Do you think they really believe that?

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

Do you think that posters here who make comments like "arming everyone, guns for everyone, guns everywhere" really believe that anyone wants those things? If not why do you think they make those comments.

David

[east texas lib]

1. Fear, anger, shock value...

Among other things.

[the_real_38]

18. Power, common sense, concern for victims ...

... among other things.

[east texas lib]

25. Having an acute sense of situational awareness...

Plus being armed and competent with your weapon will increase your odds of not becoming a victim.
It will raise your chances of surviving a hostile encounter. Nothing more, nothing less. But nothing
can help you if you buy into the fantasy that it's someone else's responsibility to protect your
life or the lives of your loved ones. The police can only do so much. The rest really is up to you.

[carguy67]

2. What

Pro-Gun forum member has said that? Only such posts I have seen are from anti-gun members taking things out of porportion. I am not saying no one has or anything just asking who or where.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

4. What made you think I was talking about pro RKBA people?

Those comments are standard fair for the anti's here.

David

[carguy67]

5. Sorry

Sorry I misread the post... Didn't think that you were an anti

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

6. It wasn't really clear, my fault.

[jody]

3. Some people believe things that are demonstrably false, others know they are false but perpetuate

false hoods.

IMO whether through ignorance or malice, they don't serve a useful function in society.

[tburnsten]

7. I think many of them don't care much

for a realistic discussion, and I think they misconstrue our (pro-gun posters) comments borderline intentionally, but I think at least some of them do it simply because they can't stomach the idea of re-thinking their negative attitudes and prejudices against gun owners, no matter how wrong they may be.

Seriously, there is a lot of horrible stereotyping that goes on here.

[spin]

16. Just like many people stereotype motercyclists...

They see a biker with a doo-rag and tattoos and assume he's a member of some motorcycle gang like the Outlaws or Hells Angels. If they actually knew the biker they might be surprised to find that he is an honest citizen. In the small town that I live in, most of the local police ride motorcycles off duty and fit the stereotype of the outlaw biker. When on duty they stick their lives on the line to protect their community for marginal pay and little respect.

So people who are not familiar with the gun culture and gun owners make assumptions about gun owner's intelligence and far too often their penis size. They presume anyone who owns a firearm is a racist. They watch violent unrealistic movies and equate gun owners with the screen characters.

Many anti-gun people are well educated and they assume that the degrees they posses prove that they are far more intelligent then the average person. Their education has failed them. An advanced degree is evidence of hard work and dedication and the opportunity and the financial ability to acquire it. A truly educated person will have learned that people have different motivations and goals in life and their life experience will cause them to develop a variety of hobbies and interests. A person raised with and around firearms will have a far different attitude than a person who has never had the opportunity to handle, own and become proficient with them.

A truly well educated person would never stereotype.


“Stereotypes are devices for saving a biased person the trouble of learning”
unknown

edited for typo

[Indy Lurker]

8. Yes, in some ways they do.

I won't try to speak for anyone posting here in particular, but I can relate this to my next door neighbors.

They are clearly Type A.

They seal coat their blacktop driveway 4 times a year, their lawn is perfect. They worry about the occasional weed in my lawn, because they believe that if one weed gets into their lawn, soon their lawn will be overrun with weeds.

Even though I make a special effort to keep weeds away from the property line, and even though the few weeds I do have, have not taken over my lawn, it doesn't seem to matter. they are sure that if a weed gets into their lawn it will quickly spiral out of control.


I believe it is the same with people who have an irrational fear of guns, or for that matter different races, or ethnic groups. It almost looks like a phobia.

For certain people, and certain concepts, there seems to be rational disconnect. Like the fear of spiders. If you try to confront these people with the facts, (or for that matter a small spider), they get visibly uncomfortable, even angry, even though they are never in any real danger.

[WWFZD]

9. They've been swayed by propaganda

It would explain much of the venom spewed by some of the antis against the pro 2A folks. On this forum I've read numerous posts by antis that link to articles in publications such as Mother Jones that regurgitate anti-gun propaganda and even report outright lies. It's easier to believe official journalists reports in highly regarded news outlets than the claims of some anonymous guns forum poster.
It's easy for those who've never handled a firearm to hear and believe propaganda about gun shows, "assault rifles", "sawed-off shotguns", machine guns and automatic AK-47's in the hands of gangbangers and not too much of a leap to then attribute bad or evil intentions to those who would argue against these official reports.
I've often wondered why the same people repeat the same falsehoods over and over again, are proven wrong over and over again, and return to repeat the same Brady campaign talking points the next time.
A little research might dispel some of these false assumptions but many of them aren't interested in spending time researching something that doesn't conform to their world view anyway.

