What is it with Women?

[coloradodem2005]

In continuing with the post earlier about a fellow confused male, I would just like to ask why is it that women could make a 180 degree turn so quickly on a guy, especially when he is a good one.

I posted my story before, but once again. This girl started talking to me online. So we started emailing back and forth. The email turned into calling. I was very interested. I used to be into looks, but by the current stage of my life, I feel that the most important thing is that we have common interests and that we can have good conversation. I felt that she and I had a lot in common. In her profile she even said that nice guys finish first. I am a nice guy, so I have been told. We agreed to meet face to face. So I met her. We talked for two hours. I thought it was going well. We exchanged stories, told jokes, then talked about going to a movie. We were on our way out and she said that she wanted to take separate cars so she would not have to backtrack. I gave her a hug and then we were on our way. I followed her until she pulled off into a shopping center. She told me that she got a call from her friend's mom that her friend was in the hospital because she got into an accident. Said she would call me tomorrow.

I went home. Sent her a quick email expressing my concern and hoping that things were alright. I tried calling her the next day. Her phone must have been off because I got one of those automated messages that says "We're sorry, the number you are trying is no longer in service." I think that the phone may have been off. I tried again three days later. The first time, she didn't answer and it went to her voice mail. THe second time, she was on the phone. THe third time it went to her voicemail again. I figured that she had probably brushed me off. I did send her another email expressing my concern on Friday as a last ditch effort. But I figured this one was over.

I know that I was brushed off. This has been my first true date with a woman at 24, sadly. But I have been brushed off in a pretty cold way by women in the past. Which contributed to my not having a date for a long time. My only fault is that I want to care about someone. Even when I don't really care. Maybe that is my problem. It is a quality about myself that I hate. It is also the reason I am writing this post. I will tell you this. I will never hurt a woman. I would never rape a woman, I would never raise my hand to a woman. I would never put a woman down. I would always appreciate her. I may even compliment her too much.

It has lead me to believe that women hate me and has helped to make me cynical. Mind you this was certainly not my attitude during the date.

[NewHampster]

1. I've been married for 30 years and loved many women

but you my boy may need to start thinking about whether women are what you really want.

nuf said, i'm outa this thread....

[Droopy]

11. What's that supposed to mean?

How could you make that insinuation and then run off. I don't think you're as wise as your years should have made you.

[Blue-Jay]

28. That means that NewHampster thinks you're gay.

Because some stupid woman didn't call you back. See? It makes perfect sense to me. :eyes:

[coloradodem2005]

32. Men who have problems with women are not gay.

Just because a man is inept around women does not make him gay.

[Demonaut]

34. true, but not all that shines is gold

keep trying, everyone you meet has needs or wants, just because one girl or many does not feel that you are the "one" does not mean all women are the same...give it time. Variety is the spice of life.

[camero]

2. Never judge a person on thier words

Look at thier actions. Plenty of fish in the sea.

[Deja Q]

3. Same thing happened to me 3 times this week... what is it with people?

From 3 men who initiated contact via responding to my personals ad! There's always an excuse or ambiguous end to the conversation.

But enough about me:

You might have been better off holding off after your voicemail, instead of calling back and back and back again, which likely would have turned her off...

In short, people are as reliable as random co-ordinates.

[coloradodem2005]

12. Just to be clear.

I did not leave any messages on her phone. I only called three times on Wednsday. Not before or after. The only reason I called that many times was because I was just trying to get a hold of her.

[Deja Q]

14. Oops, sorry!

If she had Caller ID (tm) she might have realized who you were though... Thogh Caller ID seems to be pointless because the only people you want to see so you can avoid them (telemarketers) can block their #s from Caller ID...

People aren't worth it. Not anymore.

[liberalhistorian]

4. Please DO NOT

JUDGE ALL WOMEN BY THE ACTIONS OF SOME WOMEN! Men are always complaining that we gals do that to them, and they're right in a lot of cases.

I had that problem with men for quite awhile after my son's father threw me out of the house when I was three months pregnant, not caring that I had nowhere to go and no money and we were engaged and planning a life together. And I'd had a few dealings with some not-so-nice men before and after that, as well.

But it would be grossly unfair of me to blame and tar ALL men in the same way because of the actions of a few, and the same thing should apply here.

