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ForestsBeatBushes Donating Member (633 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-07-03 10:33 AM
Original message
Yasser Arafat ‘has £1.8bn fortune’
A television documentary is to claim that Yasser Arafat, the Palestinian president, has amassed a personal fortune of up to £1.8bn and his wife is given tens of thousands of pounds each week to fund a lavish lifestyle in Paris.

The £1.8bn estimate of Arafat's personal fortune is almost six times higher than had been previously been touted.

<snip>

It is claimed that Arafat controls most of the £3.3bn in international aid that has flowed to the PA over the past nine
years, during which time he has established a system of financial aid that guarantees the support of a host of Palestinian factions.


http://ww1.theherald.co.uk/news/4130.html
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LittleApple81 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-07-03 10:43 AM
Response to Original message
1. How truthful is this? We cannot believe anything anymore. I think
that BOTH Sharon and Arafat have been guilty of terrorism, carnage, and genocide. But why should we believe one source more than the other? And I suspect this is not Arafat's source.
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guernica Donating Member (23 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-07-03 10:51 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. I know this much
it was only a year ago that the figure touted around for Arafat as Howard Hughes was more like $300 million. The PA responded with an audit, accounted for all the money and implemented a transparency system that most sane people find completely acceptable.

Of course this new figure is the equal and inevitable Israeli apparatchik response. I expect that in a few years it will be reported that Arafat's personal fortune is so large it is creating a singularity in space time and that he needs to be destroyed for the sake of the planet.
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judge_smales Donating Member (752 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-07-03 10:57 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. He sure does live

like a billionheir though, doesn't he? The run down, bombed out buildings he sleeps are a dead give-away that he's loaded!
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ForestsBeatBushes Donating Member (633 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-07-03 01:31 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. His wife lives outside of I/P in great luxury and
I would think he visits her from time to time.

While you are correct that his symbolic home is a hovel, it does appear to be for show...
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IndependentThinker Donating Member (10 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 01:06 PM
Response to Reply #3
14. It's just for show
Sure he lives in rubble, but only because if he leaves he won't be let back in. And if he left, he wouldn't be able to surround himself with armed security that he pays $20 million a month - in cash.

Outside of his tightly controlled world, a world he creates by spreading around the money he steals from his own people, he'd be dead in short order.

The 60 Minutes program exposed his wife living in luxury in Paris, on $100,000 a month.

And the gasoline and cement concessions he gives out to his cronies that fleece the people. After this was exposed recently, the head of the gasoline distributor fled to California, and diesel fuel prices dropped 80%.

Arafat's the worst thing that's happened to the Palistinians.
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IndependentThinker Donating Member (10 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #2
12. Transparency?
The 60 Minutes piece last night showed the only thing that's transparent is how corrupt Arafat and the Palestinian Authority is.

It's now quite trnasparent that Suha Arafat, his wife of convenience, gets $100,000 a month to live in Paris, while the Palistinians live in misery, a misery which is Arafat's creation.
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bluesoul Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 12:04 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. And I am sure
Israel has nothing to do with their misery...
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IndependentThinker Donating Member (10 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 01:11 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. You're right
Israel has little to do with their misery. They didn't seek to occupy Gaza and the West Bank. The invading Arab armies in 1967 brought this about.

If Arafat stopped inciting Palestinians to violence (he can't, it's his reason to exist) and the Israelis didn't have to worry about being blown up while eating in a restaurant, all of the conflicts could be solved.

Face it, if the Israelis ever dropped their guard they would be destroyed. Whether they closed the settlements and moved behind the Green Line or not.

If the Palistinians dropped their weapons, there would be PEACE.
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Aidoneus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. the "invading" Arab armies in 1967?
Need I break out the dictionary & history books to address this remark, or was that a typo?
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drdon326 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 01:23 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. No....thats 100% correct...
Edited on Mon Nov-10-03 01:24 PM by drdon326
we've had this discussion before.

You were wrong then and I suspect now.
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Aidoneus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 01:54 PM
Response to Reply #17
20. ok, dictionary & sarcasm first
Though both the dictionary & history book side with me, just the former for now will have to due:--

One entry found for invade.

Main Entry: in·vade
Pronunciation: in-'vAd
Function: transitive verb
Inflected Form(s): in·vad·ed; in·vad·ing
Etymology: Middle English, from Latin invadere, from in- + vadere to go -- more at WADE
Date: 15th century
1 : to enter for conquest or plunder
2 : to encroach upon : INFRINGE
3 a : to spread over or into as if invading : PERMEATE <doubts invade his mind> b : to affect injuriously and progressively <gangrene invades healthy tissue>
synonym see TRESPASS
- in·vad·er noun

--------------------------------------------------------

One entry found for aggression.

Main Entry: ag·gres·sion
Pronunciation: &-'gre-sh&n
Function: noun
Etymology: Latin aggression-, aggressio attack, from aggredi to attack, from ad- + gradi to step, go -- more at GRADE
Date: 1611
1 : a forceful action or procedure (as an unprovoked attack) especially when intended to dominate or master
2 : the practice of making attacks or encroachments; especially : unprovoked violation by one country of the territorial integrity of another
3 : hostile, injurious, or destructive behavior or outlook especially when caused by frustration

--------------------------------------------------------

Prove to me that the two definitions do not apply to the Israeli side. I expect proper Queen's English; pie charts and graphs would be acceptable additions. I also accept bribes, but flattery will get you nowhere.
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The Magistrate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #20
23. Nasser And Co. May Have Been Bluffing, My Friend
Many maintain that. But persons who bluff have no grounds for complaint if they are believed, and get some ribs kicked in in consequence.
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IndependentThinker Donating Member (10 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 02:28 PM
Response to Reply #23
28. Could have been bluffing, possible I suppose...
Edited on Mon Nov-10-03 02:50 PM by IndependentThinker
But blockading the Straight of Tiran to prevent Israel's access is an act of war by any definition.

If you start a war and get beat, and lose some land as a result, you've got no right to whine.

And the Arabs have been whining for almost 40 years.
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BushCutters Donating Member (48 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 02:40 PM
Response to Reply #28
30. You might have a right to whine,
but you don't have a right to the land!
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bluesoul Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 02:41 PM
Response to Reply #30
31. Oh?
Says who?
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BushCutters Donating Member (48 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 02:44 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. LOL
What are you? A tough guy? :eyes: :smoke:
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bluesoul Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 02:45 PM
Response to Reply #32
34. Not really
I was talking about international law though;)
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Scurrilous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 01:26 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. The Arab armies were invading...
..Eratz Israel as they retreated.
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IndependentThinker Donating Member (10 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #16
19. Yes, "Invading" Arab armies
Do you think Egypt kicked out the UN observers and massed its troops in the Sinai as a show of support for Israel?

Or that Egypt, Syria, and Jordan's promises to push the Jews into the sea were just a little joke?

1967, just like 1948 and 1956 before it, as well as 1973 afterward, was the result of Arab aggression and publicly stated intention to destroy the 1% of the Middle East that Jews are permitted to live.
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The Magistrate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 01:56 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. The Suez Venture Of '56, Ma'am
Does not really belong on that list. It was rather a put-up job arranged with France and England to re-claim the Suez Canal for the origional proprietors. For a student of old-style pretext, it has many entertaining features.
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Aidoneus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 03:02 PM
Response to Reply #19
36. where to begin..
Edited on Mon Nov-10-03 03:47 PM by Aidoneus
I don't feel quite ambitious enough to go into anything except direct answers to your specific points with a small amount of deviation.. perhaps later. This may end up as the 11th of my last 16 long posts to be ignored, but I don't mind that really.

Somewhat disorganized and several rules of grammar will be broken, please keep this far from the sight of any English Professors, or if there are any reading this please resist the urge to judge the errors made in the course of these scattered observations crammed in with little thoughts towards organization. :)

Do you think Egypt kicked out the UN observers and massed its troops in the Sinai as a show of support for Israel?

No, rather as a show of support for Syria. The Israelis had been threatening to invade Syria and carry out "regime change" in Damascus. Months previous to the June war, a pattern of minor hostilities reached a more serious stage with the bombing of Siqufiya, in which Syrian civilians were killed. What caused this? The kibbutzim of the area sought to possess the farmland on Syria's side of the border, and consistantly engaged in a little game of provocations to turn the heat up. Quite deliberately and for no legitimate reason, they would drive armoured vehicles & tractors deep into Syrian territory just to provoke a response, which lead to a counter response--the most serious being Siqufiya and the IAF shooting down several Syrian jets over Damascus itself. Throughout the period, there were also small-scale Israeli attacks against Palestinians & Jordanians in the West Bank (as-Samu in late '66, for example), with some reciprocating actions in response, as well as al-Fatah and other independent Palestinian activities on the side.

