Gere draws a battle line with Clark

[Freddie Stubbs]

Richard Gere ambushed Wesley Clark Thursday night at a presidential campaign fund-raiser. The activist actor asked the retired Army general to state his stance on the death penalty during a Q&A at Diane von Furstenberg's West Village atelier.
"I don't believe in the death penalty, per se, but I do believe we should reserve the right to use it in extreme cases, like that of Osama Bin Laden," the Democratic hopeful responded.

Gere, a devout Tibetan Buddhist, countered, "How can you not believe in the death penalty, but reserve that right for certain cases?"

An uncomfortable silence settled on the big-ticket crowd, which included Alexander von Furstenberg, writer Brad Gooch, producer Sandy Gallin, Hamilton South and Anne Dexter Jones. But Clark soldiered on, again trying to explain his belief that the death penalty should be considered in the face of the most heinous crimes.

more: http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/139606p-123917c.html

[BayCityProgressive]

1. As horrible as Osama is..

I still wouldn't support the death penalty ever. However, I know saying that would definately lose you the general election.

[Renew Deal]

2. Gere knew his position going in.

It sucks that we have to deal with the Hollywood crowd.

[mandyky]

7. Hollywood Crowd - you sound

like Laura Ingram. The Hollywood crowd has the right to ask that question - especially since I assume Gere had paid money to be there.
Good Grief!

[w4rma]

19. I'm glad Clark doesn't seem to share your attitude.

If he had your condensending attitude towards Democrats from a particular group, I would have a very hard time supporting him for vice president.

[Name removed]

33. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[LuminousX]

3. I support the option of the death penalty

It should be so rare in its use that the entire nation is fully aware it is being used and when. It frightens me that there are people being put to death in my name that only a handful of activists are fully aware and knowledgable about. It should be so uncommon that we as an entire nation can weigh the merits of the action, understand the act we are committing as a whole, and accept the collective guilt of the action.

Clark answered admirably under the circumstance. We live in a country that doesn't appreciate genteel responses. People want black and white, yes or no. You are either for or against. You can't be for it sometimes and against it other times.

[BayCityProgressive]

5. why kill Osama?

it would be an easy way out and he would become a martyr. Better to let him live in misery and shame.

[ClintonTyree]

4. Gere...............

goes a little over the top at times, but he's entitled to his opinion, as are all others. Confronting Gen. Clark in such a fashion was a low blow though. If he was so concerned, he could have sent Gen. Clark a personal message, but it appears his only motive was to embarrass Gen. Clark.

[chaska]

11. I don't know, we weren't there.

I can imagine a scenario in which this would not necessarily come off as hostile. It's possible (likely?) that the press sees a story here. It's got everything: death, Osama, the military man and the devout Buddhist, controversy, the future directon of a country, starring Richard Gere and General Wesley Clark ... based on a true story.


Actually, I'm quite relieved to hear the general state that he is generally against the death penalty. I would have expected him to be for it, unequivocally.

[Bucky]

16. I support Clark and the death penalty, but Gere was right to speak up

He wasn't just trying to embarrass Clark. He was speaking out for a cause he believes in. That's not grandstanding, that's politicking. I disagree w/Gere on this issue, but certainly this was fair game. If you can't speak out in public for fear of embarrassing a leader, what's the point of the First Amendment?

[SheilaT]

6. For those who support the death penalty

ask yourselves, Why is it that most of the rest of the world gets along without it? Do countries that don't have the death penalty have higher rates of violence because people can do any horrible thing they want and know they won't be killed?

Check it out.

[Freddie Stubbs]

9. For those who oppose the death penalty

ask yourselves, Why is it that a majority of Americans support the use of the death penalty? Wouldn't going against the will of the people be undemocratic?

[chaska]

12. I can't believe you just wrote that. nt

[Freddie Stubbs]

29. Beleive it

It's not by some coincidence that a large majority of elected officials are in favor of the death penalty. This isn't one that you can blame on lobbyists, corporations, and campaign contributions. The American people want the death penalty.

[drfemoe]

38. the role of a democracy

is to provide social equality and protection for individual rights.
.. not as some believe, to allow the majority to mob any one they choose.

[Freddie Stubbs]

42. That is what you would like the role of Democracy to be

Unfortunately, its role is whatever those in the majority choose it to be.

[SahaleArm]

10. Death Penalty is not a deterrent and is more costly than life in prison

Why it's kept around isn't for practical reasons, just emotional.

[SahaleArm]

8. Richard Gere a Tibetan Buddhist?

When the f*ck has he ever renounced materialism? Insert hamster joke here :evilgrin:

[helleborient]

14. Gere has done a tremendous amount of work for Tibetans...

And has followed Buddhism for a long time now. He is well-respected in these circles...despite slams like these.

[eileen_d]

26. Yes, and besides that

- it's GERBILS, not HAMSTERS! :evilgrin:
Seriously, Gere and his wife Carey Lowell (of Law and Order / Bond Girl fame) are well-known Buddhists and activists. They walk the walk as well as talking the talk. He's not the guy he plays in films.

I think Clark handled the question just fine. I wonder if people who think Clark was "ambushed" would think the same if it wasn't a celebrity? (Of course, it wouldn't have made the news if he wasn't a celeb)

[SahaleArm]

34. OK it was a bad attempt at humor...

And Hollywood's enfactuation with materialism and Buddhism. At least Gere's serious: http://www.gerefoundation.org/main.html :)



'Celebrity Buddhists': http://www.shambhalasun.com/Archives/Features/1999/May99/gere.htm

[Lefta Dissenter]

13. I think Clark handled it perfectly;

Clark looked as if he was about to order the actor to drop and give him 20, and wrapped it up. "We could have a philosophical discussion about this for hours," he said, "but I don't think this is the right venue."

That's precisely what I thought when I read the above article. A fundraiser is supposed to.... well, raise funds! and get everyone enthused so that they'll open their wallets... What the heck are you doing ambushing him there? It's just like some of the "What did you Clarkies like about Clark's speech" threads that are suddenly ambushed by anti-Clarkies and their slams. Not the right place or the right time.

I think some people feel that their own opinions are SO incredibly important that they forget to consider anyone else's right to hold a civilized conversation.

[LizW]

18. Yeah, how dare Gere question the general on an issue?

Doesn't he know he's just there to open his wallet?:evilgrin:

[dfong63]

24. especially (gasp) during a Q & A session!!

[OhioStateProgressive]

15. i think Richard Gere is right to do so

if mainstream Democrats don't start conforming to the agenda of far left wingers, we will stop voting Democrat

i think it is fair after what happened in 2000, we are going to vote Democratic this time, we are not going to allow a Republican in office

but I swear, if we get screwed with another centrist, i know many will never vote Democratic again

the death penalty is one of the issues the mainstream needs to let the Left define

[paulk]

17. I don't support the death penalty

But, I prefer Clark's position to that of GW Bush. Opposing the death penalty is something a candidate cannot do if he expects to win a statewide of national election.

I grew up in New York State, and I watched one of our best governors ever, Mario Cuomo, go down in defeat because of just this issue.

[Nancy Waterman]

20. I agree with Clark's position

Luminous stated it perfectly above.

It should only be used very, very rarely, and in the most heinous of cases. The whole country should be aware of it and share a collective responsibility. It is used way too much now, and GWB exemplifies the callousness of this position.

And I also agree that this country is always looking fot the black and white answer. Bush has intensified this intellectually indefensible position. Few things are that clear cut. Out thinking needs to be more flexible and more nuanced.

[Kahuna]

35. True. Even though in theory I don't support the death penalty...

In a case like the D.C. snipers where the acts were particulary henious and the guilt is not in question, I have to admit I support it. In the cases of Muhammed and Malvo, I say the sooner the better. They are beasts, not humans, IMHO. Bin Laden on the other hand I would not kill, as it would martyr him and he would welcome that.

Clark and Dean, like myself and lots of other people are ambivalent when it comes to the death penalty. We don't like it. But some cases just seem to call out for it. I only support in in cases where the guilty party has confessed and been caught red handed. And where they showed a depraved indifference for human life.

In my city a couple of weeks ago, two victims were shot in the middle of the day by joyriders in a stolen vehicle who where randomly selecting victims to shoot and rob. One of the victims was a nice 15 year old boy who was killed and robbed for his jacket. The other victim was standing on the street and was shot in his back and robbed. I probably wouldn't want the death penalty for these assailants. They wouldn't get it in NJ anyway. I would certainly hope that the killers who have been caught, spend the rest of their natural lives in prision.

[FrenchieCat]

21. Gere had the right....

And Wes Clark gave him his answer. I believe that Osama should be caught (first of all), be put on trial (public)in an international court, and if they come up with a death penalty, so be it.

Gere has the right to support who he wants to, but if he thinks that someone is going to get elected for President who is "in all cases" against the death penalty, he's got another thing coming!

The bottomline is beating Bush.....I guess that Richard Gere, with all of the money he has can't see the forest for the trees....or for the Tibetan Mountains.

As much as I have suffered under Bush, that confrontation was, well, an idealistic reach that will maybe have Gere voting for someone else, and well might as well he votes for Bush, and save himself the burden of a middleman!