The singles world is, frankly, dog-eat-dog, and you will, undoubtedly, run into situations like this. But you're young and you're obviously a really great guy, and I really think your time will come and someone will come along who appreciates you for who you are. But please DO NOT CARRY a chip on your shoulder about women, because that is a MAJOR MAJOR turn-off for both sexes. Good luck and keep us posted!

[coloradodem2005]

31. I am sorry that you went through that.

That was not cool what he did.

[Droopy]

5. Don't stop being a caring individual.

And don't let this one experience with a woman make you cynicle. Your still very young and I imagine the woman that you had the date with was, also. I think things will get better with age.

Some people meet the person of their dreams when they are 18. Others have to work at it a little. I'm 31 and still haven't found that special person, but don't be discouraged. She's out there.

[WiltedFlowerChild]

6. chalk it up and move on

speaking from experience (50 years, 27 of those married to a real nice guy :) I would say you are lucky to be rid of that one. Hang in there. You sound all right to me. I know it's a cliche but you will find what you are looking for and be amazed when you do because you had given up looking!

[jpgray]

7. Sounds like she's not for you. Look elsewhere. (nt)

[SarahB]

8. A lot of women feel just like you

You can't catagorize us all by one experience.

"My only fault is that I want to care about someone. Even when I don't really care. Maybe that is my problem. It is a quality about myself that I hate."

I could write these same words under very different life circumstances. It's painful and I'm sorry you're feeling bad. :hug:

[coloradodem2005]

13. It's not just one experience.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

18. Here's what happened to me

A man answered my personals ad, I called him back, and we agreed to meet in Portland. I was living in a small town an hour's drive away, so it took some effort to meet him.

He was late to the appointment, and when he showed up, he was wearing cutoffs and a dirty T-shirt. He explained that he couldn't stay and talk because he had been tapped for a last-minute volleyball game.

A graduate school acquaintance once asked me out and when I didn't want to have sex on the first date, he not only stormed out but told all his friends that I was a "frigid bitch." For a couple of weeks, his friends would make remarks to that effect whenever I encountered them.

I could go on, but the point is that everyone who has been on the singles' scene has some scars to show for it.

I'm going to give you the same advice I give to every guy who starts a thread like this. That is, ask a platonic female friend about the impression that you make. I asked a female friend's husband about the impression that I was making, and it was one of the most valuable (and painful) discussions of my entire life.

It has been my experience that neither men nor women are good at guessing what the opposite sex finds attractive.

[alittlelark]

54. Lydia has very good advice.

Your female friends are your best bet.

Also, after reading your post, I was wondering about your social skills. Too intense perhaps....just a guess.

Talk to the gals - they'll set ya straight!! But keep an open mind - that which you percieve as ridiculous or silly could very well be just what you are lacking, for whatever subconcious reason.

Best of Luck!!

[SOteric]

9. I think your question is sexist in its phrasing, do you think

men have never behaved badly with regard to seeing a woman again? Do you think they've never tried to ditch someone in a hurry, stood a woman up for an appointment, done a 180 when they found out a prospective relationship wasn't what they'd hoped?

Realistically there are individuals of both genders whose behaviour with regard to relationships and dating is hurtful or abhorrent. And there are people of both genders who try to behave with as much sensitivity and honour as they can even when it becomes obvious a relationship will not be forthcoming.

[coloradodem2005]

15. True.

THe thing is I am looking at things from a male's perspective. Specifically mine. Many women say the same thing about men, because they are looking at things from their perspective.


You are very right that it can be sexist. But take into account the context of what I am saying this in.

[SOteric]

16. So,

you think your specific circumstances should excuse your sexist phrasing and/or attitude?

Interesting.

I suspect if everyone got a pass on their intolerance based on their unfortunate life circumstances we wouldn't need to concern ourselves with tolerance any longer.

I'm sorry for your troubles, truly I am. We've all had a share or two of grief from love if we're old enough to vote. But I still think you ought not to give yourself permission to frame the issues in this way.

Your question is more genuinely: "why are there so many unprincipled, insensitive people in the world?" Not 'what is it with women.'

[slinkerwink]

38. now that's a better question to ask instead of laying the blame at women..

