|
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend Bookmark this thread |
This topic is archived. |
Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Israel/Palestine |
Kurska (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Apr-23-11 05:11 PM Original message |
Hamas, PA reject any peace plan without right of return |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
azurnoir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Apr-23-11 05:25 PM Response to Original message |
1. And what would Israel have to give up with the 'new' Obama Peace Plan? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kurska (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Apr-23-11 05:42 PM Response to Reply #1 |
2. I don't believe it has even been proposed yet. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
azurnoir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Apr-23-11 05:54 PM Response to Reply #2 |
3. Israel would be required to give up everything outside the 1967 |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
azurnoir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Apr-23-11 11:17 PM Response to Reply #2 |
5. according to the Palestine Papers the PA already |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kurska (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Apr-23-11 11:27 PM Response to Reply #5 |
6. Their position then might not be their position now. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
azurnoir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 01:17 AM Response to Reply #6 |
7. But there is some question here as to Mr Sha'aths actual role here |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kurska (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 01:44 AM Response to Reply #7 |
8. If Abbas wants to come out and rebuke this stance fine. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
azurnoir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 01:58 AM Response to Reply #8 |
9. Mr Sha'ath at present does not appear to be an official negotiator |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kurska (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 03:03 AM Response to Reply #9 |
10. Well then it would be fairly easy for Abbas to denounce the comment then. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
azurnoir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 12:23 PM Response to Reply #10 |
16. Does Netanyahu have to 'denounce' every Israeli politician |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kurska (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 01:32 PM Response to Reply #16 |
19. A minister who used to be a negotiator isn't just another politician. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
azurnoir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 01:35 PM Response to Reply #19 |
21. so every Israeli politician is now an official spokesman or is this a blatant double standard? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kurska (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 05:21 PM Response to Reply #21 |
29. Sha'ath is clearly a rogue element, i mean he is only a minister! |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
azurnoir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Apr-26-11 12:02 AM Response to Reply #29 |
82. You are the one making the 'rogue' this and that claims my stance is that Sha'ath is not |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-27-11 06:05 PM Response to Reply #8 |
95. Netanyahu needs to make a meaningul counter-offer. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Ken Burch (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Apr-28-11 04:10 AM Response to Reply #95 |
97. Damn...that should've been "meaningful", not "meaningul". |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
shira (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 06:50 AM Response to Reply #5 |
15. The PA offered nothing WRT refguee return.... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
cali (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 04:04 AM Response to Reply #2 |
13. I think this is more a bargaining position than anything else. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
houstonintc (202 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Apr-23-11 11:01 PM Response to Reply #1 |
4. Asking for National suicide is asking alot... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
azurnoir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 12:48 PM Response to Reply #4 |
17. But there is no 'national suicide' being asked for here n/t |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kurska (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 01:34 PM Response to Reply #17 |
20. Are you denying that full right of return would be the end of Israel? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
azurnoir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 02:08 PM Response to Reply #20 |
23. I am denying that full RoR is being required |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kurska (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 05:23 PM Response to Reply #23 |
30. Yes you're countering a statement made days ago by a minister with statements |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
azurnoir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 05:36 PM Response to Reply #30 |
32. BS I am stating that nowhere in your JPost piece does it state that full RoR is required |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kurska (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 06:12 PM Response to Reply #32 |
33. "Right of return" has a meaning. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
azurnoir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 11:21 PM Response to Reply #33 |
41. and once again does Netanyahu have to qualify everything his politicians say? the double standard |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kurska (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 01:09 AM Response to Reply #41 |
45. Go ahead and be appalled, the mental gymnastic being used to explain away |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
azurnoir (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 01:26 PM Response to Reply #45 |
72. or those off someone trying to ignore the issue of one standard for Israeli's |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 03:12 AM Response to Original message |
11. not to sound excessively semantical - but there is a huge difference in legal terms between refusing |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kurska (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 04:01 AM Response to Reply #11 |
12. And the position of 2001 or 2003 doesn't dictate the position of now. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 04:18 AM Response to Reply #12 |
14. well Mr, Netanyahu has specifically ruled out any possibility whatsoever of any settlement freeze |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