[old mark]

10. Dave, they base their opinions and statements on

information gleaned from movies, tv shows and the anti-gun organizations.
Media is famous for being wrong about guns, about the types and uses of guns by ordinary people, and about the types of people who own, use and (horror)enjoy guns and shooting.
The antis need us to be stupid so they can be smart.
They have a need to be IN CONTROL of every situation in life, your life and mine as well as their own, and will not accept that other people have the right and capacity to make important decisions for themselves.
Many of the anti gun crowd are very scary individuals to me, and I am very glad to see so many good Damocrats who are pro-gun.

The really screaming antis have serious mental and emotional problems, IMO.
(Recomended)
mark

[SteveM]

13. Where full-auto weapons are used most: real life crime or T.V. drama?

This would make a good study, and might dispel the "All-AK-all-the-time" images fed us by MSM.

[old mark]

19. Steve - full auto weapons have been regulated in the

US since 1936 by the Federal government.
They are available to those who can pass a background check and pay a tax of several hundred dollars per weapon.They may be bought and sold only through specialy licensed dealers called class III dealers, and their sale is heavily regulated, much more so than other guns.
They are pretty much rich man's toys -prices are very high, some wartime collecter's items (WWII) selling in the tens of thousands of dollars. They are almost never used in crime - they cost more money than most criminals will ever see. The amount of ammunition alone is more than many criminals could afford.

TV, though, has everyday criminals shooting full auto guns all the time.

Check any old "A-Team" episode.

mark

[carguy67]

21. The last

Class three firearm used in a crime was by a Police Officer... Hmm only cops can have guns, yet there are like it or not bad cops out there too. NFA was BS to tax the working man out of being able to afford them.

Mark, This post is not directed against you... just continuing what you had said.

[old mark]

22. You are right - the full auto guns

are only affordable by tohos with enough disposable income to buy a small house.

Kind of ironic you can buy a real - full auto capable - AK in parts of Africa for $50.

Can't legally import one here, but toy AK's - semi autop only - start at nearly $400. They are pretty much high capacity plinkers and fairly useless.

mark

[carguy67]

23. It's a joke

Full auto especially in untrained hands is less deadly than aimed fire. I'd bet you money that 99% of gang bangers couldn't get but maybe 1 round on taget at 50yards with FA.

[slackmaster]

11. It's just an indication that the person doesn't have anything intelligent to say

So they rely on logical fallacies like straw men, red herrings, and poisoning the well with statements like "reasonable gun control".

[SteveM]

12. These expressions have proliferated recently...

as gun-controllers have been defeated in their activities, especially since the Heller decision. The expressions are tacit admissions by prohibitionists that their positions are no longer tenable. Melodramatic over-the-top statements, loud as they are, really constitute a tongue-in-cheek warning for anyone who might see this stuff that the "barbarians" have breached the wall. Any attempt to smear gun owners yet again is over-shadowed by these rather comical admissions of defeat. Let them continue to gnash teeth.

[Seenterman]

14. Thank god we got some Pro-gunners with us

One of that main reasons I joined DU is to dispell this false image of gun owners as all white republicans who are racists, have mullets (even though nothing wrong with mullets), drive pickups with the confederate flag on the back.

99% of gun owners I've meet DO NOT fit this sterotype.

Im just glad we have some rational gun owners here to defend the 2nd at DU. Kudos!

[SteveM]

17. Welcome to the show!...

We try to use good data, facts and argument. It's a culture war, so expect so rather hideous things to be said about gun-owners. (In an open survey of DU members, some 51% indicated they owned at least one gun -- so the stereotype doesn't even fit here.)

[old mark]

24. That is the main reason I came here, too.

I am on a lot of gun forums, have been shooting for fun since I learned to shoot in the Cub Scouts in the 1950's at age 10. (I'm 61)

I just got tired of being surrounded (on the gun forums) by republicans and worse, thought I'd be welcome here. IMO, some of the very very left are quite similar to the very very right - they know everything, especially about how you should live your life, and have no hesitation about demanding you follow their instructions - "for your own good".
I really can't stand people like that, never could.
Like you, I am very glad to find gun owning Democrats. Some day we might need them, especially if McCain wins. Rant over.

Well it is a change, anyway.

Welcome to DU.

mark

[krispos42]

15. It's a rhetorical device

And not a very good one at that.

I respond my explaing the difference between non-discrete and discrete weapons, like a land mind versus a rifle.

[joshcryer]

20. It's called irrational mockery.

They're attempting to mock a caricature that doesn't exist, thus showing their irrationality.