could have handled certain aspects of her life differently. No, she wasn't a paragon of virtue and made mistakes and might have even made it easier for some of the slime out there to take advantage of her.

But for all those I've seen on DU pissing on her grave, just answer one question for me. Name one mean-spirited thing she ever did. Marry an older man for his money? Then why did she wait so long to marry him? Why did she wait until she was successful, or at least a success in her eyes, before marrying him? From all accounts, he wanted her to marry him right away and she insisted on waiting. What else is there, other than the fact that she was not, by her own admission, a freaking rocket scientist?

As for her pushing real news off the front page, give me a fucking break. Like the fucking newschannels were all set to do an in depth report on what a fucked up quagmire Iraq is and, just because of Anna Nicole dying, it all had to be put on hold. THEY WEREN'T GOING TO REPORT ANYTHING BUT THE SAME OLD CRAP ANYWAY!! C-Span isn't reporting on her death. Turn to C-Span and watch the Senate run around in endless circles about whether they're going to debate on Iraq if you can't stand watching anything but news about politics, okay?

Jeebus, what is so HARD about being nice? I know we're all suffering battle fatigue after the crap the Boy King has put us through, but I'm not going to lose any shred of humanity I have and stop caring about everything else and neither should you. If you don't care, use hide thread and save the vitriol for a punching bag or go out and do something constructive with your anger. Fact is, a child is left without a mother and a woman who was 39 YEARS OLD is dead for no good reason. That IS a tragedy. Period.

[SeattleGirl]

1. Great post, belladonna

From some of the absolutely nasty crap I saw posted yesterday, it makes me wonder what kind of person these folks think is "acceptable", and worthy of a tad bit of respect upon their death.

[Left Is Write]

2. Thank you.

[MonkeyFunk]

3. Thank you Belladonna

I will never, as long and as hard as I try, understand the mindset of people who would DELIBERATELY go out of their way to shit on a thread where people are sharing their sorrow, and take glee in it.

It's just sick.

[belladonna]

25. Neither will I

And I really, really don't like the ones using the excuse that somehow she's keeping the real news from being reported. What cave were they dwelling in for the last 6 or 7 years anyway?

[MonkeyFunk]

27. Yeah

cuz you just KNOW that CNN had an in-depth exposé on the administration's crimes that got bumped by her death.

[Midlodemocrat]

4. Thank you for this. As I said before

Taking joy in someone's death diminishes one. And that little baby is now motherless. Tragic.

[terrya]

5. Thank you, belladonna

There are some assholes around here who need to read this.

I appreciate your comments. They needed to be said.

[ronnykmarshall]

10. Ya think they will?

Or will they just shit on this one too?

[belladonna]

12. Oh, I expect them to shit on it

They'll be along soon enough. That wasn't enough to keep me from posting this though. It's just unreal to see how mean-spirited some people can be sometimes :(

[terrya]

13. If they had an ounce of humanity in them...

then yes, I would hope they would read belladonna's post. And perhaps take something from it.

But fuck...I've been around this place long enough to know it won't happen. Wishful thinking, Ronny.

[xmas74]

14. You know damn well they'll shit on it.

I do my best to get along w/ everyone here and I try to find some common ground w/ each and every poster I speak to on here. After a few of these threads on her (and a couple of incidents in the past from some of the same posters) I've officially started my ignore list.


Ignoring someone seems so mean but the recent behavior of a few has shown that it must be done.

[ronnykmarshall]

18. I don't use ignore

But if I did those posters would be at the top of the list.

[xmas74]

22. I didn't until today.

(Except for one other time but that was an accident-I didn't mean to do it!)

I just don't feel like reading those comments. They almost make you sick.

[MonkeyFunk]

16. oh, they'll be here.

If they don't crap on threads like this, how will people know how cool they are?

I couldn't believe it when I read there was a flamewar over Laura Branigan's death!! Laura Branigan!!!

The Pope, Nixon, Reagan, etc... yeah. They were powerful world figures who pissed people off. But Laura F'n Branigan?!

[Caoimhe]

6. She never offended me

She seemed like a nice person who was overwhelmed by fame and people not always doing the right thing for her. I was sad to hear she died, not because I thought she was some amazing talent, but that she was a person, a vulnerable person. She had a new baby, she had just lost her son. It all adds up to a tragic life. I hope she has found peace now.