[ajacobson]

22. I don't see the problem

with Gere raising the question. I think what surprised the salon crowd is that Gere would press the issue after getting his answer. Sounds like the General handled it pretty well.

BTW, Clark's position is identical to Dean's:

From deanforamerica.com:
"I believe the death penalty should be available for extreme and heinous crimes, such as terrorism or the killing of police officers or young children. But it must be carried out with scrupulous fairness."

I'm against the death penalty-flat out. But if the nominee pulls back the reins on it's use, I can go with that position. There has been incredible expansion on the Federal level of death-penalty qualified crimes, for more info see http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/

[Eurobabe]

23. Hey I am sure Wes listened to him...

After all, Gere has a philosophy degree too - it does pull weight on the *gritty* issues.

(Unlike Dunce in the White House who can't even pick up a book)

[unfrigginreal]

25. Gere's an ass

No, not for his position, but for ambushing Clark at a fundraiser. Clark should have pulled one of his FOX moments on him.

[jeter]

27. That was a lousy answer by Clark

"per se" is definitely not something you want to say in an election. It makes you look like you want it both ways. A better answer would have been "yes, I support the death penalty."

[Kahuna]

36. Not true. A lot of people, including Dean are ambivalent ..

about the death penalty.

[drfemoe]

39. That's the REAL answer ..

If you don't support the death penalty, then you don't believe people should be put to death.

There are lots of countries with the death penalty.
Isn't war a "death penalty"? Boomb - you're out :nuke:

The answer Lum gave is the best way to phrase that POV. If I support society's choice to kill members of our society, it needs to be a much bigger deal.

I'm a cross-over. In college I gave a presentation in a class in favor of the dp. (Didn't we go through a time period when it wasn't used?)

I changed my view about 20 yrs ago. I could never sit on a jury and decide to put someone to death. That's my 'vote' on the issue.

[TXvote]

28. Dialogue is an AMBUSH????

Gere asks a legitimate question and you feel compelled to throw mud at him. How tolerant is that? Maybe you are just upset that Clark's answer was not bold and firm.

You know, a candidate needs be prepared for the Zen and the other opinions America is full of. And unlike the spineless Dems that voted to give Biff Co a blank check on the war, Clark would be well served to stick to his guns. The answer should have been an unequivocable YES, that is exactly what I believe.

You know one of the reasons Biff is admired is because he does not back down one iota from his stances even if they are ridiculous. That kind of confidence inspires followers.

It's called HUTSPA and any candidate running had better get a whole bunch of it before he faces off with Biff.

Peace,
Teresa
www.votervirgin.com

[kwolf68]

30. NO Death Penalty

Us Dems fight about a lot of things, but I believe being completely against the Death Penalty SHOULD be a strong part of the party platform.

We Liberals promote visions of peace...not vengeance...we promote humanity not inhumanity.

Under no circumstances should we ever commission our government to "punish" someone by murdering them.

I think most of the Democrats are for some form of Death Penalthy (Dean, Kerry, Edwards, etc)...The only ones I know of totally against it are Kucinich and Sharpton.

[TexasSissy]

31. I'm a Dem. in favor of the death penalty

I'm a Democrat who is in favor of the death penalty, although I recognize that many Dems. do not. Consequently, I don't care that much if a Dem. MIGHT be in favor of it, and I don't care much if they ARE, since I would expect that from most Dems.

But Clark's answer should've been clearer. He can't straddle the fence on everything. He has to take a stand.

[genius]

32. Gere is right. Clark's position is much better than Dean's but it could

be better than it is. Kucinich and Sharpton are the only two candidates who firmly agree with Richard Gere on the death penalty.

The truth of the matter is that, as it is practiced in America, the death penalty is a genocidal way for Aemricans to kill off poor black people, who are probably innocent. The best researched article I've seen on the subjected was written by Natasha H. for DebateUsa.com. It was called "Where Has the Compassion Gone?" The article shows how innocent people are frequently executed because of missed deadlines - even though they are proven to be innocent. The disproprotionate numbers of poor black people on death row is something the former South African Aparteid government would have applauded.

[Kahuna]

37. Clark and Dean are close. Dean, for the election's sake..

has come out more in favor of it. Clark has said that he'd like a moretoreum on it. Kerry is unequivocally against it.

[genius]

40. Dean currently has the worst position on the death penalty of all

candidates. He said that executions of innocent people were an "acceptable risk." That is a guy I can't vote for. Clark seems more concerned about doing what's right.

[Myra]

41. Seemed like a perfectly reasonable exchange to me

Reasonable question, reasonable answer...tho'
I'd rather hear Clark say he's against the dealth
penalty - no exceptions.

But if Gere's considering cracking open his wallet,
he has every right to inspect the goods.