Al Franken said on his show today

[babsbunny]

That he doesn't believe the election was stolen! We need to send him the Big Book by Bob Fitrakis, "Did George W. Bush Steal the 2004 Election?" I can't believe he said that!

[wryter2000]

1. I know what you mean

He'll denounce conspiracy theories even when there's good reason to believe there might be a conspiracy.

[BlueEyedSon]

2. He's practically a DINO

[merwin]

39. The fact that he doesn't believe the election was stolen does not make him

a DINO. I'm sorry, but he has proven himself time and again to be an avid progressive. Just because he's not on the extreme left, or he doesn't believe the election was stolen doesn't make him a DINO.

[fooj]

3. I won't even listen to the hack...

Peace.

[jrthin]

4. Another reason why I

avoid his show. :mad:

[movonne]

5. I am not crazy about Franken, to me he is a Repub light....

[tridim]

13. I wouldn't go that far.. All his positions are Liberal

But the "there are no conspiracies, ever" attitude is maddening. The Young Turks and Jerry Springer's guest host say this too. They need to read more and open their minds.

[redqueen]

6. Is he really that stupid?

Glad I miss his show every day. I'll make it a point not to listen even if I'm able from now on.

How ignorant...

[DemNoir]

7. The Simple Reason

He is not a talk show host. He is a Senate candidate.

[Humor_In_Cuneiform]

31. I agree

Shortly after the election he had some experts on who said they didn't believe the election was stolen.

Never mind that there are so many other experts who believe that it was or could have been.

I was so frustrated with him back then.

Then I wrote it off in my mind to his not wanting to be associated with so called "conspiracy theories," because he wants to run for the Senate.

[Botany]

8. I e mailed him the results from Claremont County OH

Hackett's race compiled by Truth is all. I also told him to take his head
out of his ASS. He is trying to not be considered "fringe" for his senate race.

Hackett won 38 of 191 Clermont precincts but lost ALL of the largest 54 precincts (more than 187 votes).

What are the odds of THAT?

The Graph
Image

Link to thread
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...


In Clermont:
Hackett TotVote Pct over187
12439 29889 41.6% 54


1 46 61 75.4%
2 36 57 63.2%
3 83 136 61.0%
4 62 103 60.2%
5 42 70 60.0%
6 50 85 58.8%
7 74 127 58.3%
8 49 86 57.0%
9 43 76 56.6%
10 22 39 56.4%
11 46 82 56.1%
12 48 86 55.8%
13 54 97 55.7%
14 72 130 55.4%
15 75 136 55.1%
16 44 81 54.3%
17 72 134 53.7%
18 37 69 53.6%
19 46 86 53.5%
20 71 133 53.4%
21 47 89 52.8%
22 94 178 52.8%
23 68 130 52.3%
24 31 60 51.7%
25 63 122 51.6%
26 73 142 51.4%
27 37 72 51.4%
28 65 127 51.2%
29 49 96 51.0%
30 49 96 51.0%
31 55 108 50.9%
32 57 112 50.9%
33 94 185 50.8%
34 95 187 50.8%
35 43 85 50.6%
36 69 137 50.4%
37 27 54 50.0%
38 40 80 50.0%

