Bush's actions indicate he really did steal the election in Ohio...

[kentuck]

There are numerous examples of how Dubya will do anything to "win". It's all about "winning"....for Dubya. It's in his history. This latest example of him nominating the same judges that were defeated once before. He refuses to play by any rules. No matter if it is international rules or military rules or political rules, they are all made to be broken if it means that Dubya will win. If anybody doubts that he wouldn't do everything he could, legal or illegal, to win in Ohio - just like he did in Florida - then they are terribly naive.

[napi21]

1. Good points. But we need evidence to prove some of 'em.

I'm not talking about poll #'s v/s actual votes, I'm talking PROOF! So far, I haven't seen or heard any.

I'm positive there was fraud in Fl and OH, but I don't live in either state, and I'm not a lawyer or and investigator.

WE NEED ACTUAL PROOF!!!!!

You can't get anything done by saying I just know the election was stolen!

[Doctor_J]

2. The long lines/broken machines/inadequate machines in

the Dem districts looks an awful lot like proof to me.

[napi21]

8. But it's NOT proof of fraud!

I live in Ga. In an area about 65 miles north of Atlanta. My hustand and I went to vote (early voting) one day, saw the long line and said, ah, lest come back tomorrow. Most people in our relatively small town waited over 2 hours to vote. We have a whopping 150,000 people here.

This doesn't constitute proof of fraud!

We have to find things like programing in the source code that actually changed votes, or segments of a precinct votes that were declared not valid. Things like that.

Please understand, I'm with you, not against you, but you have to understand that what convinces you will not convince a jury! You need proof that can be substantiated. That part of the problem. We haven't been able to get the source code for the voting machine program. And we have't been able to show proof that segments or areas of people were disenfranchised.

[Imagevision]

11. Without investigative news coverage investigation-- its a zero!!

[napi21]

13. The media doesn't employ investigative journalists anymore.

We have to hire investigators on our own.

Have you not heard about all news broadcasters cutting investigators to make the news a profit center? I don't know how to change that, but listen to them some time. Our affiliate in...., or local news station XXXX. They just don't have investigators anymore.

The only way I can think of doing this is to hire our own investigators. A bit expensive, but it can be done!

[pgh_dem]

17. There are still a few investigators, check out this thread

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x371329#371396

The Toledo Blade has investigative journalists on this, and it links the MONEY to the fraud. Already, 5 of the OH Supreme Court Justices have recused themselves(including Moyer who *refused* to recuse himself in a case where he himself was a defendant), because they are documented to have received campaign contributions from this guy Noe.

50 million OH tax dollars were given to Noe, the former chairman of Lucas County (Toledo) Republican party, to invest in rare coins. The coins are disappearing, reported stolen, maybe never existed, Noe pocketed 11 million in profits, but actual money is proving hard to track down (can you say 'slush fund'?). Noe's Repub activist wife was just fired from Lucas Co Board of Elections for a laundry list of screw-ups, including mishandling of ballots and failure to secure ballots, during the 2004 election. (When you screw up SO bad that KEN BLACKWELL has to fire you, you know things are getting hairy).

Most importantly, Mr Noe seems to be connected to just about every effort to block the recount after the election. Noe + Blackwell + recount obstruction + 50 million dollars + wife fired for incompetence which smells like fraud = ?

Anyway, check out the link...As bad as this looks for Noe, I'm thinking this might shape up to be the ol' limited hangout for Blackwell.

[LightningFlash]

19. But this, my friends, is..

http://www.votersunite.org

It doesn't get more clear that votes switched and "manufactured" problems favoring Bush in every single individual precinct.....

[dchill]

3. Been thinking the same thing

for a long time. He's never in his life been refused or denied anything he wants. It makes him all pouty. Also dangerous.

[murielkane]

4. Wasn't there something about him playing games as a kid?

When he was playing games with his brothers, if he couldn't win, he'd change the rules . . . Ah, here it is:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7017489/

"As a boy in Maine, he was the oldest of many cousins and would set the rules for summer games at the family compound. “If he was losing he’d change the rules — or take the ball and leave,” one cousin told me."

