The Republican Party is so "anti-Christian"...

[kentuck]

Hypocrites that pray in public, professing what strong Christians they are, when Jesus said plainly to go into the closet to pray. Do not make a public display of your religion.

And as far as a rich man going to heaven, it is as difficult as getting a camel thru the "eye of the needle". Of course, the "eye of the needle" was not a real needle but a very close and tight opening in a building near Jerusalem. But, difficult just the same. And Republicans seem to all want to squeeze thru that eye of the needle.

They praise taxcuts for the wealthy and the creation of wealth. Jesus was not wealthy. He said, Blessed are the poor. The Republicans say "Screw the poor". As the poor donkey is stuck in the ditch, they walk on by as if it is none of their concern. And Jesus advised to help the donkey from the ditch, even if on the Sabbath. Samaritans, they are not.

And as they see poor people without health coverage, losing jobs, needing help, they walk to the other side of the street, pretending not to notice. They are too busy wiping the dust off the slippers of their rich friends. And they call themselves "Christians"...

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

1. Time to erase tax exempt status for churches.

They're able to continue the ruse because churches continue to endorse Republicans and their agenda. Strip their tax status - they're political entities.

[texastoast]

5. Not all churches are pro-Republican

My United Methodist bishop came out against Bush's war. Bush professed to be a Methodist, but I understand he has been attending an Episcopalian church now.

However, if any church steps outside and gets political, yeah, buddy, buh-bye tax exempt status.

[Lone Pawn]

2. That 'eye of the needle' crap is a RW theory

completely unsubstantiated. You might as well say that "Love your neighbor as yourself" is a reference to a brothel in Bethlehem that Jesus informed his disciples to enjoy when they felt like pleasuring themselves.

[ourbluenation]

3. and look how many registered republicans...

are not even remotely rich - just stupid wanna-be followers...

[forgethell]

6. Everything depends on context

Matthew 19

24And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

25When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved?

26But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.

[RobertSeattle]

4. Ran across the Republican Ten Commandments while googling...

http://www.glennston.com/antibush/ten_rep_command.htm

I. Thou shalt talk about Christian principles, but not live by them

II. Thou shalt attack opponents personally when you can't win on policies

III. Thou shalt call yourself pro-life, but be in favor of the death penalty

IV. Thou shalt call yourself pro-life, and put guns in the hands of school children

V. Thou shalt give lip service to democracy while taking away civil liberties

VI. Profit is the Lord Thy God, thou shalt not put the people's interest above those of your corporate contributors

VII. Thou shalt make sure fetuses have health coverage, but leave children and babies behind

VIII Thou shalt bear false witness against your opponents and liberals, and demonize them

IX. Thou shalt run on a moderate platform, then enact right-wing policies as soon as possible

X. Thou shalt call the media liberal, so that people forget that the media is owned by corporations with a conservative fiscal agenda

[GOPBasher]

7. LOL Those are good! Thanks for posting that. nt

[Igel]

8. I've always been torn between believing the state should

follow Christ's words and believing in separation of church and state.

If the state is expected to fulfill Christ's commands, and that is the explicit reason being given for government-supported benefits, isn't the Bill of Rights being violated?

A second point: Are we to judge other people as Christians? I don't recall Jesus saying, "Judge others that are not perfect and chasten them, that they may enter the narrow gate and not wrongly say they are my disciples, and that thou mightest properly consider thyself superior and more virtuous."

It's best to make your arguments in secular language.

[kentuck]

9. Point taken...

But I'm not making the point as a "Christian"...just pointing out my observation. Call it judgemental or whatever.

[Igel]

10. No offense intended.

But it's best to avoid sounding like a liberal fundie when criticising conservative fundies. That is, if "liberal fundie" makes any sense whatsoever.

:hi:

[kentuck]

11. Then we choose to not make the point at all...

or make it in another manner, perhaps less effective, less we be called "judgemental"? We liberals have to make those distinctions, don't we? :)

[Igel]

23. Making the point in another manner may make

it weaker, but respectful. I was grumpy and tired (and still am), else I would have worded things a bit less offensively.

I was in a church for a long time that tried to make a moderately schizophrenic point: they and those in closely related churches were "real" Christians, those not in those churches weren't--although they were always careful at the end to say they really couldn't judge. I guess any belief that supposes that others aren't Xian has to say something like the first; the second I regard as necessary Xian humility.

I prefer to try to understand other people's reasons for interpreting texts the way they do. It's always possible I'm mistaken. On the other hand, I frequently learn something in figuring out why I don't and can't believe the way they do--and I learn how to debate them, rather than call them names. I can afford to do this: I'm not making national policy, and if I take a while to understand why they believe what they do, absolutely nothing outside of myself is affected.

I think my separation of church/state point stands--it's not a tough call.

[kentuck]

24. To make a judgement as to the destination of a person's soul...

is much different from stating that he is a thief, a liar, and a drunk - if those charges are true. Stating facts is different from making a "judgement"...

[Igel]

25. Yes, but

it's possible to say somebody stole; this says nothing about their present moral state, and could be referring to a moment of weakness. If they do it repeatedly, we have better evidence they're a thief. But I don't regard it as a final judgement.

But saying they're a Xian or not presupposes we know their current relation with Christ. Who's a Xian? Can I judge somebody else's motives? I can see what they do, but not why; I can listen to what they say, but not what they don't say. And who gave me the right to judge another man's servant anyway? I strongly objected whenever anybody told me my office manager in student government should be fired; I'd ask what happened, and try to get around the student's opinion; if they insisted she be rebuked, I'd tell them she was my employee, not theirs.

Other people can feel free to do what they want. I was mostly trying to point out the breakdown of the church/state wall that was implicit in the argument the OP made. (But after a while of one person saying they're a Xian and somebody else isn't, I guess I just felt I needed to add my point of view. This doesn't mean the OP isn't Xian, or that Falwell is. Not my call.)

[kentuck]

26. Can a Christian not criticize another Christian ?

Or are Christians exempt from criticism? And can any Christian claim that you are "judging" them - even if you tell the truth about them? Are you then "persecuting" them?

And as a non-Christian, can I say I think their actions and deeds do not resemble the works of a Christian? Can I make that judgment call? Or do I have to walk the perfect path to criticize those that are "born- again"?

[Igel]

28. Yes, a Xian can criticise another Xian.

If I called you a non-Xian (assuming they are), would you be more receptive to me saying that I thought you were unnecessarily rude, or less? That's not criticism. It's saying they're not subject to criticism.

It's not persecution unless you whip them, and they don't like it. I've been called un-Christian by many a folk, and I don't feel persecuted in the least. In some cases, I was relieved that they didn't consider me "one of them." But my judgment on the matter doesn't count in the long run, I believe. For all I know, I'm going to be told they were right. I don't think so, but I'm hardly infallible.

And if you're a non-Xian, you're plausibly subject to the tenets of your faith or philosophy. But having a non-Xian interpret the meaning of Christ's life and behavior is like a Catholic interpreting the meaning of Muhammed's life and behavior. Possibly wrong. Easily beside the point. And certainly ignorable. That's not to say it doesn't happen. It's good for tenure, but not much else.

As I said, you can do what you want. I just got tired of people thinking they're the Judge.

[kentuck]

30. Here comes da judge !

:)

[Skidmore]

13. There's another verse that I haven't been able to locate

which I recall.

Something like: Judge not lest ye be judged by the same measure, pressed down, something, something...

Do you know where that verse is? I've wanted to quote it more than once. Message was that for those who judge they will be judged by the same standard and then some.

[kentuck]

15. And another about removing the log from thine own eye....

But what do you consider "judging" other people? Is telling the truth about hypocrites making a "judgement"? I'm not sure that fits into the Biblical definition? :)

[Skidmore]

18. What I consider judging is not using common sense to

discriminate the utility of a view, but when someone decides that they speak for God in determining whether that person's behavior will condemn him to hell or not. There is also a verse that says that judgment is the purview of God, not man. I interpret that to mean what is in man's purview is to learn to negotiate how to live together peacefully and reasonably. It is not my place to judge your behavior or beliefs as worthy or unworthy. I can judge whether they are truthful or sincere based on observable facts. Maybe I'm splitting hairs or not articulating this well, but there is judgment, and then there is Judgment.

[kentuck]

19. I think that is well said, Skidmore.

:)

[marcologico]

17. Matthew 7:1-2: "Judge not, that ye be not judged.

For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged
And with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again."

[Lindacooks]

22. My favorite verse in the Bible

"Judge not, that you be not judged.

2: For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and the measure you give will be the measure you get.

3: Why do you see the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?

4: Or how can you say to your brother, 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' when there is the log in your own eye?

5: You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother's eye.

Matthew 7:1-5

Part of the Sermon on the Mount.

[Skidmore]

12. The Antichrist Party...

Works for me.

Kinda covers more than one base, too.

[seabeyond]

14. i think i will just start saying that

republican party is so anti christian

oh the faces on people. i can just see

[kentuck]

16. By ye works ye shall be known...

What works are the liberals "known" for? And the conservatives?

[realFedUp]

20. Bush policies are strongly anti-Christian

Jesus would be fighting them as
strongly as he fought the Roman rulers
and their surrogates.

[kentuck]

21. i don't think your comments are "judgemental" at all...

They are factual.

[paineinthearse]

27. It's OK to call at church breakfasts for Syria to be nuked

see http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x3219008

See especially the message from the church office.

[Disturbed]

29. RW so-called Christians have the ethics of scorpions.

Anytime someone proclaims that they are a Christian I immediately suspect that they are trying to rob me of anything I have.

[liberaltrucker]

31. Your Pic.

Is there a way to get a higher res pic of der Fuhrer leaving the church? Reminds me of * invoking religion. Thanks.