[coloradodem2005]

41. I guess you are right.

Like I said though, you need to look at the context of what is being said. Many women would lay the blame on men when they have been hurt many times. I wouldn't blame them for doing so, if they had my life experiences in reverse. Or have otherwise been hurt repeatedly.

[NashVegas]

10. Meeting People Online -> Offline

Can be a shock. At that point, you can no longer project/protect your vision of what you think the other person is like. Perhaps she had a different idea of who you were than who you really are, and couldn't reconcile the two.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

20. That's another point

I once had a really great correspondence going with someon I "met" on a professional mailing list, only to find that we had no chemistry whatsoever in person.

I also found this to be true with platonic friends. At one point I had four different correspondence relationships, two with men and two with women, going on. Only one of the males proved to have any chemistry in person, and only one of the women was easy to talk to in person.

On the other hand, some of my best friends in the translators' community are people that I hardly ever e-mail at all.

The connection between the Internet and real-life is tenuous.

[Susang]

17. I know you'll think this sounds corny

But you really need to work on liking yourself a little bit more. I know, easier said than done, but I think your problem really is that you don't seem to like yourself very much. It comes through in your posts on this subject.

I don't know what has happened to you in your young life to make you feel this way, but I'm guessing it must have been pretty shitty. The only advice I can offer is to get whatever kind of help appeals to you to get yourself in a better place. You're not going to find love until you actually believe you are worthy of it.

[EstimatedProphet]

19. You're making an assumption

and I bet you don't even know you are doing it. I used to make the same assumption: that she is "normal".
Maybe she has issues of her own.
Maybe she's not aware that her behavior confuses you. After all, neither of you are coming out and saying exactly how you feel.
Maybe she's simply not interested, and doesn't want to "hurt your feelings"-she then goes out with you for a date, but splits quietly because she won't have to hurt you by saying she's not interested.
Maybe she's crazy.
Maybe she doesn't care.
Jumping to the assumption that women hate you is wrong. Period. You just haven't met the right one yet. The more you focus on that idea, the harder a time you'll have.
I personally could never understand why it was that I kept going out with women that played me, until I finally woke up to the fact that I was picking women that play men. Until I saw that, and altered how I selected women, I kept picking women that would use me for attention, then when it came down to being there for me, weren't there and would say things like "where did you get the idea that I liked you anyway?" I could never understand why it was that women could never appreciate or understand that I would treat them like a queen. what I didn't understand then was that the women that I was attracted to only cared about attention, not whether I would respect them.
You're new at this. Everyone is until they get experience. Getting the experience isn't easy, but it's better afterwards. So, see if you think in retrospect that maybe she's got things going on that you didn't see at first, and see if maybe that's part of what interested you at first.

[radwriter0555]

21. If the physical attraction isn't there, it just ISN'T there... there has

to be a meeting of the minds, bodies and spirit. If one of the three doesn't mesh, it's just not going to happen.

This isn't about you, or who you are, unless of course you weigh 300 lbs and don't bathe, but appearances DO matter.

Clean, nice haircut, nice clothes, the package is important when you meet someone. This is reality. We're attracted to each other based on basic instincts that go back to our cave man ancestry.

We inately want someone who provides the appearance of being able to take care of us and raise a family.. it all comes down to that.

[EstimatedProphet]

22. As someone who weighs 300 pounds

I'd like you to rephrase the "of course" part.

[Droopy]

24. I thought that post was awful shallow

As someone who is 5'10" and 245 lbs., does that make me incapable of providing a good life for my would be mate?

[EstimatedProphet]

26. Agreed

I don't want to start a flame war here, but the fact is that people of both sexes all too often overlook people that can and would be the best mate they could find because of looks, and ALL of it is corporatist brainwashing.
The fact is, the original poster (starter of the thread) needs to understand that if indeed the person he was seeing left because of how he looks, then he simply doesn't deserve her because he is too good (and mature) for her. Same goes for anyone.
The idea that people are interested in finding stable mates that are capable of providing is understandable. I contest, though, the idea that it reflects on weight. I am 6' tall, and 300 lbs. I also have a Ph. D. and am in charge of a national environmental program for the government. I'd have to say I am pretty economically stable and capable. Also, I have a SO who I am likely to get engaged to this summer, and she's literally devoted to me.
I'm a lucky guy. I don't think my weight makes me less so.

