DLC: "Michael Moore does not represent the Kennedy or Truman tradition"

[Bush_Eats_Beef]

Michael Moore's Impact on the Election

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,141628,00.html

Democrats have been asking themselves whether Michael Moore’s high profile during the campaign might not have done them more harm than good.

Al From (search), head of Bill Clinton’s Democratic Leadership Council told a gathering at the National Press Club: "This party has to be the party of Harry Truman and John Kennedy, not the party of Michael Moore. Michael Moore does not represent the Kennedy or Truman tradition in the Democratic Party of patriotism and security.”

The New Republic's Peter Beinart (search) had a more stinging rebuke: "The problem with Michael Moore is, he doesn't believe there is a war on terrorism … This is a guy who doesn't basically believe in American power or American national security. He's a problem."

So what does Michael Moore think? Not surprisingly, he thinks Michael Moore is good for the Democrats, and so are his movies. In a meeting with Hollywood Democrats on December 6th, Moore argued that Democrats would have suffered greater losses had it not been for him: "Fahrenheit 9/11 prevented a Bush landslide. Why, interviews of Republicans leaving the movie theaters showed that more than 30 percent would tell their friends to see the movie."

[mzmolly]

1. Uhm, Mr. Moore is a FILMMAKER, not a politician. Let's hope not.

:hi:

[Chandler Stork]

2. OK, the DLC,

which turned it's back on the New Deal, wants to "represent the Truman tradition"? That makes sense. :eyes:

[Fridays Child]

3. I see that Faux is trying to stir this pot. Gee, what a surprise.

[Synnical]

18. Exactly

Don't rise to the occasion.

[tsuki]

35. They are repeating quotes.

[BattyDem]

4. The DLC does not represent the Kennedy or Truman tradition.

Michael Moore represents the traditon just fine. He fights for the little guys. The DLC caters to the big guys.

[genius]

71. The DLC represents the Herbert Hoover tradition.

[librechik]

96. indubitably. Now Al From wants to blacklist MM? Ironic

I think he represents the J. Edgar Hoover tradition. From struck me as a petulant child when he said that. Screw him.

[Maat]

5. Hey, I love Michael Moore!

He was good for the Democratic party. I know dozens of young adults that voted for the first time (Democratic) becasue of him.

Michael Moore - you are welcome in the Progressive Wing of the Democratic Party (along with me)(although I think that currently he is an Independent).

Maybe the DLC needs to stop insulting their own - and just accept that our party is a 'big tent' party - and that there are different wings of it, so-to-speak. No need to get insulting.

[flaminbats]

69. Moore did more to motivate our base than the DLC..

without Michael Moore's influence many young voters would have never registered or voted. Kerry didn't loose because of Moore, he lost because he was running against an incumbent.

Kerry remained competitive mainly because he won most of the voters between 18-29, and he was able to win most of the Nader votes Gore lost. If Michael Moore had not supported Kerry or made his movie, Kerry would of done as badly as Mondale or Dukakis. If a movie like Fahrenheit 9/11 had been made in 84, there would of been no Reagan landslide!

[LSdemocrat]

6. Neither the DLC nor Michael Moore perfectly fit the JFK/Truman ideal

But they both represent wings of the party that are entitled to different viewpoints.

Also, NOTE THE SOURCE (Fox News), this article is just a weak attempt to divide the Democrats and inflame people on both sides.

[Bush_Eats_Beef]

8. True, it is simply more "Tokyo Rose" journalism from Rupert's hacks.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B0002HDXTQ/qid%3D1103171057/sr%3D11-1/ref%3Dsr%5F11%5F1/002-8865653-6023268

[Old and In the Way]

11. Actually, a very good point.

We really do need both viewpoints in the Party. The DLC aren't motivating people who relate to MM....and MM isn't going to win the Party lots of converts in the boardrooms. But both views are needed and it should be an inclusive strategy, not exclusive. One can still be pro-business and appreciate Moore's critique and exposure of unethical corporatism.

[tsuki]

36. They would not have a wedge issue, if From and Bienart had not

given it to them.

[LSdemocrat]

43. Are you saying Michael Moore has never questioned the DLC?

[tsuki]

70. I am saying what is the sense of the Leadership (and I use that term

loosely) attacking a member of the party if not to fuel the RW's scorn and alienate potential voters.

[zulchzulu]

7. Al From is a pigheaded dumbass

He proved it with that STUPID statement. Thinking some filmmaker who did a great documentary is somehow a bad guy is just plain insipid pandering. Maybe he needs to diss Sean Penn too. What about Streisand?

Oi.

[Old and In the Way]

9. What's the DLC done lately to win elections?

I'll cast my lot with Moore.

[KarenS]

10. I do NOT like the DLC !!!

If they have their way the Dems will be Republican-lite!!

Those of us in Colorado that supported Mike Miles (prgressive Dem) to run for the Senate got a taste of the State DLC :puke:

[paulk]

19. and it was so horrible

that we won a Senate race.


????????

[UpsideDownFlag]

20. ...A senate race?

one? how many did we lose?

[JohnKleeb]

22. I know what you're getting at but what paulk is saying that we did

indeed win in Colorado with a more moderate candidiate in Ken Salazar.

[UpsideDownFlag]

24. that's true. there are two highlights i can find this time around...

colorado and Obama. The thing is, there should be so much more than that right now, and I am choosing to blame the political strategy of centrism to place my blame on.

[JohnKleeb]

25. Yep

I am not defending those candidiates who ran as centrists because they thought it would make it easier but Colorado was a win for us is all I meant. I am personally surprised how bad we lost in Oklahoma with Carson.

[KarenS]

28. what I mean is,

after Salazar beat Miles in the primaries, the DLC put out a nasty "I told you so" "Miles is a left wing whackjob and so are his supporters" email,,,,

It was rather stunning.

Repugs are not the only sore winners,,,,

[noamnety]

12. Moore's an independent, isn't he?

So the whole conversation is a little silly.

It's like me saying I don't know which vegetable I like better, lettuce, or steak.

[saracat]

33. Moore was always a dem , unless he recently changed. That

was the reason so many Dems were outraged when he supported Nader in 2000. He never changed his registration. As for now, He appears to be still Dem. But I could be wrong.

[peacetalksforall]

13. Maybe Michael represents the little people and the DLC represents

the corporations and maybe the DLC like their little parnerships with the right/cabal.

[JohnKleeb]

14. Moore is good for the dems

He's gotten the message out.

[madfloridian]

15. Moore deserves our respect. The DLC needs to hush.

:hi:

[rniel]

57. Michael moore

could sit on his ass and make millions making movies that do not make anyone angry. He puts himself out on the line and takes great risks to change things. Unlike a lot of us.

Not just Michael Moore but anyone that actually does something instead of sitting on their ass deserves respect.

[Me.]

16. I Saw From In A Debate On C-span

last week and he struck me as rather arrogant, smug and self satisfied.

[Cheswick2.0]

17. he struck me as a republican

an ignorant oen

[Me.]

27. I Can See That!

especially when he'd lean back in his chair and push his stomach out after putting someone down. I also thought he had a tendency to be dismissive of the people who were asking questions.

[Cheswick2.0]

47. yup

I noticed that move too. It was angry and dismissive and defensive all at the same time. Let's face it, this guy is making money for pulling the democratic party right. He knows what he is doing. It's too bad some democrats haven't figured out his aggenda yet.

[jellybelly]

76. hate Moore

I personally don't care for Moore. He's brilliant and a good filmaker but he's an ass. Since he pisses off the Repugs so much there is no chance the democratic party could, or should, ignore him.

[UpsideDownFlag]

21. you know something's wrong when the DLC is being used for FAUX

propaganda.

[Supersedeas]

49. nail on the freaking head

[ShaneGR]

23. I refuse to read anything preceeded by "Fox"

Sorry.

[Eric J in MN]

26. John Kerry is as close to John Kennedy as any Dem. nominee

in 40 years, and it didn't do him any good.

[politicasista]

78. Sadly no.

:cry:

[Guaranteed]

90. Well, he doesn't really have the charm...that was more of a Clinton thing.

[Edgewater_Joe]

29. The DEMOCRATS Are The Part Of Truman/Kennedy, NOT the DLC

They've got it bass-ackwards, as ususal.

From is such a tool -- maybe he can get a job cleaning Zell Miller's spittle off the lenses at FoxLies. It would be appropriate for the head of the Democratic Losers' Committee.

He. Must. Go. NOW!

[Chicago Democrat]

30. Hey DLC! Go fuck yourself! Kucinich and Dean need to be cloned together

Goddamn a liberal needs to win a primary...

If Dean and Kucinich had been one person instead of two.. Splice their genes and create the UBER GENETIC PRESIDENTIAL candidate.

[latteromden]

93. That's like... the best idea ever. Too bad the Republicans would never

allow it.

Still the best idea ever.

[Bush was AWOL]

31. Then they need to go in the direction that Kennedy and Truman went in

which is not their current path. I don't, however, think that Moore would approve of the hawkish attitude of Kennedy, Truman, or even Roosevelt. All 3 of those men would be crucified by Moore followers if they were conducting their foreign policy while Moore had his camera on them. I sincerely hope that whoever is in charge of the party, and has a say so, sends this party back in the direction that FDR started, Truman continued, and JFK would've set in stone had he not been assassinated.

[Krocksice]

32. Where does FDR fit in there?

I think we should be pushing a more socialist agenda to combat the over corporate right wing... I think there's a huge vulnerability there.

[tsuki]

34. Has anyone every heard the RNC criticize Ann Coulter, or Rush

Limbaugh?

[Q]

37. Isn't the issue here that the DLC is using the same tactics as the GOP...

... smear machine to discredit and destroy people with which they disagree? Isn't this the 'politics of personal destruction' that Democrats hate so much about the RWingers?

The "Party of patriotism and security"? Like fighting a 'war against terror' in Iraq? What's patriotic about invading Iraq when those who planned, financed and executed 911 were from SAUDI ARABIA?

Sounds like the DLC wants Dems to join the Bushies in being the Party of Lies and Deceptions.

[Cheswick2.0]

45. yes that is the point and some people on this board need to wake up

The DLC is the worst of the DINO impersonators. I see NO difference these days between them and the republicans.

[Selatius]

38. Al From can claim to be a leader among the Democrats

Whatever. It doesn't mean I have to follow him. I'll walk in the opposite direction. He can say whatever he wants, but I disagree with him.

[sendero]

39. Man...

... these mental midgets are running scared aren't they.

Name one useful thing they have done to help us win the 2004 election.

Coming up blank, aren't we?

[TayTay]

40. Moore's a real democrat

And a muckracker. (And entriely honorable thing to be.) Moore is as hard on Dems when he thinks they are wrong as he is on Rethugs. Moore was not all that thrilled with Clinton and spoke out about it. The DLCers don't like that and don't like Moore not being a totally loyal team player. They fear him, so they want to knock him out.

Times have changed. Michael Moore brought a lot of attention and interest to the Dems. He should not be kicked out, but he should be reconized as a force for good. It should also be noted that Moore is going to continue to pursue his own agenda and that agenda may not always reflect well on Dems. Most of us don't mind that. So do.

[Fleurs du Mal]

41. There is no war

and the DLC doesn't represent the Democratic tradition. Next.

[Willy Lee]

42. Why the hell do they embrace coulter and limbaugh

and "we" are ashamed of Mike Moore? Damnit- I wish this party would get a spine and STAND UP for what we believe.

