Rove apparently told Cooper that it was ''Wilson's wife, ...

[whistle]

...who apparently works at the agency on WMD issues who authorized the trip," according to a story in Newsweek's July 18 issue.


<snip>
Rove had 2003 talk with Time reporter
But he didn't name CIA agent, lawyer says
By Josh White, Washington Post | July 11, 2005

WASHINGTON -- White House Deputy Chief of Staff Karl Rove spoke with at least one reporter about Valerie Plame's role at the CIA before she was identified as a covert agent in a newspaper column two years ago, but Rove's lawyer said yesterday that his client did not identify her by name.

Rove had a short conversation with Time magazine reporter Matthew Cooper on July 11, 2003, three days before Robert D. Novak publicly exposed Plame in a column about her husband, Joseph C. Wilson IV. Wilson had come under attack from the White House for his assertions that he found no evidence Iraq was trying to buy uranium from Niger and that he reported those findings to top administration officials. Wilson publicly accused the administration of leaking his wife's identity as a means of retaliation.

The leak of Plame's name to the news media spawned a federal grand jury investigation that has been seeking to discover the origin of the disclosure. Cooper avoided jail time last week by agreeing to testify before the grand jury about conversations with his sources, while New York Times reporter Judith Miller was jailed for refusing to discuss her confidential sources.

To be considered a violation of the law, a disclosure by a government official must have been deliberate, the person doing it must have known that the CIA officer was a covert agent, and he or she must have known that the government was actively concealing the covert agent's identity.
<more>
<link> http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2005/07/11/rove_had_2003_talk_with_time_reporter/

[Karmakaze]

1. We have to fight the media's framing of the issue.

The defence is gonna be "He didnt specifically name her", and you can see the media is trying to help with lines like "The leak of Plame's name to the news media".

The fact is it was not her name, or her identity or any other such bullshit that was leaked - what was leaked was her job as a covert agent on WMD issues - a leak that seriously set back the fight against WMD and terrorism in general.

By saying "leaked her name" they are trying to build a defense for Rove that should not stand up in court - it was not her NAME that was important, it was what she did.

He gave more than enough identifying information so that ANYONE could find out her name, so the crime still stands.

[Old and In the Way]

2. So who authorized the trip?

I've heard Cheney, I've heard Tenent, now I hear Plame. I think Rove's lying here, would she have the authority to check up on this administration's veracity?

[Karmakaze]

3. It's long been proven a lie..

Plame had NOTHING to do with sending her husband, so it of course was a lie. The Interesting part is not only was it a lie, but it was a treasonous lie.

The whole Bush administration should be on charges of committing treason in the name of politics.

[sam sarrha]

4. Here is why...This explanes it all........................ link>>>>>>>

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=103x66773

Chaney had to stop Plames investigation to cover up his involvement in the distribution and profiteering of WMD's... Plame and her group were getting close to proving it

[The Backlash Cometh]

7. If this is true and Cheney has been the one orchestrating the intelligence

in this country in order to protect himself and his business partners, not even the religious right nor the freepers will help him. Hell, he will have more to fear from them than from us.

[sam sarrha]

11. WOW !!!! someone actually read it !!! thank you thank you...

[Old and In the Way]

13. I just read it, too, for the 1st time.

It's dense, but it's extremely well documented and unbelievably damning, and it deserves another shot at Greatest Page.

Maybe RobertPaulson should restart the thread, it's extremely relevant to the subject at hand. I can't believe that the MSM isn't exposing this to the American people....oh wait, yes I can.

[Old and In the Way]

12. Thanks for posting.

Wow, just wow. I'm sure glad I don't believe in kooky conspiracies, because then I'd have to believe that Dick Cheney and Don Rumsfield aren't just world class war-profiteers, but also world-class treasonous bastards.

What's it take to be tried for high crimes these days? An Act of Congress?

[sam sarrha]

15. that would be put on the long list, behind gay horse riding or gay dancing

[CoffeeCat]

5. Hair splitting...

Rove may not have "named" Valerie Plame, but clearly--he identified her.

I'm not getting what the big distinction is. So what, if Karl Rove didn't scream, "Valerie Plame! Valerie Plame!". He said, "Joe Wilson's wife" and that is the same thing as saying her name.

In the end--the result was exactly the same as saying her name.

DUH, Karl!

[auburngrad82]

6. Right, "Wilson's wife" is just as effective as "Valerie Plame"

There should be no way in Hell that they could let Rove off on a technicality like that. He's a traitor.

[The Backlash Cometh]

8. I agree. This "name" thing is a red herring.

I'm shocked that Rove's well-paid lawyers think it'll stick in a court of law. Obviously, the public, with the help of the complacency of the media won't get it, but lawyers?

[truthisfreedom]

9. it depends on what your definition of "is" is.

any form of positive identification, whether using a name or not, is "outing."

i love this. Rove's lawyer is starting up the whole Clenis thing again.

[Roland99]

10. NBC's Today Show just covered this as a top headline!!

They did say that Rove claims to have never mentioned Plame by name but that he was the "secret source" for Matt Cooper and that "a few days later" Plame's name appeared in an article by Bob Novak.


Certainly the implication by NBC News is there.

[jerryster]

18. But didn't they also suggest that Rove

is in the clear legally? The reporter said that Bush had promised to punish the leaker. Like THAT'S going to happen now that he knows it's his own brain that did it.

I posted a few days ago that I was afraid Rove would get away with it and that I would love to be proved wrong. If we have to rely on Bush nailing Rove we can consider this a dead end road. Can you imagine how much more smug Rove is going to be now? He exacts an act of political vengeance by breaking the law, gets away with it, all the while knowing that he is untouchable by Bush.

[Roland99]

20. I'd be happy with a Rove resignation at this point

That would be a HUGE kink in the Propagandist's armor.

The first step toward admitting failure/wrongdoing.

[DoYouEverWonder]

14. Maybe she was getting to close to finding out

who forged the Niger documents. We couldn't have that now could we?

[Tesla]

16. Obviously, Cheney knew all along

what, who, and when........

What's that smell........

[skip fox]

21. Likely many knew. Likely multiple indictments for Rove:

One or more indictments for Rove is nearly certain. One or more indictments for one or more high-ranking administrative official is likely.

The logic is very simple:

If Rove acted alone he made at least SIX calls (six reporters were contacted). Repeatedly and deliberately telling national reporters (at the least) that the Wilson's wife worked at the CIA and "arranged" his trip to Niger shows he KNOWINGLY exposed her identity (it was far from a slip or even a lapse), whether or not he used her name or knew she was covert. In addition, if he was the only primary caller, he would have had to arrange for confirmation by at least one other administration official at least THREE times (for Novak, Cooper, and Miller). (Since he could not control who the reporter would call for confirmation, he likely arranged for three or four others who would willingly--and "knowlingly"--confirm the story.) Therefore he CONSPIRED to expose a CIA official (since he knew the result of his leak would lead to exposure).

If Rove was the only primary source, however, that means he released Matt Cooper from his confidentiality agreement but he did not Judith Miller from hers. The logical reason is that his leak to her included a much more obvious case of illegal activity. Rove's hope, then, is that such a case will never be known. But with the national attention on the Plame matter and, especially, a tenacious and objective prosecutor tracking him down, Rove has little hope (especially with the fact that he had to have done this SIX times and arranged for at least one other to support his story THREE times).

But if Rove was one of at least two or more sources (which would explain why Cooper's released him but Miller's did not release hers), then it's far worse for him since he probably coordinated the entire leak with both planning and foresight (two elements which again indicate that he KNOWINGLY leaked Plame's identity).

Any administrative official originally realizing the Wilson-Plame-CIA link would immediately realize it could discredit Wilson, but much more importantly he would have known who to take the information to, the master of such discreditations (among so much else), Karl Rove. Rove would then insure that the leaks did not overlap and that at least FEW other officials could be counted upon who would readily confirm the information of the original sources (perhaps each having different details or a different slant to make it sound realistic and not a set-up), since he could not insure who the reporter would call for a confirmation.

How do you do ANY of this UNKNOWINGLY?????

Think of the possibilities! At least two indictments for Rove (leaking Plame and leading a conspiracy to leak) and likely indictments (leaking Plame) for other high administrative officials: Rice, Cheney, Libby, etc. Maybe even W.

[mainer]

17. Am I the only one who thinks Miller SHOULD have talked?

I can understand journalists protecting whistle-blowers, who are, for whatever motives, spilling secrets of wrong-doing. A free society needs inside informants who can keep the public aware of illegal activities.

But Rove wasn't telling us ABOUT illegal activities. He was COMMITTING an illegal activity by revealing Plame's identity. The journalists, in this case, weren't conduits for information. They were patsies and accomplices to a crime.

I think the concept of protecting unnamed sources doesn't apply here.

[kentuck]

19. But do not get focused entirely on what he told "Cooper"...

What did he tell Novak or Miller or whomever? Even if he didn't tell Cooper, perhaps he told someone else? Do not let Cooper be the diversion that gets Rove off...