Settler diplomatic plan calls for bi-national state

[tinnypriv]

Settler diplomatic plan calls for bi-national state
Jerusalem Post, 25 November 2003

Right wing members of the Likud along with settlement leaders have secretly designed a broad diplomatic initiative that calls for a bi-national state and ultimately offering all willing Palestinians Israeli citizenship, settlement leaders said Tuesday.

The parameters of the plan were revealed Tuesday morning as the spearhead of a public relations campaign to block Prime Minister Ariel Sharon's consideration of unilateral evacuation of certain settlements.

The proposal, which would be introduced in phases, grants Israeli citizenship and equal rights to all Palestinians living in the West Bank Gaza who are interested in such a status quo. The crux of the initiative would provide for the dismantlement of the Palestinian Authority and would proscribe the establishment of a Palestinian State.

...

To circumvent the drawbacks of a bi-national state – the rapid demographic growth of Palestinians (in 10 years more Palestinians will live west of the Jordan than Jews according to surveys) the West Bank and Gaza will be partitioned into cantons.

These cantons will receive parliamentary representation according to factors other than population, in the hopes of permanently assuring a Jewish majority in the land west of the Jordan River. The constitution would provide that the bi-national state will in perpetuity be led by a Jewish Prime Minister and that his deputy will be an Arab.

...

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull&cid=1069742947947
http://images.maariv.co.il/cache/ART594269.html (hebrew)

...

Comment: Ma'ariv outlines some "particulars" of the plan (to be presented in roughly two weeks, according to Adi Mintz, head of yesha):

* No Palestinian state west of the Jordan
* Jerusalem united as capital of Israel
* No right of return to Israel, period
* "terror destroyed"
* end of incitement.

Also mentioned is possibility that some Palestinians will have Jordanian citizenship (not decided as yet).

Also, there will be three stages:

1. Destruction of terror.
2. Establishment of autonomy within the Arab areas (who knows what this means) + end of the PA.
3. Regional diplomatic agreement.

Finally, Israel + "Judea-Samaria" and Gaza will be split into 10 cantons. 1 of these will be in the WB, the other in Gaza. No sizes are mentioned. Then these cantons will be allocated voting rights in the Knesset. The 8 Jewish cantons will have more voting power than the other two, ensuring a Jewish majority "always".

BTW, the Yesha boys also have the nerve to say this is like America. I'm not sure what you Yanks will have to say about that ;-)

[La_Serpiente]

1. WHOA

this is an eye-opener. I would have to see more information to see where this is going.

[bluesoul]

2. Anyone accepting this

would be signing suicide. Are they serious with such "offers"? :crazy:

[papau]

3. Similiar to US Senate

and it could work.

and they need something to stop the Geneva 2 state solution.

But why whould the "arab" cantons not go to a separate state via urban warfare ala Ireland.???????

:-)

[Aidoneus]

4. Well, "like America" in the sense that..

...the invaders here keep the natives in "cantonments" too. Different in that that we killed most of them off before giving a vote.

Maybe that'll be written into the plan later, as sadistic harassment and making their lives hell hasn't worked well so far. :shrug:

[bemildred]

5. It is interesting that they feel pressured enough

to come up with this.

"all animals are equal but some animals are more equal than others"
-- Animal Farm

[The Magistrate]

6. Lebanon Redux

This kind of gerry-mander could never last, even if it were to be accepted.

[bemildred]

7. It won't be accepted, but I'm sure you know that.

It is a stalking horse to combat the Geneva Accords,
nothing more. But it is good news that those latter are
being taken seriously enough to arouse alarm in the
settler camp, I would think. One wonders if that is
what lies behind the babbling about "unilateral concessions"
coming from Sharon and the sudden interest in the Bush
Administration in "getting tough" with Sharon?

[tinnypriv]

8. Funnily enough

The print edition of Ma'ariv says this is "The Right's answer to Geneva".

Hardly concealed, is it? :D

[bemildred]

9. Not much.

I have been trying to figure out was behind the
"disturbance in the force" we talked about a few
days back, and it just dawned on me it is the Geneva
Accords, duh? It has serious grass-roots support on
both sides, and it is the end of things as they are and
the loss of power and control to those that benefit
from things as they are. A strong effort will be made
to head it off at the pass and/or change the subject, and
this can be observed already.

[tinnypriv]

13. There might be something more to that tomorrow (wed)

Mitzna is giving a lecture in Sederot about it I think.

Don't think he'll reveal much (given that all the maps etc are available now), but he might give some decent analysis.

[The Magistrate]

21. It Does Seem, Mr. Mildred

That the "Geneva" plan has wide and growing support, which ought to come as no surprise. It has long been a staple of intelligent commentary on this situation that the broad outlines of a durable settlement are clear to just about all, are acceptable to the great majority of ordinary folks on both sides, and that the only real obstacle is getting the political leaderships to knuckle under. The "Geneva" plan comes within these obvious parameters, and will be clearly seen to do so by more and more people as it becomes more widely known and talked of. It provides, so to speak, a "somebody" to fix the difficulty heretofore that "you cannot beat somebody with nobody" in a political contest. The "Geneva" plan provides an excellent platform for a party or coalition within Israel to make a serious run at Sharon, as well as a platform for what might be called the "silent majority" of Arab Palestinians to influence their leadership and isolate the radicals, in whatever means they have available to them to make their will known. The sort of proposal made above not only will not be acceptable to the people of Arab Palestine, it will provide no more competion in Israel to the "Geneva" plan than a high school football squad might give a pro team.

[bemildred]

22. Indeed Sir.

They have wrested control of the "terms of debate" from
the "leaders", and the fact that they have managed that
rather suggests that the time is right for it. Let us
hope that is the case. It is certainly true that the vast
majority on both sides would be better served by a fair
settlement, as near as that can be managed.

[Classical_Liberal]

10. Hah!

Oh my!

[BlackFrancis]

11. It is like America in all the worst ways

It's like what we did with the South having to bribe those knuckleheads with giving votes to their slaves for them to cast and giving them unproportional representation in the House and electoral college.

[Classical_Liberal]

12. Exactly Palestinians are 3/5 human

. All that is needed to change this is a 13, 14 and 15 amendment so the offer might just be tempting. Like I have said all along, if their is a binational multicultural state, you can blame the right wingers for it.

[bemildred]

18. "Separate but equal"

I think that's the phrase.

The Law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as
well as the poor to sleep under bridges, beg in the streets,
or steal bread." -- Anatole France (I think)

[BlackFrancis]

19. it wouldn't measure that standard..

That would be more like how Israeli Arabs are treated today..

[bemildred]

20. It made me think of Jim Crow,

but you are right, that's a bad fit, more
like current policies towards Arab citizens.

[Classical_Liberal]

14. More news on the 3/5 compromise

ightwing Israelis make a plan
25/11/2003 12:37 - (SA)


Jerusalem - Israel's right wing hit back on Tuesday with its own alternative peace plan which rules out the creation of a Palestinian state or dismantling any settlements, after Prime Minister Ariel Sharon warned there was no alternative to land for peace.

Following on the heels of the internationally-backed "roadmap" peace plan and the "Geneva Initiative" which is being officially launched next Monday, the latest blueprint drawn up by rightwing MPs and settlers' groups rejects the principle of trading land for peace.

Ben Tzvi Lieberman of the Settlers' Council, said that an alternative plan was needed as the roadmap and Geneva plans were "very bad solutions".

The plan would involve "the eradication of terrorism, the abandonment of the principle of peace in exchange for land, autonomous administration for the Arabs and a final regional accord which would exclude the creation of a Palestinian state or the dismantling of settlements," Lieberman told public radio.

http://www.news24.com/News24/World/News/0,,2-10-1462_1450490,00.html

[JAbuchan08]

15. Well, they're moving in the right direction

Once again; however, the Israeli insistence on a majority Jewish demography is once again the sticking point. I think there is a way to have a majority Arab state and enforce the rights of Jews as well, but the underrepresentation of Arabs can't continue. Perhaps they could have a multi state one government institution where all the "cantons" have independent constitutions and the central government cannot violate the constitution of any of the states therefore hopefully restricting it to only the most basic logistical legislation.

[BlackFrancis]

16. a solution first proposed by Quadafi..

go figure :shrug:

[legin]

17. Mmmmm...

If it's a bi-national state, the first thing that goes is the israel name, it stands for something, an idea, that is definatly anything but bi-national.

A suggestion would Palis or Ispal.

[Jack Rabbit]

23. This is not a serious plan

The Geneva Accord has the virtue of being an agreement between credible diplomats on both sides of the conflict. This is a rightwing plan to impose unilaterarally peace conditions on one side by other without regard to whether it is acceptable. Does anybody believe that any Palestinian leader would accept this?

It is maintained by many that a binational state spells the end of Jewish democracy. It doesn't matter how it comes about. A binational state either will not be Jewish or it will not be democratic.

This binational solution is one of those that dispenses with democracy.

To circumvent the drawbacks of a bi-national state – the rapid demographic growth of Palestinians (in 10 years more Palestinians will live west of the Jordan than Jews according to surveys) the West Bank and Gaza will be partitioned into cantons.
These cantons will receive parliamentary representation according to factors other than population, in the hopes of permanently assuring a Jewish majority in the land west of the Jordan River. The constitution would provide that the bi-national state will in perpetuity be led by a Jewish Prime Minister and that his deputy will be an Arab.

That is no more democracy than would be denying Palestinians the right to vote. Of course, such a monstrous idea as that doesn't seem to be off the table with the Israeli right:

"To give the Palestinians the vote, is crazy, it is political suicide," said Rabbi Daniel Shiloh a leading member of the powerful Yesha Council of Rabbis. Eventually he reasoned, the Palestinian electorate will demand "one man one vote. And that will be the end of us. If this is the basis of the plan then we do not support it."

[The Magistrate]

24. Not Even Good Comedy, My Friend