I love Mike Moore!

[Me.]

48. Exactly! n/i

[leesa]

44. So why is the DLC the party of Ronald Reagan and Bush??

Moore represents Truman and Kennedy far more than these RW wimps.

[Norquist Nemesis]

46. Oh, puhleeze!!! The ONLY reason this is being discussed by

Democratic "leaders" is because they keep listening and responding to the God damned Republicans!! Michael Moore only becomes an "issue" when they start responding to the attacks by running away and looking like sniveling cowards! Idiots!

We need to send these guys some selective ear plugs for Christmas!

[Hell Hath No Fury]

50. Fuck Al From without lube...

He can kiss my Democratic ass.

HE AND HIS ILK are the true dangers to the Party, not folks like Michael Moore, Dennis Kucinich, the war protestors or anyone else he has chosen to attack as un-Democratic/un-American.

WOULD SOMEONE PLEAE DRIVE A FUCKING STAKE THROUGH THESE IDIOTS??

[Name removed]

51. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Forkboy]

56. well,that makes sense

:crazy:

[IrateCitizen]

59. Please explain your ridiculous and inane assertion

In what ways did Michael Moore help Republicans?

:crazy:

[Forkboy]

60. A search of his posting history will explain all

:)

[IrateCitizen]

61. Thanks. I've seen that now too.

I hope he/she enjoys his/her stay here while it lasts.

[Name removed]

62. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Willy Lee]

63. Wow... I think you are on the wrong board.

[Forkboy]

65. I know she is

[crasmane]

52. Time for a point by point attack.

Democrats have been asking themselves whether Michael Moore’s high profile during the campaign might not have done them more harm than good.

Sounds like "some people say . . ."
Which Democrats? When? Where? Why?

Al From (search), head of Bill Clinton’s Democratic Leadership Council told a gathering at the National Press Club: "This party has to be the party of Harry Truman and John Kennedy, not the party of Michael Moore. Michael Moore does not represent the Kennedy or Truman tradition in the Democratic Party of patriotism and security.”

We don't need the Kennedy or Truman tradition.
These are different times, fascism is a direct threat to the Constitution.

The New Republic's Peter Beinart (search) had a more stinging rebuke: "The problem with Michael Moore is, he doesn't believe there is a war on terrorism … This is a guy who doesn't basically believe in American power or American national security. He's a problem."

No there isn't a war on terrorism.
It's a defense-contractor, Pentagon free-for-all.
The State Department has been nullified.
Where there is neoconservative fascism, there is no national security.
I want my country back.
I believe in the power of the American government to commit crimes against humanity. Bush made me believe that.
I also believe in the power of the American government to make itself sovereign and usurp the people. It has done that.
I don't believe in American power because I haven't seen it. When the people overthrow the neoconservative gov & force its supporters in the media along with all its members into the ICC to face war crimes trials, I'll believe in it.
I don't believe in American national security. Look at the infrastructure of this country and you won't either.


So what does Michael Moore think? Not surprisingly, he thinks Michael Moore is good for the Democrats, and so are his movies.

No direct quote actually saying this.
Again the reporter is just waltzing on as if he can read minds.

In a meeting with Hollywood Democrats on December 6th, Moore argued that Democrats would have suffered greater losses had it not been for him: "Fahrenheit 9/11 prevented a Bush landslide. Why, interviews of Republicans leaving the movie theaters showed that more than 30 percent would tell their friends to see the movie."

I believe that too, because of the many attempts to stifle public access to the film. The house in my town did not run F-911 until there had been considerable public outcry this summer.
Even republican observers at the time of its release conceded that the film would have a strong impact on public opinion. No quotes from them here. Bad reporting. Slipshod to say the least.

[mattclearing]

106. This is idiotic. Truman was a populist JUST LIKE Michael Moore.

The DLC continue their slide into irrelevance. Don't buy their snake oil. If we ignore them and erect a true opposition to the other side, we still have a chance of winning.

Doom waits for us if we continue to let the DLC guide our politics.

[ernstbass]

53. MM can speak for me!!!!!

[DinahMoeHum]

54. Al From and the DLC can blow it out their fat-cat asses.

Three-time losers.

Three strikes and you're out, kids.

Bring on an ass-kicker like Howard Dean.

:kick:

[rniel]

55. Michael Moore is a fucking Hero

To working class americans who are getting screwed. No wonder the Corporate DLC doesn't like him. He's working for their destruction basically. And so am I.

[robbedvoter]

58. MM speaks for me - therefore this "middle class" country club cannot

accept him. he's too- well, working class - and Frum&comp decided a long time ago to give those away to W faith based crap.
They got a handful of "me first" moderate in exchange and now they are winners (in the findraising contest).
On elections they gave up long time ago (at least since jan 6, 2001)

[robcon]

64. Al From is right

I believe Kerry would have won with one little Sister Souljah moment: denounce Moore's description of the Iraqi insurgents (the ones killing Americans and Iraqis) as analogous to Minute Men.

Many Democrats seem to think the big issue for the Democratic Party is to get Democrats to vote for the Democratic candidate. I don't think so.

With the electorate divided into thirds - one-third Democrats, one-third Republicans, and one-third independents - the battle is mostly for the middle third, the independents. The DLC has a right-on strategy to attract that key part of the electorate.

[crasmane]

66. I've written this once, & I'll write it again:

The DLC is a neocon plant.

[IrateCitizen]

68. Both you and Al From are dead wrong, robcon

I suggest you read the following article by David Sirota, a top advisor for Mark Schweitzer's successful populist campaign for Montana Governor...

http://www.thenation.com/docprint.mhtml?i=20050103&s=sirota

Polls on every major issue from health care to corporate influence to taxes show that the progressive populists are on the side of the public opinion, and that the DLC is not.

[geek tragedy]

67. Both are right. The DLC are preachy prigs, and Moore is a liability.

Kerry totally should have gone off on Moore over the disgraceful "Minutemen" comment.

The Dems should make it clear that they stand by their traditional values of protecting the little guy and seeking justice, but also make it clear that Michael Moore and his followers have no influence whatsoever.

[proudbluestater]

72. Let's compare these two, then

Who has done more for the Democratic Party? Al From or Michael Moore? No freaking CONTEST.

Who the hell IS Al From and why doesn't he go back under his rock?He's part of the corporate wing of the Democratic Party. Obviously he does not speak for actual VOTERS.

There was unprecedented grass roots participation in this election. Thanks TO the grass roots Kerry was able to stay even with Bush in fundraising. Thanks, also, in large part to Michael Moore's efforts on college campuses all over the country. This party needs STRONG voices to counteract the weak ones like Pelosi who think the DNC should be headed by a pro-life Democrat. More milquetoast people like she and Terry McLoser this party does NOT need.

Screw Al From and the entire DLC.

[lojasmo]

73. LOJASMO: The DLC does not represent the DEMOCRATIC tradition N/T

[kamqute]

74. Y'mean the one about killing innocents?

And disrespecting other peoples' cultures

[Walt Starr]

75. The DLC represent the Nixon and Bush tradition

Fuckers.

[journalist3072]

77. Michael Moore

The DLC should be THANKING Michael Moore, not dumping on him. He has done an incredible service to this country, by exposing Bush.

I will never forget when I went to see F 911 at the movies. I cried in the theater, and after the movie was over, everyone stood up and clapped.

I have never been to a movie where everyone stood up and clapped at the end.

[bling bling]

79. What the????

Is Michael Moore an elected Democratic official who is on the payroll of the taxpayer. Last time I checked, he was a United States citizen who freely chooses to use his time and resources to try and expose the truth about this insane Administration.

Al From is simply trying to kiss up to or impress the conservatives once again. Why doesn't he just do the rest of us a favor and WORK for the conservatives if he cares so fucking much about what they think. The DLC does nothing but constantly insult my values and pander to the conservatives.

There are sooooooo many things about the Reblicans and especially about this administration to criticize, and Al From chooses instead to focus his criticism toward a Democrat. Unbelievable. Just unbelievable.

[Revolucionario83]

80. Fuck The DLC

[FightinNewDem]

83. My, you are an articulate chap.

[Charon]

81. DLC

A person could make a strong case that the DLC does not represent the
tradition of Presidents Roosevelt, Truman or Kennedy.

[GOPBasher]

82. Yeah, the DLC really knows how to win elections.

They won with Clinton, but he was far more progressive than they're going now. When Al Gore was playing the safe, DLC, campaign, he was 15% - 20% behind in the polls. When he went to a populist strategy, he closed the gap and won the popular vote (and we know he should've won the electoral college). What has the DLC done to us lately. I DO believe we need to compromise, and someone who is leftist on every single issue cannot win an election, but they don't know where or when to compromise. Why do we need to compromise on NAFTA, for example? Is THAT why we lose elections? That's absurd. We've been losing because of the Christian Right movement, so if there's some compromise to be done, it's on social issues. We do NOT need to pander to corporations.

[FightinNewDem]

85. Actually, they do

"Yeah, the DLC really knows how to win elections."

Mary Landrieu
Blanche Lincoln
Mark Pryor
Dianne Feinstein
Tom Carper
Evan Bayh
Joe Lieberman
Ken Salazar
Hillary Rodham Clinton
Ed Rendell
Janet Napolitano
Jennifer Granholm
Jim Doyle
Mark Warner
John Kerry
John Edwards
Bob Graham
Bill Nelson
Bob Kerrey
Kathleen Blanco
Mike Michaud
Ellen Tauscher
Jane Harmon
Bob Menendez
Adam Smith
Ron Kind
Tom Allen
Brian Baird
Jim Cooper
Ed Case
Dennis Cardoza
Rahm Emmanuel
Zoe Lofgren
Steve Israel
Gregory Meeks
Tom Udall
Mike Ross
John Tanner
David Wu
Vic Snyder
Mike Honda
Mike Easley
Kathleen Sebelius
Martin O'Malley
Michael Coleman
Bart Peterson
Kwame Kilpatrick
Kent Conrad
Herb Kohl
Debbie Stabenow
Tim Johnson
Maria Cantwell

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

86. The DLC did not do jack shit to get Di Fi elected

She rode to fame in the eyes of Californians after she took over the SF mayor's office...she also had gotten huge name identification in her gubernatorial race...the fact that her name appears on some piece of literature means nothing.. I know...I was on her original campaign team for senate

[GOPBasher]

87. A lot of those people are pretty left.

If you consider John Kerry and Hillary Clinton to be centrist, great! I see them as being fairly left, even if they might consider themselves to be part of the DLC. And then someone like Evan Bayh, even though he's too conservative for my tastes, I know that's the best we can possibly do in a state like Indianna. And I like Mark Warner, Ed Rendell, and even Joe Lieberman.

I'm actually very pragmatic. I don't want to go all the way to the left and lose elections forever. But my problem with the DLC is, they compromise on dumb things that have nothing to do with winning and losing election. We lost this election because of social issues, so that's where we need to compromise. Why compromise on NAFTA? That's not something people vote on, in general, so a candidate is free to do whatever he wants with it. They're like that on a lot of issues.

I don't think we need to pander to corporations. We can be populists, even if we try to grab the center.

[Guaranteed]

91. LOL okay now list all of their candidates, including Congressmen,

that have been kicked out since 1994.

[wyldwolf]

92. fair comparison, so how about a list of non-DLC dems...

..that have been kicked out since 1994?

[rman]

98. yeah they help repubs win elections... n/t

-

[Name removed]

84. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[itzamirakul]

88. From where cometh Al From's salary and the...

salaries of the rest of the people who work at DLC?

Do those salaries come out of the corporate donations made to the DLC or do they have a private donor for salaries?

How much is Al From's annual salary?

[FightinNewDem]

102. Robert Borosage?

From where cometh Robert Borosage's salary?

From where cometh Jesse Jackson, Sr.'s salary?

Who funds the Center for American Progress?

Who funds People for the American Way?

Who funds NARAL?

[itzamirakul]

112. Oh, are all of them out there

demonizing Democrats and democratic supporters the same way Al From is doing? I think the names and groups you mentioned are Democratic supporters not demonizers.

Why isn't From out there demonizing Bush and the Republicans instead of demonizing Michael Moore who did the work that the stupid DLC SHOULD have been doing? Why isn't he demonizing Bush's Social Security initiatives or demonizing the fact that so many Americans do not have health coverage?

Again, where does his salary come from and how much does he earn annually? If his money is coming from the DLC, those of us who donated to that organization have the right to know.

[MrBenchley]

89. Give 'em Hell Harry would have told From to cram it....

And it might be remembered that the New Republic not so long ago was actually making up magazine stories to support a right wing point of view...

"New Republic editor Charles Lane fired associate editor Stephen Glass on May 8, saying that a recent article by Glass about computer hackers was "a hoax." After further examination, the New Republic said that Glass had fabricated all of 6 and parts of 21 articles. He had written a total of 41 articles for the magazine over the last three years. Glass' lawyer, Gerson Zweifach, said that his client had confirmed the findings (Howard Kurtz, "New Republic Fires Writer Over `Hoax,'" Washington Post, May 11, 1998, p. D1; Robin Pogrebin, "Rechecking a Writer's Facts, A Magazine Uncovers Fiction," New York Times, June 12, 1998, p. A1).
Glass, 25, is a free-lance writer who had contracts with GQ, Rolling Stone, Harper's and George magazines. The magazines discontinued their contracts with Glass and conducted investigations of their own. He was attending law school in 1997-1998 at nights. Glass graduated from the University of Pennsylvania. He worked as a staffer for the Heritage Foundation before starting at the in the New Republic in 1995."

http://www.ndsn.org/mayjun98/netnews5.html

[Clarkie1]

94. "Dissent is the highest form of patriotism" - Wes Clark

BLITZER: I've got to tell you, Michael, I was pretty surprised. Why do you like Wesley Clark?


MOORE: First of all, I like him as a human being. I think he's a very decent and honorable person. I trust him. He seems very down to earth. And I like where he comes from. And, most of all, I think, as "The New York Times" pointed out last week, he's actually slightly to the left of Dean.

And this is something I think a lot of people don't realize, especially probably a lot of young people. Women, African-Americans, labor people, should really take a close look at this guy, because I did and I really liked what I saw.

[NYCGirl]

110. "Dissent is the highest form of patriotism" — Thomas Jefferson

NT

[Placebo]

95. why Why WHY would anyone get their news from FOX?

:puke: This "article" is shit.

[T Town Jake]

97. Well, the DLC is right. As has been proven...

...just recently, on Nov. 2nd. Their analysis is correct; what's the problem? :shrug:

[banjoman]

100. new party needed

the democratic party has become so fractured that the best solution may be to look to the north. canada has a conservative party, liberal party, and new democrat party. take a look at the web sites and figure out where the dems would best fit. democrat does not equal socialist, but the direction that michael moore and his crew are dragging the party will never place it in middle america where the (electoral) votes are.

[banjoman]

99. michael moore

he is to dems, what pat buchanan was to reps. michael moore is the crazy uncle in the attic, that is typical of the far edge of the party. dems would be better off telling him and his ilk to go **** themselves and not letting him speak as the "voice of the party"

[Q]

101. Moore has never presumed to speak for the party...

...which is what makes this whole thing absurd. The ONLY reason he is a target of the Neocons and Neodems is because he has exposed them for the charlatans they are.

Moore exposed the underbelly of the corporate beast running our government and starting wars for profit and empire.

The Neodems are especially afraid of those they call the 'far edge' or 'fringe' of the party. This 'fringe' is all that remains of the once progressive Democratic party...the only thing that stands in the way of the Neodems plan to join with the Neocons and destroy the last remnants of the New Deal and any program that benefits the people instead of corporations.

[Bridget Burke]

103. Bullshit

Michael Moore is not a leader of the Democratic Party but his issues align with many of the best issues we're supposed to stand for. Like economic justice & not starting unnecessary wars.

And he makes Republicans scream like stuck pigs. The louder they scream, the more I say "Go, Michael!"

(By the way, the current meme is "Christmas Under Attack By Godless Liberals"--"Michael Moore is Too Far Left" is so last week!)

[IronLionZion]

104. Well, we do need more Truman/Kennedy democrats

those guys said what they believed and believed what they said. It's nice when a leader speaks plainly and doesn't come across as an out of touch flip flopper (like John Kerry).

[CWebster]

105. If you picked up on any of the new DLC buzzwords -

Echoed by the editor of the "New Republic" --it is the "Islamic totalitarianism" angle that the DLC parades like a contemporary McCarthyism-searching for the new evil commie under the bed.

[satori]

107. The DLC is right

I don't usually have anything that I can agree with concerning the DLC but I agree with them on this issue. I personally think Moore is a Republican Rove plant. Here is why. Back in 2000 the Republican Party Rove gave more money to the Moore Nader campaign to run Nader campaign ads critical of Gore in swing states then Nader spent on his own ads.

Moore was one of the principle soldiers in getting out the anti-liberal message concerning Gore,over at Indymedia in 2000 if not Moore himself then thousands and thousands now millions that are on his mailing list that are anti-Semitic, anti-liberal and anti-liberal Democrat.

I just did a brief Google on Moore and sure enough he supported Arafat a KGB-backed terrorist and Moore is on the Jewish Defense league's Watch list http://www.jdl.org/position/moore.shtml because of his support of Arafat and the terrorist organization the PLO. http://www.geocities.com/munichseptember1972/the_kgb_man.htm

The Jewish Journal also has an article that says that Conyers and others such as Moore I would guess give anti-Semitic messages to those that want to join the anti-war demos.
http://www.jewishjournal.com/home/preview.php?id=9576

I knew I had a reason to be critical about this so called liberal great hope for the dissent movement and the liberal Democrats. Liberals such as myself don't make deals with people that Moore supports and because they think they know better then me how to protest.

Dissent for me comes from a long tradition of opposing anti-Semitism, from my research of such pacifists as Franz Jägerstätter, whom was an Austrian Christian executed for his refusal to serve in the armies of the Third Reich. See http://elvis.rowan.edu/~kilroy/JEK/08/09.html

I will not just give up some of the very principles that caused me to become a pacifist because of some populist Icon like Moore on the left whom supports the 20th centuries most infamous terrorist Arafat and the PLO. http://www.geocities.com/munichseptember1972/the_kgb_man.htm

[Capn Sunshine]

109. can I have some of what you're smokin'?

Jeese, Rove is a boob. An incompetentunpricipled fool with tons of psychologiocal baggage.

It's just that compared to OUR GUYS, he looks like a frikkin' genius.
We just need to find new guys.
Trust me, the Emperor has no clothes.

[Capn Sunshine]

108. No one cares about the DLC any more

except a band of posters in cyberspace

The ideas that they espouse are out of the mainstream, and anyway, they were more a social vehicle,wine and cheese parties, speaking from personal experience.

I've been a member since 1992, and they went south the second they tried to become K Street brokers.

They really don't matter.

[roguevalley]

111. Yes he does. He speaks truth to bs. Those idiots. They need to

shut the hell up!