5 days to renew AWB.

[FatSlob]

As of today:

There is one legislative day left in July, and that is tomorrow.

There are zero legislative days in August, as there is a "Summer District Work Period" until the 3rd of September. Then there is Labor day, then four more legislative days.

Looks like the ban will go bye-bye.

[Wickerman]

1. And with it my vote for Bush

didn't he promise to keep the bill intact? At any length?

And here we go - he's not done a damn thing either way. Gutless and spineless waffler. That clinches it - looks like Judge Roy Moore for me.

[MrBenchley]

3. Yours, and millions of moderate voters...

But Chimpy will hang on to the lunatic fringe he's courting by pissing on the NAACP and the like....unless by then they're so depressed they stay home.

[leanings]

25. millions of moderate voters???

LOL. Yes, millions of moderate voters have been hanging in there with Bush up to now. The AWB is going to be the straw that breaks their collective, gun-fearing back.

Nobody gives a rat's ass about gun control except for the gun rights folks and a few frothy mouthed Brady drones. Your position is politically obsolete. No one in either political party is going to pursue it. You lose, and don't have a chance of winning until we forget about the 2000 election. And that, my friend, is going to be a long, long, long, long time. :hi:

[MrBenchley]

29. Surrender, Dorothy!

I think I'll just keep going anyway...and ignore the mutterings of our trigger happy brethren...

[FatSlob]

4. Judge Roy Moore:

I believe he was the Judge who had his courtroom in his saloon, right?

[Wickerman]

9. With respect due to Benburch - bite yer tongue, boy!

[FatSlob]

11. Who was the old west "hanging judge" then?

on edit: It was Roy BEAN! Duh!

[TX-RAT]

12. It was Roy BEAN! Duh!

Law west of the Pecos.Little town called Langtry.Little Saloon called the Jersey Lilly. The Hanging Judge.

[Wickerman]

14. A Texas guy, I do believe

or, perhaps I am thinking of the whorehouse judge, whatever his name was - or, maybe I don't have a clue what I am typing.

[benburch]

5. If your tongue

were any farther in your cheek, you'd poke a hole through it.

[Bowline]

38. It's not like he was gonna get my vote anyway.

However, ANY politician that states publicly that he/she is going to vote to obstruct my ability to exercise any of my rights will not only lose my vote but will cause me to actively support his/her removal from office.

Imagine the stink that would be caused if someone proposed a waiting period for book/magazine purchases, or if they proposed mandatory registration of all PCs and other righting materials, or if they required mandatory registration of church affiliation? How about if they wanted to allow you access to an attorney only after you had fulfilled some arbitrary governmental regulation? Pretty ridiculous, eh? Well, that's how some people see the asinine AWB and most of the other TWENTY THOUSAND gun laws in this country.

[Wickerman]

45. So, can I read your post that you are actively working to make certain

Kerry is not elected?

I do have a bit of problem with the analogy:

"Imagine the stink that would be caused if someone proposed a waiting period for book/magazine purchases"

against the concept of gun control. Last time I looked, books weren't responsible for 10's of thousands of deaths per year.

[Bowline]

47. Neither are guns...

PEOPLE are responsible for deaths. Guns only kill if a person pulls the trigger. The problem is not the guns but the lack of deterrence for using a gun. Only the threat of SERIOUS punishment for committing a crime with a gun will deter most people. Some people simply will not be deterred by anyone.

It's time we started holding PEOPLE accountable for their actions.

[Wickerman]

49. Boy, you said it - high time

we start holding people accountable. Yet the US has the highest rate of incarceration of any of the so called free nations on the planet. the prison industry is so profitable that even the Bush Crime Family has reached their slimy tenacles into the bidness.

Meanwhile, crack down on gun crime? Yeah, every whack job who commits a gun crime seems to get a pass- We have all sorts of folks who defend Randy Weaver because he was off 1/2 an inch when he shortened just ONE barrel of shotgun out of the goodness of his heart for friend. When he ran the law he was being accountable.

David Koresh? Another great law-abider.

You never answered my question so I ask again; are YOU working to defeat Kerry's run for the White House?

[Bowline]

51. No, I am not working to defeat Kerry's run for the White House

I am working to defeat Bush's run for the White House, but I'll work to defeat Kerry in '08 should he, as President, sign any legislation infringing any of my rights.

