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OKIsItJustMe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-19-11 03:10 PM
Original message
Solar Power Almost as Cheap as Natural Gas in Six States
http://cleantechnica.com/2011/02/19/solar-power-almost-as-cheap-as-natural-gas-in-six-states/

Solar Power Almost as Cheap as Natural Gas in Six States

February 19, 2011

In the short time since http://cleantechnica.com/2011/02/09/department-of-energy-foresees-solar-wind-power-as-cheap-as-fossil-fuels/">President Obama’s alternative energy plan was announced, already the prospects look good for clean energy that is cost-competitive with fossil fuel. That’s without even factoring in the http://cleantechnica.com/2011/02/17/cost-of-coal-500-billion-year-in-u-s-harvard-study-finds/">avoidable health costs that that the public currently absorbs from high risk, antiquated fuels. The latest case in point is http://www.nrel.gov/features/20110216_low-cost_solar.html">a new high efficiency solar power system out of the National Renewable Energy Laboratory. Designed with the help of some centuries-old technology, it produces electricity at a competitive rate with natural gas in at least six states.

NREL Multi-Junction Solar Cells

The key to the new system is a high-efficiency solar cell based on “multi-junction” technology. As reported recently on this site, http://cleantechnica.com/2011/02/17/high-efficiency-solar-cells-getting-more-efficient-cheaper/">multi-junction solar cells are far more efficient than conventional silicon solar cells. In the recent past they were not particularly cost effective, but that is changing as the technology improves. NREL has been working with the solar company http://www.amonix.com/">Amonix to integrate multi-junction solar cells with its existing concentrated solar system, the Amonix 7700, which was originally designed for conventional silicon cells.

Super-Efficient Concentrated Solar Power

In the lab, NREL’s cells can convert 41.6 percent of the sunlight they collect to usable energy. NREL notes that production cells always under-achieve lab cells, and the ones produced for the Amonix 7700 are achieving 31 percent per module and 27 percent for the system overall. That’s quite a bit lower but it’s still a respectable figure; in fact, NREL states that it is the highest ever recorded for concentrated solar.

New Tech + Old Tech = Cheap Solar Power

Aside from using multi-junction solar cells, NREL and Amonix used a few tricks to keep the cost of the Amonix 7700 down. One factor was the pairing of each cell with an inexpensive lens called a http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fresnel_lens">Fresnel lens, which was first conceived and developed in the 1700′s. For less than $2.00 per lens, each cell got a whopping 500-power amplification. As with another http://cleantechnica.com/2011/02/19/go-anywhere-solar-power-fits-in-standard-shipping-containers/">modular solar power system new to the market, Amonix also focused on keeping the cost of installation at rock bottom. The 7700 requires only a few subassemblies that can be hauled to the site on just two flatbed trucks, and put together in several hours.

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crypto666 Donating Member (3 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-19-11 05:44 PM
Response to Original message
1. Yeh, but...
They still haven't addressed the issue of adapting solar energy to landscapes. They are still trying to adapt landscapes to solar energy production. This means that vast acreages of vegetation is removed during the construction and operation of solar facilities. Because many of these areas are in arid warm deserts, they cannot be reclaimed or restored during decomissioning, and leaves a barren area devoid of vegetation and susceptable to wind and water erosion. So it really isn't renewable energy.
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OKIsItJustMe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-19-11 06:03 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. This is a bit of a red herring
Edited on Sat Feb-19-11 06:06 PM by OKIsItJustMe
http://apps1.eere.energy.gov/solar/cfm/faqs/third_level.cfm/name=Photovoltaics/cat=Applications#Q50


Q: How much space would be needed for photovoltaic systems to meet the entire electrical needs of the United States?

A: If PV were a primary energy source, what would the world look like? Would PV collectors cover every square inch of available land? Contrary to some popular notions, the landscape of a world relying on PV would be almost indistinguishable from the landscape we know today. The impact of PV on the landscape would be low, for three reasons. First, PV systems have siting advantages over other technologies; for example, PV can be put on roofs and can even be an integral part of a building, such as a skylight. Second, even ground-mounted PV collectors are efficient from the perspective of land use. Third, adequate sunlight is ubiquitous and often abundant, and present in predictable amounts almost everywhere. As we move away from fossil-fuel energy, PV will become important because of its land-use advantages:

PV's low-impact siting for flat-plate systems. In the United States, cities and residences cover about 140 million acres of land. We could supply every kilowatt-hour of our nation's current energy requirements simply by applying PV to 7% of this area—on roofs, on parking lots, along highway walls, on the sides of buildings, and in other dual-use scenarios. We wouldn't have to appropriate a single acre of new land to make PV our primary energy source!

PV's efficient ratio of produced energy to land use. Even if it isn't installed on rooftops, flat-plate PV technology is the most land-efficient means to produce renewable energy.

PV has a competitive conversion efficiency, a high capacity factor, and can be "packed" densely in a given area. We still wouldn't have a land use issue, even if we didn't use roofs for PV. We would need only 10 million acres of land — only four-tenths of one percent of the area of the United States — to supply all of our nation's energy using PV. Is that a lot of land? Not for something as important as producing electricity, and not in comparison to some of the other ways we use land.




http://apps1.eere.energy.gov/solar/cfm/faqs/third_level.cfm/name=Concentrating%20Solar%20Power/cat=Applications#Q84


Q: Do concentrating solar power (CSP) plants require a lot of land? How much, exactly?

A: Relatively speaking, no. Consider Hoover Dam, for example. Nevada's Lake Mead, which is home to the dam, covers nearly 250 square miles. In contrast, a CSP system occupying only 10 to 20 square miles could generate as much power annually as Hoover Dam did in one recent year. And if we take into consideration the amount of land required for mining, CSP plants also require less land than coal-fired power plants do.

It's hard to say exactly how much land is required for a CSP plant, however, because this depends on its generating capacity and the particular technology used. For example, a 250-kilowatt plant composed of ten 25-kilowatt dish/engine systems requires less than an acre of land. And a parabolic trough system uses about 5 acres for each megawatt of installed capacity. But in any case, the solar resource needed to generate power using CSP systems is quite plentiful. Imagine being able to generate enough electric power for the entire country by covering about 9 percent of Nevada — a plot of land 100 miles on a side — with parabolic trough systems!

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AtheistCrusader Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-20-11 10:30 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. Erm.
Going to have to be bigger than 20sq miles to produce round-the-clock power like Hoover dam, and that 250sq miles of Lake Mead IS habitat.
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OKIsItJustMe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-21-11 02:28 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. OK, let's address that in two parts
Going to have to be bigger than 20sq miles to produce round-the-clock power like Hoover dam


(Silly Department of Energy! What do they know!?)
http://www.eere.energy.gov/basics/renewable_energy/thermal_storage.html

Thermal Storage Systems for Concentrating Solar Power

One challenge facing the widespread use of solar energy is reduced or curtailed energy production when the sun sets or is blocked by clouds. Thermal energy storage provides a workable solution to this challenge.

In a concentrating solar power (CSP) system, the sun's rays are reflected onto a receiver, which creates heat that is used to generate electricity. If the receiver contains oil or molten salt as the heat-transfer medium, then the thermal energy can be stored for later use. This enables CSP systems to be cost-competitive options for providing clean, renewable energy.

Several thermal energy storage technologies have been tested and implemented since 1985. These include the two-tank direct system, two-tank indirect system, and single-tank thermocline system.


http://www1.eere.energy.gov/solar/thermal_storage_rnd.html

and that 250sq miles of Lake Mead IS habitat.

Lake Mead is an artificial lake. There was a different habitat there before we flooded it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hoover_Dam#Environmental_impact
http://www.usbr.gov/lc/region/pao/pdfiles/bcpact.pdf

http://www.lvrj.com/news/st--thomas-residents-knew-progress-doomed-their-town-103813134.html

The remains of a building poke up from the brush in Moapa Valley, where the receding waters of Lake Mead have exposed the old townsite of St. Thomas.


St. Thomas' post office as it looked in 1938, when the lake flooded the old Mormon settlement for the first time.
COURTESY OF THE LOST CITY



When people complain about the environmental and social impact of a solar farm, the comparison to “Hoover Dam” is an apt one.
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AtheistCrusader Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-21-11 04:14 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. That's nice.
I know you can store thermal power overnight. 20sq miles does not produce 2.08gw of power around the clock. Period. Hoover can torque out 49.92 gigawatt-hours a day.

At the equator, peak energy density for that 20sq miles is 833watts per square yard, PEAK energy, at noon, best case scenario. And that is just what hits the ground. Some of the best PV panels will only convert about 130watts of that potential 833watts hitting the ground. And that's only about 6-8h per day peak production, translating into about 5000 watt-hours per day.

3097600 yards per mile times 20, times 5000: 309 gigawatt-hours hitting the ground per day.
41 gigawatt-hours via the best market efficiency PV, during useful productive daylight hours.

Now, concentrating solar is a different story. Because you have additional/different inefficiencies over PV, converting sun to stored heat, and then stored heat to steam, to turbines to electricity. But it DOES offer 24x7 power, like Hydro, initial efficiency is much higher, and the curve of available power somewhat matches our usage, being a dinural species.

Even a concentrating solar plant will consume significant habitat. Hell, we can barely get wind towers approved, due to the environmental impact on certain land-based species, and we're just having conversations now about the impacts to birds.

Everything has an environmental impact.
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Kolesar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-21-11 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. we can barely get wind towers approved,
Cannot put wind turbines *everywhere*, but your comment is overstated.
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AtheistCrusader Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-21-11 05:33 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. No seriously...
There is a ground squirrel that endangered the entire oregon/wa wind power project.

There's even union resistance to certain tower projects.
http://www.oregonlive.com/environment/index.ssf/2010/03/fighting_wind_farms_in_oregon.html

Pretty much everywhere there's a prevailing wind, there are migratory birds.

This is frustrating as hell.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-19-11 08:27 PM
Response to Original message
3. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
cantbeserious Donating Member (270 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-19-11 10:29 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. All True - Probably Won't Happen Till The Greedy Oil Execs And Capitalists Are Gone
eom
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Marblehead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-20-11 11:36 AM
Response to Original message
5. the oil industry
has captured our goverment
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AtheistCrusader Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-21-11 06:19 PM
Response to Original message
11. According to Amonix
these multi-junction cells are already in production, and installed around the world.
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