Carmakers say California greenhouse rules would endanger SUVs

[RedEarth]

The auto industry said Monday that lawsuits over vehicles' greenhouse gas emissions could eventually force manufacturers to eliminate big SUVs from the market in California, an assertion denied by environmental attorneys and the state air quality board.

"If we lost (in court)," said Dave Barthmuss, General Motors' spokesman for environmental and energy affairs, "certain vehicles could not be offered for sale -- vehicles that consume more fuel than others. There would be fewer SUVs and we might not be able to offer them for sale in California. It could spell the end of the big SUV in California."

At the California Air Resources Board, however, spokesman Jerry Martin said the 2002 law in question cannot force the auto industry to reduce the size of its vehicles or to abandon any models it wants to keep selling.

The spat over what may happen to SUVs in California stems from a pair of federal court lawsuits that have been going on for years but are back in the news because one of them is scheduled to be argued Wednesday before the U.S. Supreme Court.

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2006/11/28/GREENHOUSE.TMP&type=printable


...Great news...the same law needs to be passed in each state...get these monsters on the f....... road..

[phantom power]

1. god forbid.

:eyes:

But that won't happen. Because Toyota and Honda know how to make an SUV that gets sufficient mileage to continue selling them. Assuming that this possibility was ever anything more than a ginned-up threat.

[democrat_patriot]

2. Good. Who needs those huge SUV's anyway?

They aren't needed.

[TwentyFive]

13. I disagree. Some people need a big truck or SUV.

I don't own an SUV, but they have always been around. Chevy has been making them since 1937. A midsize SUV gets about the same mileage as a full sized luxury car, while carrying more cargo and passengers. Toyota hybrid models get in the 30+ mpg range.

The problem is the do nothing congress from 94-06 never set any mileage standards. With a little proding from the gov't, the auto makers will make a fuel efficient SUV.

[wtmusic]

16. What this will do is get rid of the Tahoes, Navistars, etc

which have way too much macho metal and not enough transportation built in. About friggin' time.

[Porcupine]

18. Even on building jobsites 1/2 the trucks are empty.

and carried a guy and his toolbag to work. Some of the local contractors here in town are starting to pack tool sheds into trailers that they leave on the jobsite while the job is in progress. Larger contractors building multiple houses have taken to securing materials in shipping containers.

Of the people I know with trucks and SUV's (a lot) 7/8 could used a downsized vehicle for the job they are doing with it.

[napi21]

3. And THAT should make me sad????

I suggest GM & Ford wake up to the fact that the days of the SUV are GONE!

And they wonder why the foreign mfg'sare always outselling them!

[Dead_Parrot]

4. I'm heartbroken. nt

[LynneSin]

5. Instead of bitching about not selling your supersized-SUVs....

...why not find ways to make those supersized-SUVs more gas efficient. It can be done if they just try.

It's not about the size - it's about the gas mileage

[MountainLaurel]

6. Waaaaaah!

:nopity:

[Der Blaue Engel]

7. "It could spell the end of the big SUV in California"

First the Dems win both houses, now this! It's like Christmas just keeps on coming. :evilgrin:

[wtmusic]

19. Doncha love it?

:D

[AX10]

8. Wonderful to hear!

:party:

[acmejack]

9. So they should kill the planet instead?

I get it...

[Make7]

10. Couldn't they just petition to have SUVs put on the endangered species list?

Arguing that if a corporation is legally comparable to a person, the product(s) it produces would be legally comparable to its children. At the very least this issue might legally fall under something regarding forced sterilization.

:) Make7

[wtmusic]

20. Wow

If you can pull that off you deserve the 2007 Johnny Cochran Award. :crazy:

[Dead_Parrot]

21. I think you need a breeding pair to qualify.

Now there's a weird idea...

[Eugene]

11. Why would that be a bad thing?

...even if it were true.

America's obsession with big SUV's endangers the planet.