[camero]

27. Providing

That just hits a little sore spot with me because sometimes we get sick and become unable to provide. We're in a different world today.
Both partners can work as a team.

This whole deal actually says more about society itself than men and women per se.

[EstimatedProphet]

29. Ain't that the truth!

Try having a 1-paycheck household today!

[camero]

30. I know

I just got left by an SO while I was in the hospital. I'm sure she thought she had a right because in her mind I was no longer able to "provide".

We can say that she was just a bad person but until we look underneath or put ourselves in the other's shoes, we can't take things personally.

[coloradodem2005]

25. Just to tell you.

I have had women tell me that I am quite handsome. I have a pretty good profile. I stand about six foot and am about medium build. I got a haircut that day. She even said that I was adorable. Also, my picture was posted on the site, so she knew what I looked like.

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

23. What a bee-otch

If she changed her mind about the movie, why not just say it? It can be said in a kind way. You can also say hey this just isn't working for me in a kind way. I mean, yeah, it's going to be a let down no matter how you put it, but wouldn't you rather have KNOWN that night than have to wonder about it for the next two weeks?

Again, bee-otch who is also a wimp.

Keep on keeping on. We women aren't all like that. I am married to a nice guy, too. I LIKED that he was/is a nice guy and called when he said he would, showed up when he said he would, was respectful and polite, etc.

[noiretextatique]

33. so she didn't call you...so what?

maybe she wasn't interested...maybe she's dealing with some issue that doesn't involve you. maybe she is on a different time schedule than you are. maybe she moved.
it seems your expectations were inflated...perhaps that is what you need to address. perhaps your expectations scared her off.
i know what i'm talking about...been there.
if you think women hate you, believe me it will reflect in your attitude. perhaps you need to change your attitude.

[foreigncorrespondent]

35. It mgiht help...

...if you can get a look into her past. Most times when women run from something that is good, it is because of things happening in their past that is affecting their emotions today. Trust me on that, I am a bag of mixed emotions (all past history related), and it has caused Sapphocrat some bloody huge headaches.

[Runcible Spoon]

36. I saw my roommate/ex-boyfriend

go through this over and over again with girls he met online. I hope this doesn't sound too harsh; you sound like a great guy who will make some girl very happy. It seems like you came off a little needy, just by reading your post and seeing how many times you called her. This seems to happen to people who "click" online: they meet in real time and somehow the whole allure of the mystery and anonymity dissolves. I was with my ex for 5 years, and the breakup was pretty hard on him. He went online a lot looking to meet new people, and there were quite a few girls who were really shitty to him. My guess is that after 5 years, he forgot that people have to get to know each other first before forming a relationship. Even if your emails were quite intimate, that can mean little without real face time. Honestly, she probably thought you were a nice guy but not exactly what she was looking for, and thus the whole (most likely) lie about her friend in the hospital. She probably thought that you wouldnt question the validity of such a lie. That's pretty shitty, and she should have just been honest, but take to heart that she probably thought you were a good person she couldn't reject outright. She most likely felt bad about the situation to the point where she couldn't face you and created the lie as a cheap and dirty "out" for herself. It's cowardly, but people do such things.

There is a silver lining, though. My ex met a girl he really likes, someone who, as you say about yourself, just "want(ed) to care about someone". So as I see it, you have two choices: you can either stop putting so much pressure on yourself to "care" about someone and just try to casually date until you find someone you click with (my ex, BTW, was supposed to be a one-night rebounder for me, but he was just sooooo nice in the morning that I stayed with him for 5 years!) or you can risk rejection by continuing to wear your heart and good intentions on your sleeve. I'm not saying one road is better than another, since we learn something from every experience. But you sound an awful lot like my ex, who lacked self-esteem and left himself open to get hurt. But don't give up on us women just yet. Nice guys may not always finish first, but they stay in the race much longer. Good luck to you!

[coloradodem2005]

40. Maybe.

Like I said though. I only tried to call her three times on Wednsday, four days after the date. I only did so, so I could get a hold of her to see what was up. I did not call her at any other point in time after the date.


As for staying in the race much longer, people who finish last stay in the race longer than those who finish first because the people who finish first are done, that's it.

