i'm watching ESPN's special on the Colts marching band and developing a hatred towards Indianapolis

[charlie and algernon]

Indianapolis was a fricking bastard for stealing the Colts from Baltimore. Sure the owners of the Colts deserve a VERY HOT spot in the depths of hell, but they wouldn't have gotten far without the city of Indy agreeing to take the Colts. That was the first stake in the heart of the City of Baltimore.

[Swede]

1. What bastards for stealing a team from another city........

oh wait,nevermind.

[charlie and algernon]

4. name another hugely popular team that was stolen in the middle of the night

At least teams like the Brooklyn Dodgers and the Cleveland Browns were moved legitimately in daylight, not stolen.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

5. And at least the Browns got their name and history.

And a guarantee of a new team within several weeks of the announced move.

When it comes to losing a team, Cleveland doesn't know suffering...

[TZ]

7. Oh BULLSHIT!

Cleveland was selling out games when they were stolen. AND MY FUCKING TAX dollars were given to that SOB Art Modell to do it. What Modell did was far far worse. It's why I despise the Ravens and always will. BTW people from Pittsburgh and Cincinnati felt the same way.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

18. Actually it wasn't tax dollars that built the stadium.

It was lottery money that built the stadium, which had been earmarked for the stadium long before Modell considered moving to Baltimore (when Baltimore was in the running for an expansion team back in 1993). Nothing came out of the general fund. One thing I will say about Maryland over Florida is that they are infinitely smarter when it comes to use of revenue funds--tax money goes to things like schools and roads, and lottery money can go to things like stadiums. As opposed to Florida, which uses lottery money for schools and thinks it is okay if the state runs without a dependable source of revenue like income tax.

And I'm sorry, in no way was what Modell did worse than what Bob Irsay did. No way. Bob Irsay systematically demoralized the fanbase of one of the greatest franchises in the NFL for several years before pulling his ultimate coup de grace in the middle of the night. Baltimore was then left to toil for 13 years in uncertainty before football ultimately returned to the city.

Cleveland, on the other hand, received official word that football was returning to the city within a couple of months of having the announced move. Oh, and not only that, but they got to keep their own name. Oh, and not only that, but they recieved the right to use the history of the old Browns franchise for the new franchise, meaning all old Browns records stayed with the team. Oh, and not only that, but Cleveland got a brand new stadium out of the deal.

I'm not saying what Modell did was a great thing, and that Cleveland fans weren't inconvenienced for three years. But you can't compare what Modell did to what Irsay did. There is just no way. Take it this way--if NFL owners were WWII era fascist dictators, Irsay would be Hitler. Modell would merely be Mussolini.

Hell, I say in terms of bad sports owners, Modell isn't even as bad as Wayne Huzeinga's ownership of the Marlins, who I still blame for some of the apathy South Floridians have for the team after what Huzeinga did after the 1997 series.

[JonLP24]

21. In the show The Wire..

Sobotka uses a Irsay's photograph as a target on the dartboard. I thought it was pretty funny considering it was Season 2 which was made in 2003. 19 or so years after the move.

[KamaAina]

23. You scoff, and yet...

...your own avatar originated in St. Louis.

[JonLP24]

26. Actually originated in Chicago 1898

I can understand the resentment of all these years. Robert Irsay based on press conferences was clearly an asshole.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

28. Good old Frank Sobotka

The scene near the end of Season Two where he is walking down the pier to meet the Greeks knowing what his fate would be was such a chilling scene in such a great TV show.

Chris Bauer is a pretty good actor. I enjoyed him a lot in True Blood as well.

Now Ziggy Sobatka was crazy. But James Ransone is a terrific actor in his own right.

[NNadir]

13. The first one was a great crime against the People's Republic of Brooklyn.

The Imperialist takeover of the city by the Manhattanites was bad enough, but sending the Brooklyn Trolley Dodgers to a hell hole of the car CULTure was a great crime against humanity.

[Blue_Tires]

16. at least Brooklyn is gonna steal an NBA team...

[Brigid]

2. You have a team again, and have had for a while now.

Time to let it go. :hide:

[TZ]

8. Where could Maryland use that 40 million dollars

They fucking gave Modell do you think? Indiana people did not have to shell out. Having relatives in Cleveland and seeing their distress made it even worse to me. Art Modell deserves to rot in hell the greedy bastard

[Tommy_Carcetti]

19. Your Cleveland relatives were "distressed" for all of three years.

During which time they could still go out and buy Browns merchandise and know it would never be worn by any other team other than the CLEVELAND Browns. Seeing Peyton Manning sport the Blue Horseshoe knowing how much that used to mean to Baltimorians? Now THAT's truly distressing.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

3. It was a crime what happened to the Colts.

Even worse was the fact that the Indianapolis NFL Franchise continues to use the Colts name and history, and that Johnny Unitias is in the INDIANAPOLIS Colts section of the football hall of fame.

Say what you will about Art Modell and what had to be done to get the NFL back to Baltimore (where it belonged), but at least the Cleveland Browns name and history was left where it belonged--in Cleveland. Baltimore never got that luxury, nor did they get the virtually instant guarantee of a return of a team like Cleveland did. Instead, they were used and abused for 13 years by virtually every owner in the NFL.

[charlie and algernon]

6. exactly, Indy not only stole baltimore's team, they stole it's history

that was low

[JonLP24]

9. Go Ravens!!

:hide:

[Tommy_Carcetti]

20. That night made the 13 year exodus all worth it.

Never prouder to be an honorary Baltimorian than that day. (I say honorary because I actually grew up in Southern Maryland but all my ties go strictly to Baltimore).

[Rabrrrrrr]

10. It took you THAT to get to hate Indianapolis?

:eyes:

[Rabrrrrrr]

11. Plus - I mean, fucking hell - haven't the Colts been in Indianapolis for like fucking 30-40 years?

[JonLP24]

12. About 25 years

I do agree with your point though.

[Minimus]

14. I lived outside of B'more at that time and boy it sure caused a big stink.

Sneaking out in the middle of the night was the lowest of lows.

[Captain Hilts]

15. Hate Robert Irsay. Then hate Art Modell. nt

[Jokerman]

17. This Indy resident would like to give the colts back to Baltimore

I keep hoping that they will sneak out of town just like they slithered in.

Don't really care about football but as long as they're taking our tax money my favorite team will be whoever is playing the colts.

[PVnRT]

22. Thank You For Your Concern

[KamaAina]

24. Not even (then) sports-hungry Phoenix would deal with slimeball Irsay

Good thing Indian-no-place came through. :sarcasm: According to the show, they were the only ones left who'd even speak to him, after he'd been shopping the team around for years.

[PVnRT]

27. Indian-no-place?

Love to see that fucking arrogance from the coastal crowd.

[madinmaryland]

25. Heh! You could be stuck with today's Cleveland Browns!

:evilgrin: