How stupid does the media and Rumsfeld think we are? '06 has begun.

[cindyw]

130+ base closings announced.

Base closings affecting Democratic districts as well as republicans ones.

The media says that the base closings are not political for this reason.

The media talks about how certain Repubs will fight to keep bases open.

People think, oh the soldiers will hate Repubs now for the same reason they hated Clinton.

But wait, all might not be as it seems. Next in this fight.

I predict. Repub senators will be successful in "saving" their bases and Dems will be unsuccessful. You can imagine the campaign commercials now in '06.

Repub challengers will run commercials saying how the incumbent is responsible for the economic deterioration of the town (when W has already done that. But they need another reason to blame).

Incumbent Repubs will run commercials saying how they saved the town.

Soldiers and their families will damn Dems and proclaim the sainthood of Repubs. repubs will ignore who started this thing. Voila '06 victory!

We need to be smart and know that this is coming. Don't let people forget it is Repubs suggesting this. Start now or they people will forget. Say it a million times that in the end it will be politics that affects the closures. This way we have a win-win in '06. Either what I have said will happen anyway and people will associate it with politics. It will make people sick. Or they will have to close all the bases and people will hate them for it.

If we do not jump on this now, you'll all see that this is the first shot over the bow for '06.

[Inland]

1. What's the process of "saving" a base?

Majority vote in Congress or what?

[cindyw]

3. I would think that Congress has to approve the closings.

I just heard a news report where they said that every time there are base closings Lott's bases are on the list and he always manages to "save' them.

[Inland]

8. I think congress has to vote to change the recommendations.

but I dont' know.

[ray of light]

37. Well, think of it this way:

Republicans work on campaigning 24/7 365 days a year. We have to work on democracy the same amount of time and work much harder since they own the media too.

This is why I encourage everyone to join the Democracy Cell Project which is a grassroots organization that really helps turn people into activists. We've already started but we need you too. We need people ACTIVE in their local towns and we need them being the media.

Please, join us too.

http://www.democracycellproject.net

[MockSwede]

41. Saving Private Bush

Back room deals. I left you save your base and you vote for Bolton. (snowe and collins in Maine)

[GetTheRightVote]

2. I can not agree with enough, the writing is on the wall

:kick:

[hector459]

4. Olberman should a red/blue map of base gains and losses.

It's so obvious, it's embarrassing. All Keith said was for us to draw our own conclusions. If I can get a link for that map, I will post it.

[FinallyStartingToWin]

9. Any chance you can describe more what the map looked like?

I've heard about it several times now want more of a description :)

[ray of light]

46. Where is that map?

On the Democracy Cell Project, I saw some stats about job employment in Red states improving while the blue states are plummeting.

Democracy is suppose to be about voting without direct repercussions related to who you voted for. That's why our ballots are secret and that's why all former presidents realize they are the president of the red, white, and blue.

Shame on NeoCONS and any moderate Republican who won't stand up and make sure we are being represented fairly!

[K8-EEE]

5. Yes Exactly WHAT A SCAM

You would have to be really stupid to fall for this but unfortunately, they can count of the Freepers...

[MockSwede]

42. save 48 BILLION over 20 years

Heck, Idiot In The White House wants 82 BILLION MORE THIS YEAR for IRAQ. And he cannot find 48 billion for the bases over 2o years????

[Mz Pip]

6. How stupid do they

think we are?????

Well, the Dems continue to lose seats in the House and Senate. We lost the WH AGAIN to an incompetent intellectually lazy corporate appeaser.

How stupid to they think we are? It's a rhetorical question.

Mz Pip
:dem:

[cindyw]

7. By "we", I meant DU. I think it is fairly evident how easily fooled a

large portion of Americans can be.

[Ichiro]

44. It is how ineffective we have become

Stupid isn't a factor, power is and we have little and use it ineffectively.

[Jane Eyre]

10. My thoughts exactly

I've already seen Senator Thune on Crossfire talking about how he will save Ellsworth. Only two bases house the B1B's and one is Ellsworth. If Ellsworth is closed, we have another Pearl Harbor situation with all of the B1B's sitting in one place waiting for an attack. Didn't take long for that to start. Thune will save us not just from a South Dakota base closing, but from another Pearl Harbor.