[Dogmudgeon]

37. It's Chickrant time again! (Now with extra Archetypes!)

Men who dedicate themselves to finding and pleasing women usually end up on medication. You need to find something to which to dedicate yourself that doesn't involve fulfilling your mating agendas. Also, men who dedicate themselves to finding and pleasing women usually end up with sadistic women. It's not that "women prefer jerks" as much as the female jerks know who they can play.

Find something better to do -- an art, politics, education, write a book or five, start a UFO cult if you have to. It is absolutely not worth it to obsess over your need for love. It will rip your heart out and drain you of every last drop of your blood.

The Prince, in his maturation into the King, must occasionally put on paupers' rags and leave the Kingdom. Such a Prince may suffer the random and frequent insults of the world, but will not suffer the childish snubs of bratty princesses -- even if he someday will marry one of those brats when she has learned how to properly love a man, and herself, as well. A Prince on the road to wisdom will dedicate himself to a purpose that will become his art -- his spiritual art (in a manner of speaking). Suffer for your art if you must, but don't suffer over the world of women.

I don't like being a pompous fool, a know-it-all, a grandiloquent historiator, or a dumbshit hard-ass about it, but this advice is coming from a Perfect Master of Masochistic Supplication before the feet of every bitch-goddess I ever gazed at from afar. If I simply had the good sense to throw myself into something other than supporting myself, getting married, and having kids, I might actually have a decent career, a loving wife, and a couple of kids today.

You ought not to be looking for "women" -- you're looking for a select few women with whom you can have deep relationships, even if they don't last. And if you're not having any success, forget about it for a while and do something else worth that while.

You don't have to cop an nasty 'tude. Just turn your attention elsewhere. I'm not going to tell you that the chicks will flock to you like you were Konrad Lorenz. What will happen is that you won't be driven by a desire that is your undoing. Once you shake free of it, you can make the changes that you must. At the same time, you will accomplish a great deal in your life otherwise.

Whatever you do, killing yourself for love is just dumb. Stop doing it. Break loose.

I wish you the best of luck. I really do. But, damn it, man, you have a life to build, so snap out of it!

--bkl

[redqueen]

47. Damn that's a good post!

And I don't know if you pointed this out, but by dedicating yourself to something that you love, you will end up being around other people who share that passion. Sounds like a good way to meet interesting people of the opposite sex (or not, depding on what you want) to me!

[waldenx]

39. quit being nice

it has worked for me.

[Bertha Venation]

42. I'm sorry to hear this was so lousy.

I hope you soon meet some women who disabuse you of your impression of us. We're not all heartless, spineless assholes, hon. :hug:

[Catherine Vincent]

43. Please, don't give up.

You're only 24. You just have to meet more women to find the right one for you. Btw, if my bf and I break up, will you be available?;-)

[coloradodem2005]

44. Most likely.

Flattering I must say.

[nini]

45. Get over her.. She wasn't feeling the vibe

and she took the chicken shit way out. She should have at least been upfront and said she wasn't seeing any reason to pursue a relationship.

This is going to happen in the dating game. You can't dwell on it or you're going to end up settling in a relationship that isn't right for you because you think you'll never find the 'right one'

My suggestion is to not be in such a hurry. Look at a date as a way to get to know someone to see if they'd even be the right one to consider.. not as the beginning of a long-term relationship. Too much relationship talk right off the bat will scare some people off.

Be patient and don't give up. You'll find the right one if you take your time and keep trying.

[coloradodem2005]

46. You're right.

Though, there was no relationship talk. Just to let you know. We were just shooting the breeze.

[nini]

49. Unfortunately, people think coming up with an excuse as she did..

.. is letting others down easy - which of course it is not because decent people as yourself worry about the friend you thought was hurt in that accident. It takes real character to just be honest with someone else and say it just isn't there for them. If she had, you would probably would still be disappointed a bit but you wouldn't have stressed as much as you did.

She doesn't deserve you.. You'll find someone that does eventually and by then she'll probably be in a relationship with a lying guy that treats her like crap :evilgrin:

[redqueen]

48. BareKnuckledLiberal stole my thunder

:)

Just make finding a mate your fourth or fifth priority, and focus on other things to channel all your passion into. Once you find a cause or effort that completely consumes you, and you're not really interested anymore on finding that special someone, chances are they'll show up in your life.

