Dem bill aims to curb gun trafficking

[jpak]

http://thehill.com/homenews/senate/157265-new-bill-aims-to-curb-gun-trafficking

<snip>.

Sponsored by Rep. Mike Quigley (D-Ill.), the proposal aims to quash the illegal gun market by granting the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco Firearms and Explosives (ATF) new powers to trace crime guns.

Quigley said his proposal is a "common-sense" way to help law enforcers "close the loopholes that allow criminals to buy and traffic guns."

<snip>

Announced Wednesday — the 12th anniversary of the deadly shooting rampage at Columbine High School near Denver — Quigley's bill proposes three significant changes to current firearm laws.

First, it would require gun manufacturers to stamp a second, hidden serial number onto every new gun in order to prevent criminal tampering that makes guns untraceable. Second, it would require firearm dealers to maintain background-check records on gun buyers for 60 days, rather than destroying them after 24 hours, as current law dictates. And third, it would force gun dealers to inventory their stock and report all lost and stolen guns to the ATF.

<more>

[Glassunion]

1. I only like one of his ideas. The rest... Not so much.

"First, it would require gun manufacturers to stamp a second, hidden serial number onto every new gun in order to prevent criminal tampering that makes guns untraceable." The first guy to find the super secret serial number will ruin it for everybody. Once on the internets, criminals can scratch away at it. But not too bad of an idea. But I fear it may not be effective.


"Second, it would require firearm dealers to maintain background-check records on gun buyers for 60 days, rather than destroying them after 24 hours, as current law dictates." This one is really stupid. Form 4473 is a record of the background check AND firearm dealers are required to keep these FOREVER or turn them over to the ATF who then keeps them FOREVER when they leave the business.

"And third, it would force gun dealers to inventory their stock and report all lost and stolen guns to the ATF." I like this one. Can be cheap and easy to do with the right equipment.

On Edit: Where the fuck is the loophole that is being closed with this guy's ideas?

[AtheistCrusader]

2. Put the serial number on the chamber.

Yeah, go ahead, file it off, dipshit.

Either they won't file deep enough to prevent the police from 'raising' the letters (Simple chemical applique to do that) or they will file it off enough, and kB! the weapon next time it is fired.

Simple.


Inventory report is good though. Nothing wrong with that.

[ThatPoetGuy]

3. kB?

Is that ka-Boom?

[AtheistCrusader]

6. Exactly.

ka-BOOM!

[Glassunion]

5. Good point...

Would work well with most firearms... But what happens when you buy a new barrel from the internets? Would barrels be regulated at that point?

[AtheistCrusader]

8. One little mistake...

Possible the BATFE might regulate barrels as part of the lower, or like the lower or something goofy like that. Yeah, it would have side-effects.

[TheWraith]

7. That's been tried. It doesn't work.

In fact, the microstamping marks are extremely easy to remove without leaving traces.

[AtheistCrusader]

9. I'm not talking microstamping.

Big, gnarly, forged in letters like the model number around the chamber on my USM1917. You can't file that off without sincerely risking blowing your face off. Sure, you could get it flat and polish it safely enough, but forensics can raise the letters anyway from it. You have to go deep to prevent it.

[petronius]

20. I wonder what it would do to production costs, though, to have to retool

to create this hidden and hard-to-remove serial...

[TheWraith]

21. Not very useful, I'm afraid.

You'd still have to actually have the gun in order to have the numbers, so it doesn't help if the criminal takes the gun with them, or ditches it somewhere that the police can't find it, like off a bridge or in a dumpster 20 blocks away.

Even assuming that you do have the gun, if like most crime gun it was stolen, then you still have more or less a dead end trail, with no real way to connect it to the shooter.

If there were a simple, technological silver bullet for this problem, I dare say we would already have it. Hell, we've certainly tried ineffective technical solutions for long enough.

[AtheistCrusader]

22. Weapons are recovered by the bucketload in Mexico.

Not all are traceable because they have had the numbers filed off. If there is a correlation of gun shops pumping out these weapons to dubious buyers, or directy to the cartels, we might be able to better identify the source and prosecute.

Trace it's sale, or file the number off and render the weapon too dangerous to use. Seems like one way to attack the problem. At some point, weapons slip from lawful markets, to criminal hands. That point of transfer needs to be found, whether it's a gun dealer, or a legal export to the Mexican Government that was then lost/stolen/misappropriated.

[Bold Lib]

14. Problem. Barrels have a finite life and are often replaced

with better barrels when upgrading for the various shooting sports. I have replaced several barrels for accuracy reasons, one to change the caliber, and one that was "shot out".

[PavePusher]

18. Change barrel to a blank with no serial number. n/t

[Riftaxe]

11. Don't be such a pessimist, didn't you know multiple VINs

completely stopped auto theft? :) for the humor impaired, here is your :sarcasm: tag.

Although for the purpose of recovering stolen firearms, I suspect I could support that part of it.

[Glassunion]

12. "Although for the purpose of recovering stolen firearms, I suspect I could support that part of it."

That will never happen. Just look at the NFA registry. It proved ownership in one case, however since that was not its design, it was inadmissible.

[lawodevolution]

4. fail fail and fail

Yeah, Let's stop violent crime by farting in the wind. Here are three better ideas:

1. Legalize weed etc. 2. Liberalize Mexican gun laws. 3. Promote law abiding citizen purchase of black market guns.

[jpak]

10. Ha Ha and Ha

:rofl:

[DonP]

13. Quigley is a Daley meat puppet

Imagine that? A representative from Chicago that Daley got elected, supporting more gun control. Give Quigley all the respect you'd offer Daley on this issue. He hasn't had an original idea since he got elected.

Just another Chicago puppet out of the US mainstream. Oh, and a hypocrite too. In Illinois, as a legislator, he does have concealed carry rights. "Good for me but not for thee" at work again.

[Bold Lib]

15. yup

[ManiacJoe]

16. Bad writing: paragraphs 2 and 8 conflict with each other.

[rl6214]

17. That's all we need to do is grant the ATF more power

:sarcasm:

[PavePusher]

19. "Quigley"?!

I bet Tom Selleck is frggen' pissed....