[jpak]

12. Boo fucking hoooo

My heart bleeds

:nopity:

[JuniperLea]

14. Awww... I don't know whether to laugh, cry, or...

wind my watch!


:rofl:


It reminds me of a lady I saw on TV... she was in tears because she had to sell her summer home... boo freaking hoo...


Since when is it the responsibility of the people to keep big corporations in business? Especially corporations who are paying their CEO's outrageous fortunes and cutting back benefits for the few American workers they have remaining.

[lapfog_1]

15. I believe that Honda or Toyota have a mid-sized SUV

coming that is supposed to gets over 40 mpg in city driving.

Ford has a version of the Escape SUV now which is a hybrid and it is rated at 36 MPG.

So if you HAVE to drive an SUV for some reason (you are the designated little league chauffeur, for example), there will be a vehicle you can drive that is better than 90 percent of cars currently on the road as far as green house gasses go.

[leveymg]

17. As an American, its my God-given right to commute in an 8,000 lb Hummer

Why else did we invade Iraq, anyway?

[NNadir]

22. I won't try to pry it from your cold dead hands.

[Blix Krieg]

23. Good Riddance Detroit

The article should read "American Built SUV's" Honda and
other offshore manufacturers make plenty of models that
meet California standards. No one in their right mind
would spend hard earned money on Detroit Junkheaps anyway.

[Kolesar]

25. I see the "hate America crowd" has appeared, right on cue

[Dead_Parrot]

27. As have the "you're either with us or against us" crowd...

:)

[wtmusic]

28. If you love America, buy a Toyota hybrid SUV

Built in America and built better than anything coming from Detroit.

[Kolesar]

30. I have concluded that it was an anti-union misinformation campaign run amok

With all the RW messages of "lazy union workers", "union bosses taking our wages", etc., all right out of a Cato Institute republiporn briefing book.

[AndyTiedye]

24. So Build Us Some Hybrid SUVs Then! Ford and Toyota Can, Why Not GM?

This SUV meets SULEV standards.

[Kolesar]

26. Most of those drivers could get by with a minivan anyway

I don't know who thinks those hard to park, unreponsive trucks are nice to drive.

[AndyTiedye]

31. Is a Minivan Any Better?

If I replaced my Escape Hybrid with a minivan,
it would probably burn more gas and pollute more.
It would certainly have ground clearance issues in places.

Actually, the easiest car to park was my old RAV4.
It was the 2-door model, only 96" long.
That would fit in the tiniest of parking spaces.
I actually parked it in a space touching the bumpers of the cars ahead and behind me once. Some onlookers applauded.

I traded the RAV4 for the somewhat larger Escape Hybrid
because the hybrid gets much better mileage and is a SULEV.

Our other car is a Prius (which requires as long a parking space as the Escape -- The Prius is bigger than it looks.

[Kolesar]

32. Yes, for six or more occupants

Or a hundred cubic feet of cargo room. However, a minivan would not be able to supply the attribute of excessive conspicuous consumption as well as a Chevy Suburban.

[AndyTiedye]

33. Suburbans Haven't Exactly Been Flying Off The Showroom Floors Lately

If they want to sell any of them at all, they had better put hybrid powerplants in them, regulations or not.

[AndyTiedye]

34. Best for 6-7 Occupants Would be the Toyota Highlander Hybrid

I am not trying to defend the practice of buying an oversized vehicle.

I just don't get this "SUV bad, minivan good" thing,
when the vehicles are the same size and the SUV gets better mileage.

[Kolesar]

35. What does a Toyota Highlander Hybrid cost?

I also have doubts that it is actually off road capable and not just a poseur like a RAV4 or most of Toyotas "SUV"s.

Why is not this supposedly-beneficent company building a hybrid minivan?

Did you know that Toyota company also opposes increased fuel economy standards?

edit:a proper noun for a pronoun

[w4rma]

29. Yup. Exactly. A huge hybrid would be able to meet the rules. (nt)