pelsar (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 01:18 PM Response to Reply #14 |
18. history once again is ignored...its too bothersome i guess |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kurska (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 01:38 PM Response to Reply #14 |
22. The fate of the settlements are a FINAL STATUS situation that should be discussed. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 03:35 PM Response to Reply #22 |
27. all settlements in Occupied Palestinian Territory are in violation of International law and have no |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kurska (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 05:25 PM Response to Reply #27 |
31. You're just reading off the talking points now aren't you? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 07:07 PM Response to Reply #31 |
34. Olmert to Haaretz: Two-state solution, or Israel is done for |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kurska (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 01:11 AM Response to Reply #34 |
46. I support the two state solution, you don't need to convince me it is necessary n/t.. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Recursion (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-27-11 04:03 PM Response to Reply #46 |
94. You cannot support both a two-state solution and any settlement expansion |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 02:09 PM Response to Reply #14 |
24. those are Mr. Netayahu's words not mine... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
pelsar (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 02:29 PM Response to Reply #24 |
25. so? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 03:33 PM Response to Reply #25 |
26. knock it off..Everything I said was 100% correct and you know it. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
pelsar (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 04:17 PM Response to Reply #26 |
28. i was just commenting..... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 07:16 PM Response to Reply #28 |
36. but the PA did NOT say that..one minister did while he was in Paraguay |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
pelsar (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 11:50 PM Response to Reply #36 |
42. i do not doubt your sincerity...nor do i doubt the info you post |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 01:53 AM Response to Reply #42 |
48. you may genuinely believe you are not propagandizing - but there is such a thing |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
pelsar (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 04:08 AM Response to Reply #48 |
52. i am bias...no doubt about that.... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 04:37 AM Response to Reply #52 |
54. well I am glad that you recognize your bias...I was wondering there for a moment |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
pelsar (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 05:38 AM Response to Reply #54 |
60. yes...i believe we have an understanding.... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 05:44 AM Response to Reply #60 |
62. of course I would want to see the Gaza economy improve - whatever it takes |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
pelsar (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 06:16 AM Response to Reply #62 |
63. i dont know if you "get it" |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 08:23 AM Response to Reply #63 |
64. of course a working Gaza would help on every level |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
pelsar (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Apr-26-11 12:05 AM Response to Reply #64 |
83. a new thread... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
shira (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 07:12 PM Response to Reply #14 |
35. No settlement freeze happened under Olmert but he made a generous offer Abbas rejected |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 07:28 PM Response to Reply #14 |
37. very interesting article in Forward - quote: "No, Abbas didn’t “walk away,” as myth has it." |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
shira (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 07:46 PM Response to Reply #37 |
38. He walked away, saying the gaps were too wide. He never mentioned waiting for the next PM. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 08:08 PM Response to Reply #38 |
39. I have no idea whether I would have accepted it or not. I was not privy to all the fine details and |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
shira (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 04:05 AM Response to Reply #39 |
51. That's a cop-out. Arafat said he regretted rejecting CD/Taba 10 years ago... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 05:04 AM Response to Reply #51 |
56. as Akiva Eldar put it in regard to the Moratinos Document record of Taba |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
shira (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 05:10 AM Response to Reply #56 |
57. So if more time was needed at Taba, that was rectified with Annapolis |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 05:20 AM Response to Reply #57 |
58. as you know Olmert's own Foreign Minister as well as other members of his cabinet |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
shira (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 05:35 AM Response to Reply #58 |
59. So you would have rejected it and opted for more war, occupation, and settlements? n/t |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 05:41 AM Response to Reply #59 |
61. There was nothing to reject -- you know that - show some intellectual honesty |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
shira (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 09:59 AM Response to Reply #61 |
65. You're making that up - Abbas/Erekat did reject Olmert's offer, claiming the gaps were wide. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 10:14 AM Response to Reply #65 |
66. it still would have not made it through the Israeli cabinet and be implemented -so the point is mute |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
shira (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 11:03 AM Response to Reply #66 |
67. You don't know that - you're making that one up too. You have no problem w/Abbas rejecting Olmert. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
shira (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 11:58 AM Response to Reply #66 |
70. Douglas, would you be happy if Abbas had accepted the Olmert offer? n/t |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
aranthus (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 12:45 AM Response to Reply #11 |
43. Not true. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 02:30 AM Response to Reply #43 |
49. the Israeli negotiating team at Taba did accept the principle of the right of return |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
shira (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 04:24 AM Response to Reply #49 |
53. Douglas, are you for keeping Palestinian refugees caged up another 60 years in camps if need be? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Douglas Carpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 04:41 AM Response to Reply #53 |
55. no I am not. I think they should be offered citizenship in their country of residence |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
shira (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 03:27 PM Response to Reply #55 |
73. Excellent! So why is it that no pro-Palestinian activists are working on making this happen? n/t |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
aranthus (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-27-11 02:20 AM Response to Reply #49 |
92. They did no such thing. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Alamuti Lotus (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Apr-24-11 11:12 PM Response to Original message |
40. as well they should! |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
aranthus (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 12:48 AM Response to Reply #40 |
44. You do understand that the demand prevents any kind of a peace agreement, right? n/t |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Alamuti Lotus (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Apr-26-11 11:00 PM Response to Reply #44 |
88. I request a defintion of precisely what is implied by "peace" before answering |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
aranthus (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-27-11 12:40 AM Response to Reply #88 |
89. The dictionary definition is |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Alamuti Lotus (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-27-11 01:40 AM Response to Reply #89 |
90. not really my question, but as good an answer as I can expect, methinks. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
aranthus (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-27-11 01:52 AM Response to Reply #90 |
91. Then you need to ask better questions. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
King_David (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 01:43 AM Response to Reply #40 |
47. its a non negotiable. nt |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Violet_Crumble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 02:40 AM Response to Reply #47 |
50. Was that supposed to mean something? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kurska (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 11:19 AM Response to Reply #50 |
69. Don't be rude, you know what he meant. n/t |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Violet_Crumble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 05:03 PM Response to Reply #69 |
74. I wasn't. The sentence made no sense... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kurska (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Apr-26-11 12:23 AM Response to Reply #74 |
84. Where was I rude? n/t |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Violet_Crumble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Apr-26-11 12:52 AM Response to Reply #84 |
85. Telling me that I'm rude and that I know what he meant... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
oberliner (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 11:59 AM Response to Reply #50 |
71. Also, remember that "you're" means "you are" |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Violet_Crumble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 05:07 PM Response to Reply #71 |
75. Ah, but that's not an error. I do it intentionally! |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
oberliner (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 05:50 PM Response to Reply #75 |
76. Well, that's even worse! |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Violet_Crumble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 06:08 PM Response to Reply #76 |
78. I'm sure you think it is... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
King_David (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 05:55 PM Response to Reply #50 |
77. Go ahead and fix it ,I do not mind at all |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Violet_Crumble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 06:28 PM Response to Reply #77 |
79. You didn't explain what you meant.... |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
King_David (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 06:32 PM Response to Reply #79 |
80. Sigh |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Violet_Crumble (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 07:08 PM Response to Reply #80 |
81. Well, that's a bit rude and condescending! |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Alamuti Lotus (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Apr-26-11 10:54 PM Response to Reply #47 |
87. We agree, any demand to give up right of return is absolutely non-negotiable and unacceptable |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Kurska (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Apr-25-11 11:18 AM Response to Reply #40 |
68. Well we finally know your postion regarding actually wanting peace. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Alamuti Lotus (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Apr-26-11 10:51 PM Response to Reply #68 |
86. Do not put words into my mouth |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
aranthus (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-27-11 03:43 PM Response to Original message |
93. The demand for a Right of Return is a call for total war to the death. |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Harmony Blue (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Apr-27-11 09:55 PM Response to Reply #93 |
96. The demand being made is supposedly to not lose |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
Shaktimaan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Apr-28-11 11:03 PM Response to Reply #96 |
98. huh? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
pelsar (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Apr-29-11 03:12 AM Response to Reply #96 |
99. subtly? |
Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top |
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) | Thu Apr 18th 2024, 10:26 PM Response to Original message |
Advertisements [?] |
Top |
Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Israel/Palestine |
Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators
Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.
Home | Discussion Forums | Journals | Store | Donate
About DU | Contact Us | Privacy Policy
Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.
© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC