Fuck Death

[Taverner]

Fuck Death

No seriously, fuck it. It sucks. It's the least pleasurable part of life, it fucks with everyone involved and it only brings more suffering, more sadness.

Even if the death happens in one's 90's or 100's, fuck it.

There is no value in it.

Death is mankind's only enemy - everything else is just an abstraction

[mdmc]

1. I disagree

For me death will be the release from infinite pain that I currently suffer from.
Many a day I pray for death to end this pain and suffering.
For me it is the last great adventure, and a reminder to be kind and do good things..

[Taverner]

5. Enjoy death then...

You can make peace in life easily by making peace with death

But I choose to rail against it with all my might

I will not die

And we will not die

---------------------------

A little background : my grandma just died, where she was #2 in a series of 3 deaths rocking my family. She was 95. She probably would have made it to 205 if her daughter hadn't died (#1) a few months earlier. Once that happened, her will broke - and I fully understand that.

#3 was the family dog, Tigger. You may have seen my posts about him - he was living with my dad when his hips finally gave out for good (he had horrible hip displaysia) The doctor put him down as the alternative was puting a scooter under him. His legs did not work. He was 15 years old. Most Samoyeds are only supposed to live to 12-13.

So I'm a bit angry at the idea of death itself. Fuck it. Too much of it.

[mdmc]

7. Yes .. I do remember the threads that you posted about Trigger

It sounds like you have suffered much loss recently.
My thoughts and prayers are with you my friend.
Peace out..

[Taverner]

8. Peace to you too

Peace is all we really want

Any of us...

[Taverner]

9. Did I mention that I had to clean out Grandma's house today?

Lots of memories of 1,2 and 3

[mdmc]

13. You did not mention that my friend

I remember cleaning out my grammies house.. I swell up with tears just thinking about that time in my life.
I pray to God that when my time comes, my grammie is there to meet me..
I don't know how it works, but that would be a very good way for me to 'go to the other side'..
Now I'm teared up and need to go to bed soon.. perhaps a little Seinfeld to curb the hurt..

[laylah]

16. How painful that had to

have been :hug: You've had your share recently, Taverner, but we all will before it is over with. Peace to you.

[shireen]

27. i feel the same as you.

The finality of it all.
Remarkable beautiful lives cease to exist.
People cheated of a full happy life by illness.
Young people killed in war before reaching the legal age to drink a beer. :wtf:

When you die, it's over. It's nice to believe in an afterlife, but that's all it is, a belief.

Sometimes, I wonder ... if people lived on the assumption that there is no life after death, would our world be less messed up? Would people treasure life even more, and strive to make it as meaningful as they can? Sometimes, I think that some after-life believers don't value their time on Earth because heaven awaits them. So why not trash the planet before you leave? :(

[shireen]

28. delete, duplicate. nt

[ChickMagic]

21. I have the same sentiment

At times death can not come soon enough but I'm too apathetic to
do anything to hasten it. Chronic pain is death in life.

[Amerigo Vespucci]

2. The things in your life which have power...YOU, Taverner, and no one else...

...are the things you give power to.

Whether death is "pre-ordained in the womb"...as Christians believe (and I'm a Christian)...

...or whether "shit happens" and that's it...

I've been afraid of a few things in this life.

Death has NEVER been one of them.

Give death power, it will rule you.

Deny power, it has none.

It's as simple as that.

[tigereye]

3. hmm, death is a part of life- I often think about the Disney film The Lion

King. I like the idea of the past members of the family living on in us, and the fact that every being returns to the earth in some way. Our lives have great value despite their not being permanent. We have been watching a lot of films lately about the ancient Egyptian culture and their ideas about death and views of an afterlife. It's fascinating.


Although I understand how painful letting go of loved ones can be - it often seems so unfair. I hear you.

[Skittles]

4. the least pleasurable part of life is dying, not death

[Taverner]

6. True that

Yes, dying

Not death

You will have no idea what death is like, since you won't be there

[pokerfan]

19. Death is nothing to us

. . . death is nothing to us. For all good and evil consists in sensation, but death is deprivation of sensation. And therefore a right understanding that death is nothing to us makes the mortality of life enjoyable, not because it adds to it an infinite span of time, but because it takes away the craving for immortality. For there is nothing terrible in life for the man who has truly comprehended that there is nothing terrible in not living. Death does not then concern either the living or the dead, since for the former it is not, and the latter are no more.

Epicurus

[quakerboy]

10. What is the value in living forever?

I wrote a long initial post, vehemently disagreeing with your statements that struck a cord with a bitter part of myself. Then I thought, probably there is some reasoning and experience behind this post, and why strike out against something I dont know the reason of.

Here is what remains after i take out my well reasoned defense of the practical necessity of death:

I would argue that decaying is the least pleasurable part of life. What brings suffering and pain and torture to everyone. Seeing someone turn from a vital to a shadow of what you knew them to be. Whether it is physical wasting, or mental, either is harsh. Both together is somewhat ameliorated practically, because the faculties decline. But to have someone who looks fine, but their brain just wont work, wont let them live with their wife or love their kids. Or the opposite, who's brain is fine, but their body wont allow them to step outside for fresh air, and their eyes won't let them read a book anymore, and no one wants to visit, and they rot trapped in a shell that has betrayed them.

Death may just be the best friend man has, in the end.

[Taverner]

29. Not living forever, but wouldn't you want to choose your death date?

For me that might be 500 years from now...

