To those who think we should distance ourselves...

[WilliamPitt]

from gay rights and/or the right to choose, I remind you of something that happened just a few days after September 11. This is the original essay version of what I wrote at the time:

===

The American Taliban

Amidst the dust and ruin, amidst the pain and woe, amidst the remarkable unity that is being demonstrated by Americans everywhere, there lurks a vein of hatred and evil that is nearly beyond description.

Some Americans today are leveling fingers of blame towards homosexuals, towards liberals, towards the ACLU, towards those who protect and defend a woman's legal right to reproductive freedom.

That anyone would seek to smear fellow American citizens with blame for the atrocities that have been visited upon us is wretched enough to make any decent human being physically ill.

That those who do this are denouncing our fellow citizens in the name of God is the definition of evil, and is the same kind of hate that drove those airplanes like a dagger into the heart of our nation.

I am ashamed to be an American today because of Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson. This is what Mr. Falwell had to say on the nationally broadcast television show, 'The 700 Club':

"The ACLU's got to take a lot of blame for this...throwing God out successfully with the help of the federal court system, throwing God out of the public square, out of the schools. The abortionists have got to bear some burden for this because God will not be mocked. And when we destroy 40 million little innocent babies, we make God mad. I really believe that the pagans and the abortionists and the feminists and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle...all of them who have tried to secularize America. I point the finger in their face and say, 'You helped this happen.'"

There were more Americans killed on Tuesday than in the attacks on Pearl Harbor and the invasions on D Day and Iwo Jima combined, if the estimates prove to be true. There were more Americans killed on Tuesday than in a year's worth of fighting during the Vietnam War.

America has taken a mighty blow, yet we still stand strong. We are pulling together as best we can. So much greatness has been demonstrated by our firefighters, police, medical professionals, rescue workers and ordinary citizens who queue up to give blood, because it is the best thing they can do.

Yet, here is a religious bigot who has the unmitigated gall to lay blame upon some of our citizens because he does not agree with the way they live. He does this in the name of his vicious, hateful, bloody God. His God is not my God. His America is not my America.

Mr. Falwell should take that finger of blame and turn it towards his own miserable face. Religious zealotry and intolerance – on both sides - lies at the root of this disaster.

No worse fate could ever befall America than to have it to come under the sway of demagogues like Jerry Falwell.

Gay? To the wall.

Pro-choice? To the wall.

ACLU, defender of the Constitution? To the wall.

Not Christian? To the rack, and then the wall.

Support any of the above, or believe those citizens who support the above have the right to do so? To the wall.

Jerry Falwell has done a grave injury to millions of American citizens for his words. The First Amendment of the Constitution allows him to do so, allows him to advocate the destruction of the very rights that protect his hate and evil. Nevertheless, he must be punished for this.

I denounce Jerry Falwell and his lapdog, Pat Robertson.

I say, as an American, that these men do not represent the country I love and would die for. They are a cancer on the soul of our country.

I say to my homosexual brothers and sisters, to those who are not Christian, to those who support the legal right of reproductive choice, that I am with you. I stand with my fellow American citizens in this time of trial.

To Mr. Bush, I demand that you denounce these people as well. Once upon a time you gave your soul to Jesus in the presence of Falwell. Be a leader, Mr. Bush. Be a leader of all of us.

To the world, I offer a plea: ignore these villains. They are not us. We will deal with them the way they should be dealt with. Religious extremism of any sort is the most dangerous threat in the world right now. That this breed of the Taliban are American makes them all the more so.

Mr. Falwell, God sees you, and is not pleased. Neither am I.

===

Be careful what you start arguing for. You might find yourself keeping some pretty disgusting company.

[Missy Vixen]

1. This is the bottom line

to those who believe that demonizing anyone who doesn't share their religious beliefs is appropriate and necessary.

To quote Will: "God sees you, and is not pleased. Neither am I."

Have these people ever read the New Testament? Furthermore, do they comprehend what they read?

Julie

[RBHam]

2. It couldn't happen here...

First they came for the Arabs
and I did not speak out
because I was not an Arab.
Then they came for the Gays
and I did not speak out
because I was not Gay.
Then they came for the liberals
and I did not speak out
because I was not a liberal.
Then they came for me
and there was no one left
to speak out for me.

[SarahB]

3. Very good!

:thumbsup:

[davepc]

4. I understand what you're saying

but we cant win national elections as the gay abortionist party.

We have utterly lost the terms of the debate. Now we need to change the debate.

That dosent mean casting you aside, or not caring about your issues.

[sangh0]

5. Those people are disruptors

.

[MrTriumph]

6. Get real

Hey, 11 states easily passed bans on gay marriage and more states will be joining them.

I was tempted to say gay rights is dead, but Rove is not going to let it die.

You can give me platitudes, but no one can state what the strategy is to accomplish your goals. May I suggest leaders of the gay rights movement examine the goals by putting everything on the table. Ask the question that must be asked: Are the goals attainable? If not, what is Plan B?

[VelmaD]

7. Thank you Will

That was one of the first things of yours that I read. I just don't have the words right now but I figure you know. :hug:

[mbee]

8. We are all Americans and citizens of the word and we distance ourselves

only from those who would do us harm. No one else!

[wabeewoman]

9. We are the party of equal rights

We don't distance ourselves from anyone's rights. That said, we don't let them frame the debate. The repukes, as always, focused sex instead of rights. That turned some people off as they knew it would. At the democratic caucus's way back when, there was a delegate who was stauchly Dean, and democratic in my group and against gay marriage. However, he was for gays rights. I think gay marriage maybe is code for gay sex?? but gay rights is not? I confess I don't get it! I had read polls earlier in the year that the majority of people were for gay rights. What happened to that?

[vpigrad]

12. Sigh

> the majority of people were for gay rights. What happened to that?

The electronic voting machines stole those votes. That's what happened to them.

Do anyone of us know someone who thinks marriage is limited to only some people? I certainly don't, so I don't understand the original poster's call to distance the party from that. The party is about rights. It is about protecting minorities. Sometimes that doesn't make you popular, but unless you're a complete coward, you'll stand-up for what is right. What is right is protecting marriage from those that want to turn it into a subset of what it really is.

[NYCGirl]

14. What if we reframe "gay rights" as "human rights"?

Lakoff says that when the right mentions "gay marriage", their constituency thinks "gay sex."

"Human rights" includes everyone.

[unfrigginreal]

10. There's a big difference between distancing ourselves from and

promoting for the same issues with a different approach. I agree that we should not distance ourselves from from gay rights and/or the right to choose but we have to find a winning way to support them.

[billyskank]

11. I bet

that winning way involves not talking about them at all, right?

[RBHam]

13. don't ask...

don't tell...

[unfrigginreal]

15. Nope, it should be discussed as equal rights for all

If not, then we're going to continue to see Democratic candidates for Congress supporting anti-gay legislation. Personally I find that a hell of a lot more repugnant than reframing the debate.

[Kagemusha]

16. You guys really do need to be the opposition. It's more moral.

If you can't be a moral opposition, a conscience for the country, and be able to express things in those terms rather than bootlick Bush's rhetoric, then you can't ever be claiming to be doing what's right because it's right, and not because it's politically convenient or a dodge to pander to the center while keeping the left happy.

Be a real opposition. It's not just your only political hope - it's good for your soul.

[StanleyWalkersB_tch]

17. People, Please...

As an observer from a neighbouring country, I just wanted to point out something that seems to be getting overlooked:

All of the in-fighting, finger pointing, and blaming that's going on right now is ~precisely~ what the "evil-doers" {both foreign and domestic, or whichever you prefer} ~wanted~ to create. A divided Democratic party, a divided America, and ultimately a divided, polarized, and extremely hate-filled world is exactly what they need in order to succeed. "Divide and conquer"...it's worked in the past, and apparently it's working again.

Gays are not to blame, abortion is not to blame, "American values" are not to blame. The reasons this election turned out the way it did can be more accurately sourced to stupidity, ignorance, and fear. Please don't succumb to this...don't give in and become one of "them" by playing right into their hands. Everyone here is capable of ~so~ much better than this! :-)

[Strawman]

19. Perfectly stated

And you don't defeat stupidity, ignorance and fear by embracing it. When you are right you fight until you win. You enlighten people who need to be enlightened. You reassure people who are afraid and appeal to their humanity and to their hopes. I don't want any hollow victories by capitulating on gay rights or women's rights or anyone's human rights. I understand that it is possible to overreach and to be too rigid, but some things just should never be bargained away.

[George W. Dunce]

18. It's all a moot point

After the Massachusetts Gay Marriage act all bets were off. It is really the main reason Shrub kept using the Massachusetts liberal line. People knew about this and it was right up there on their list with abortion. The toothpaste is out of the tube we cannot distance ourselves from it now. I would have supported an gay marriage act AFTER the election as most Dems would have. I think we put the needs of the few ahead of the needs of the many on this one.

[StanleyWalkersB_tch]

20. Perhaps I'm mis-guided...

...but I thought being compassionate towards the needs of the few {minorities, the disenfranchised, those without rights} was the very point of being a progressive liberal democrat. :-)

[donheld]

21. You are exactly right

This blame the gay group of DUers and "We can't" group are making me very mad.