The NRA right wingers are lying about Michael Moore's BFC

[Lefty48197]

It gets quite tiresome listening to the NRA's right wing propoganda team telling us that Michael Moore's, Bowling For Columbine is somehow less than fully truthful.
Most of their ranting centers around the first scene, where Michael opens a bank account, and gets a free gun for doing so.
Apparently there are quite a few right wing websites, that the NRAites like to cite as "proof" that Moore is lying.
For those of you that haven't seen the film, or know better than to buy into the NRA's lies, I have compiled a partial transcript of that first scene:

(The scene starts with Michael entering the North Country bank, somewhere near Tim McVeigh's hideout in northern Michigan.)

MM(standing at the teller counter): "I want the account where I can get the free gun"

Teller #1: "OK"

<cut>
Teller #2: "You do a CD, and we'll hand you a gun...
...once we do the background check and everything, it's yours to go"

(The tellers are all dressed in the same blue 'polo' style shirts, with the white bank logo on the left side of the chest. There is a gun rack on the wall, holding three guns, right next to this teller who is speaking to Michael)

T#2: "We have a vault. At all times, we keep at least 500 firearms"
MM: "500 of these, you have in your vault?"
T#2: "In our vault"
MM: "Wow"
T#2: "We have to do a background check"
MM: "At the bank here?"
T#2: "At the bank. Which we are a licensed firearm dealer"
MM: "Oh you are? You're a bank AND a licensed firearm dealer?"

(The film then cuts to a scene of a young man handing Mike his firearm. The man is dressed in the exact same blue polo shirt with the exact same bank logo on the front. The exact same teller counter is in the background, with the exact same gun rack hanging on the wall, right where it was when Mike opened his account)

YM: "There you go Mike"
MM: "Thank you very much. Wow."
YM: "I Have one personally"
MM: "That's a nice action" (said while operating the rifle bolt)
YM: "It is. It's a straight shooter, let me tell ya"
MM: "Wow Sweet"
MM: "Well here's my first question: Don't you think it's a little dangerous handing out guns in a bank?"

A recent post by a "pro RKBA" poster tried to claim that he picked up the rifle at a warehouse or something. Why then is that teller counter is the background when he is being handed his gun?

[trumad]

1. I always put the winger gun nuts on the spot

when I chuckle at how Moses took off when Mike started grilling him with some tough questions... Moses ran and hid in his own house...

One of the best seens of 2002..MHOP

[Emoto]

11. Which NRA'ers and what lies?

Can you be specific please?

So far, from what I have read, Moore's movie is pure propaganda, and should not have been considered a documentary by any sane standard.

[coloradodem2005]

2. Interesting Movie.

I especially like how in the movie, he seemed to cite that the root of the violence was fear.

[Lefty48197]

3. You are correct

Anyone who watched that film knows that Michael was stressing that our society is living in fear, and that the media helps perpetuate that fear. Moore makes the point that gun violence is really a symptom of those fears.

Of course, all the NRA nuts are running around believing that is it an anti-gun film (because Wayne LaPierre has told them how to think). It's too bad that their minds are too closed for them to actually watch the film.

[DeathvadeR]

4. If you liked BFC, read "Dude, Where's My Country?" it Kicks ass.

[ClassWarrior]

5. Give 'em the litmus test...

It's also been well-proven and documented (including by Mike himself at his web site) that BFC is an honest film, and that the so-called distortions were common documentary film techniques - compressing time, retakes, and so on.

But let's assume for a moment that Mike is lying in BFC.

Did his lies result in the deaths of more than 400 American soldiers, and the maiming of more than 2,000 others?

QED

[CarinKaryn]

6. This is a very powerful movie

that should be watched by all gun owners. It may help them to shed some light on them selves.

[Romulus]

7. you mean like the Canada segment?

should be watched by all gun owners. It may help them to shed some light on them selves.

You know, where the Canadian guy says he can get all kinds of firearms, legally, no problem? Just before Moore walks into a store and buys some ammo? Just before Moore points out that Canadians have access to the same types of firearms Americans do, but aren't killing each other at the rate Americns are? This despite all the "killing firepower" floating around with the Labatt's Blue?:shrug:

[Lefty48197]

15. The NRA keeps telling us that Canadians aren't allowed to own guns

I though it was interesting to hear a Canadian tell which kinds of guns he owns, and just how easy it was for him to buy them.

[CO Liberal]

17. I Thoough It Was Interesting......

...to note the difference in gun death ratets north and south of the border. Could it be due to the fact that there's no NRA in Canada???

:-)

[MrBenchley]

18. It could also be due

to Canada having that "socialistic safety net" that right wing pieces of shit (of the sort peddling gun rights) keep declaring "doesn't work."

[Romulus]

19. imagine that!!

"It could also be due"
Posted by MrBenchley
to Canada having that "socialistic safety net"

:think:

[beevul]

22. WOW!!

"It could also be due to Canada having that "socialistic safety net""-MrBenchley




Good point Bench.

[the_acid_one]

8. Seen it.

And if by "shed some light" you mean "bore into submission". Then yes, it certainly did.

The most powerful thing about this movie was the powerful need to delete when I was done with it.

The first time I watched it,I to was fooled into thinking that Mikey had a point somewhere.
The second time I watched it I realized that I was wrong, and there wasnt a point afterall.

So where exactly is this light you mentioned supposed to come in?

[Peaceful_Nation]

21. Maybe it will help them to realize........

that they are in love with a machine that is good for killing and nothing else. They glorify death by owning the machines that can bring it so quickly.

[BullDozer]

9. Yes or no

It seems to me that only question needing to be answered about that scene is whether or not anyone elses transaction (minus the cameras of course) would have been doen exactly the same as Michael Moores was done for the movie.

I've only seen slanted (both ways)and twisted (both ways) answers that never actually address the question.

It really seems to me to be a yes or no answer.

If I walked into that bank today would my transaction be handled and completed the same way as shown in the film?

[Emoto]

10. Care for a little fact with that whimsey?

Here is another point of view:

From www.bowlingfortruth.com

"Only one problem plagues it's cleverness: It was staged.

Staged scene

Indeed, there's more, a lot more, to this story. In an interview, Jan Jacobson, the woman at this bank shown in the movie, says they were filmed for about an hour-and-a-half during which she explained everything to Moore in detail. But, the way things were presented in the film, Jacobson says, it looks like "a wham-bam thing." She says she resents the way she was portrayed as some kind of "backwoods idiot" mindlessly handing out guns. She says Moore deceived her into being interviewed by saying of their long-gun-give-away program: "This is so great. I'm a hunter, a sportsman, grew up in Michigan, am an NRA member." She says: "He went on and on and on saying this was the most unique program he'd ever heard of." This is the first example of how Moore completely deceives and manipulates his subjects to be made to look stupid in his film. Unfortunately, it is not the last and more unfortunately, an ignorant audience plays patsy to Moore's dishonest depiction.

Jacobson says the movie is misleading because it leaves the impression that a person can come in, sign up and walk out with a gun. But, this is not done because no guns are kept at her bank, although one would think so. She says that ordinarily a person entitled to one of the long-guns must go to a gun-dealer where the gun is shipped.

In fact, despite what BFC wants us to believe, Jacobson says there are no long-guns at her bank. The 500 guns mentioned in the movie are in a vault four hours away. But wait a second... Didn't I see some long guns sitting right there on the rack above her shoulder? Yes - you're not going crazy - those guns you saw (as shown in the picture up the page) are models.

She says that Moore's signing papers in the film was just for show. His immediately walking out of the bank with a long-gun was allowed because "this whole thing was set up two months prior to the filming of the movie" when he had already complied with all the rules, including a background check.

Jacobson says the bank's so-called "Weatherby Program" has "absolutely" been a smashing success. She says their corporate office was braced for some possible criticism because of BFC. But, they got only two calls -- and these were from people wanting to know the details of the "Weatherby Program" so they, too, could get their long-guns! "

[DoctorWho]

12. Twisting the Truth for Columbine

I do not see what was the big deal Mr. Moore made of this,
and now the truth is out too, He staged plenty of stuff in that
movie, now copies have warnings on them about the lies contained
in this film, it seems more fiction than truth,
No laws were being broken, so why did He make it out to be so bad ?
or dangerous ? no one that deposits $ 15,000 in a Bank, and passed a backround check,and gets a Hunting Rifle is a risk to society.

[jtb33]

13. So if you ask MM...

Is his BFC pro-gun or anti-gun?

It seems that most think it's more about the irrational fear of guns that the media hypes up.

[Lefty48197]

16. The DVD has a warning about lies contained in the film?

That's funny, my copy doesn't have any warning. I guess there is some lying going on, but it's not coming from Moore.

[Lefty48197]

14. You think Mike was trying to deceive her?

When he said he was an NRA member? When he said he was from Michigan? When he said he was a hunter? How is that deceptive?
Emoto, your whole response is hilarious. Did that woman really claim that Moore made her look like some kind of 'backwoods idiot'?
That's kind of strange. I saw the movie, and I don't think it made her look like a 'backwoods idiot' at all. Almost all of the dialog in that bank is posted above. Which part made her look like a backwoods idiot? I'm curious as to how something could be distorted so much by people who are claiming to be clearing up distortions.
And Dear God, did Mike actually go through the background check prior to going in to pick up his gun? That's very deceptive. Of course, what you're telling me is that Mike went to the warehouse to pick up his gun right? Since they weren't actually handing them out in the bank right? So what he must have done, is pick up his gun (at the warehouse) and then walk into a bank with a rifle. (I'm just guessing, but that would probably be illegal - One of the NRA constitional scholars/crimefighting experts will please comment on the legality of that)
And after Mike walked into the bank with a rifle, he somehow conned that bank employee into handing the gun to him, and saying 'here you are'? Do you really expect me to believe all that?

[Emoto]

20. heh

Glad I gave you some enjoyment. :-)

Why is it so difficult for you to believe that the whole thing was staged?

[MrBenchley]

23. Gee moto

Perhaps it's because the same folks claiming it was staged are also claiming there's a non-existent warning label.