I also noticed that one of the bases scheduled to be closed is a reserve station in or near the 8th Congressional District in NC, which is Republican Robin Hayes' district. That race should be competitive since it is about 53% Democratic and in fact was Democrat Bill Hefner's seat for a very long time prior to Hayes taking it over. The Republicans bring out the big guns every two years to make sure that it stays in their column. Would not be surprised to see Hayes fighting to save this.

[FreedomAngel82]

11. Something I'm wondering

is why are they closing the bases? Anybody know about this? And especially in a time of "war."

[cindyw]

12. Rumsfeld is trying to stream line the military. Go from stationed military

to a mobile one that is always on the move. In other words. The vast majority of the military would move from conflict to conflict. It seems to be, Rumsfeld's plan assumes a constant state of war.

[erpowers]

26. One Reason

One reason that has been given is to save money. It has been claimed, by the Rumsfeld and the Bush Administration, that closing these bases will save about $48 billion over about 20+ years. There could be other reason, but that is the one I heard.

[chomskysright]

31. I posit that we think about the other possible reasons and the ...

Republicans who saved us is a good candidate. Perhaps we could look at those stated---one is GA----Ft. McPherson: 2 worthless Repuke senators...one Max Cleland...who had the unmitigated gall to slamm Max Cleland's decades long work to the citizens of GA...making fun of the military record of this triple amutee----can you believe that?----and who, on top of ALL of that stole the election with a 14 percent difference from the exit polls.

[cindyw]

13. Also, I've been trying to figure out why the media is focusing on Repubs

saving their bases and Lieberman. Then I realized, Lieberman is likely to lose his seat. I think they made a deal with him, that if he does whatever they want (SS, filibuster, bolton), then they will let him get in on the "saving".

[0007]

22. Probably to offset the 14 bases in Iraq and the ones they plan

on in Uzbekistan and Afghanistan. :shrug:

[cyr330]

14. What do you mean by "we"??

If you mean "us" right here on this blog, I would said that they are grossly mistaken if they think we're stupid. However, if you mean the collective nation, do we even need to go there?

[cindyw]

17. See my reply to #6. :-) nt

[Jane Eyre]

15. Georgia - case in point

I just heard on the news that Atlanta is going to be losing a major military base taking thousands of jobs with it. However, another base in the state, in Cumberland, will be gaining the jobs at its base.

It isn't just red/blue states that are being played with, it is red/blue counties and cities within states. The major divide today isn't between states, it is between urban areas and everything else. Cities are blue, and will keep getting punished by the rightwingers in office.

[cindyw]

18. Oh that's brilliant. I had not even thought of that. Cities are blue.

Starve them and reward the Repub districts. All of this deserves a more careful look at a re/blue map. The one with district break downs.

[chomskysright]

32. good pick up: you're right: Atlanta is blue and Cumberland?I dunno it...

near Columbus? But I saw that one as also closing on the map on the NY Times today, front page.

[Goldmund]

16. You may be just devious enough to have figured them out.

[cindyw]

19. Why thank you!

:evilgrin:

[janx]

20. I think it might be more serious than that.

Over 130 bases?

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

We have a problem.

[Robworld]

21. The Republican party would never close bases for political purposes...

Just kidding.
This strategy fits perfectly into their track record.

http://www.dumdumgoestothecircus.com/
small update

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

24. Exactly..it's where the "Clinton decimated our military" crap came

from...Cheney closes a bunch of bases during Bush 41 and Clinton gets nailed with it

[OzarkDem]

23. Very astute observation

The local RW rag in Cleveland is already trying to pin the job losses in our area on Dennis Kucinich. My guess is Voino will get to be the knight on the white horse because the jobs were sent to Columbus, OH from Cleveland.

Kucinich = Villian
Cleveland Mayor Campbell = Villain
Voinovich = Hero

[erpowers]

25. Letter Writing Campaign

I think it would be a good idea to write letters to our representatives, the White House, and the Pentagon. Then liberal should write letters to the editors of our local papers protesting the base closures. Another way the Democratic legislator could use this to their advantage is to give alternative plans to the base closures. Does anyone think '06 is the reason so many of the base closures are in Democratic areas?

[erpowers]

27. Ellington Field

So in your opinion what is the deal with Ellington Field, which is in Tom Delay's district? Even though it is not being closed it is in danger of losing it fighter jet fleet. So is this an opportunity for Delay to be a hero and win reelection in Houston? Is this an attempt to keep people's minds off his other problem and make them think of how he saved their base?

[Mugsy]

28. Notice that troubled DeLay's district base was cut.

I find it no coincidence that Elligton Field, which is in Tom DeLay's district, is on the list of bases to be closed.

Elligton Field is the only military airfield in Houston. The closest field to the Port of Houston (the third largest/busiest port in the country) as well as NASA Mission Control. Two other fields in Texas, one in El Paso and one in San Antonio are not listed for closure.

Just imagine what it might do for the beleagured DeLay if he "saves Elligton Field and all those jobs".

I *definitely* will be keeping eyes/ears open on that one.

[Zinfandel]

29. I adore perceptive, pre-empt liberal offense ideas and strategy…

Cheers to you!!!

Most around here, have no perception what so ever. They just wait for the next news story and then go on the attack...when its already too late and they react like stupid dogs thrown some bones by their master...In this case...I'm referring to their master as Rove and the republicans.

They always react predictably...

Because they lack perception.

[chomskysright]

30. GREAT proactive, innoculation thinking: INNOCULATE YOURSELF:

there's a notion in psychology, worked out by Meichenbaum, re: 'stress innoculation' which was first used with bone marrow aspiration patients.

It has to do with 'what you can anticipate' and therefore outlines what the possibilites are so you can start to plan on the matter .

This is a strategy useful here, I think: anticipate what they can do; create the possible frame.

[chomskysright]

33. my letter to Senator Chambliss (R-GA) who stole that election from Cleland

Dear Senator Chambliss:

Are you supporting closure of Ft. McPherson, in the southeastern part of Atlanta, where many African-Americans certainly may work----BECAUSE ATLANTA IS A BLUE DISTRICT, SENATOR?

And then, let me guess: you're going to ride in your '06 horse in order to 'save the day' so that people will re-elect you to undoubtedly a truckload of brouhaha?

Senator: I still find it absolutely dishonest and dishonarable what you had to say about triple-amputee Cleland, Dem runner, for the Senate seat in '02----maligning his military record?---a purple heart triple amputee?

We'll be watching you sir. Meantime, you're on : www.democraticunderground.com

Sincerely,

[July]

34. So, how many bases

-have a rep up for reelection in '06

-have a potentially close race

-have a fairly evenly divided electorate

???

My inquiring mind wants to know.

[Donailin]

35. I think you're right

and the thought occurred to me as NPR was discussing it on Diane Reem.

Gotta hand it to Rove, he has all manner of tricks in his pocket.

[ooglymoogly]

36. kick

it only gets more outrageous

[patricia92243]

38. If most the bases are closed, how is Bush going to fight his wars? n/t

[cindyw]

39. Seriously, I can't do it, but someone needs to do a district comparison

in each state. I guarantee it will show my theory. From the analysis we have to start a letter campaign. Then the Dem Reps and Senators have to run town hall meetings in the towns about the strategy. In Dem districts they have to tell the people that this is Bush playing politics with their lives. Just keep pointing out that all of this makes no sense since 911. Then Dems have to go to the Repub districts and hold rallies warning people not to fall for the trick. They also have to make sure people associate the idea with Bush in the first place. That way, if their local repub looks like he is "saving" the town, it looks like there is discord in the Repub party.

[jfdunphy]

40. One example to reinforce the basic point

One who has been through the base-closing cycle before is Fort Monmouth, Eatontown, NJ. After the "DOD study" and the base commission study, the last proposal was to move all the electronics R&D to Ohio.
Without breaking too much of a sweat, local businesses quickly proved how counter-productive a base closing would be. Quite simply, the cost of moving all the infrastructure--ie businesses to supply the fort--would have vastly outweighed any savings. Thus, a net loss to the economy.
A simple freedom of information act request would find out whether the latest recommendation even took into account the finding of that study. If this is an example the type of input that went into the entire base commission study, either they ignored pertinent data (ie this was non-scientific) or (surprise, surprise) this is another intensely political attempt at punishing legislators for "political gain."
By the way, do any of our meterology majors remember how many tornados made their way through Ohio since the last base closing commission study? Personally, I didn't think putting the nation's electronics research into the path of tornados was a particularly sagacious move. But that's just me.
Luckily, this time, the base commission has recommended moving the electronic R&D to around Aberdeen, Md. How much you want to bet the new site will be downwind of the chemical testing area? As they say in mathematics, the numbers may be changed, but the pattern seems constant. Maybe the next base closing commission will propose Yucca Mountain.

[newyawker99]

50. Hi jfdunphy!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[Thor_MN]

47. Don't have to go to the Dustrict level...

The state level is quite clear, Blue states lose over 24 thousand jobs, Red States gain almost 12 thousand jobs.

-2018 California
-8586 Connecticut
91 Delaware
-6496 Distict of Columbia
-298 Hawaii
-2698 Illinois
-6938 Maine
9293 Maryland
491 Massachusetts
125 Michigan
-262 Minnesota
4 New Hampshire
-3760 New Jersey
-1071 New York
-1083 Oregon
-1878 Pennsylvania
531 Rhode Island
56 Vermont
760 Washington
-552 Wisconsin
-24289

2664 Alabama
-4619 Alaska
-550 Arizona
3585 Arkansas
4917 Colorado
2757 Florida
7423 Georgia
-659 Idaho
2197 Indiana
-6 Iowa
3582 Kansas
-3658 Kentucky
-1297 Louisiana
-1678 Mississippi
-3679 Missouri
-124 Montana
-213 Nebraska
1059 Nevada
-2849 New Mexico
-422 North Carolina
-2645 North Dakota
241 Ohio
3919 Oklahoma
709 South Carolina
-3797 South Dakota
1088 Tennessee
6150 Texas
-446 Utah
-1574 Virginia
-251 West Virginia
37 Wyoming
11861

[DrCorday]

48. >> Map of Base Closings.

I've put together a map of the base closings and expansions, nationally. I'm working on simplifying it, cleaning it up, and putting together a map for each state with Congressional district lines.

:: Red Flags indicate base closings
:: Green Flags indicate base expansions, gains

It's sort of hard to read right now, and I'm trying to improve it. This is more to give the visual people out there a general idea of where the supposed bases are. (oh- and sorry about the Alaska issue, it's hard to see.) The map was generated in Microsoft MapPoint using CBS News' complete list of proposed closings.

[djamieg]

43. Bases already closed?

It also would be interesting to search the base closings list for bases already closed.

For example, the Army National Guard Reserve Center, in Thermopolis, WY, is on the current base closings list.

But this facility was decomissioned several years ago and is now being used full time as a kindergarden and early education site.

How many more minor bogus sites are on the list, but just padding it to make it look longer?

[newyawker99]

51. Hi djamieg!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[Auntie Bush]

45. Democrats need to do a study to see just how much money it

REALLY will cost to have these closings. I haven't heard anyone refute Rumsfeld's estimates. I wonder if he's including the costs of all the local businesses that will be ruined? All the incomes lost, all the extra people on unemployment and loss of tax revenue and total devastation to communities. I'm sure the liar has exaggerated
the savings and under estimated the costs. Watch out for a revised estimate. No way do I believe anything he says!

Study number two:

Challenge his reasons WHY each base is necessary to be closed and HOW it will improve our military for the better...and IS it worth the additional cost? How much is it actually going to increase our national DEBT?

If we play our cards right...this could be a wedge issue.

[tx_dem41]

49. Same as it ever was.....Same. As. It. Ever. Was....

--- David Byrne

[Joey Liberal]

52. The repubs will use this to their advantage

Repub senators will be successful in "saving" their bases and Dems will be unsuccessful. You can imagine the campaign commercials now in '06.

Repub challengers will run commercials saying how the incumbent is responsible for the economic deterioration of the town (when W has already done that. But they need another reason to blame).
==========
Great post! Very true.

[Nothing Without Hope]

53. Base closings are VERY political. See this thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x1782877
Thread title: “LAT: Military base closings will shift troops to the South- POLITICS!!!”