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MR. RUSSERT: Let’s turn to Iraq... SEN. EDWARDS: Yes. MR. RUSSERT: ...an issue very much on the minds of the American people, and I want to refer you to something you said in September of this year, Senator, and get your reaction to it: “We have young men and women in a shooting gallery over right now. It would be enormously irresponsible for any of us not to do what’s necessary to support them. ...I will vote for what needs to be there to support our troops that are on the ground.” The president asked for $87 billion to support those troops, money for body armor, armed Humvees, and you voted against it. Why? SEN. EDWARDS: Because, Tim, I said from the very beginning that in order for this operation to be successful—and remember, I supported the resolution. I did think Saddam was a serious threat, one that needed to be dealt with. But I said over a year ago that for this to be successful, it needed to be an international effort, and there needed to be a clear plan. The president came to the Congress without either of those things, without a clear long-term plan for success, still just an American occupation. And my view was we needed to send a clear message to the president that we had to change course. I do support, I stand by what I said there. I do support money for the troops. I support us playing a significant role in the reconstruction. What I won’t do is give this president a blank check to continue with a policy that I think has failed. MR. RUSSERT: But if every other senator voted the way you did, there would be no body armor for our troops, no armed Humvees. What would happen then? SEN. EDWARDS: What would happen then is the next day, the president would be back to the Congress with a different plan. He would come to us, he would respond to the Senate and the House saying to him, “The Congress of the United States says your plan and what you’re doing in Iraq is not working.” None of us would allow our troops to not get what they needed to do. But we can’t say to this president, “Yes, here’s $87 billion. You can come back next year and ask for another 100; the following year, another 100,” without giving us some indication, Tim, that you’re going to change course and take the American face off this operation, internationalize it, which is the single -most critical component that’s missing. MR. RUSSERT: Your home state paper, The Charlotte Observer, had this observation. “Edwards’ ‘No’ Vote Will Alter Position, Candidacy Requires Distance From Costly War, Other Liabilities. ...this particular vote—a ‘no’ on President Bush’s $87 billion request for efforts in Iraq—has become a linchpin in bid to revitalize his lagging campaign for president. It’s also the latest example of Edwards’ distancing himself from a few of his own previous ‘yes’ votes—on the Iraq war the Patriot Act...that have since become unpopular with Democratic primary voters.” SEN. EDWARDS: My response? Not true. What I have done on this $87 billion is perfectly consistent with what I’ve said from the very beginning. Tim, it would have been wrong—it’s fine for all the Democratic presidential candidates to criticize George Bush about his failed policy in Iraq right now, but this was a chance where I had to stand up and do something. If I had voted yes, my view is all that criticism would have just been words. I think I had to stand behind what I was saying, say this policy in Iraq is not working, and we have to change course. MR. RUSSERT: What specifically would you do? The United Nations has pulled out of Iraq. The Red Cross has pulled out of Iraq. The president has gone to the French, the Germans and the Russians, they’ve all said “no.” What would you do differently? SEN. EDWARDS: But the problem, Tim, is the president goes to them and asks for assistance, but he’s completely unwilling to relinquish control. That’s the critical thing that’s missing from this process. What I would do, to answer your question specific ally, is I would turn over the Iraqi civilian authority to the United Nations tomorrow. You’re right. We’d have to convince them to take that responsibility. But I believe that could be done if, in fact, we went and talked to them, told them we’re going to relinquish our control over what’s happening there. The second thing is I would make this a NATO security force instead of just an American security force. This gets to be a fairly simple thing at the end of the day. For this operation to be perceived both by the Iraqi people and people in that region of the world as one that they can respond to and embrace, it’s going to have to be two things. One, an international effort, and two, an international effort that’s moving toward Iraqi self-governance. MR. RUSSERT: As you know, the French could veto any United Nations involvement. Any nation that’s a member of NATO could veto NATO involvement. SEN. EDWARDS: Sure. MR. RUSSERT: And, in fact, the French have been rather insistent, they do not want to participate in this from day one. If they did that, what would you do then? You’re in the Oval Office. The U.N. and NATO have said “no.” Do you withdraw U.S. troops? SEN. EDWARDS: Well, I don’t accept that proposition. The answer is, first of all, we have a responsibility there. I believe it’s a shared responsibility, one that we need to embrace along with the rest of the world. I would never suggest that America could simply leave, take our troops out and walk away from that responsibility. I don’t believe that. But I also believe if we were—also, let me be realistic about this. Because this president has done things the way he has, this is not easy. I’m not naive about this. I understand if this had been done months ago, the likelihood of success would be much higher. But I still believe if this case were made the way it needs to be made to the United Nations, to NATO—and, for example, I think the members of the United Nations and NATO want this operation to be successful. They have a vested interest in this region of the world being stable for world peace, for their own stability. So I think there’s a great chance of being successful. But it would have been much easier if we had done it a long time ago. MR. RUSSERT: In the interim, Senator John McCain, the Republican from Arizona, Senator Joe Biden, Democrat from Delaware, are saying, “We need more American troops in Iraq. Our guys are being attacked 30 times a day. We have to go after the insurgence in the Sunni triangle. Let’s send more American troops.” Do you agree? SEN. EDWARDS: I understand what John McCain’s saying. He’s looking at a security situation on the ground there that’s very hazardous for our troops. Is it possible we need more troops? Of course. Now, I would give some deference to our commanders on the ground there who are saying they don’t need additional troops. The key thing from my perspective is if, in fact, it becomes necessary to bring additional troops in order to provide better security for our troops who are there, I think those troops need to be international. I don’t think it necessarily requires that we bring American troops to this effort-additional American troops. MR. RUSSERT: The Turks wanted to send troops. They’ve been told “no.” Where would you find the other troops? SEN. EDWARDS: Well... MR. RUSSERT: As long as the French, the Germans, the Russians say “no,” where are you going to find them? SEN. EDWARDS: But the Turks, Tim, that’s a perfect example of what’s gone wrong with this operation and what the administration has done wrong. They went to the Turks, they asked for troops; the Turks said eventually they were willing to give the troops, but they hadn’t cleared this and worked this out diplomatically with the Iraqi people. That ended up being the problem with trying to bring Turkish troops in. I really believe that if—and, again, being realistic, this won’t be easy, but I really believe if we made this case to the United Nations, to NATO, to our friends and allies, that we can put an international face on this operation and we can get others to participate. Now, I’m not suggesting we won’t continue to need to have a serious presence there. We will. There’s no doubt about that. MR. RUSSERT: Will you recommend that the president go to the French and apologize for the way he’s treated them? SEN. EDWARDS: No. No. What I would recommend is that we as a nation go to the French, the Germans, all of our friends and say, “This is important. It’s important to the security of the world. It’s important for that region of the world’s success over the long term. We have the real potential of having a foothold for democracy in a part of the world where one’s desperately needed where the only democracy now is Israel. We have the chance for having democracy in an Arab country which is obviously important for precedence purposes.” So what I would say to them is, “We need you. We need your help. And we’re not asking you just to participate and follow our lead. We’re asking you to sit at the tape, have a decision-making authority and take responsibility with us for moving this forward.” MR. RUSSERT: And if they say “no,” we are there alone. SEN. EDWARDS: Yeah, but I don’t accept that. I don’t accept that they’ll say “no” if, in fact, we give them some decision-making authority and give them a seat at the table. MR. RUSSERT: Let’s talk about the lead-up to the war and what happened, what you and the Senate were told, and why you voted the way you did. On October 10th of 2002, you put out this press release: “Senator John Edwards supported a resolution poised for final passage that would authorize President Bush to use military force to eliminate the threat posed by Saddam Hussein’s weapons of mass destruction. ... ‘I believe that the risk of inaction are far greater than the risks of action... We must achieve the central goal of disarming Iraq. ... We cannot trust Saddam Hussein, and we would be irresponsible to do so.’” In March on the 15th, four days before the war, you went to California and spoke to Democrats out there, and you raised the whole possibility of a nuclear threat from Saddam Hussein. Let’s listen: (Videotape, March 15, 2003): SEN. EDWARDS: I believe that Saddam Hussein is a serious threat and I believe he must be disarmed including the use of military force if necessary. We cannot allow him to have nuclear weapons. (End videotape) MR. RUSSERT: Senator, you have said that you thought that Saddam Hussein could have nuclear weapons within six to nine months. What did you base that on? SEN. EDWARDS: Over a decade of efforts of Saddam Hussein to gain nuclear capability. As you know, Tim, I serve on the Senate Intelligence Committee and there’s a significant accumulative body of evidence about his efforts over an extended period of time to get nuclear capability, and I might add-you heard the booing in the background. I will say that I do—and I’ve continued—you asked me about the $87 billion earlier. I think it is enormously important for any candidate for president of the United States to be consistent and stand behind what they believe in no matter who their audience is and I knew when I said—I brought this issue up. I wasn’t asked about it, at the California Democratic Convention. I raised it myself because my view was these people, even though I knew would disagree with me, deserved to know where I stood on this issue. MR. RUSSERT: Do you regret your vote in giving George Bush in effect a blank check for the war in Iraq? SEN. EDWARDS: No, I voted for what I believed was in the best security interests of the American people. MR. RUSSERT: Where are the weapons of mass destruction that you spoke about? Biological, chemical, and a nuclear threat within six or nine months—Where’s the evidence of that? SEN. EDWARDS: Well, that’s a serious—that’s a very good question. What we know is that a lot of what the intelligence and the information we were given before the vote on the congressional resolution has not been found, has not been found on the ground. Which means we, those of us who not only are candidates for president, but those of us in the Congress, we have an enormous responsibility here, which is to find out why is there a discrepancy between the information we were given beforehand and what we’ve now found. Did, in fact, somebody misrepresent what was there? Did, in fact, somebody exaggerate what was there? Is this just a failure in intelligence? All those are important questions because if either of the first two are true, we have to hold responsible and accountable the people who did it. If the latter is true, it’s enormously important going forward. I mean, right now, Tim, you were asking earlier about the security situation on the ground in Iraq. One of the critical things that we’re missing in trying to be successful in providing security is we don’t have an adequate intelligence operation in Iraq right now. We need to strengthen that operation. So what went wrong before the congressional resolution, and why did it happen, and how do we make sure that it doesn’t happen in the future because we depend, not only on our military operations, but in our policy-making, on the information that’s given to us by the intelligence community. It has to work. MR. RUSSERT: There were dissents with the intelligence community, the National Intelligence Estimate, which, as a member of the Intelligence Committee you see, had this from the State Department. “...The activities we have detected do not...add up to a compelling case that Iraq is currently pursuing what” the ” would consider to be an integrated and comprehensive approach to acquire nuclear weapons.” Why do you believe that? And why weren’t you more demanding of the administration to provide evidence that their notion of a nuclear threat was real? SEN. EDWARDS: Because you can’t look at any isolated piece of information, Tim. You have to look at what Saddam Hussein had been doing over the course of a decade. I mean, there was a long and very powerful body of evidence that this was a brutal, sadistic dictator who had been doing everything in his power to acquire weapons of mass destruction, and, ultimately, his goal was to have nuclear capability. And that would have completely changed the stability of that region of the world. And I’m—I was convinced then, I’m convinced now, that for a long period of time he was trying to acquire nuclear capabilities. MR. RUSSERT: But if we cannot find the biological or chemical weapons, or evidence of an advanced nuclear program, what was the threat and why did we have to go to war when we did? SEN. EDWARDS: The threat was that this was a man who we knew was going to do everything in his power to acquire nuclear capability. And he was a different and distinct, unique kind of threat, because of his history, because of having started a war. We know that over a long period of time we made the effort, whether he, in fact, has them, had them at the time the war began or not, we know that over a long period of time he had been trying to acquire that capability. It is an obvious and serious threat to the stability of that region of the world. And Saddam Hussein, Tim, with nuclear capability, completely changes things. MR. RUSSERT: The French were saying at the time of the vote in the United Nations “Let’s give inspections a few more months, and if you, Mr. President Bush, do that, we will then go along with you, ultimately, in fact, if Saddam does not cooperate.” In hindsight should the president have gone along with the French and allowed inspections to continue? SEN. EDWARDS: Well, we don’t—those of us who have responsibility for making these enormously important decisions, we don’t have the benefit of hindsight. I mean, that’s a great luxury, looking back now. I did what I thought was right at the time. I still believe it was right. We’ve had almost 400 young Americans lose their lives in a cause that I think is important. Saddam Hussein is gone. That region of the world, if we pursue the right policy, can be much more stable than it was before he came there. And I will not say to the mothers and fathers of those young men and women who lost their lives that it wasn’t important because I think it was enormously important, and I think they deserve to know that. MR. RUSSERT: So President Bush was right in invading Iraq in March? SEN. EDWARDS: Well, you know, I didn’t make the decision about the timing. The president of the United States made the decision about the timing. What I voted on... MR. RUSSERT: But his policy’s right? SEN. EDWARDS: His policy about going to war at that time? MR. RUSSERT: Going to war at that time. SEN. EDWARDS: I believe, based upon—I voted for the resolution. I stand by that decision. You know, whether, if I had been president of the United States, I would have done this exactly like him, probably not, you know? Because if I had been in a decision-making position, I would have made more of an effort to build a coalition over a much longer period of time because, as I’ve said from the beginning, I think having this be an international effort was enormously important. But, having said that, I still stand by what I did.
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