Knesset approves bill eliminating NII benefits to terrorists

[Gimel]

Terrorists and their families members would not be eligible for National Insurance Institute welfare benefits, according to a bill given preliminary approval by the Knesset plenum on Wednesday.

The bill, submitted by MK Aryeh Eldad (National Union), received the approval of 62 Knesset members and 12 voted against it. The government has not yet submitted an official opinion of the proposed law, and the opposition allowed its MKs freedom to vote as they wish.

"In our absurd reality there are extreme examples, such as the grants paid by the State of Israel to families of murderous terrorists through the National Insurance Institute," Eldad said.

Welfare Minister Zevulun Orlev, who voted for the bill, said that the law was a justified moral law intended to defend the citizens of Israel.

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The final paragraphs are imposrtant, as the Arab party leader calls this law racist, while the Israeli Cultural minister defends it.

No doubt it is called racist here too, because it is amined at stopping terrorism.

[number6]

1. It all depends on ....

whether families members had knowledge of said act

if one your family members comits a crime, and you have no
knowledge of it, should I put you in jail ?

[number6]

2. bull

"No doubt it is called racist here too, because it is aimed at stopping terrorism."

no, it is aimed at collective punishment

accomplice's to a crime can be punished under current law .

[lefty_mcduff]

3. Bollocks.

"and their families members" - wonder if my father should lose his social security if I commit a crime, without his knowledge.

Wandering treacherously close to 'collective punishment' - again.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

4. You're right about one thing: it isn't racist -- it's Stalinist. (nt)

[Gimel]

5. In cases where this is done

the suicide attacker lived in the home, and operated out of the home during his training. Kind of hard not to know what a 16 to 20 year old is up to when he lives in your home, where you are basically shoulder to shoulder anyway.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

6. These justifications for COLLECTIVE PUNISHMENT aren't new either.

Same source.

[Gimel]

7. The mass killings

are being done by the terrorists. We all know why and for what gain and for whose profit.

[idontwantaname]

9. I AGREE.

the IDF terrorists are definitly out of hand here. they have an agenda which feeds on propaganda and ignorance and only benifits Israels greed.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

10. And their mothers and fathers and grandfathers and cousins etc.?

Ah, they're ALL terorists. Residential contamination. Suuuuuure.

[Gimel]

11. the families

In the single case that I know of that this law would apply, the terrorist was married to two wives and had several children. They received extra benefits for the death of the head of household. That is the benefit that would be cut under this new law.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

12. Oh, I see.

These people will REALLY play nice as a response to that. NOT.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

8. Of course

Because, you know, teenagers NEVER manage to do things their parents disapprove. Nosiree.

[Djinn]

13. once again rendered

almost speechless by your calm acceptance of collective punishment.

IF family members knew what was going on then charge them with conspiracy or being accomplices. Otherwise they are innocent. Just one of the many ways Israel makes it's claim of being a democracy an absolute joke.

[Gimel]

14. Collective punishment

Your ignoring the collective punishment rendered by the deaths of countless Innocent victims is most distressing.

[Djinn]

15. and YOU are ONCE AGAIN

comparing the actions of a few terrorists to the POLICY of a NATION STATE and if you're going to talk about innocent victims perhaps you could begin with the reality that 3 times as many innocent Palestinians have been killed than Israeli citizens in ALL the years of fighting between Israel and Palestine

[Gimel]

16. The issue on numbers

The issue of numbers is deceptive and I have dealt with this at length in discussions on this board over the past year and a half.


your statement 3 times as many innocent Palestinians have been killed than Israeli citizens in ALL the years of fighting between Israel and Palestine is false.

The numbers do not indicate how many of the Palestinians were innocent. Think again. More than half the Palestinians killed were terrorists or accomplices.

[Djinn]

17. whatever Gimel

never let facts get in the way of good IDF propaganda, if the IDF says they're terrorists then they ARE. The fact that the Israeligovernment considers friends/relatives and neighbours as ACCOMPLICES without any evidence shouldn't trouble you too much I guess.

[Gimel]

18. Friends and neighbors

are never imprisoned or detained unless they are armed and accompanying the terrorist when apprehended. Again you have made an inaccurate over-generalization.

[Djinn]

19. not they're not detained

they're just incinerated when a missile lands on their "known terrorist hideout" AKA their home in a Gaza refugee camp. (Also it's actually untrue that they're never detained unless armed but what's the point arguing with someone who has no problem with the concept of collective punishment)

Tell me will the relatives of non Arab Israeli's who kill people loose THEIR benefits?

If your teenager starts selling drugs (and believe me plenty do without their parents knowledge) do you think you should be arrested for aiding and abetting drug trafficking?

[Gimel]

20. If it happens, yes

Tell me will the relatives of non Arab Israeli's who kill people loose THEIR benefits?

The law isn't partial to nationality. That's why I thought it so amazing that the Arab factions would call it racist. They actually admit that it's a cultural problem.

Parents are usually charged if the dealing is operating out of their home. The same goes for downloading songs illegally. Parents are as libel as the children.

The young Haifa resident who turned out to be the "Jewish terrorist" was arrested and charged as was his father. There is no bias in this law.

[Djinn]

21. "If" it happens

you make it sound like it's unlikely that a non arab Israeli could kill someone?? persumably Israeli's committ crimes at much the same rate as everyone else?

While I'd be willing to bet every cent I'll ever earn that this law heavilly disproportionately effects the arab community, either way it's another nail in the coffin of the myth that Israel is democratic, you can't punish people for what their relaticves or friends do.

[Gimel]

22. Terrorism

Terror attacks are not simple murder. Of course murder occurs, and the murderer and his or her family is not rewarded. There is a special law that aids victims of terror attacks (does not apply to criminal murder). The families of terrorists would not be able to benefit from the actions of the terrorists. They will not qualify for assistance under the law that aids victims of terror. It's another loop-hole that terrorists could benefit by. The terrorists might be Arab or Jewish, but so far, there have been few Jews involved in terror attacks where deaths or injury has occurred.

[Djinn]

23. well not since the Nakba anyway

"there have been few Jews involved in terror attacks where deaths or injury has occurred."

hasn't been needed since.

[Classical_Liberal]

24. You don't have to go back that far

. What about Sabra and Shatilla, and the massacre on the temple mount. Not to mention all those incidents involving settlers "accidentally" killing Palestinian rock throwers to death. Also you have to buy the accidental killings in self defense on the part of the IDF, and I don't.

Also injuries during olive grove takeovers(thefts not stopped by the idf) are pretty common.

[Djinn]

25. but surely you don't think the brave and honorable IDF

target people (sarcasm off)

To some people only Palestinian resistance/terrorism is a problem, these are people who will burble on about "innocent civilians" but would never consider a strike against a military base or soldiers as justified resistance - it'd still be terrorism to them.

[Gimel]

26. The NII laws

These law is apply to Israeli citizens. It's a social security program. Compensation is not given to people who are not citizens. The money that is collected from salaries funds the National Insurance Institute (NII).

It is run similar to an insurance company. If someone takes out insurance on his wife and then murders her, is he eligible to collect the insurance? If someone has insurance on himself and then commits suicide, the insurance companies will not pay.

So if someone decides to become a suicide bomber, should the government pay the insurance for him? That is the bill that is being proposed. No benefits to attackers in terror attacks, or to their heirs.

[Djinn]

27. no the ACTUAL bombers shouldn't

as for their heirs? YES unless they were accomplices - being related doesn't mean they were

[Gimel]

28. Not charged with criminal actions

They are not charged with crimes. They are not considered accomplices. Should they benefit from the crime, they might be, however.