Will the 2008 Dem presidential nom field have a true secular candidate ?

[Bombtrack]

I know that this country will elect a black man, a woman, and a clone before it elects someone who's anti-religion like I am. But I'm just wondering if we'll even have someone the likes of Kucinich in the last election, someone just speaking for what, atleast is categorized, for better or worse, as a "hard-left" position. For Kucinich it was stuff like the Department of Peace, that kind of stuff. I'm just wondering if we'll get one man or woman who's aloud to debate the rest of the candidates, who calls for a strong secular platform. I sort of wish the author Sam Harris, who's book "The End of Faith" perfectly addresses the requirement for a heightening of the conversation that secularists have been preaching for a long time, but what's needed more than ever when religion is threatening and really killing in many cases like never before, would be the one to run.

[CPMaz]

1. Probably not

and probably shouldn't either.

The ideal candidate (and winner) would be one whose religiousness or irreligiousness is utterly irrelevant to his/her qualifications for the job.

I'm not anti-religion, I just think it should have nothing to do with public policy.

[Poppyseedman]

2. Will the 2008 Dem presidential field have a true secular candidate?

Of course they can. Only problem is just about nobody will vote for someone who expresses a non faith position.

A position with the amount of power given to one person as the POTUS does possess, the need to reassure people they believe think they are accountable to a higher power

[Virginia Dare]

3. In my fantasy world....

Dennis Kucinich is our President...
:dem:

[Bombtrack]

5. this isn't about Kucinich

it's just an example of what I'm talking about in terms of their function in the primary election. The means to the end of winning in 2008 does not involve nominating someone with a platform based around a position that challenges the bullshit 80 percent or so of Americans believe.

[Virginia Dare]

13. No, because there's no way they'd be elected...n/t

[TreasonousBastard]

4. No. Show me how...

any hard left candidate can get over 60 million votes necessary to win the general election. Or even get through the primaries.

FWIW, hard right candidates don't do so well either. The ghost of Goldwater and how he was demonized still haunts national elections. Every President we've had since Eisenhower claimed to be a happy moderate in the middle, with the polarizing candidates shunted off somewhere. What they turned out to be is another matter, but they still all ran as moderates. Even this pantload in there now ran claiming to be a moderate of sorts.

OK, maybe this is frustrating and not quite right, but in a two party sytem with winner take all no one is going to bet the farm going outside what they think is the "mainstream."

And, yeah, with 85% of the popuolation claiming some sort of religious belief, no one in his right mind would run without at least giving some lip service to religion.

[Bombtrack]

6. Jesus Christ can you read? I'm not talking about someone for the general

I'm talking about someone for the primary, hence the Kucinich analogy. Someone to increase the conversation on a popular topic or group of topics their platform is centered around.

[Virginia Dare]

14. I can read, but I didn't get that from your original post...n/t

[TreasonousBastard]

17. Oh, that...

yeah I figured it out the second time I read it. It's there, but not obvious on a really quick read.

So, to answer your question, hasn't there always been someone on the left running? Kucinich, Sharpton, Jackson...

Why would the next primary campaign be any different?

(Not that the results would be any different...)

[Bombtrack]

19. I'm just hoping that one of those "minor candidates" represents a secular

anti-religion platform

[pinto]

7. I think the broad electorate, outside of the small evangelical

cadre of religious activists, have little or no interest in religion as it effects politics. And visa versa. It's overplayed media hype, imho.

[Bombtrack]

8. thats wishful thinking that stats don't backup

22 percent of Americans firmly believe that Jesus Christ will return to Earth sometime in the next 50 years. Another 22 percent believe that Jesus PROBABLY will return to Earth sometime in the next 50 years.

[pinto]

10. I'm not concerned with their belief. I'm concerned with their vote.

[Bombtrack]

12. And you have to have your head in the sand to not realize it affects their

vote. As well as the votes in congress of the legislators they elect.

And this isn't just about Christianity.

[pinto]

16. Are those two 22 per cent groups voting Republican?

I don't know.

But, again, I think the broad electorate - that actually votes - doesn't vote solely on religious grounds.

[skipos]

9. Probably not, and it doesn't bother me.

Religion can bring out the worst in people, but it can also bring out the best in others. I have never had the hatred of religion that some DUers have. I don't give a crap if anyone is jewish, christian, scientologist, whatever. If you use it to make the world a better place, I am all for it. It is when you use your religion to spread hate, or force other people to share your beliefs, that I will get pissed off.

[Bombtrack]

11. There's no person that couldn't achieve any of the same "good"

by other means other than religion. And the good is utterly and unamiguously dwarfed by the bad.

[skipos]

15. I think you are wrong, but that is just my opinion.

There are quite a few people I know that have had seriously self destructive lives until they found religion. I imagine that there many, many people in the world like that. Are there great human beings who are atheists? Absolutely.

I would describe myself as religious, but I keep it to myself. I don't go around quoting the bible or trying to convert people to my beliefs. I may believe in an afterlife, you may disregard that as Santa Claus for adults, but we will probably both be out there in 2006 and 2008 fighting on the same side. My religion and your dislike of it doesn't matter.

[smoochpooch]

18. Not in 2008

The electorate will have to witness the fact that how often a person prays or attends church does not effect their performance. They will also have to witness the decline of America on the world stage and realize that it might be a good idea to elect the person with the best ideas for the country, not those who believe more in unprovable speculation that in facts.