[geniph]

50. She might be a total psycho

you might have reminded her of someone else, whom she doesn't like, for some really trivial reason. She may have decided she doesn't want to date right now. Whatever. It's HER issue, not yours. Your thing should be to meet women in relaxed circumstances in real life. Online works fine for flirting, but it's damn dicey for forming actual connections. Find something you really like to do that will involve meeting new people, including new women. Volunteer at an animal shelter, do a Sierra Singles hiking trip, take a continuing ed class in Spanish - something. Get out and about and meet actual women - without assigning each one a "potential partner" score. Friendship is the best way to meet potential mates.

I had very good luck with forming friendships through Sierra Club service trips and local politics. I didn't actually end up dating any of them, but did enjoy spending time with them. I recommend Sierra Singles for any environmentally-minded lonely folks - you can do good things and meet nice, like-minded people.

[talkingrain]

51. Hang In There!

I am 41 Years old. Never been married. Still looking for "The One." I will wait for what I am looking for! I am confident with that for myself!
You, however, are young! Get out and meet people! At your age you have so much going for you! I have been following your posts! It does not matter if you are goofy, cute, or whatever!

Forget the on-line stuff! Go to meetings, etc...! Build self esteem in person. Trust me! Been there! At your age? GET OUT OF THE HOUSE! Go Play!

I am new here but have been in your place before and just wanted to share....Be well!!!

[RoadRunner]

58. Hi talkingrain! Welcome to DU!

Glad ya' found us.

:hi:

[lolly]

52. A Little Bit of Repetition here . . . .

I think what I'm about to say has been touched on in other posts, but bears repeating.

Take a good hard look at the women you've been attracted to, and ask yourself if they're the kind of women who will be attracted to you and to what you want. Make sure you're not working at cross-purposes with yourself.

Example: I used to know a very attractive woman who really, really wanted to get married and settle down, have a few kids. Wanted to have a fun career, but wanted a man to pay most the bills. Now, there are lots of guys who would be perfectly willing to step into this picture (my hubby, for one)--but she had absolutely NO interest in these types of guys. Instead, she chased after the playboy type--older (we were in our early 20s, so this meant 30-ish), very good looking, sophisticated, established successfully in pretigious careers (doctor, lawyer) already. Men, in other words, who would already BE married if they had any interest in marrying.

So, make sure that you're not sabotaging yourself by, for example, getting attracted to women who might be utterly uninterested in what you have to offer.

[coloradodem2005]

53. You are right.

Just to be clear though. We had been talking. She contacted me first. It truly seemed like we had a lot in common. We liked a lot of the same things and were in similar stages in life. I don't know what went on in her head. But I have been in the situation you have described, but this time did not feel like that.


You are absolutly right, but I don't feel that it applied to this particular situation.

[NewHampster]

55. coloradodem2004 I want to apologize

for my post last night at the beginning of the thread.

I was feeling scotch good and trying to be funny when that was the last thing you needed.

I do think I gave you a long post about women the other day. They are best left to find you. Because they are directors of our destiny and always make the choice anyway. Whatever guys may think.

Your job as in sales or fishing is to create situations that allow many women to find you. If you're fishing Southpark for cuts you look upstream from the lake during the rainbow spawn. Thats where the action is in late April.

More to the point, join a group that may have women with similar interests to yours. Get active in the local Dem party and work your butt off. DON'T look for the women. Let them find you. And I mean don't look for them. A guy joining a group and prowling is a real turn off to everyone. Just join and put your heart into the group.

Don't want to do that then what do you enjoy? did you have a great skill in high school that you could teach at the Y?

When people say join, it doesn't have to be church. I just joined Toastmasters http://www.toastmasters.org/ to improve my speaking skills. I love the group and if I wasn't married .....

Just get out and off the friggin computer and meet live women.

[coloradodem2005]

56. I have been doing that.

My virulent hatred of everything Bush or Republican has led me to do just that in recent times. And no, I am not there for the women. Nor am I making it a very high priority there. I just want to participate in the process in my own way. I will simply participate and that will be it.

[Doomsayer13]

57. I guess the moral is don't trust the internet