[quakerboy]

31. Would you want someone else to chose your death date?

That seems to be the more common circumstance. In the absence of (pick your choice of diety or fate here) making irrevocable choices for us, it often seems that by the time we would be ready to make that choice, our capacity may not allow for it anymore, and it falls on others who may not have our own desires closest to heart, but their own.

Some are so lucky. My great grandma decided she was going to live to 100. And she did. And shortly after that everything fell apart, and before long she had died, right on schedule.

Some are (questionably) not. My grandma is now in a care home, bedridden. Occasionally she tells us that she needs to go, because her youngest daughter(now in her 50's) just had her first period and there's some things to be attended to, or that her worst mistake was marrying Ted (her other daughters abusive ex husband). And I know that grandma would not have wanted to be this shell of herself. But it is not my decision.

Others are just not. I visited with an older gentleman a few years back. He was unable to get out of bed without the assistance of 2 people. He was still with his wife, who with her adult developmentally disabled son propped him up in a wheelchair once a week to eat breakfast, as that was all they could manage. Most of the time he couldn't talk, but on his few lucid moments, whenever his wife was out of the room, he would say that he wanted to die. But he had been that way for years, unable to even turn his own head or scratch an itch in the safety of his own home, and stayed for as long as I ws visiting him

In the second case, I strongly believe grandma will die in a few months. The Dr's said she wouldn't make it to Christmas 08. But she hung on. I strongly believe that even in her nonlucid state, she is hanging on so that when the house sold(which it finally appears it will here extremely soon), her kids would get some via her expressly spelled out for wishes for money in her will, instead of having it all go to her (drunk and abusive, but undivorcably Catholic, havn't slept in the same room for a lot longer than I've been alive) husband as the house would. Time will tell whether I am right, or whether her continuing on was just a cruel trick of fate. Or perhaps it all means nothing, one way or the other.

I do get what you are saying, I think. Its just my own experience of life tells me that the real ability to choose would lead to more early death, not less. Then again, maybe not. We humans cling to life quite tenaciously when faced with the unknowns of death.

[TK421]

11. Taverner, do you believe in life after death? I ask because I'm not so sure anymore

understood you have suffered some losses recently...sorry

[Taverner]

25. I don't

And as surprising as this is, once I realized there was no afterlife, death no longer scared me

Now it just infuriates me

[kwassa]

12. Necrophilia?

[DerekG]

14. I reserve my hatred for its practitioners

Politicians. Generals. Arms dealers. Corporatists. Drug dealers. Thugs.

Mankind's only enemy is itself.

So go easy on Mr. Death.

[Arugula Latte]

15. But who would want to live forever, really?

I find the thought of an endless afterlife terrifying. Luckily for me, I believe that when you go, that's it, lights out, end of story. Ashes to ashes.

[proteus_lives]

17. "Death is the high cost of living."

[Terra Alta]

18. I used to fear death...

back when my fundie mother was dragging me to her fundie church.. where the pastor often spoke of fire and brimstone.

Now, though, that I am able to think for myself.. I no longer fear it. I do intend to live my life to the fullest, though, whether I die tomorrow or 100 years from now... death is inevitable, and I don't fear it.

[Deep13]

20. Yeah, it's always a bummer.

Still, it is hard to think it is our enemy when we owe our existence to it. Evolution would not have been possible without death. It is the rejection of random mutations by killing them off that powers the evolutionary process. Without that, we would be just a bunch of self-replicating proteins.

[Mari333]

22. I am looking forward to that particular moment.

but i do understand your anger,. been there, done that.
still actually angry that I am in three dimensions.
hugs to you

[Bertha Venation]

23. I'm so sorry you're hurting.

[alfredo]

24. Death defines life just as darkness defines light.

About the living: it's better to feel sorrow than feel nothing.

[bikebloke]

26. Death to Dying!

I ain't gonna do it.

[Forkboy]

30. Eh, doesn't seem so bad.

Almost welcoming, in fact. Something I can't say about my actual enemies.

[Blue_Tires]

32. I PISS on death's grave!

[Orrex]

33. Her?

Hubba hubba!

[RFKHumphreyObama]

34. I'm so sorry for your loss Taverner

My deepest, sincerest and most heartfelt thoughts, prayers and condolences to you and your family

And yes, death sucks when it happens to your loved ones

I am still coming to terms with the loss of my mother. 60 years old, so vivacious and full of life, who seemingly loved waking up each day and confronting the challenges that faced her and who died from a rare illness she defied the statistical odds to get. Who wanted so badly to see her grandchildren but who died two years before the first one came along. Even now, as I enjoy watching my niece growing up, it is tinged with the pain of knowing that she will grow up without knowing the one person who would have been the best grandmother you could ever imagine.

[unpossibles]

35. my mother died 26 years ago tomorrow

I'm the one who found her (I had just turned 13) and tried to wake her. My last words with her had been an argument, and it was just the two of us. It took me a long time to even begin to deal with it in a healthy way, instead of railing against death and just generally being self-destructive out of guilt and not giving a shit - or pretending to.

While you're right that it leads to suffering and sadness and sometimes worse, it's also a part of life. This time of year always fucks with me on some level and sometimes on several levels, frankly.

That said, I have made it a point to never forget to reflect on all of the positive aspects of her life, to be thankful for how she raised me, and to just make my peace with her and with life/death in general. And you are absolutely right; it never is easy no matter the age, but personally when I die I want people to celebrate my life instead of just mourning the end of it.

:hug: