Dean slow to answer Kerry's challenge

[Feanorcurufinwe]

In announcing that he would give up matching funds, Kerry said he would not spend more than $45 million on his campaign until the time the Democratic nominee is effectively chosen, and he challenged Dean to do the same.

"I ask Governor Dean to join that pledge so that he can show America that his decision is not a decision based on trying to get an advantage against his opponents in the primaries, but it is truly an effort to try to deal with the money that President Bush will have," Kerry said.

<snip>

Under Kerry's pledge, the monetary cap would apply to the candidates until it is clear who the nominee will be, which could happen as early as March with the front-loaded campaign calendar.

That would leave the winner free to spend money above the $45 million cap between March and July, to better compete with Bush, who has opted out of the public finance system and is expected to raise $170 million to $200 million.

Last Saturday, in announcing he was giving up matching funds, Dean said he was taking that step to better compete with Bush's war chest in the period between the primaries and the party nominating conventions.

After the conventions, both the Republicans and Democrats will get an equal amount of money to run their general election campaigns.

Dean's campaign was non-committal, but also not enthusiastic, about accepting Kerry's pledge.

"We are a long way from making a decision on spending $45 million," said Dean spokesperson Jay Carson. "There is no clear defining line between when the primaries end and the campaign begins. Bush could start advertising right away."
http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/11/14/elec04.prez.kerry.money/index.html

[virtualobserver]

1. since Dean is running against Bush.......

he should not take up that challenge. He should be running as many ads as he can afford attacking Bush . So should Kerry.

[jeter]

virtualobserver, I agree

I agree that Dean shouldn't bombard other candidates. But at the same time, I think this is more Kerry grandstanding. Had he come out and asked Dean privately - instead of trying to make yet another political issue out of nothing. He would have gotten some results.

He is trying to make Dean look weak. Like he is doing this because of Kerry. Which is why Dean will probably not respond.

[virtualobserver]

12. Kerry baffles me......

His only chance to win the nomination is to present himself as the true opponent of Bush. Dean's success has nothing to do with attacks made against Democrats. It is his forceful rejection of Bush and all that Bush has done that has made him the top contender.

[MaineDem]

23. Technically, Dean IS running against Kerry and the other Dems

Once one of them gets the nomination the battle will be against Bush.

The idea is to tell the Democrats why one candidate would be better against Bush than the others.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

31. Didn't you get the memo? Dean already won.

We don't need to actually have elections, the media and the pollsters have already picked Dean for us.

[virtualobserver]

36. there is a memo that reads "my campaign will self-destruct in 5 seconds.."

Signed, John Kerry

[Feanorcurufinwe]

38. Making ridiculous, mocking statements

show a cleverness I just can't match.

[virtualobserver]

39. only you get to make memo jokes, I guess......

my mistake.

[Ediacara]

41. the truth hurts don't it?

[Feanorcurufinwe]

43. Why don't you try some and we'll see?

[Ediacara]

48. try some what? truth?

How about the TRUTH that John Kerry is not running an effective campaign. If you wish to deny that TRUTH, go ahead, but don't call me a liar for saying so.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

55. Truth?

"You can't handle the truth!"

[Ediacara]

40. well maybe if your guy ran more than a half-assed campaign...

The "media and pollsters" would have picked him...

[Feanorcurufinwe]

44. We'll just have to see if you have the same mocking tone on January 28

[Ediacara]

49. mocking?

Whatever.

If you wish to continue your bitter preaching about how John Kerry will come from no where with a train wreck of a campaign, and beat back everyone, go right ahead.

It seems to be that because what I say is true (Kerry's campaign is half-assed) you seem to think I'm personally insulting YOU.

Are you John Kerry? If you aren't, then get a grip!

We can all find half-assed campaigns. Gore's in 2000 was an example, Dole's in 1996 is another. Kerry's in 2004, is a similar example.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

56. I'm just pointing out that you are counting votes that haven't been cast.

And yes I also pointed out that you used a mocking tone. There's nothing personal about it.

[Ediacara]

66. I wasn't counting shit

and sorry for the "mocking," I guess it's my reaction to unbelievable bitterness.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

67. So let's kick some together next November

[JohnKleeb]

59. I havent got it yet

:D
and my watch says its mid November. I aint given up.

[Andromeda]

73. Then all the Dean bashers...

should just fade away soon...waiting.........:boring:

[Feanorcurufinwe]

81. Have a nice sleep

[virtualobserver]

35. Technically, but I see it as all of them running against Bush

I think that the reason that Dean has done well is that he has so fiercely opposed Bush. If Kerry or any other Democrat can win the nomination by opposing Bush even more fiercely and effectively than Dean then I won't be disappointed. But that is what it will take...attacks on Dean won't secure anyone the nomination.

[MrSoundAndVision]

71. it is a sad day...

when someone who so supports the picture of American genius claims that the TV will decide the fate of our people. http://www.kucinich.us --> Kucinich man, Kucinich

[Patriot_Spear]

2. Correction- attributed to the wrong person.

My mistake Feanor - you merely called him arrogant.



http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=713449#713482

[killbotfactory]

3. And most of that 45 million will be spent in NH attacking Dean

If Kerry wants to pretend to take the high road he should abide by the spending caps of each state.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

4. So you want Kerry to follow rules that Dean won't follow?

Does that make any sense at all?

[Patriot_Spear]

5. correction

I got the impression from your post yesterday that Dean is not your candidate- is this correct?

[killbotfactory]

6. If he's going to whine about taking the high road.. yes

He bashed Dean for being "politically expedient" for refusing matching funds... then does the same damn thing. Now he's going to bust the spending caps and "go nuclear" on Dean in NH, and he expects Dean to abide by the 45 million dollar limit? Dean has a handful of other candidates he has to go up against.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

18. Total hypocrisy.

Dean is the one who falsely claimed the moral high ground:


Dean made headlines in March for vowing to attack any candidate that didn't commit to public financing like he was.

Howard Dean committed Friday to taking taxpayer dollars to finance his presidential campaign while fellow Democrat John Kerry laid the groundwork to do the same with a letter to donors suggesting they could double their money by helping him qualify.

In fact, only donors’ first $250 gets matched by the government.

Like Dean, Al Sharpton, former Illinois Sen. Carol Moseley Braun and Ohio Rep. Dennis Kucinich are committed to taking public financing and the spending limits that come with it, aides said. They are trying to raise the required amounts – $5,000 from each of 20 states in contributions of $250 or less – to qualify for the public money.

Former Vermont Gov. Dean said he has already met the requirement. He promised to make it an issue in the Democratic primaries if any of his rivals decide to skip public financing, as President Bush did en route to winning the Republican nomination in 2000.

“It will be a huge issue,” Dean said. “I think most Democrats believe in campaign finance reform.”
http://timesargus.nybor.com/Local/Story/61946.html

This isn't the first time he broken the same promise. He did so in an earlier governor's race. http://www.rutlandherald.com/News/Story/70402.html

And going even farther, he tried to permanently remove funding for Vermont's public financing system altogether.

Governor Dean's Plan to Remove Funding

Early on in the 2002 legislative session, Democratic Governor Howard Dean targeted the public financing provision of the law for elimination. VPIRG led the effort to preserve funding for public financing of qualifying candidates. The Governor claimed that the law was not working and therefore should not be funded until a final court decision has been reached. Working with Republicans, Progressives and Democrats, VPIRG was able to keep public financing alive (although hundreds of thousands of dollars were taken for other unrelated uses).
http://www.vpirg.org/campaigns/financeReform/cfr_page111.html

Dean's commitment to Campaign Finance Reform seems to be as sincere as his commitment to the environment or the social safety net.

[Name removed]

19. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[killbotfactory]

25. What's that have to do with Kerry bashing Dean for opting out

due to "political expediency", and then doing the same damn thing for the same reasons (only using Dean as the reason for why he opted out instead of Bush).

[Feanorcurufinwe]

26. You just accused Kerry of trying to claim the moral high ground.

And I pointed out what a hypocritical case of the pot calling the kettle black that is. Sorry to be so blunt.

[killbotfactory]

28. He is trying to claim it

But he has to defend NH from Dean, so he's going to blow the spending caps in the state and "go nuclear". Dean has to compete with all the other candidates, not just Kerry, so it's quite convenient to tell Dean to abide by the 45 million spending limit, since Kerry is going to blow all his money attacking Dean in NH.

Dean has not criticized anybody for opting out, even when he said he would he didn't criticize anybody.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

30. Dean's words and actions have been hypocritical and indefensible.

I'm not surprised that you are reduced to attacking Kerry.

However, the fact is, Dean promised to take public financing. And that was another in a long string of well-documented lies.

[Ediacara]

50. Well documented lies?

Or a change in plans due to huge amounts of cash coming in from donations?

[virtualobserver]

52. yeah, if Dean hadn't opted out, it wouldn't have been long before ......

he would have had to start sending money back to people.

It is so sad that Kerry always seems to have to dip into his own funds for his campaigns, since voters don't seem interested.

[virtualobserver]

51. People aren't dying in Iraq because of an indefensible vote.....

on a War resolution that Dean voted for. I know that I couldn't have that on my conscience. How does Kerry live with himself? After seeing the horrors of war, he issues a blank check to someone like Bush.

[Andromeda]

72. Kerry IS trying to claim the moral highground...

he should have just kept his mouth shut instead of making himself look like an ass.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

79. Is not. Is. Is not. Is. Is not. Is. Is not.

lol

[DianeK]

7. this is not a football game..

this is about taking our country back, dean made a courageous decision and why should he limit himself? what would be the point?

[w4rma]

8. How can anyone trust Kerry? The guy still refuses to attack Bush.

Kerry isn't a liberal. He's a liar. This non-issue distracts from the major problems and Kerry is even attacking a straw man.

Dean opted out of the matching funds BECAUSE of the spending limits and to defend against BUSH.

Kerry opted out of the matching funds to use his fortune and to attack Dean.

If Kerry goes down the route I see him going down and somehow wins the nomination using those tactics Bush WILL slaughter him in the general. Kerry's loss will make Dukakis's loss look good.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

16. Your statement is totally false, that's all.

Here is just a tiny sampling from a quick web search. I'd be doing this all day if I wanted to be comprehensive:

By Attacking Bush, Kerry Sets Himself Apart
N.E. senators blast Bush over environmental issues
Kerry, Lieberman Fault Bush on Veterans
Kerry Says US Needs Its Own Regime Change
Kerry Stands By Bush Criticism
Kerry to firefighters: Bush has failed you
Kerry again attacks Bush administration
Kerry, Graham fault Bush in deadly Baghdad bombing
Kerry Attacks Bush While Defending Iraq Resolution Vote
Kerry attacks Bush over 9/11 air reports
Democrat Kerry Says Bush Has Credibility Gap


Your attacks might have more credibility if you stick to truthful statements in the future...

[Skwmom]

9. Didn't Dean say he was opting out because he needed the money

to fight Bush. If he say's no to Kerry's challenge this is just another example of Dean not telling the truth.

[sandnsea]

10. Rules don't apply to Howard Dean

This thread makes me sick. Howard Dean came out at the beginning of the year, publicly, and made a HUGE issue out of all the Democratic candidates staying in public campaign financing. Then the wind changes and all of those Howard Dean morals and ethics that HE made such an issue about are blown aside. And KERRY is the one who is wrong?

[eileen_d]

11. Is it "DEAN-ial"?

OK, spank me :spank:

Personally, I'm not with Kerry on this issue. He should opt out fully and not make it an issue with Dean.

[sandnsea]

13. If Dean hadn't...

made it such a huge ethics issue months ago, I'd agree. And if he doesn't put pressure on Howard to agree to this cap, he's going to be accused of buying the nomination.

[virtualobserver]

14. Dean realized that he had made a mistake......

so he changed his mind.

If that is flip-flopping or lying to you, then I'm sure that I can't convince you otherwise.

Are people allowed to change their minds? I guess that is for the voters to decide.

[w4rma]

15. Bull.

I've seen your non-stop Dean bashing posts. Whatever Dean said you'd find some way to twist it and attack him, sandnsea. :puke:

[sandnsea]

17. Because I don't like him

I don't like him. I don't like him. I've never tried to pretend anything else and the more he lies and spins and postures, the more I don't like him. And if you want to follow the pied piper like a rat plunging to your death, go ahead. I'm going to fight it every step of the way.

[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

22. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

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[sandnsea]

27. It's all about issues

People who really fight for issues. I know the Deanie's in my town. I know what they're all about. They fought a new department store and used the dunes and 'environmentalism' as their cause. The truth is they were just trying to protect their pocketbooks. If they cared about the environment, they'd be fighting the ATV's that are destroying the dunes on the other end of town, but they don't. Because that would hurt their pocketbooks. They're phony, just like Howard Dean. They do the right thing by passing a school bond but don't really support kids in this town because the seniors might get mad and that would hurt their pocketbook. It goes on and on. So now they rally behind Howard Dean, not because he's going to really make changes, but because he's going to talk a good talk and make them feel righteous, but in the end they know their pocketbook will be protected. He's not going to ask for any REAL sacrifice. He's not going to ask them to actually provide health insurance to their employees. He's not going to ask them to make the environmental changes to their business, drive different cars, heat their homes different. He's not going to ask them to commit to community service. Just write a check and you'll change America. Status quo, so typically American.

[sandnsea]

29. I didn't alert on that

So you know. I only alert on freepers and you're obviously not a freeper. It doesn't bother me what somebody says to me.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

69. Good one Eileen, but I'm with Kerry here

Clearly, Dean should just say 'Yes- it's money for Bush, and I'll abide by the caps in the primaries'- statements that everyone is running against only Bush right now are bunk. They are all running against one another, and Kerry's running for his life right now.
I think this was a smart decision on his part.

[Demobrat]

21. Dean's not just running against Kerry.

Since the others have agreed to a "get Dean" strategy, rather than running against Bush, why on earth should Dean play ball with any one of them? He's in this to win, not to make up for Kerry's failings.

[Monte Carlo]

32. I think the Democratic candidates SHOULD agree to a primary spending cap.

Maybe I'm just biased, but...

Any good Democrat would appreciate the virtues of spending caps in the campaign process. The best candidate should be the one who gets the nomination, not the one with the most resources for a campaign.

Bush will not play by those sorts of rules, so neither can the Democrat that gets the nomination. We're going to be going up against some $200+ M in November, and the nominee is going to need all the financing he can get. But... Democrats are more principled when it comes to money and politics. If the candidates did make a common spending cap, it would likely hold, and we'd end up with the best candidate to beat Bush.

THEN, the big money should come. I think that would save our resources until most needed.

[dfong63]

33. how about if dean challenges kerry not to use his personal fortune

... to bankroll his campaign?

it seems like Kerry is using Dean's unprecedented decision on matching funds, as an excuse to use his enormous personal fortune.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

34. How about it?

Since Dean's campaign is so 'people-powered' maybe your idea has a chance of being adopted...

[babzilla]

37. Kerry has used this strategy before

http://www.dailykos.com/comments/2003/11/10/6575/0432/1

Blaming the other guy - this is the same smokescreen that Kerry raised in 1996. He accused Weld of breaking the cap upon which the two of them agreed after extensive, gentlemanly, and detailed negotiations. The agreement was done very carefully by lawyers from both sides. He had no proof that Weld would break the cap, and Weld had not broken the cap, but Kerry said he had to break the cap to pre-empt Weld breaking the cap. (No wonder he voted for Bush's pre-emptive war.) Here's a final analysis of the Weld-Kerry flap from the Boston Globe:
"In the last days of his reelection campaign, Sen. John F. Kerry blasted Gov. William F. Weld for violating the spending cap the two men agreed to in August - a cap hailed across the nation as a political model.

"But federal campaign spending reports released yesterday indicate that the only clear violation of the cap was Kerry's, as he poured $ 1.7 million of his own money into his campaign to keep pace with Weld's advertising barrage.

"The cap limited the political use of personal funds to $ 500,000. Weld, whose fund-raising outpaced Kerry's for much of the campaign, only tapped his personal fortune for $ 120,000 before election day, though he kicked in an additional $ 150,000 after the election to allow some staffers to receive paychecks through the end of November.

"The post-election finance reports filed yesterday indicate that Kerry, who gained his wealth from his 1995 marriage to heiress Teresa Heinz, needed to use personal assets in order to keep pace with Weld in the final months of the campaign.

"Had he not used his own money, Kerry's campaign could not have aired television commercials in the final crucial days of the campaign, a time when Weld was flooding the airwaves with his ads.

. . .

"In overall spending, Kerry, relying on his personal assets and early cushion in campaign funds, outdid Weld, $ 8.4 million to $ 7.6 million.

"The spending cap limited the two campaigns to $ 6.9 million in spending from July 1 on. Both candidates, according to the federal reports, adhered to that limit, with Weld spending $ 6.6 million and Kerry $ 6.3 million in period covered by the cap."

-- Frank Phillips, Report: Kerry spent $1.7m on election. Boston Globe (Dec 6 1996), A38

[Feanorcurufinwe]

42. That's right, Kerry has faced this before, and won.

I, for one, am sure glad that it is Kerry representing MA in the Senate instead of Weld. And I'm sure Weld regretted breaking the cap, because Kerry did indeed come back at him with a vengeace. The man is a fighter, and he fights to win. Dean will end up nursing the same regrets as Weld.

Weld, Kerry Accuse Each Other Of Breaking Agreement

Massachusetts' nasty Senate race is getting nastier with both sides accusing the other of violating a voluntary spending limit.

The race is incumbent Democratic Sen. John Kerry versus GOP Gov. William Weld, both wealthy individuals who agreed previously to cap personal expenditures at $500,000, and hold to an overall cap of $6.95 million. Weld says a recent $400,000 loan, for which Kerry used his own assets as collateral, violates the agreement. He plans to file complaints with the Federal Election Commission and in U.S. District Court.

"John Kerry has broken the spending cap, and he is now breaking the law, as well as demonstrating once again that his word is no good," Weld spokesman Rob Gray declared to The Associated Press.

But the real problem, according to Kerry, is that Weld violated their agreement by spending some $5.4 million on TV advertising, over the agreed $5 million. His campaign treasurer collected records from media outlets of Weld's expenditures.
http://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/1996/news/9610/24/spending.cap/index.shtml

Sounds like one of those, well I guess the best word is partisan issues, where you basically are either gonna support the Republican, or the Democrat.

[virtualobserver]

45. Cue theme to the TV Show "Mission Impossible"

"Now we dolly back,
Now we fade to black"


Only a Steely Dan fan has a chance of identifying the last two lines....


Hint: It was on the "Royal Scam" album.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

46. Yeah, no ones ever come from behind in politics before.

The polls have also always predicted the winner in NH.

[virtualobserver]

47. All things are possible

I'll have to see a few good moves from the Kerry "strategery" group before I'll believe it.

[babzilla]

53. Except Dean & Kerry are both democrats

therefore partisianship does not apply.

Dean will end up nursing the same regrets as Weld.

heh heh... you said nursing.

But the real problem, according to Kerry, is that Weld violated their agreement by spending some $5.4 million on TV advertising, over the agreed $5 million. His campaign treasurer collected records from media outlets of Weld's expenditures.
http://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/1996/news/9610/24/spending.cap/index.shtml

Sounds like one of those, well I guess the best word is partisan issues, where you basically are either gonna support the Republican, or the Democrat.

IMHO, It is obvious that Kerry needs to better understand the meaning of partisianship.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

57. I was talking about the charges and counter-charges between Weld and Kerry

when I said it was a partisan issue.

[babzilla]

61. now it is interpartisanship

Kerry is simply carrying that same Weld game-plan over to the democratic primary.

[babzilla]

54. I for one am suspicious of pre-emption in war and elections alike

"He had no proof that Weld would break the cap, and Weld had not broken the cap, but Kerry said he had to break the cap to pre-empt Weld breaking the cap."

[polpilot]

58. Dean makes the rules, not Kerry.

Dean '04...

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

60. Interesting.

To achieve $45M all Kerry has to do is pull out his checkbook.

Dean needs to capture the support of 450,000 people at $100 a clip.

Which one of these models best represents the spirit of Democracy?

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

62. For every million dollar check that Kerry writes himself...

Dean needs the support of 10,000 people.

[eileen_d]

65. Does Dean only accept $100 donations?

If I sent him $101.00 would he send it back? What if I send it in all dimes? ;)

Yeah, Kerry's rich. At least he's honest about it. (Not to imply Dean is dishonest about anything... O Perish The Thought!)

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

68. He'd take your $101.00. Is that a pledge?

Bush, George W
No. of $200+ Contributors 48,929
No. of $2,000+ Contributors 29,798
% from Donors of $2,000+ 73%
% from Donors of $200 or less 11%

Dean, Howard
No. of $200+ Contributors 18,375
No. of $2,000+ Contributors 1,554
% from Donors of $2,000+ 13%
% from Donors of $200 or less 56%

Kerry, John
No. of $200+ Contributors 12,720
No. of $2,000+ Contributors 4,361
% from Donors of $2,000+ 55%
% from Donors of $200 or less 12%

http://www.opensecrets.org/presidential/donordems.asp



Kerry is closer to Bush than he is to Dean in how he raises money. Doesn't that bother you? Over half of his contributions are $2k+. 12% or less comes from $200 or less in contributions. Doesn't that bother you? Meanwhile, over 55% of Deans donations are $200 or less. Doesn't that inspire you? 13% of his donations are of the $2000 variety. Kerry receives over 4X as many of his donations from the wealthy as Dean does. Doesn't that bother you? Who's going to have a say in the Kerry campaign? Over half can afford to donate $2000. They'll have the say. Over half of Dean's supporters are of the $200 or less variety. They'll have the say. Free your mind (and free up that $101, even if it is in dimes).

[eileen_d]

70. Call me cynical

Yeah, Kerry's getting more money from big donors. I'm not denying it. But you state: Over half of Dean's supporters are of the $200 or less variety. They'll have the say. It's the second half of that I find difficult to believe. Again, call me cynical, but I don't see anything from Dean's record that states he wouldn't be as much of a friend to corporations as the other Democratic frontrunners.

Aside from that, I think what Dean's doing with fundraising is great. I think his campaign is a positive thing (when he's not doing the tired "Washington insider/Bushlite" thing). And I'm actually starting to believe that he can beat Bush. But as they say, in the primaries, vote "with your heart", i.e. for your ideal candidate... and it ain't Dean.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

75. Fair enough.

I'm also cynical when it comes to whether Dean will be the populist that his fundraising suggests. I'm not wearing blinders. I know some people who are high up in the California Dean organization who have spoken to him many times. He claims that the reponse to his campaign changed the way he looks at politics. Could he be lying? Yep. Taking that possibility into consideration, that leaves me two options. Vote for either Dean or Kucinich, the only two candidates who receive more than half of their donations from the under $200 category or vote third party and take a chance that that candidate isn't bullshitting me either. In view of the fact that Kucinich appears to not have the broad support that would enable him to become the nominee, that leaves Dean or a third party candidate. The third party candidate has the same problem as Kucinich. That leaves me with Dean.

Why put so much emphasis on the small donor aspect of HD and DK's campaigns? Because they are the only legitimate candidates to break away from the cycle of Corporate influence on how legislation is shaped and written in D.C., because they don't have to rely on said Corporations to acquire and maintain power.

Since I'm 75% sure that Dean's intentions are honorable, I'm willing to gamble on Dean. All the other candidates are gambles, too. So it's a crapshoot no matter what. All that being said, I respect your right to "vote your heart" in any manner you choose. I'll be voting mine.

Now, how about that pledge? :evilgrin:

[LuminousX]

63. I fully agree, Dean should limit his spending in this phase

And I thought Kerry was SPOT ON in doing so.

Right now this is Democrats against Democrats and isn't about who can outspend who. If Dean does not take up Kerry's challenge, I will lose a great amount of respect for him.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

64. Hmmm.

How about they limit themselves to donations under $200. And no use of personal wealth.

Would it be fair for Dean to agree to the cap when Kerry can simply write a check for $45M and Dean might be able to only cut a $2M check? And Kucinich might be able to cut only a $200k check? And Edwards could cut a $20M check?

[MasterofCeremonies]

77. I agree with LuminousX

As a neutral observer it was a good political move on Kerry's part. Dean should counter-challenge that he will accept the limits if Kerry will abide by the state spending caps. It will damage Dean if he doesn't find a way of dealing with the issue.

As far as the campaigns sitting at a table and amicably working things out, that ain't going to happen. These people are out for their political lives.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

78. My point is that Kerry and Edwards can reach the agreed upon

limit by pulling out their checkbooks. Meanwhile, all the others would have to work hard to get tens of thousands of people to donate. Not exactly fair, imo.

[MasterofCeremonies]

80. You can't make any system completly fair.

It should be enough that one's personal wealth can be balanced off against another candidate's popularity or fund raising ability. Kerry and Edwards are not in an advantageous position vis-a-vis Dean's ability to raise money from the many in my opinion. And the polls bear that out.

Dean is responsible for opening the gate to Kerry's fortune. In retrospect Dean should have waited until later in the election cycle to opt out of public financing, but I don't know what timetables and deadlines he was up against.

[ludwigb]

74. Absolutely

Though I agree that Kerry should have tried to reach an agreement with Dean instead of publically attacking him, I think it is in the Democrats' interest to reach an agreement on primary spending. I think Dean would go along if they could agree on a reasonable date when the primary stops and the interlude begins.

[virtualobserver]

76. he might.....

but if they all focused their fire on Bush, it wouldn't be as much of an issue.