Thanks for your post. I couldn't believe the nastiness either. But DU was nothing like Fark yesterday. Those people went into immediate circle jerk mode about it.

I try not to speak ill of the dead, and that can be a hard thing, like when Reagan and Nixon died. :hide:

[belladonna]

8. You know, with the Reagan and Nixon thread, I could ignore most of the nastiness

Reagan and Nixon did some pretty horrid things and, while I didn't really feel the need to say anything nasty about them, I could sort of understand why some did. But Anna Nicole? She didn't HURT anyone, regardless of what anyone says about golddigging. That old man was HAPPY with her. She obviously brought him some much needed joy and happiness in the last years of his life. She didn't throw mental patients out into the street or pretend that homeless people didn't exist. I just don't get the hatred at all :shrug:

[Nickster]

7. Sounds right on target to me. n/t

[Shakespeare]

9. Well said.

:applause:

[sundog]

11. good stuff

:thumbsup:

[ronnykmarshall]

15. G'on belladonna!

Anyone with a screen name of a Stevie Nicks song is ok by me in the first place!

[belladonna]

17. Yay, somebody finally gets what my screenname is about!!

There were some people back in the day who thought I named myself after a porn star or poison :D

[ronnykmarshall]

19. Her first solo album! I love Sharon and Lori's back up vocals.

You can ride high atop your pony
I know you wont fall...
cause the whole things phoney.
You can fly swinging from your trapeze
Scaring all the people
But youll never scare me

Bella donna...
And we fight... for the northern star

No speed limit... this is the fast lane
Its just the way that it is here
And you say... I never thought it could

Bella donna... we fight...
For the northern star

And the ladys feeling
Like the moon that she loved
Dont you know that the stars are
A part of us
And the ladys feeling
Just like the moon that she loved

And you say... I never thought it could
Bella donna...
Come in out of the darkness...

You are in love with...
And Im ready to sail...
Its just a feeling...
Sort of captures your soul

Bella donna...

And the woman may be awestruck
And the woman may truly care
But the woman is so tired...
So the woman dissappears...

Come in out of the darkness...

Bella donna... my soul...

Dont change... baby please dont change
And you say...
And your face becomes thin
You never thought it could
Come in out of the darkness
Bella donna...

You are in love with
And Im ready to sail
Its just a feeling

[belladonna]

20. Heh, I had the 8 TRACK of that

I feel so old thinking about it right now, but I wore that tape OUT :D

[ronnykmarshall]

21. Me too

My car ('77 Toyota Celica) had an 8-track in it. But I also had the record. I think one of the first CD's I bought was Bella Donna.

[belladonna]

24. Mine too

The minute I found it on CD, I grabbed it. One of my favorites from Stevie, just good from beginning to end.

[ronnykmarshall]

26. Same with Trouble in Shangri-La

This CD was my savior from going bat shit crazy after 9/11. That and her concert in October '01.

[belladonna]

28. Ahh yes, another great one

Of course, there's not too much that Stevie Nicks did that I didn't like, but those two truly stand out.

[Xipe Totec]

23. Good post

Thank you, Donna Bella!

[Raven]

29. Well, here comes the shit...

this is very sad. no one should pass away so young leaving a small child behind but I really don't think this was a national tragedy. I think that the people who have objected to this are simply struck by the disproportionate attention being paid to someone who didn't really stand for anything (as far as I know) and who gave very little back to this world. Someone who milked the press for all it was worth ... and now they are milking her. Today, for me, the real issue has been the press coverage...all day...all the time. And I just wonder why we would spend so much time on speculating on Nicole and the three self proclaimed fathers of her child... and on and on and on. It just seems misplaced to me in the world as it is today.

I know I'm going to get piled on but please tell me one thing that this women left as a legacy that is worth anything. Don't misunderstand me, I am sorry for her passing but I am sorrier for what she left (or didn't leave) behind. Now I'll put on my slicker because I just know what's coming!

[Shakespeare]

30. I don't think anyone has suggested anywhere that this is a national tragedy.

I tried to sum up last night why I think people are interested in her death:

Here's the way these things usually go on DU: somebody famous dies, a few people post threads saying, "oh, how sad." If it were just left at that, the threads would fall quickly off the page after people said their piece. But it is such an ugly, jarring afront to have the words no quicker out of your mouth (or off your keyboard) and some asshole starts up with the "oh, he/she was a worthless human being," or "what'd they do for society," or "she only got by on her looks," or "she was just trash." Or my personal favorite, the suggestion that we're somehow incapable of simultaneously maintaining our political focus while commenting on the sad passing of some celebrity.

What that puts out there in undiluted form is ugliness that I really hate to see on this site. It's an excuse for people to wallow in sexism, classism, and often homophobia. Yes, ANS was poor white trash from Mexia, Texas. She was uneducated, unsophisticated, and utterly unprepared for what fame brought her. She was beautiful, and flawed, and probably not terribly deep. But I can see no way to justify some of the outright viciousness I've seen here today. She's a bitch, a slut, a golddigger, a drug addict. Gee, way to pass judgment, folks--and in this specific case, there's more than just a slight whiff of sexism.

Yes, it's fine it you think the media overblows it--I happen to agree. But to use the occasion of someone's death to trot out your (collectively speaking) own issues that need to be dealt with (see: sexism, classism, homophobia) is just kinda sick.

By all accounts the woman didn't have a mean bone in her body, she was an advocate for gay rights, and an effective PETA spokesperson. So, no, she didn't live a "worthless" life. She was also iconic and tragic in a way that should make the outpouring of comments here instantly understandable. There's something we can't resist about a beautiful, fucked-up girl who can never find happiness, and then to have her life end prematurely just compounds the tragedy. It's human nature to be fascinated by that.

It's not the speaking ill of the dead that's so offensive; it's the ugly little reasons why some choose to speak ill that I find so disturbing.

[belladonna]

31. You said it for me

And said it better than I could. I'll just let your reply stand for what I was going to say. Can't put it any better than that.

[Raven]

32. An enormous amount

of wasted energy here. My post was not vicious, ugly or sexist/racist/ homophobic. Merely pointing something out about what some people apparently think is earth shaking and important in this life. I knew there was a good reason why I haven't visited this site in a long, long time.

[Shakespeare]

33. I didn't say your post was. I pasted in my response from a thread from last night...

...because many of my comments then are relevant to what I wanted to say to you, and I didn't feel like retyping the whole thing. I thought by pointing out that I was pasting it, you might've figured that out.

And I reiterate, I don't think ANYBODY has found her death earth-shaking or important; they've just found it very sad, and have been viciously attacked for it (and again, not by YOU, but en masse yesterday).

To start out from a debate point of "she wasn't a national treasure" is to begin from a point of hyperbole that has no resemblance to what was ever going on among those who chimed in to mourn her passing.

You haven't visited the forum in awhile? Then be grateful you didn't see a few threads in particular yesterday. I know you from your previous posts as a very decent person, and I'm pretty sure you'd have found them dismaying at the very least.

[L A Woman]

38. didn't you say this....

"please tell me one thing that this women left as a legacy that is worth anything."

a statement like that comes from a very deeply nasty part of a person. i think the fact that so many people are mourning her loss is a testament to her legacy. what's yours?

[ronnykmarshall]

41. Well, you know one thing she did.

Anna was a great supporter for gay rights and I stepped up to the plate today and told that on "Stephanie Miller" this morning.

[LostinVA]

64. Shakespeare didn't call you any of that, as her post makes clear

Any offense you're taking is from your own manufactured sense of outrage. Shakespeare wrote a very nice post, with not one iota of "wasted energy" or nastiness.

Jeebus.

[lildreamer316]

34. Wish I could rec this reply.

Thank you; so very much.
And thanks to belladonna also. Both great.

[L A Woman]

36. it happened 24 hours ago

DUers were bitching about it 3 minutes after it was announced. i've seen plenty of coverage of other things over the past 24 hours - it has NOT just been all Anna, all the time. but it's a HUGE story and it should be covered.

but this is about deeply mean and vicious people. you see them every time a famous person dies. and i took it as a great opportunity to use the hell out of the ignore feature.

[last_texas_dem]

61. I've refrained from posting in these threads, but

I just wanted to tell you that I agree with several of the points you make. I've had the same thoughts as you when reading a couple of the threads here on this issue, and I think your post sums up my own feelings as well.

And I'll add this: Yes, I didn't like that a handful of posters made disparaging remarks about Anna Nicole Smith so shortly after the news broke that she had died. I had no problem, however, with the posters who complained about both the media in general and some on DU treating the death like a national tragedy. I see absolutely nothing disrespectful or cruel about disapproving of the way the death has been treated by the media. To me, the most offensive posts I have seen have been the sanctimonious, preachy postings by a number of holier-than-thou DUers, railing against *all* the *cruel* posters who would *dare* to criticize the media turning the event into a circus. I just don't get it. Aren't most DUers disgusted when the mainstream media behaves like the National Enquirer and spends excessive amounts of time on stories about celebrities? Why is this somehow such a different event? I just cannot see how criticizing the media treatment of a death equates to criticizing the recently deceased and was disgusted by all of the posters on here who were purposely equating the two.

[Seabiscuit]

70. She didn't just "milk the press for all it was worth"...

She milked her breasts for all they were worth.

[Coventina]

72. She campaigned against wearing fur and also exposed the cruelty

of Iams.

There was a thread in GD about it.

I'd say that was a good legacy.

[hickman]

35. It's nice to see someone standing up for her.

She was always an easy target and knew it. I'm sorry for her, her son and her daughter. I'm also sorry for her husband who always seemed to stand by her thru thick and thin.

edit for no stupid pun intended at all.

[DainBramaged]

37. What did she do for humanity other than draw attention to herself?

Simple question. And though I completely disagree with your opinion, you are entitled to it.

I have a friend who works for the ASPCA, no fanfare, no accolades. But EVERY day she goes out to rescue mistreated and injured animals.

She will receive praise from me, but not a celebrity.

[L A Woman]

39. isn't the fact that she was human enough not to dance on her grave?

do we need to make lists of reasons we shouldn't pee on someone's grave?

and the reality is, attention was drawn to her...she was tall, gorgeous and hard to miss. i don't think she can be faulted for being the object of the world's attention.

the real question i have is, why do you try sooooo hard to dig for reasons not to behaved like a civilized, decent person?

but of course....chuckle chuckle....when saddam hussein was hanged, there were very few grave-dancers on DU...

[DainBramaged]

42. Civilized in who's eyes? I asked a question, you berated me

I don't care what you think about me, She wasn't a Deity and I am entitled to my opinion of her, and you have NO right to disparage me for mine.

[L A Woman]

47. but your entire argument is baseless

who said she was a deity? i have yet to read a single post claiming she was a deity. we are talking about why you should NOT piss on someone's grave. the answer is not "because they are God." the answer is "because they are human." is this really something that has to be explained TO A LIBERAL????????????????????????????????????????

[DainBramaged]

50. (sigh) no problem, believe what you want to about everyone in the news

bye

On edit,

One more point, Baseless is Reich-wing lurkers. Baseless is heaping praise on celebrities. Baseless is telling members their opinion is baseless.

In my eyes, so is yours. Since you block private messages, I put you on ignore. If you think that your opinion is the only and correct opinion, at least I won't have to see it.

[Shell Beau]

53. Who do you NOT have on ignore?

on edit, I guess you can't see this! :rofl:

[flvegan]

48. The OP was a question, and you berated it.

At least you CAN recognize that.

[flvegan]

43. Well, since you asked

and you mention animal welfare/rescue, then you might find this interesting:
http://blog.peta.org/archives/2007/02/anna_nicole_smi.php



And as a vegetarian, she did quite a bit for animals every day, with every bite she took.

[DainBramaged]

44. I don't eat meat either, does that make me a super hero?

Let me think, how many Democratic candidates did she contribute too? And when she was doing her reality show, did she contribute any of her gelt to worthy causes? Like DU?

I really hope when Jimmy Carter finds his Heavenly home he gets as much praise as this bimbo.

[Name removed]

46. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[DainBramaged]

49. Your opinion, but this time, you made the ignore list

I don't put up with insults any more. I just report them

When the fuck did DU become Hanni ty or Freeperville, where differing opinions are flamed and the posters insulted for their opinions? Jesus Christ on a sandwich, how do you get away with insults and not get the granite sandwich? Like I said, you think it's funny bashing members for their opinion, too bad we don' have a resolution for that here.

She was a freaking celebrity, nothing more. And you people think she is the second coming.

How fucking sad.

[flvegan]

52. Fantastic!!

YOUR "ignore" list is like a Winner's Circle here.

[L A Woman]

51. is "bimbo" a term that you use often?

mysogynyunderground.com should have a direct link to this site.

let's be honest here. the VAST majority of people who are dancing on her grave are freaky, unattractive little males who spend all their time on the computer, doing I think we all know what, fantasizing about women who look like Anna Nicole and hating them because they know they will never have them. they will never have anyone because they have the social skills of a door knob.

really. must we keep pretending otherwise?

[Shell Beau]

54. Trust me here, you are talking to a brick wall!!

There is no point unfortunately!

[Name removed]

55. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Shell Beau]

56. hahahaha!! You're getting put on ignore!! Just wait!

:rofl:





Seriously, I agree with you.

[Name removed]

60. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Fran Kubelik]

40. BUT WHAT DID SHE DO FOR HUMANITY??111???

Apparently it is only appropriate to say nice things (or even not say mean, evil, judgmental things) about people who were saints. Maybe if she had died rescuing a baby cow from a roadside mine in Somalia. Maybe then it would be appropriate to say nice things about her...that is if we could prove that she had consistently voted for Democrats. Otherwise...of with her head.

[L A Woman]

45. ha ha OR if she was an evil dictator....

evil dictators who slaughter thousands of people and are hanged for it get the RED CARPET treatment, as we recently discovered. no grave dancing there!

[terrya]

71. She didn't win the Nobel Peace Prize, so who gives a shit?

Come on. There are certain people...gasp, even celebrities...who you liked. And you are sad when you hear news of their deaths. And especially, an unexpectedly sudden death such as Anna Nicole Smith's. It's needlessly mean spirited to come in to a tribute thread and piss all over it...such as the assholes who came in this thread. Again...the hide thread feature works quite well.

[Fran Kubelik]

73. I think you missed my sarcasm.

:shrug:

I agree with you entirely.

[seaglass]

57. I'm not getting good vibes from the 20/20 interview with her

mother.

Her daughter died and she's talking about how Anna Nicole never helped the family out financially. What kind of loving mother would say something like that the day after her daughter died?

This is just sad.

[Hardrada]

58. I noticed that too.

More like a disapproving stepmother.

[Shakespeare]

59. They've been estranged from her for YEARS.

And now I think we know why, as we watch her glom on to every talk show that'll take her. She's also lying when she says ANS grew up middle class in Houston. She was BORN in Houston, but grew up in Mexia. And in no way were they middle class. Lower middle at absolute best, but they were pretty much dirt-poor.

[L A Woman]

67. as i posted somewhere else, my mother is like that, as well...

i totally feel for what anna has gone through with her mother. if i got famous, my mother would call the tabloids to sell her story for a hundred bucks. and her story would be that she was a great mother and we were middle class. in reality, she spent her entire welfare check on new clothes and pot.

i totally get ANS.

[LostinVA]

65. She ISN'T a loving mother, that's the thing

ANS hadn't talked to her for about 15 years, and I believe her mother didn't even come to her son's funeral. The only thing that woman wants is money.

Why did ANS have to financially support a woman who had tried to beat her down?

[seaglass]

69. I don't know anything about Anna Nicole or her family and haven't

watched any of the coverage until the 20/20 last night.

Her mother made me sick. I think she was jealous of her daughter even when her daughter was young. I don't think ANS owed her mother a thing.

[QMPMom]

62. Excellent, belladonna! I agree with you 100%.

Thank you for posting your thoughts. The dissing of Anna Nicole is so disrespectful and very maddening. I always felt sorry for her, too. She really never harmed anyone except maybe herself.

My heart breaks for her daughter and those left behind that loved her.

[LostinVA]

63. Great post

[wildhorses]

66. well said--

:thumbsup:

[Skittles]

68. I agree with you

I liked that Anna Nicole, for a completely phony personna, was the most un-phony gal to go about it - in other words, she was what she was and made no apologies for it. I felt terrible for her when her son passed away and now I feel so bad for her baby girl. And yes I can do all this while grieving for the casualties in Iraq.

[graywarrior]

74. I wasn't going to read this because I was afraid it was another Anna Nichol hate thread

But now I'm glad I did read it and I thank you for posting. Any one of us here could hhave been in the same predicament. I'm sorry she died.