UN Commissioner rejects meeting families of abducted soldiers

[Behind the Aegis]

The families of kidnapped soldiers Eldad Regev, Ehud Goldwasser, and Gilad Shalit protested on Tuesday to United Nations representatives in Israel following the refusal of the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights, Louise Arbour, to meet with them.

The coordinators of the effort to free the soldiers said Arbour, who is now in Israel, finally said no to a meeting after avoiding a direct answer for two weeks.

The families want to discuss UN efforts to attain signs of life from the three soldiers.

Benny Regev, brother of Eldad Regev, said the families were "furious and disappointed" at Arbour's refusal to meet with them.


more...

[breakaleg]

1. I thought the publicity tour of the families in the US was distasteful, at best.

Since so many here have named the UN a joke, and since Israel shows complete disregard for the UN why would they want to meet with him anyway?

Either you believe in the UN or you don't.

[Behind the Aegis]

2. Figures.

This is just further proof of the attitude the UN has toward Israel. Any wonder it is so un-respected by Israel?

As for the stupid question as to why the families would want to meet with them...they want to know their loved ones are ALIVE. How fucked up is that?! :sarcasm:

[breakaleg]

3. Perhaps if Israel were to start to honor certain UN resolutions they'd have a little more clout.

[Behind the Aegis]

4. So the families of victims should bear the brunt of the state? Interesting theory.

[breakaleg]

6. I'm just saying it's not proof of anything.

[Behind the Aegis]

7. Sounds like you were trying to defend the actions of the UN.

[IntiRaymi]

16. John Bolton would like to talk to you.

He needs allies in his effort to 'reform the UN'

[Behind the Aegis]

17. Sad thing is that a right-wing loon can see that change is needed...

...and so-called progressives cannot.

[IntiRaymi]

18. We are progressives only when it suits you.

As for Israel - you are right in line with our fundies. Hope you enjoy the company you keep!

[Behind the Aegis]

19. I wasn't addressing anyone here in particular.

Interestingly enough, the converse is also true, especially here! No one side is always correct, despite those that think that to be true.

[IntiRaymi]

28. Yes you were.

You are attempting to de-link a progressive mentality from one that is critical of Israel due to the manner in which it treats palestinians.

I posit that the converse is true - you cannot blindly defend a government, such as the one Israel has provided itself, and espouse progressive ideals at the same time. There are too many glaring abuses of human rights to allow this.

[Behind the Aegis]

33. Do not presume to tell me what I am doing.

It is very clear you don't have the authority to speak for me or declare my intentions. As I don't blindly defend any government, your following points are nonsense.

[IntiRaymi]

34. Fair enough.

I will not speak for you, and you will not question me.

[Behind the Aegis]

35. No. You will not speak for me, nor I for you. But questioning, that is the point of these boards.

[Violet_Crumble]

36. Don't sweat it.

In the words of bta in another thread:

Answer what you want and who you want. As far as I know, it is a discussion board and one can choose to answer or not, despite childish actions. This is also their right not to respond, which they often invoke. Ain't nothing but a thang!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=124x155683#155730

[Behind the Aegis]

5. Some reading for you....

---snip---

Annan: Rights council should broaden focus
The United Nations Human Rights Council should broaden its focus beyond the Palestinian-Israeli issue to avoid accusations it is one-sided, UN Secretary-General Kofi Annan said Tuesday.

Speaking to reporters in Geneva for the last time before he steps down as secretary-general at the end of the year, Annan said the council's preoccupation with Israel's actions in Lebanon and the Palestinian territories while ignoring the situation in Darfur had caused some to wonder whether it had "a sense of fair play."

"They have tended to focus on the Palestinian issue, and of course if you focus on the Palestinian-Israeli issue without even discussing Darfur and other issues, some wonder 'what is this council doing?"' he said.

The 47-member council, which earlier this year replaced the discredited Human Rights Commission, has been severely criticized by some countries, including the United States, for moving four times to condemn Israel but not taking up human rights violations in Myanmar, North Korea or Sudan.

---snip---

source

[Boston Critic]

8. Here's a question for you:

How many times has Israel had one of the rotating seats on the UN Security Council?

And when you answer that, the follow up question is: Why?

And after you've answered those two, if you still don't know why the UN is considered a pathetic joke, you'll never learn.

[IntiRaymi]

14. What makes you think that Israel actually needs a seat there?

They have powerful allies in the US.

[Boston Critic]

21. Nice dodge

Israel is the ONLY nation of the UN membership unable to get a seat on the Security Council.

Now why don't you explain why that is?

[IntiRaymi]

22. Vast conspiracies everywhere?

:crazy:

[oberliner]

23. Israel, until recently, was the only UN member state denied access to the SC

Because they were not a member of one of the five regional groups.

The Asian group withheld Israel's membership even though that is where they geographically should be assigned.

They were admitted in 2000 to the "Western European and Others" group as temporary members.

I believe that in 2005 they requested membership on the Security Council but that all rotating seats are reserved until 2018.

[IntiRaymi]

26. Thanks for the terse explanation.

Can you post a link?

If not for me, then for the people that read these posts, and would like a lazy-person's point of reference.

[oberliner]

27. TEXT: Gore Statement on Israel Joining U.N. Regional Grouping

http://israel.usembassy.gov/publish/peace/archives/2000/may/me0531c.html

Following is the White House text of Gore's statement:

(Begin text)

THE WHITE HOUSE
Office of the Vice President

May 30, 2000

STATEMENT BY THE VICE PRESIDENT ON ISRAEL JOINING A UNITED NATIONS REGIONAL GROUPING

Today Israel announced its acceptance of an offer to join the Western European and Others Grouping (WEOG) at the United Nations. This development effectively ends an injustice that for decades deprived Israel of its right to fully participate in the UN's decision making process. Until today, Israel -- a member of the United Nations since 1949 -- was the only country to be actively excluded from participating in the regional groupings of the United Nations.

I raised this issue with UN Secretary General Kofi Annan earlier this year, and later with the Government of Spain, which played an important role in building international support. I am proud to have led the Administration's effort to correct this inequity, which also involved intensive efforts by President Clinton, Secretary Albright, and Ambassador Holbrooke. I welcome this courageous and historic step taken by the membership of the WEOG and Israel.

(End text)

[IntiRaymi]

29. Glad to see my government working so hard on Israel's behalf. nt

[oberliner]

30. Not sure what is meant by that comment.

Is the suggestion that Clinton, Gore, and Albright, should not have worked to make Israel a member of one of the regional groups?

Do you really think that Israel deserved to be the one and only UN member state that is not part of such a grouping, and therefore not eligible to sit in the Security Council or hold committee leadership positions?

[IntiRaymi]

31. The only thing meant by my comment is this:

Israel has its own foreign policy team, does it not?
Let them duke it out on their own. I am not happy with my team going to bat on behalf of these abusive monsters.

[oberliner]

32. My thoughts on Clinton/Gore and the UN

Personally, I think it is encouraging to see that "our team" actually engaged the leadership of the United Nations in order to rectify what was an unfair situation.

It is nice to know that the principles and values of the UN are something that the US felt were worth arguing for.

Back when we had a President who cared about that sort of thing.

[Boston Critic]

37. In other words...

... you know absolutely nothing about Israel or American foreign policy towards it except for the fact that you are consumed by hate towards it.

Well, at least we know where you're coming from.

[Boston Critic]

24. Just admit you don't know

Is it that hard for you?

[IntiRaymi]

25. You ought to examine carefully world opinion regarding Israel.

And the source of this opinion.

Perhaps then you will find that illuminating moment in your life ...

Requisite caveat: Assuming you are fairminded enough to contain more than one thought in your head at the same time.

[Boston Critic]

38. I suggest you do the same...

...you might learn that how ill-placed your hatred is.

[Englander]

40. 75 countries.

That's how many UN member states haven't been elected to the SC. Personally, I'd like to see an end
to this blatantly biased & blatant anti-Grenada sentiment that is rampant at the UN.