39 52 105 49.5%
40 46 93 49.5%
41 113 229 49.3% 1< indicates over 187 total votes
42 36 73 49.3%
43 119 242 49.2% 1
44 23 47 48.9%
45 75 154 48.7%
46 89 183 48.6%
47 34 70 48.6%
48 81 167 48.5%
49 48 99 48.5%
50 71 147 48.3%
51 68 141 48.2%
52 35 73 47.9%
53 49 103 47.6%
54 76 160 47.5%
55 52 110 47.3%
56 25 53 47.2%
57 73 155 47.1%
58 40 85 47.1%
59 54 115 47.0%
60 74 158 46.8%
61 51 109 46.8%
62 42 90 46.7%
63 46 99 46.5%
64 77 166 46.4%
65 54 117 46.2%
66 60 130 46.2%
67 72 156 46.2%
68 115 250 46.0% 1
69 17 37 45.9%
70 73 159 45.9%
71 70 153 45.8%
72 86 188 45.7% 1
73 79 174 45.4%
74 59 130 45.4%
75 111 245 45.3% 1
76 28 62 45.2%
77 23 51 45.1%
78 64 142 45.1%
79 54 120 45.0%
80 183 408 44.9% 1
81 56 125 44.8%
82 38 85 44.7%
83 42 94 44.7%
84 63 141 44.7%
85 84 188 44.7% 1
86 54 121 44.6%
87 94 211 44.5% 1
88 60 135 44.4%
89 46 104 44.2%
90 41 93 44.1%
91 89 202 44.1% 1
92 48 109 44.0%
93 51 116 44.0%
94 61 139 43.9%
95 43 98 43.9%
96 146 333 43.8% 1
97 78 178 43.8%
98 69 158 43.7%
99 58 133 43.6%
100 117 269 43.5% 1
101 30 69 43.5%
102 36 83 43.4%
103 99 229 43.2% 1
104 41 95 43.2%
105 42 98 42.9%
106 81 189 42.9% 1
107 96 224 42.9% 1
108 55 129 42.6%
109 65 153 42.5%
110 82 194 42.3% 1
111 92 218 42.2% 1
112 81 192 42.2% 1
113 83 198 41.9% 1
114 36 86 41.9%
115 28 67 41.8%
116 114 275 41.5% 1
117 96 232 41.4% 1
118 51 124 41.1%
119 53 129 41.1%
120 78 191 40.8% 1
121 82 201 40.8% 1
122 41 101 40.6%
123 30 74 40.5%
124 49 121 40.5%
125 59 146 40.4%
126 99 245 40.4% 1
127 46 114 40.4%
128 44 110 40.0%
129 46 115 40.0%
130 74 186 39.8%
131 69 175 39.4%
132 59 150 39.3%
133 110 280 39.3% 1
134 82 209 39.2% 1
135 85 217 39.2% 1
136 16 41 39.0%
137 32 82 39.0%
138 59 152 38.8%
139 79 204 38.7% 1
140 103 266 38.7% 1
141 96 248 38.7% 1
142 57 148 38.5%
143 90 234 38.5% 1
144 157 410 38.3% 1
145 37 97 38.1%
146 85 223 38.1% 1
147 56 147 38.1%
148 112 296 37.8% 1
149 42 112 37.5%
150 63 168 37.5%
151 99 264 37.5% 1
152 146 391 37.3% 1
153 32 86 37.2%
154 52 140 37.1%
155 134 363 36.9% 1
156 23 63 36.5%
157 95 264 36.0% 1
158 49 137 35.8%
159 158 442 35.7% 1
160 112 314 35.7% 1
161 57 160 35.6%
162 53 149 35.6%
163 29 82 35.4%
164 75 213 35.2% 1
165 85 242 35.1% 1
166 87 252 34.5% 1
167 86 250 34.4% 1
168 48 140 34.3%
169 132 385 34.3% 1
170 13 38 34.2%
171 45 132 34.1%
172 86 254 33.9% 1
173 61 182 33.5%
174 83 248 33.5% 1
175 30 90 33.3%
176 69 209 33.0% 1
177 49 149 32.9%
178 55 169 32.5%
179 80 247 32.4% 1
180 64 199 32.2% 1
181 63 196 32.1% 1
182 23 73 31.5%
183 140 445 31.5% 1
184 57 182 31.3%
185 38 127 29.9%
186 55 190 28.9% 1
187 25 88 28.4%
188 28 101 27.7%
189 20 77 26.0%
190 114 446 25.6% 1
191 128 549 23.3% 1
Sum 12439 29889 41.6% 54

[Mojambo]

9. I don't agree with him on that score

But he still does very good work.

[LSK]

10. which hour???

I will listen to the repeat later for this.

[babsbunny]

12. Between 12:00 and 1:00 think

The 1st hour.

[whistle]

11. Which Bush election did Franken mean?

[babsbunny]

18. 2004

I think he was talking about the 25 States who now will have paper trails.

[LisaM]

14. There is a large group of liberals that simply will not address this issue

I'm not sure I understand why - afraid that it's still considered a fringe issue? Or are they doing something behind the scenes that we don't know about?

[getmeouttahere]

17. Let me ask you this...

do you believe there is a possibility that 9/11 was a staged event? If not, then how can you bash Franken for not believing the election was stolen? I believe there is just as much compelling evidence the Twin Towers were a controlled demolition, among other fishy things, as there is that the 2004 election was stolen (yes, 2000 also).

[Hippo_Tron]

24. Umm, if 2000 wasn't stolen, then why wouldn't they allow a recount?

[AllyCat]

19. Because it means they would have to admit they were asleep at the switch

while we all kept telling them it would happen in 2004. And no one listened, even AFTER what happened in FL in 2000...they all slept on with the rest of the sheeple. Now they don't want to admit they were wrong.

[JerseygirlCT]

37. I know I get the rolled eyes everytime I mention it

I think anyone admitting they believe it gets treated to the crazy look. And a whole bunch of people will do anything to avoid giving the appearance of being crazy.

I just shrug and continue on my merry way.

[danalytical]

15. I'm not so sure he isn't right

It's certainly possible, but it's bot as if Franken is a DINO just because he doesn;t believe it. Do you really think that stealing a national election is that easy, yes they used dirty and probably even illegal tricks but I don't think a national conspiracy took place.

There are a lot of stupid people out there, and they vote replublican. They don;t need to steal those votes, cause they already stole their minds.

[Humor_In_Cuneiform]

33. Stealing an election isn't that easy

and gets harder the more scrutiny is focused on the process.

But when you have voting machines made by a company whose President contributes to and supports one candidate and promises to deliver the election or do everything possible...

Some of the machines are paperless, some have paper backups, but it doesn't really matter if you can't get an honest recount ie Ohio.