The Soviets had informed Nasser that Israel was massing troops on the Syrian border; this suspicion was confirmed in their eyes by the observation that the years' "Independence Day" military parade was missing any displays of armour. At the time Nasser had a very signifigant portion of the Egyptian army fighting a proxy war against the Saudis & British in Yemen, but still sent a division or two to the border in a show of support for the threats facing its fellow-UAR member Syria, then under the radical left Prime Minister Dr. Yusef Zayyain (overthrown by Aflaq's "moderates" in the military a short while after the loss, who in turn were overthrown by Asad acting on Aflaq's example). This was a veiled threat by Nasser to lay off of Syria, but not a sizeable enough force to move against the well-prepared Israelis.

Shortly before the war broke out, the Soviets had convinced Nasser that the Israelis were not going to start any trouble, and demanded that Nasser not start anything either. Whether this was a naive mistake on the part of the Soviets or a plot against Nasser is open for discussion, but their assurances tied his hands and assured that nothing would be begun by the Egyptian/Syrian side. In addition to them, Jordan was bound to them by a mutual defense pact and was uncomfortable at the attacks in the runup to the war. The moves to the border on the Egyptian side are better pegged as nervous political posturing rather than any conspiratorial threat.

It can be read in interviews made after the war by luminaries such as Rabin, that the Israeli camp in truth leaned towards expecting no real threat, and rather seized upon an opportunity they had obviously long planned for. The large call-up of reserves was draining economic sectors and would either have to be quickly acted on or withdrawn; the Israeli leadership opted for the former and went on the offensive, destroying the Egyptian air force in a sneak attack, the war progressing from there with the neighboring Arab lands being occupied in course.

Despite a ceasefire being signed, Israeli attacks on Syria continued, with eventually some 130,000 Arab refugees ejected from the Golan. Some 200,000 more Palestinians fled to the eastern bank of the River Jordan. In '68, there was a moderate Israeli invasion of Jordan (East Bank) that was stopped by joint PLO/PLA/PFLP fighters at heavy loss. Around 100,000 Arab inhabitants were driven out of the immediate River Jordan valley in this period (West Bank), as the first Jewish colonies were established in Hebron.

Or that Egypt, Syria, and Jordan's promises to push the Jews into the sea were just a little joke?

“just a little joke”, no, “typically shrill, bombastically blind, and self-defeating outbursts of petty nationalist rhetoric” on the part of them, yes.

1967, just like 1948 and 1956 before it, as well as 1973 afterward, was the result of Arab aggression and publicly stated intention to destroy the 1% of the Middle East that Jews are permitted to live.

'48 is a thorny bit I do not wish to get into, one that I personally do not point to any camp as wholly anything, but including '56 is just ridiculous. At the time, Israel refused Nasser's offer of peace and conspired with European imperialists in an assault on Egypt and independent Arab nationalism as a whole. The Israelis moved in and seized Gaza and Sinai while the French & British invaders attempted to take control of Suez. It was most shameful adventurism, and very likely permanently shut the door on any potential for cooperation between Israel & the Arabs--it could perhaps be said that the collaboration with the hated European imperialists in a blatent aggression against Egypt revealed the true face of what Israel would be to the region, that it would just be used as a proxy hammer by European (and later American) imperialists to bash up independent Arab nationalism with and thus keep secure the puppet oil colonies on the Gulf for “western” domination. That single fact is the overriding source of the “special relationship”--forget every lobby, forget “Jewish conspiracies” some sectors like to think up, forget even pandering for votes on election day, that is the most useful task Israel has and continues to provide to the US (intertwining ties to the enormous black hole of “defense industries” & the global arms market would be the #2 on that list).

Now, '73 was the one major event that could truly be called an "Arab aggression" in 50 years of history. But even then it was wholly confined towards retaking land that Israel had occupied in its previous aggression, and again took place after the Israelis arrogantly spit on another reconciliation offer by the Egyptians (’71, by Sadat).

It is good that you left out '82, '87, '93, and '96.
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Aidoneus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-11-03 03:20 AM
Response to Reply #36
37. ?
.
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Aidoneus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-11-03 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #37
38. ?
.
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Aidoneus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-11-03 07:51 PM
Response to Reply #38
39. ?
11 of 16 it is.
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Aidoneus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-12-03 05:44 PM
Response to Reply #39
40. oh
Edited on Wed Nov-12-03 05:45 PM by Aidoneus


Such is the risk in having a discussion in a graveyard. sigh..
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bluesoul Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-12-03 05:48 PM
Response to Reply #40
41. You really
weren't lucky with your debater! :evilgrin:
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cosmicdot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-07-03 11:09 AM
Response to Original message
4. disappointingly, if he does have any $, it's the MO of modern 'leaders'
seems most all of them have rich bank accounts ... from Bush to Blair to Charles Taylor, etc.

sounds like Bushspeak

Saddam - at least, he's not in power anymore

well, at least, not in view of the Faux news watchers

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ForestsBeatBushes Donating Member (633 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-07-03 01:33 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. Right.
I think they might have gotten the old "power corrupts" saying from just this sort of thing.

It would be naive, IMHO, to think any modern 'leader' (as you write) would not have very healthy bank accounts, to say the least.
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IndependentThinker Donating Member (10 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 01:55 PM
Response to Reply #4
21. No one can match how much Arafat stole
60 Minutes http://cbsnewyork.com/rooney/sixtyminutes_story_313203311.html reports he stole up to $3 Billion from his people.

I can't think of anyone, outside of Saudi sheiks or possibly other Arab rulers, who have amassed as much while their people live in poverty.
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The Magistrate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #21
24. You Need To Get Out More, Ma'am
Visit the Orient, particularly.
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IndependentThinker Donating Member (10 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 02:20 PM
Response to Reply #24
26. Thank you, Sir
I'd love to, but with 3 little ones our vacations are mostly to see Mickey.
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bemildred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 02:29 PM
Response to Reply #24
29. Brunei is an interesting place, for one.
One wonders about a number of others littered about, but the
Sultan doesn't seem to mind talking about it.

I find the $3 billion a bit speculative. Have you seen anything
that would put a number on that order on a sounder basis?
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The Magistrate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 02:45 PM
Response to Reply #29
33. No, Sir
The range of allegations is far too great, and actual situation is doubtless complicated by cominglings in a sort of "privy purse" arrangement, where state use and personal blend in the pursuit and maintainance of power. Even ostentasious display has its political effect, after all: the chief must live grandly, and give with a lavish hand, or many will begin to suspect he is no chief, or an unsuccessful one, anyway....

These figures seem to me best read like reports of armies in a medieval chronicle, where the figures may be safely taken as meaning "an awful lot of people marching by." The fellow doubtless has much more money than he could possibly spend in his remaining days.
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bemildred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 02:48 PM
Response to Reply #33
35. Thank you Sir.
I believe it is still a challenge to spend sums on that order.
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drdon326 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-09-03 08:36 PM
Response to Original message
7. Very interesting....
GOOD post.
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SweetheartLikeYou Donating Member (40 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-09-03 09:18 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. I agree and,
according to the old clock, this program will be starting in less than 45 minutes PST.

Has anyone in another time zone seen it already?
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IndependentThinker Donating Member (10 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 02:27 AM
Response to Original message
9. Arafat's been robbing his people for years
Edited on Mon Nov-10-03 02:41 AM by IndependentThinker
Tonight's segment on 60 Minutes http://cbsnewyork.com/rooney/sixtyminutes_story_313203311.html that Arafat's been stealing from his own people for years and has amassed a personal fortune of up to $3 billion.

His wife gets $100,000 a month to live in luxury in Paris.

Arafat pays his own security guards $20 Million A MONTH - In Cash!

All the while his people live in poverty.

I've long believed that Arafat's just another Arab dictator who pretends to love his people while they live in feces. After tonight's program I have no doubt.
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RuB Donating Member (402 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 03:48 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. I agree.
Welcome to DU!
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IndependentThinker Donating Member (10 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #10
11. Welcome to DU
Thanks!
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BushCutters Donating Member (48 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 02:10 PM
Response to Reply #11
25. What took you so long?
Please stay at I/P and keep on keepin' it honest!

:yourock:
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IndependentThinker Donating Member (10 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-10-03 02:23 PM
Response to Reply #25
27. Thanks!
It's so nice to have a place to read about others who are similarly aggravated with the way our country is being "governed". I'll try to post more, but usually can't get to the computer till the kids are asleep, and then I'm ready to crash too.

Plus hubby needs some lovin' :-)
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