List of countries never elected members of the Security Council:

Afghanistan
Albania
Andorra
Antigua and Barbuda
Armenia
Azerbaijan
Bahamas
Barbados
Belize
Bhutan
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Brunei Darussalam
Cambodia
Central African Republic
Chad
Comoros
Croatia
Cyprus
Democratic People's Republic of Korea
Dominica
Dominican Republic
El Salvador
Equatorial Guinea
Eritrea
Estonia
Fiji
Georgia
Grenada
Guatemala
Haiti
Iceland
Israel
Kazakhstan
Kiribati
Kyrgyzstan
Lao People's Democratic Republic
Latvia
Lesotho
Liechtenstein
Lithuania
Luxembourg
Malawi
Maldives
Marshall Islands
Micronesia (Federated States of)
Moldova
Monaco
Mongolia
Montenegro
Mozambique
Myanmar
Nauru
Palau
Papua New Guinea
Saint Kitts and Nevis
Saint Lucia
Saint Vincent and the Grenadines
Samoa
San Marino
Sao Tome and Principe
Saudi Arabia
Seychelles
Solomon Islands
Suriname
Swaziland
Switzerland
Tajikistan
The former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia
Timor-Leste
Tonga
Turkmenistan
Tuvalu
Uzbekistan
Vanuatu
Viet Nam

http://www.un.org/sc/list_eng6.asp

[Behind the Aegis]

46. The difference?

All of those nations, except one, until 2004, Israel, are a member of a regional group. Though they have not served on the Security Council, they had the ability to petition to do so. Also, many on that list have only recently become members to the United Nations. There are only a few on the list that have been members as long or longer than Israel.

Dominican Republic -- (24 Oct. 1945)
El Salvador -- (24 Oct. 1945)
Haiti -- (24 Oct. 1945)
Luxembourg-- (24 Oct. 1945)
Saudi Arabia -- (24 Oct. 1945)
Guatemala -- (21 Nov. 1945)
Afghanistan -- (19 Nov. 1946)
Iceland -- (19 Nov. 1946)
Myanmar -- (19 Apr. 1948)
Israel -- (11 May 1949)
Albania -- (14 Dec. 1955)
Cambodia -- (14 Dec. 1955)
Lao People's Democratic Republic -- (14 Dec. 1955)
Central African Republic -- (20 Sep. 1960)
Chad -- (20 Sep. 1960)
Cyprus -- (20 Sep. 1960)
Mongolia -- (27 Oct. 1961)
Malawi -- (1 Dec. 1964)
Maldives-- (21 Sep. 1965)
Lesotho -- (17 Oct. 1966)
Barbados -- (9 Dec. 1966)
Swaziland -- (24 Sep. 1968)
Equatorial Guinea -- (12 Nov. 1968)
Fiji -- (13 Oct. 1970)
Bhutan -- (21 Sep. 1971)
Bahamas -- (18 Sep. 1973)
Grenada -- (17 Sep. 1974)
Mozambique -- (16 Sep. 1975)
Sao Tome and Principe -- (16 Sep. 1975)
Papua New Guinea -- (10 Oct. 1975)
Comoros -- (12 Nov. 1975)
Suriname -- (4 Dec. 1975)
Seychelles -- (21 Sep. 1976)
Samoa -- (15 Dec. 1976)
Viet Nam -- (20 Sep. 1977)
Dominica -- (18 Dec. 1978)
Solomon Islands -- (19 Sep. 1978)
Saint Lucia -- (18 Sep. 1979)
Saint Vincent and the Grenadines -- (16 Sep. 1980)
Vanuatu -- (15 Sep. 1981)
Belize -- (25 Sep. 1981)
Antigua and Barbuda -- (11 Nov. 1981)
Saint Kitts and Nevis -- (23 Sep. 1983)
Brunei Darussalam -- (21 Sep. 1984)
Liechtenstein-- (18 Sep. 1990)
Democratic People's Republic of Korea -- (17 Sep. 1991)
Estonia -- (17 Sep. 1991)
Latvia -- (17 Sep. 1991)
Lithuania -- (17 Sep. 1991)
Marshall Islands -- (17 Sep. 1991)
Micronesia (Federated States of) -- (17 Sep. 1991)
Armenia -- (2 Mar. 1992)
Azerbaijan -- (2 Mar. 1992)
Kazakhstan -- (2 Mar. 1992)
Kyrgyzstan -- (2 Mar. 1992)
Moldova -- (2 Mar. 1992)
San Marino -- (2 Mar. 1992)
Tajikistan -- (2 Mar. 1992)
Turkmenistan -- (2 Mar. 1992)
Uzbekistan -- (2 Mar. 1992)
Bosnia and Herzegovina -- (22 May 1992)
Croatia -- (22 May 1992)
Georgia -- (31 July 1992)
The former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia -- (8 Apr. 1993)
Monaco -- (28 May 1993)
Eritrea -- (28 May 1993)
Andorra -- (28 July 1993)
Palau -- (15 Dec. 1994)
Kiribati -- (14 Sept. 1999)
Nauru -- (14 Sept. 1999)
Tonga -- (14 Sep. 1999)
Tuvalu -- (5 Sept. 2000)
Switzerland -- (10 Sep. 2002)
Timor-Leste -- (27 Sep. 2002)
Montenegro -- (28 June 2006)

Of your 'list of 75,' only nine (9) nations have been members longer than Israel. This means of your list, 65 nations that have not served on the UNSC weren't members until after Israel's being admitted to the UN.

But what about those who have served on the UNSC? How many of those nations came after Israel's membership?

List of 119
Algeria -- (8 Oct. 1962)
Angola -- (1 Dec. 1976)
Argentina
Australia
Austria
Bahrain -- (21 Sep. 1971)
Bangladesh -- (17 Sep. 1974)
Belarus
Belgium
Benin -- (20 Sep. 1960)
Bolivia
Botswana -- (17 Oct. 1966)
Brazil
Bulgaria -- (14 Dec. 1955)
Burkina Faso -- (20 Sep. 1960)
Burundi -- (18 Sep. 1962)
Cameroon -- (20 Sep. 1960)
Canada
Cape Verde -- (16 Sep. 1975)
Chile
China – Permanent Member
Colombia
Congo (Republic of the) -- (20 Sep. 1960)
Costa Rica
Côte d'Ivoire -- (20 Sep. 1960)
Cuba
Czech Republic -- (19 Jan. 1993)*
Czechoslovakia
Democratic Republic of the Congo -- (20 Sep. 1960)
Denmark
Djibouti -- (20 Sep. 1977)
Ecuador
Egypt
Ethiopia
Finland -- (14 Dec. 1955)
France – Permanent Member
Gabon -- (20 Sep. 1960)
Gambia -- (21 Sep. 1965)
Germany -- (18 Sep. 1973)
Ghana -- (8 Mar. 1957)
Greece
Guinea -- (12 Dec. 1958)
Guinea-Bissau -- (17 Sep. 1974)
Guyana -- (20 Sep. 1966)
Honduras
Hungary -- (14 Dec. 1955)
India
Indonesia -- (28 Sep. 1950)
Iran (Islamic Republic of)
Iraq
Ireland -- (14 Dec. 1955)
Italy -- (14 Dec. 1955)
Jamaica -- (18 Sep. 1962)
Japan -- (18 Dec. 1956)
Jordan -- (14 Dec. 1955)
Kenya -- (16 Dec. 1963)
Kuwait -- (14 May 1963)
Lebanon
Liberia
Libyan Arab Jamahiriya -- (14 Dec. 1955)
Madagascar -- (20 Sep. 1960)
Malaysia-- (17 Sep. 1957)
Mali -- (28 Sep. 1960)
Malta -- (1 Dec. 1964)
Mauritania -- (27 Oct. 1961)
Mauritius -- (24 Apr. 1968)
Mexico
Morocco -- (12 Nov. 1956)
Namibia -- (23 Apr. 1990)
Nepal -- (14 Dec. 1955)
Netherlands
New Zealand
Nicaragua
Niger -- (20 Sep. 1960)
Nigeria -- (7 Oct. 1960)
Norway
Oman -- (7 Oct. 1971)
Pakistan
Panama
Paraguay
Peru
Philippines
Poland
Portugal -- (14 Dec. 1955)
Qatar -- (21 Sep. 1971)
Republic of Korea -- (17 Sep. 1991)
Romania -- (14 Dec. 1955)
Russian Federation – Permanent Member
Rwanda -- (18 Sep. 1962)
Senegal -- (28 Sep. 1960)
Sierra Leone -- (27 Sep. 1961)
Singapore -- (21 Sep. 1965)
Slovakia -- (19 Jan. 1993)
Slovenia -- (22 May 1992)
Somalia -- (20 Sep. 1960)
South Africa -- (7 Nov. 1945)
Spain -- (14 Dec. 1955)
Sri Lanka -- (14 Dec. 1955)
Sudan -- (12 Nov. 1956)
Sweden
Syrian Arab Republic
Thailand
Togo -- (20 Sep. 1960)
Trinidad and Tobago -- (18 Sep. 1962)
Tunisia -- (12 Nov. 1956)
Turkey
Uganda -- (25 Oct. 1962)
Ukraine
United Arab Emirates -- (9 Dec. 1971)
United Arab Republic
United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland – Permanent Member
United Republic of Tanzania -- (14 Dec. 1961)
United States of America – Permanent Member
Uruguay
Venezuela (Bolivarian Republic of)
Yemen
Yugoslavia
Zambia -- (1 Dec. 1964)
Zimbabwe -- (25 Aug. 1980)

Of 119 nations to serve on the UNSC, 69 didn't become members until after Israel's membership. Almost 60% of nations that have served on the UNSC have membership "younger" than Israel's, as opposed to 1% of nations not serving that have membership that is "older" than Israel's.

[breakaleg]

41. Well,

It appears that seat is voted on by regional groups. And Israel was blocked from the group in their region by Arab nations. So, not belonging to one of these groups, they were unable to vie for that spot.

Now, here is another case where Israel needs to make peace with their neighbors in order to achieve their goals.

[Behind the Aegis]

42. You're kidding, right?!

"Now, here is another case where Israel needs to make peace with their neighbors in order to achieve their goals."

This is an example of BIAS against Israel, yet, you have turned it into Israel's fault!

[breakaleg]

43. No, I'm not saying that.

I'm not saying it's Israel's fault. I'm just saying that since they had to be voted in by their neighbors. It was suggested that all of the UN was biased against Israel and that's why they didn't get that seat. It's not all of the UN, just their neighbors. And do you honestly expect the Arab nations in that region to vote them in? Please. If Israel wants to change that, they have to work to rebuild that relationship. It's not the world's fault.

[pelsar]

44. they have to work to rebuild that relationship?

what "rebuild"....perhaps you can explain it?...was it once better?...like in 48?...67?....73?....82?....

[breakaleg]

45. build.

[Tom Joad]

11. In war, soldiers are captured. If he met with the family of everyone

who has people who were abducted by the Israeli occupation forces, he would have to meet one family every few minutes. And then it would take several months to go through each family. Israel is holding thousands prisoner, many without charge.

[IntiRaymi]

15. Not only that,

But also an understanding of the purpose of such a meeting: The Photo-Op.

[Boston Critic]

39. One person they're not holding...

...except for her remains. The Palestinian grandmother who blew herself up in the latest suicide bombing attempt. Wonder what the dead terrorist is doing with her 72 virgins.

Fortunately she only killed herself. Two Israelis suffered what were called "light injuries." We're not always so lucky in avoiding harm to innocent people when Palestnian terrorists attack.

[eyl]

9. two things for you to consider, then

1) In case you don't know, Israelis are not monolithic in their opinions.

2) What does that matter? It was the UN representative who refused the meeting, hence his opinions are the issue.

[cali]

10. Absolutist nonsense.

But rather amusing: "Either you believe in the UN or you don't."

It's not a religion. It's an institution, and one that's open to criticism like any other institution.

Oh, and your contempt for these families shines bright and clear.

[Tom Joad]

12. What about the families of thousands of Palestinian prisoners?

should he meet with each of them, also?

[cali]

13. Tom, do you willfully misread posts?

I expressed no opinion on whether he should meet with the Israeli families. Hell, I don't even have an opinion about it. Next time, try actually responding to what I write. And please, do point out where I was wrong. Is the UN as an institution open to criticism or not?

[Tom Joad]

20. sure it is. Cali, that should have been a response to another post.

My regrets.