And most of all there is software that adds up and transmits vote totals that has been demonstrated to have big holes that make it easy to hack in and change the vote count.

There are countless organizations, groups, and individuals continuing to work on the problem at many different levels and perspectives.

The computer science literature has seen a lot of new publications about electronic voting since the last election.

None of them say we should be proud to have such a reliable voting system.

The source code is unavailable for inspection by computer scientists who should have been a part of the development of the systems to begin with.

Official inspections by so called Independent Testing Agents excluded the potential "security" problem.

My opinion is that anyone who doesn't at least believe there is a good chance the election was stolen isn't aware of some important facts of the situation.

[getmeouttahere]

16. I'm the ultimate conspiracy theorist....

but I won't bash Franken the way you folks do. He's done too much good for our side.

[GreenPartyVoter]

20. He refuses to see what is right in front of him. Very sad.

[peacetalksforall]

21. I was enraged at him. I'm going to write a scathing letter. He needs

to study more. He needs help with his message, his declarations, and his education.

[Old and In the Way]

22. As much as I believe there was election fraud, I can understand

the reluctance of a public figure to say, "I'm pretty sure there was election fraud." Because the Right (and their mass-media co-conspirators) will say, "Prove it". And he says....what?

I think he'd latch on to it in a heartbeat if there was hard documentary evidence that proves even 1 vote was electronically stolen. We got so much smoke around this issue that we know there's a fire....we just can't locate the source.

[NYCGirl]

23. He also said before that, while working for election reform, saying that

the election can be easily stolen will serve to discourage people from working for their Democratic candidates and serve to drive down voting numbers. (There's certainly a number of people here who consistently question the act of voting, because of "stolen elections.") I believe he's trying to be responsible in his public statements.

[ClassWarrior]

25. WHAAAAAA?? Dems have different opinions?? Well, I'll be.

I thought we all marched in lockstep, all believing EXACTLY the same things. Well, too bad we don't believe in the power of education and reason to help people who see differently than us come around to our side.

I guess I'll go and throw away my radio now.

NGU.

[Pewlett Hackard]

26. what's the diff

it's not like we're going to ever overturn the 04 election outcome now. better to spend our energy on 06 and 08.

[iconoclastNYC]

27. Or he could have Mark Crispin Miller on.

Who said on a show on WNYC (NPR)

"Get real. Look at what happened. Look at how it was done. Look at the many many ways the system was subverted. And reform that system. Because if we don't reform the system, I don't care who the Democrats run. I don't care if they run Jesus Christ himself, he will lose. He will lose no matter how brilliant his campaign. But the democrats by and large, people in Washington, are, it's a curious phenomenon they are afraid to face this because they don't want to go there. The implications of this are really frightening, they are staggering. What we're talking about is the displacement of democracy by something much closer to fascism."

[Al-CIAda]

29. Exactly. And yes, Thom Hartmann is MUCH better than Ostrich Al. nt

[patrioticliberal]

28. LISTEN TO THOM HARTMANN DURING HIS TIME SLOT

He is so better! AMAZING

[wyldwolf]

30. yeah! And Randi dissed Michael Moore yesterday!

said he was full of himself or something like that.

Imagine Democrats who have opinions!

[napi21]

32. So far, nobody has been able to prove it was stolen!

I also think it was. At the very least, it was stolen by voter intimidation. But until we can PROVE IT, our words are very hollow! We're not only talking politics here, we're talking LEGAL! In the legal system, you have to prove your case.

If we can't do that, it's probably time to stop accusing.

[zulchzulu]

34. He just needs to have someone on the show and debunk his "claim"

Sometimes Al plays it a little safe on issues some might find a little too wrapped in tin foil.

If someone can come on the show (besides Hitchens) and offer some interesting evidence, I bet he would be game...

As for the Franken-trashing on this thread...that's bullsh*t.

[The Gunslinger]

35. Yea I noticed that too

Also when talking about Cindy Sheenans reaction to her first meeting with Bush, He mentioneed over and over that she was grieving and hinted at the fact that what she said about him may not be true.

It seems that he is afraid to flat out say anything bad about this administration without qualifing it first.

[Humor_In_Cuneiform]

38. He also said

that he wouldn't be surprised if it were true of W.

But I did share your surprise at his need to qualify his use of her description of the meeting with W.

[Vadem]

36. I know! I was listening to him and I had to turn him off! Where....

in the hell has he been! For G_d's sakes, who is advising him, why do we have someone like him on the supposedly progressive radio station, stating that there was no fraud in Ohio!!!!

Time for Al to go!!!!! Get some real progressives on that station!

[Edgewater_Joe]

40. He Has Said In The Past The Repunks "Won Dirty"

He doesn't believe in the theft, but he does believe a lot of what Conyers said. I've heard him say he thought Rove basically was a WWF bad guy and "won" by the proverbial pulling of the tights and using the ropes after spitting green mist in Kerry's face.

He is a DLC Democrat and has admitted as much, but he's not as far off the reservation as you all imply he is on this thread.