[Wickerman]

53. thank you

[skippythwndrdog]

65. True, but the authors can be a problem.

Does "Mein Kampf" bring anything to mind?

[MrBenchley]

78. Yeah, it's the sort of crap sold at most gun shows

Funny how pretty much every humhole wearing a swastika these days is peddling this "gun rights" rubbish...

[Wickerman]

80. By Gawd - you're right! Lets ban all books because Hitler wrote a book

that was obscure until he became a serious contender in national politics. I argue the opposite - had folks actual read his book when released they would've seen what a nutjob he was and we might have prevented a world of hurt AND the accumulation of wealth for the Bush* family, thereby eliminating the need for you and me to be having this inane conversation.

By the way - as a collector of whackjob literature I have a copy of the second edition in orignial german - what a crock.


The angry ranting of an obscure, small-party politician, the first volume of Mein Kampf was virtually ignored when it was originally published in 1925. Likewise the second volume, which appeared in 1926. The book details Hitler's childhood, the "betrayal" of Germany in World War I, the desire for revenge against France, the need for lebensraum for the German people, and the means by which the National Socialist party can gain power. It also includes Hitler's racist agenda and his glorification of the "Aryan" race. The few outside the Nazi party who read it dismissed it as nonsense, not believing that anyone could--or would--carry out its radical, terrorist programs. As Hitler and the Nazis gained power, first party members and then the general public were pressured to buy the book.

http://consumerinfo.tultur.com/-/0395951054/Mein-Kampf/

[skippythwndrdog]

84. So much for a little humor.

[Wickerman]

85. so little humor

nice try

[7th_Sephiroth]

112. does this ban (i havent cared much about it)

being lifted mean i'll be able to find canister magazines for my SPAS shotgun?

[Hoping4Change]

2. What's wrong with you.? If the AWB is renewed it means that

terra-ists will be inconvenienced. Sheeesh.

[Bowline]

39. The AWB has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with stopping terrorism.

It is entirely about controlling the population with nickle & dime gun control measures that, based on a false premise, pretends to prevent gun crimes by banning mere cosmetic features of lethal weapons. It's like trying to stop DUIs by banning only red and blue cars or just cars with chrome wheels.

A post-ban weapon is every bit as deadly as a pre-ban one. Absolutely no difference in lethality, only appearance.

[CO Liberal]

46. If You Truly Believe That...

...I have a bridge in Brooklyn and some lovely swampland in Florida you might be interested in.

[Bowline]

48. Terrorism wasn't even an issue when the AWB was passed in 1994.

And do you seriously believe that making semi-automatic rifles with flash suppressors and bayonet lugs illegal will prevent terrorists from flying planes into buildings, or driving a truck full of explosives into a building?

We're not talking about machine guns here, we're talking about cosmetically altered, SEMI-automatic rifles.

[CO Liberal]

50. But Making Any Type of Gun More Readily Available...

...will make it easier for the good guys, the bad guys, AND the terrorists to get hold of them.

[Bowline]

57. The AWB sunset will have no bearing on weapons availability.

It will only allow people to once again buy rifles with bayonet lugs and folding stocks.

One can already buy all of the semi-automatic rifles one wishes. Ya just can't get 'em with a bayonet lug right now.

[Retired AF Dem]

100. I really doubt that terrorist really give a crap

about what type of guns they can buy in America. Guns are not effective enough for their needs which is to kill the maximum number of people as possible. With that you need big bombs, airplanes and tall buildings, chemical and biological weapons.

[Hoping4Change]

52. I suggest Bowline you become a policeman and find out what its

like to be on the frontlines knowing assault weapons are out there.

[Bowline]

58. I couldn't be a cop. Don't have the patience for it.

I'd want to brutally club to death every child molester and wife beater out there. Besides, the post-ban weapons are just as lethal as the pre-ban ones. Identical, in fact. No change. None. Nada. Zip. Zilch. Zero.

[Hoping4Change]

59. So you know better than the police who support the ban?

[Bowline]

60. ALL police support the ban?

I know four police officers and NOT ONE of them supports the ban. I read all the time about "police who support the ban", only to find out later it is some political appointee Chief who supports the ban and NOT the rank and file.

Don't claim to speak for the police of know what the police want until you personally ask each and every law enforcement officer in the country.

[Hoping4Change]

61. Sorry but you're dead wrong. According to PoliceOne.com

800 Plus Police Chief and Sheriffs and Counting Across Country Urge That Federal Assault Weapons Ban Be Renewed and Strengthened


Remarkable Grassroots Law Enforcement Support Demonstrated for Strong and Effective Assault Weapons Ban in National Outreach Project.


Police Across Country Urge Federal Assault Weapons Ban Be Renewed


"Chiefs and Sheriffs from all across the country understand that their officers face overwhelming firepower in the hands of criminals whether pre or post-ban assault weapons, and they want an AWB that effectively bans both. We hope that Congress heeds the sad message of last week's shooting in Alabama and the call of more than 800 Police Chiefs and Sheriffs and acts quickly to renew and strengthen the AWB."



http://www.policeone.com/policeone/frontend/parser.cfm?object=News&operation=full_newsline&id=89854

[TX-RAT]

62. Beats the 4 in his survey.

[slackmaster]

63. Looks like they don't understand what the AWB actually covers

From the cited article:

And, late last week three police officers in Alabama were shot and killed while attempting to serve warrants by a man wielding a SKS assault rifle, a post-ban copycat of a gun banned by name in the current AWB....

BZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZT!

The SKS used in that tragic crime is not an assault weapon.

:dunce:

See http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/18/921.html

[Hoping4Change]

64. So what's your point? " Prior to the ban's passage,

assault rifles were used to kill and injure dozens of innocent people in some particularly heinous crimes, including:

The Stockton schoolyard massacre - On January 17, 1989, Patrick Purdy killed 5 small children, and wounded 29 others and 1 teacher at the Cleveland Elementary School in Stockton, California, using a semi-automatic version of the AK-47 assault rifle imported from China. That weapon had been purchased from a gun dealer in Oregon and was equipped with a 75-round "drum" magazine. Purdy shot 106 rounds in less than 2 minutes.<4>

The San Francisco Pettit & Martin shootings - On July 1, 1993, Gian Luigi Ferri killed 8 people and wounded 6 others at the San Francisco law offices of Pettit & Martin and other offices at 101 California Street. Ferri used two TEC-DC9 assault pistols with 50-round magazines. These weapons had been purchased from a pawnshop and a gun show in Nevada.<5>

The CIA headquarters shootings - On January 25, 1993, Pakistani national Mir Aimal Kasi killed 2 CIA employees and wounded 3 others outside the entrance to CIA headquarters in Langley, VA. Kasi used a Chinese-made semi-automatic AK-47 assault rifle equipped with a 30-round magazine, purchased from a Northern Virginia gun store.<6>

The Branch-Davidian standoff in Waco, Texas - On February 28, 1993, while attempting to serve federal search and arrest warrants at the Branch-Davidian compound in Waco, Texas, four ATF special agents were killed and 16 others were wounded with an arsenal of assault weapons. According to a federal affidavit, the cult had accumulated at least the following assault weapons: 123 AR-15s, 44 AK-47s, 2 Barrett .50 calibers, 2 Street Sweepers, an unknown number of MAC-10 and MAC-11s, 20 100-round drum magazines, and 260 large-capacity banana clips. The weapons were bought legally from gun dealers and at gun shows.<7>

http://www.bradycampaign.org/facts/faqs/?page=awb

[MrBenchley]

68. It's one of the standard bits of outright rubbish

that makes up the RKBA cause...the ban does nothing (which is of course, why our trigger happy brethren are counting down the days until they can get their sweaty shaky hands on them)...

And of course, anybody opposed to the AWB can't possibly know what assault weapons ARE. Only the sort of person who needs one so bad he can taste it knows for sure.

[slackmaster]

76. Many people who support the AWB don't understand it

It's impossible to have a rational discussion of the AWB with people who choose whatever definition of "assault weapon" fits their agenda of the moment. The person quoted in my last post defined the SKS as an assault weapon and implied that they're not available under the present ban. In fact SKS rifles are available EVEN IN CALIFORNIA which has a much stricter definition of AW than the moribund federal moratorium (I call it that because it didn't actually ban anything).

All of the weapons listed in your regurgitation of Brady Center propaganda have been available throughout the duration of the ban, both in their original (pre-ban) and slightly modified but functionally the same (post-ban) forms.

The ban did nothing to enhance public safety.

[Hoping4Change]

79. Why then are Police Chiefs and Police Unions supporting the ban?

[MrBenchley]

81. Because, you see being involved in day to day details of law enforcement

they don't know nearly as much as an anonymous guy on the internet......

[slackmaster]

82. I believe some of them support it because they don't understand it

Here's an example of a Pennsylvania police chief who has no clue what he's talking about. He supports the AWB because he think it's the only thing preventing just about anyone from buying a machine gun.

Given that one likely couldn’t get 78 percent of America to agree that humans landed on the moon, polling validity always demands scrutiny. Push polling, slanted questions, poll demographics, medium used to poll -- all can slant the results. As the Times caters to individuals with a leftward slant, the poll’s results should have been in the mid-90s.

But for argument’s sake, let’s assume the poll is correct. That shouldn’t surprise anyone given the gross misinformation and hysteria pervading this discussion. Unfortunately, neither the police spokesmen quoted in the article, nor the journalistic community has done anything but perpetuate the error.

Consider East Pikeland police Chief James Franciscus’ statement: "If the ban is lifted, people will be able to buy fully automatic weapons."

In reality, the 1994 Assault Weapons Ban has nothing to do with fully automatic weapons. The ban addresses semiautomatic weapons and cosmetic features of semiautomatic firearms -- bayonet lugs, flash suppressers, pistol grips, telescoping stocks -- none of which affect the function of the firearm: namely, propelling a bullet over distance.... Underlining added for emphasis.

For full copyrighted article please see http://www.dailylocal.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=12414319&BRD=1671&PAG=461&dept_id=17785&rfi=6

[Hoping4Change]

83. So because one chief has it wrong the other 799 chiefs and

4000 union representing some 230,000 officiers have it wrong but you have it right? Gee that's amazing.

[slackmaster]

86. Your post claims facts not in evidence

I doubt that that one chief is an anomaly. There has been a deliberate, systematic campaign to delude the public about this for over 10 years. I would bet that a non-trivial percentage of those 800 chiefs have the same misconception or just don't care.

I don't really care what police chiefs or union representatives say. The police work for me and are supposed to be protecting my liberty, not working to restrict my civil rights.

[MrBenchley]

87. HAHAHAHAHAHA....

"There has been a deliberate, systematic campaign to delude the public about this for over 10 years."
Taking the form of either "Nobody knows what anassautl weapon really is" or "The Assault Weapons ban doesn't really do anything."

"I don't really care what police chiefs or union representatives say."
But what "authorities" like Ted Nugent and Larry Pratt say is a different matter...

[Hoping4Change]

88. Well I think their concerned with protecting their lives in the line

of duty. Your rights end when they start to endanger some else's right to life, liberty and pursuit of happiness. As for the 'systematic campaign to delude the public" surely you are refering to the NRA. <<sarcasm off>>

[slackmaster]

I don't believe the AWB has enhanced their safety or anyone else's

We'll just have to disagree on this one until some concrete evidence appears to convince me to change my mind.

[slackmaster]

89. I don't believe the AWB has enhanced their safety or anyone else's

We'll just have to disagree on this one until some concrete evidence appears to convince me to change my mind.

[FatSlob]

67. Note that this is the brass, not the average Patrol Officer.

[MrBenchley]

69. Yeah, the average patrol officer can hardly wait to get shot at by AWs

He's rubbing his hands with glee at the prospect of being outgunned by thugs and crazies...

[TX-RAT]

70. You don't get to be the brass

without doing time as the average Patrol Officer.

[skippythwndrdog]

103. Tell us another one!

I personally know three chiefs who never carried a basge until they were appointed by their respective city councils. I'll grant that most come up through the ranks in one way or another, but most chiefs I've met have completely or almost completely lost touch with life on the street.

[TX-RAT]

105. three chiefs who never carried a basg?

I never carried a basg either. I carried a Badge.
I find that statement rather hard to believe.

[skippythwndrdog]

106. As the saying goes,

Truth is often stranger than fiction.

[TX-RAT]

107. I'm sure you could provide a link to back that up.

Just give us the name of the Chiefs, it's public record.

[Name removed]

108. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[library_max]

109. "Grow up and do your own research"?

So let me get this straight - you make an assertion about police chiefs who never wore a badge, and TX-RAT suspects it's not true. Please explain to all of us how this suddenly became TX-RAT's "own research"? It's your assertion, not his. So how is it his job to go find support for your assertion?

[TX-RAT]

110. Thanks L.M.

Had some chores to do,didn't get to see the response. I take it he didn't give us the names?

[library_max]

111. No. There wasn't much more to it than the line I quoted. /nt

[Hoping4Change]

72. Bullshit.

"NAPO representing 4,000 unions and associations and 230,000 sworn law enforcement officers supported the Brady Bill and also
fully supports the introduction of legislation to require background checks at guns shows, crack down on gun crimes and to provide funding for federal, State and local law enforcement to deter and prosecute gun crimes.

NAPO is ready to joing in the fight to pass bi-partisan legislation, which if enacted would end the 'gun-show loophole' and assist law enforcement in gun crime enforcement"



http://www.campaignadvantage.com/services/websites/archive/ags/press_napo.html

[FatSlob]

74. Really?

You wrote: "Chiefs and Sheriffs from all across the country understand that their officers face overwhelming firepower in the hands of criminals whether pre or post-ban assault weapons, and they want an AWB that effectively bans both. We hope that Congress heeds the sad message of last week's shooting in Alabama and the call of more than 800 Police Chiefs and Sheriffs and acts quickly to renew and strengthen the AWB."


Sure sounds like brass to me. Care to rephrase?

[Hoping4Change]

77. Read the post fatslob. I am citiing another source, nameley

the police union. For your convenience Ill pasted it below.

NAPO representing 4,000 unions and associations and 230,000 sworn law enforcement officers supported the Brady Bill and also
fully supports the introduction of legislation to require background checks at guns shows, crack down on gun crimes and to provide funding for federal, State and local law enforcement to deter and prosecute gun crimes.

NAPO is ready to joing in the fight to pass bi-partisan legislation, which if enacted would end the 'gun-show loophole' and assist law enforcement in gun crime enforcement"



http://www.campaignadvantage.com/services/websites/arch...

[leanings]

90. Chiefs and Sheriffs

Polititians. I used to be in law enforcement and the vast majority of the cops I worked with did not support the ban. In fact, many of us owned our own "AW's". And these were mostly DC/Northern Virginia cops, not exactly yokel bumpkins.

[TX-RAT]

91. DC/Northern Virginia cops, not exactly yokel bumpkins.?

So the rest of them are?

[Hoping4Change]

99. And what about NAPO representing 4000 police unions.

NAPO representing 4,000 unions and associations and 230,000 sworn law enforcement officers supported the Brady Bill and also
fully supports the introduction of legislation to require background checks at guns shows, crack down on gun crimes and to provide funding for federal, State and local law enforcement to deter and prosecute gun crimes.

NAPO is ready to joing in the fight to pass bi-partisan legislation, which if enacted would end the 'gun-show loophole' and assist law enforcement in gun crime enforcement"



http://www.campaignadvantage.com/services/websites/arch ...

[Retired AF Dem]

101. Since cops are killed more often with with their duty

gun than by "assault" weapons think of the lives that could be saved if they worked unarmed.

[FatSlob]

54. Then, tell us what the AWB did to prevent or slow terrorism.

I bet you can't.

[Hoping4Change]

75. Are you smoking something to come up with such a dense

question? With that thinking why should there be a Homeland Security Dept, a CIA, an FBI? Tell us what they have done to prevent or slow terrorism.

[FatSlob]

92. Why don't you tell me then?

I'll rephrase it for you. How will these items:

1. Adjustable stocks
2. Bayonet / Bipod lugs
3. Flash reducers
4. Threaded barrels

on rifles effect terrorists?

[MrBenchley]

6. 128 days since Democratic leadership

defeated the disgraceful "Immunity from Liability" bill the scummy gun industry and the GOP were trying to ram through the Senate....



Wonder how many Republicans will be desperately trying to appeal to moderate voters and trying to distance themselves publicly from Tom DeLay, Larry Craig and their extremist ilk by Labor Day?

[benburch]

7. Street Sweeper!

Here I Come!

[FatSlob]

8. I'd buy one.

I don't know what I'd do with it, but I'd buy one. DIE SQUIRRELS, DIE!

[benburch]

10. You can always use them

to clear brush...

[FeebMaster]

15. Here's one.

http://www.gunsamerica.com/guns/976486376.htm

[FeebMaster]

13. The street sweeper is considered a destructive device

http://www.atf.gov/press/fy01press/020901endofreg.htm

[benburch]

16. Damn.

Foiled by the ATF once again.

I wish they'd spend more time busting moonshiners.

[FeebMaster]

18. Well you can still buy one.

It's just that a fifth of the price is going to be tax and it will take awhile.

[DoNotRefill]

27. Sorry, "street sweepers" are a kind of shotgun....

covered by the National Firearms Act as a destructive device. The expiration of the AW ban will do nothing to make street sweepers more available to the general public.

[Bowline]

40. The expiration of the AW ban will do nothing...

Damn you and your facts! Now I suppose you'll tell that the sunset of the AWB will NOT really allow me to buy a full-auto Uzi at K-Mart?(incidentally, an Uzi is a submachine gun and NOT, repeat NOT, an assault rifle)

[MrSandman]

30. Isn't the Street Sweeper...

Covered by the NFA?

[FeebMaster]

31. Yes.

http://www.atf.gov/press/fy01press/020901endofreg.htm

[MrSandman]

32. Including them in the AWB was PR hyperbole...

Below are the definitions, as written, in the United States Code:

Title 18, Chapter 44, Section 921 of the United States Code states:

The term ''semiautomatic assault weapon'' means -

<snip>

(ix) revolving cylinder shotguns, such as (or similar to) the Street Sweeper and Striker 12;


http://www.awbansunset.com/whatis.html

But everyone knows in 52 days, street sweepers will be readily available with no regulation.:eyes:

[FeebMaster]

33. Well according to that atf page

they suddenly decided they were destructive devices sometime in 1994. I don't know all of the dates involved, but it's possible the AWB was written before they decided that the street sweeper had no sporting purpose.

[MrSandman]

34. I couldn't locate it...

But someone had the streetsweeper pictured on their "renew the AWB" site or magazine.

[OpSomBlood]

17. I expect a dramatic increase in assault weapon crime overnight.

I think we should all hide in our basements until Dianne Feinstein can figure out a way to protect us again.

[CO Liberal]

19. And Countless Victims Will Go Bye-Bye Too.....

A sad day for America....

[MrBenchley]

20. Hey, but no matter how many get killed...

we'll have dishonest "pro gun democrats" claiming the streets aren't running red with blood, slandering Democrats, and posting mindless right wing horseshit.

Okay with me...it's a Win/Win issue for Democrats everywhere...

"So the question isn't whether the assault weapons ban has made a difference (although in small ways it has: gun traces leading back to assault weapons declined 20 percent in the first year after the ban took effect, according to the National Institute of Justice). The question is whether the ban's prohibition of 19 types of weapons and a few add-ons went far enough.
That's not the question being posed in Congress today. Rather, the debate is verging back to its pre-1994, Bush-like arguments. On Sept. 13, the ban is set to expire unless Congress renews it. President Bush has so far refused to lend his weight to the ban. Without his support, neither the House nor the Senate are likely to take up the issue again this year. Assault weapons would become legal again by default.
The National Rifle Association's powerful arsenal of lobbyists aside, there's not much doubt about the law's support: Law enforcement agencies are overwhelmingly in favor of renewing it. Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton and Gerald Ford just signed a joint letter supporting renewal. ("At a time when terrorism continues to be a serious threat, it is even more imperative that we renew the Assault Weapons Act," they wrote Bush last month.) A poll of 800 likely Florida voters conducted for the Consumer Federation of America and the Coalition to Stop Gun Violence earlier this month shows 64 percent of gun owners and 74 percent of "NASCAR fans" in support of the ban.
The president isn't listening. Perhaps his 2000 campaign promise explicitly to support "the current ban on automatic weapons" also had an expiration date."

http://www.news-journalonline.com/NewsJournalOnline/Opinion/Editorials/03OpOP74071604.htm

[FeebMaster]

21. Blood in the streets!

Countless? Right. There were few before the ban. There were few during the ban. But suddenly there are going to be countless after the ban.

[CO Liberal]

22. I Hope I'm Wrong, Feeb...

But I don't think that will be the case.

[FeebMaster]

24. Don't worry, you are. (nt)

[CO Liberal]

26. We Won't Be Able To Determine That....

...until the ban expires. If gun deaths increase and the weapons used are ones covered by the ban, then I'll be right.

I don't want to be right, because I don't want to see more people die.

[FeebMaster]

28. Like I said. There is nothing to worry about.

"If gun deaths increase and the weapons used are ones covered by the ban, then I'll be right."

The weapons covered by the ban are available now because the ban only banned their manufacture, not the sale or ownership of them. Also, as has been repeatedly said, the only difference between pre-ban weapons and post-ban weapons is generally a flash suppressor and bayonet lug and sometimes a collapsible stock.


"I don't want to be right, because I don't want to see more people die."

None of us wants to see more people killed, but like I said, you're wrong, so don't worry about it.

[FatSlob]

55. Which feature will cause more killings?

1. Flash reducers
2. Bayonet / Bipod lugs
3. Threaded Barrel
4. Adjustable stock

Additionally, how will it cause more killings?

[EconGeek]

113. Threaded Barrels! (And why are the others so silent suddenly?) /eom

[FatSlob]

114. How will threaded barrels cause more killing?

I'd love to know.

[OpSomBlood]

23. 3% of gun crime apparently is "countless."

Much like a semi-automatic rifle can "spray-fire" 250 rounds "in seconds."

[Name removed]

35. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[VTMechEngr]

36. Damn

Even a semi-automatic thompson sub (awb) couldn't fire that fast. unless you talking a whole lot of seconds - like minutes, and like 8 clips or so...

[OpSomBlood]

37. That's what I said...

When Feinstein claims that a semi-auto can fire "up to 250 rounds in seconds," I wonder how many seconds she was referring to. Probably about 500 seconds.

Someone ought to get her a seconds-to-minutes conversion chart.

[Township75]

41. How about the countless victums after a state adopts CCW laws?

?

We've heard that line before too

[OpSomBlood]

43. This is the part where MrB posts the link to the statistics showing...

...that in Texas, CCW holders are more likely to be arrested for offenses involving a gun (but he'll be sure to leave out the conviction rates).

You know...because if you use a gun in self-defense, you will probably be arrested.

[MrBenchley]

44. And the part where the trigger-happy amongst us

trot out the same tired and dishonest crap as before....

[skippythwndrdog]

66. "Trigger happy" what an interesting phrase!

Are you referring to the Lone ranger's horse with a sugar cube or the gratification of putting one in the 10 ring? (If I miss the 9 or 10 ring, I'm likely more trigger sad.)

Get a new line.

[MrBenchley]

71. Apt too, when you read the rubbish posted here by the RKBA crowd

"Get a new line."
Oh yes, skippy...I certainly find more ways to describe the sort of person who's creaming his jeans for an assault weapon (snicker)...or even funnier, as we see currently, an ICBM....

[Bowline]

42. Just like in all of those CCW states?

Look at the terrible surge in gun deaths at the hands of CCW holders!!!

[FatSlob]

56. A surge in the death of Criminals!

[MrBenchley]

73. Yippee! Bang! Bang! Bang!

[library_max]

93. So much for gun-grabbing Republicans, eh Feeb? /nt

[FeebMaster]

94. What do you mean? (nt)

[library_max]

95. Why aren't those evil authoritarian Republicans, including Bush

falling all over themselves to save the evil authoritarian AWB?

[FeebMaster]

96. Why would they want to save the AWB?

Do you think they're as stupid as the rest of the gun grabbers out there? Maybe when they pass some more gun control it won't be as useless as the AWB. Not to mention Bush probably doesn't want to end up a one term wonder like his gun grabbing father.

[library_max]

97. Nice waffle. /nt

[FeebMaster]

98. How so?

Just because you haven't bothered to read the AWB doesn't mean the Republicans currently running the show haven't. Why would they risk throwing away votes on a useless law?

[kisses]

104. .

Good point.

[Sunset]

102. Sunset

I bet this message (or user) won't last long...