Sounds like Georgie to me.

[susanna]

5. Which is why he'll sink with his SS plan for private accounts.

He should let them go, considering the opposition of just about everyone, but he simply can't...it's all about winning, as you said.

[Disturbed]

6. This man is a Sociopath with ...

an inferiority complex and not too bright. Damn! It sure is humiliating having this asshole representing America.

[susanna]

10. I love people who know when and how to use the word...

"sociopath."

And yes, he is all that and a bag of chips (so to speak). I completely agree with your assessment!

[driver8]

14. I actually get a bad feeling in the pit of my stomach every time

I think about this buffoon representing the United States.

I really, truly hate that man.

[KaliTracy]

7. Just Released Yesterday, Dem Judicial Committee's Report in Book

form and MORE:

Now in book form -- the hearings conducted by the Democratic Judicial committe hearings -- conducted by Rep. John Conyers (ranking member)

Thursday, May 19, 2005
New Book: “STARTLING TESTIMONY FROM OHIO ON THE 2004 PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION AVAILABLE IN BOOK FORM FOR THE FIRST TIME

What Went Wrong in Ohio

Contains Complete Text of Congressional Hearings

INTRODUCTION BY GORE VIDAL

<snip>

WHAT WENT WRONG IN OHIO: The Conyers Report on the 2004 Presidential Election (Academy Chicago Publishers, 154pp, paperback, 8 ½ x 5 ½, $10.95, 0-89733-535-X) is the official transcript of these hearings—not theory, not speculation—but the testimony of elected and election officials of both Democratic and Republican parties; representatives of the Triad voting machine company; poll watchers and observers and innumerable voters. It is a record of massive manipulation of the law and massive manipulation of electronic voting machines, which created long lines in Democratic precincts, where too few machines were allocated, while Republican precincts received more machines than were needed.

It is a record also of the public statements and actions of election officials and others involved in the Ohio election process, especially those of Ohio Secretary of State Kenneth Blackwell who was, during this same period, also co-Chair of the Ohio Bush re-election committee. Mr Blackwell’s application of the law before, during and after the election, involved, according to the Committee, a series of deliberate violations of the Ohio Revised Code which, in turn, led to countless violations of voters’ rights.

In the book’s Executive Summary, the Committee states:

“We have found numerous serious election irregularities in the Ohio presidential election which resulted in significant disenfranchisement of voters. Cumulatively, these irregularities, which affected hundreds of votes and voters in Ohio, raise grave doubts about whether it can be said that the Ohio electors selected on December 13, 2004, were chosen in a manner conforming to Ohio law, let alone Federal requirements and constitutional standards.”

Anita Miller, editor of What Went Wrong in Ohio, said: “These are facts, not theories or speculations and they demonstrate all too clearly the need for electoral reform. As Bob Kerrey has said, this report ‘…should be required reading for all who believe the right to vote is fundamental to freedom and the spirit of democracy.’”

The Committee’s report was released in early January of 2005 and some of its findings were fleetingly mentioned in the press. This volume, however, is the first book publication of the report’s complete text.”


found on http://www.ohiohonestelections.org/

[Al-CIAda]

16. KICK!

[biscotti]

9. Does anyone remember the piece of video

from Ohio that featured Rep.Peter King (R-NY) with w* who asked, are you going to deliver Ohio for us. King responded something like I have spoken to all my people and everything is taken care of. I sure wish someone would put him under oath.

[Imagevision]

12. Very sad day for Amerika to allow this sort of laedership to exist!

[annabanana]

18. this pig is my rep.. HOW DO WE GET THAT VIDEO?

I don't know who archives this kind of thing, or where they archive it.. But someone here must know.

[ngGale]

15. He still plays games...

but with people's lives. He's a sick man who will do whatever it takes to win, never caring about the cost. He's the type who probably says, "payback is hell, ain't it?" :scared: