DON'T TAKE IMPEACHMENT OFF THE TABLE!

[baldingrockwarlord2]

Yes, I meant to shout that. Never forget what they did to Bill Clinton. I'm not excusing the affair, but rather pointing out that the pukes set the bar and standard for impeachment pretty low and since they didn't let Clinton off the hook for the blowjob, the affair or lying under oath(take your pick), not to mention all the money spent doing it-we need to hold Bush accountable for what are ten-fold and by far much worse and impeachable offenses and high crimes. This is NO time for deal making. It's our turn to strike back and make things right. Since when is lying us into war and illegally invading a nation and sending our sons and daughter off to die for it NOT an impeachable offense, not to mention what he has done to our constitution and bill of rights. Never forget, people. Demand full and complete accountability, and nothing less.

[LynneSin]

1. It's alot easier when we start with an investigation

Trust me, investigation, expose them and the impeachment will not only come naturally but we'll get republicans supporting it too

[baldingrockwarlord2]

6. Can't happen soon enough

as far as I'm concerned. I'm not saying don't investigate. I'm saying let's get started ASAP. I don't recall anyone on the right saying "just let it go" in regards to Clinton. It was a 24/7 smear and hate fest back then and people need to be reminded of that. The swifter we as a nation exact our own justice on these pr*cks the better off in terms of the rest of the world knowing that we as a nation have a conscience and sense of right and wrong. LET'S GET STARTED!!

[RiverStone]

18. Agreed! A little more patience will ensure an impeachment.

Better to wait till investigation reveals such compelling evidence of cover up and lies, that we won't have to "make our case."
It will be obvious. History won't care if we impeach 12-14 months after we take power; history WILL REMEMBER BushCo's bad deeds. I for one want to make sure that when we impeach, history remembers.

[whistle]

2. The impeachment option of Bush/Cheney must remain on the table

[Kagemusha]

3. No, the Clinton impeachment raised the bar rather than lowered it.

Republicans are taking full advantage of the powerful arguments Democrats made at the time that impeaching the President is a bold, grave step that should only be done for really serious offenses. Granted, a lot of people feel Bush has committed them, but Bush had a compliant Congress before that never put his feet to the fire in a meaningful way. And war has never been an impeachable offense in the American system in and of itself, out of fear of harming national interests if Presidents are made to fear such measures for every conflict. Since when is it not an impeachable offense? Phillipine War, perhaps? I'm sure I could come up with a long list if I really wanted.

The point is, the public is poisoned against impeachment because of what they did to Bill Clinton, so your logic is, unfortunately, backwards. Your heart is unquestionably in the right place, however.

[Oak2004]

22. 51% of Americans WANT impeachment hearings

Not 51% of Democrats, not 51% of liberals -- of Americans.

Out here in the real world -- and that's where I was, disconnected from active politics, surrounded by people of all political stripes, in Pennsylvania and later in Vermont, when the Republicans started their march to impeachment -- people talked about how wrong it was to impeach a President for (lying about) having an affair. It was not that he was impeached -- it was why he was impeached (a frivolous reason).

Committing crimes against the citizenry and committing war crimes are very grave offenses. Even Vietnam was not an instance of naked aggression as Iraq has been. The number of people who are dead or maimed as a direct result of this Administration's crimes is breathtaking. Whether we like to face it or not, George W. Bush is the biggest mass murderer of the 21st century. That's pretty heavy stuff, a position the United States has not (to my knowledge) ever been in before.

The blood of many cries out for justice. Anything less is to let this stain on our nation set into a permanent ugly blotch.

[beaconess]

25. Really? Where did you get that?

[Oak2004]

33. A recent Newsweek poll

http://january6th.org/oct2006-newsweek-poll-impeach.html

Add the numbers up. It's a slight majority of Americans. And that's before his misdeeds are fully bared to the world, as would happen were impeachment investigations to proceed.

[brentspeak]

35. A slight majority from one poll doesn't equal public sentiment for impeachment

A Congress pushing for impeachment without the solid approval of the public would be a Congress acting irresponsibly.

[Barack_America]

27. Not true. There were two referendums for impeachment...

...On the ballot in Wisconsin and both were defeated.

http://www.marshfieldnewsherald.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20061108/MNH0101/611080721

[LoZoccolo]

4. What they did to Bill Clinton...like run his approval rating up to almost 70%...

...gain his party congressional seats...etcetera...

[MrModerate]

5. Because if we pursue impeachment -- despite the clear justice of the case . . .

The electorate will kick Dem ass in 2008. There is insufficient appetite among the people for impeachment, and it would be so explosive and time-consuming as to eliminate the chance of making real progress in repairing some of the the Bushian damage.

Instead, use the next two years to 1)fix some of what is broken; 2)pursue, via congressional investigation, as many corrupt/compromised politicians as possible (mostly 'Lican, given they way things have played out over the last 12 years); 3)make it impossible for a 'Lican to win the presidency in 2008.

[El Fuego]

8. Yes, the GOP took a beating after Clinton's impeachment. * NOT*

[Barack_America]

13. 4 Senate seats is no small matter...

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2000/results/index.senate.html

We've just won 6 and we're calling it a "revolution".

[El Fuego]

19. They've had control of Congress for the last 12 years.

And total control of the government since 2000. The impeachment of Clinton didn't hurt them at all.

[lapfog_1]

11. Nope, your wrong.

Impeachment of NIXON was not perceived in the end as a "witch hunt". A criminal was removed from office.

Gerald Ford kept justice from being served, and paid the price in the next election.

If Bush and Cheney committed crimes, then he should be impeached.

[MGD]

20. No, he's right and Sen. Conyers agrees. Bush is a tool of our real enemies.

We might as well impeach a hammer for all the good it will do for our greater cause. Focus on results and outcomes, not tools.

[Ellis Wyatt]

7. Payback

is not a good reason.

And unless a major and earth shattering amount of widespread corruption & lies is exposed, it runs the risk of hurting democrats more than helping in the next two years.

[baldingrockwarlord2]

9. It's not just about payback

If war crimes are not impeachable but blowjobs are what have we become? I respectfully disagree with anyone who claims the country doesn't "have the stomach" for impeachment. We need to re-establish a proper set of values and parameters for impeachment and if war crimes and lying to illegally invade and cause our sons and daughters to die does not qualify for impeachment, but lying about a blowjob does then our values as a nation hold no value period. Demand accountability and nothing less.

[Ellis Wyatt]

14. not blowjobs, purgery

Had Clinton not lied (under oath) to Congress, even about something so insignificant, I think it all would have whithered on the vine.

I agree with investigations and uncovering if there were actual lies to Congress (and to Russia, and the UK and everyone else who also seemed to think that Iraq also had WMD) by the Administration, then certainly kick them all out of office.

And obviously that can't be uncovered without hearings and investigations. I'm not against these hearings, my point is only that this should not be the #1 priority or the major focus of the new Congress, because there will be a backlash, and it will cost the Dems political capital unless something major is uncovered (and there is obviously risk that there may not be.)

[frogcycle]

31. It was inappropriate

that he was put in the position of having to answer questions under oath that had NOTHING to do with a case he was giving a deposition on WHICH WAS LATER DISMISSED for lack of evidence.

That he was forced either to confess to private matters publicly, lie, or refuse to answer, which would have led to a press feeding frenzy was, in my opinion, totally out of line. That he opted to try to craft a technically honest denial, but blew it (ok, please excuse that choice of wording) was hardly an impeachable offense. That it could technically be called perjury and thus a crime was equivalent to entrapment, imo. And yet the reps spent millions and wasted hours of their time belaboring it. I'd love to see all the ringleaders get the santorum treatment.

But impeaching bush without dealing first with Cheney is a non-starter. Better to just cut off his balls and keep him.

[slaveplanet]

42. It's not payback

Crikey, there's a lot of busy little bees buzzing around here trying to redefine impeachment of Bushcrime.

It's not revenge, or any of the other terms the MSM is shoving down your thoat.

It is a matter of Justice plain and simple.

[Barack_America]

10. Polls from Clinton Impeachment.

Take a look and see how much Americans despise these sort of tactics

http://democrats.com/clinton-impeachment-polls

Oh and, by the way, the Republicans lost seats both in the Senate and the House after that impeachment (and we all know that they didn't technically win the Presidency)

[jenmito]

12. Don't worry...

It may be "off the table" NOW, but once the investigations find impeachable offenses, their tune could change. Heck-wasn't Rumsfeld going to stay 'til the end of Bush's term a week or so ago?

[zbdent]

15. Okay, which 10 Republicans can we count on to convict?

Don't include Lieberman ... unless we can be sure of 60 votes for conviction, it's a circle jerk ...

[yellowdogmi]

16. Hear Hear. eom

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

17. Nothing is off the table. Ever. nt.

[MADem]

21. Well, like it or not, it is off the table.

There will be investigations into malfeasance, but if impeachment ever gets put back ON the table, it won't be a Democratic effort alone.

The only way I can see it happening is with bipartisan support. Otherwise, forget it.

That assessment might not be popular, but I will wager it's accurate.

[Stinky The Clown]

23. If we look at impeachment as tit-for-tat, then I oppose it STRONGLY

If we lookk at impeachment of **this** cabal for the serious crimes, then I am an impeachment hawk. Your OP implies that it is for 'getting back'. That's just wrong. Its petty, its stupid, and its a sure recipe for abject failure.

[Norrin Radd]

24. Exactly.

Enough of this "I'm concerned about impeachment" Concern, concern, concern.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

26. Taking it off the table is fine.

As long as they put it on the back burner.

[Claire Beth]

28. It wouldn't be wise...

to go that route. The country does NOT want to go that route, no matter how we feel about it personally. It would cause another rift in the country that would HURT democrats. There are investigations that will be done and will prove far better than putting the country down the road of impeachment. BESIDES, we do not CHENEY as president.

:dem:

[Bobbie Jo]

32. If I remember correctly....

The Rethugs have remained in power (to this day) after they impeached Clinton. Remember....6 in 10 Americans (according to exit polling) hate Bush. Clinton never saw this much disapproval on his worst day.

The RW propaganda machine has had us smacked down and afraid to flinch for the last 12 years....talk about wimpy.

[pat_k]

29. As long as impeachment is "off the table" they are in violation. . .

. . .of their oath.

It is impossible to carry out their duty to defend the Constitution if the only mechanism by which certain types of threats can be eliminated is "off the table."

It is like taking the use of military force is off the table. Using the weapons we have made available for our defense must always a last resort, but you NEVER take any of them "off the table."

Unless they put it back on the table, there will need to be a few changes to the oath that members of the 110th Congress take.

Revised Oath (Changes Mandated by Pelosi's Pledge)

I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and be derelict in my duty to defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear foreswear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I will fail to take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully negligently and faithlessly discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter: So help me God.

[frogcycle]

30. I take it President Cheney has a nice ring to it?

[jman0]

34. Let's be sensible about this

I want Rummy and Cheney on the galllows next to Saddam too.
However we need to exercise some political finesse about this.
The "moderates" among us have a point, that letting our passions consume us may harm us tomorrow.
We don't have a mandate, the Senate is too close.
Let's begin concentrating on positive things first, try to undue some of the damage the Bush cabal has done.
Start investigating the money trail in Iraq like a tax audit.
American's deserve to know where their money has gone.
Just to get a picture of what happened to these vast sums; no mean spirited witch-hunt at first.
That should start the balling rolling, out a few thousand skeletons from various closets, expose lots of mis-management and corruption.
That may then build a public (and main stream media) consensus for Impeachment and criminal procedings.

[WA98296]

36. Actually it makes elected Dems ACCOMPLISES. They owe us more than this.

[gully]

37. Of course not, but can we bring the troops home quicker if * is over a barrell?

I honestly think we're keeping the option "available" as political leverage ...........

[E-Z-B]

38. Dubya only has 2 years left. Marginalize his efforts, and don't lose focus.

The democrats have more important work to do like fixing the Iraq mess, healthcare, medicare, and social security. Again, don't lose focus.

[raccoon]

39. Amen to that! We need to make an EXAMPLE of the POS.

"we need to hold Bush accountable for what are ten-fold and by far much worse and impeachable offenses and high crimes. "

Otherwise, it's as if all these things DIDN't MATTER.

K & R. Come on, we need one more R.

[cleveramerican]

40. A terrible waste of a golden opportunity

We have maybe twelve months to get something done, I would much rather see the time spent on something REAL and of LASTING VALUE to ordinary Americans.


Impeachment proceedings would confirm every Americans worst fears about Dems in control of congress, and control will be short if this is the direction we go in.


The opportunity is huge, The party that fixes the mess that Iraq has become will be in power for years, lauded far and wide by a grateful public. The challenge is ours.

[mom cat]

41. SIGN THIS PETITION AT IMPEACH FOR CHANGE.ORG:

Sorry for the all caps, but I do not want this to get lost. It just came in my e-mail this morning from Democrats.com:

On Saturday, Democrats.com and our progressive allies will launch a nationwide grassroots mobilization for impeachment in Philadelphia near Independence Hall, where the Constitution was signed on September 17, 1787. The mobilization is called ImpeachForChange. Our goals include:

A grassroots petition drive to collect 1 million signatures at ImpeachForChange.org
Form Impeachment Committees in all 435 Congressional Districts to lobby every Member of Congress by:
delivering books & videos on impeachment
collecting petitions and handwritten letters in front of their District Offices
meeting with every Member to discuss the issues that require impeachment
Expand our Citizens Impeachment Commission to add prominent citizens, celebrities and bloggers
12/10 Bush v. Gore Day:
Hold Town Hall Meetings on impeachment around the country with Citizens Impeachment Commission speakers
12/15-17 Bill of Rights Weekend:
Collect petitions and handwritten letters at malls, libraries, post offices, and door-to-door
Sell pocket Constitutions, bumper stickers, books, videos
2007: Pass Impeachment bills in state legislatures
More details:
http://www.democrats.com/impeachforchange-plan

[cleveramerican]

43. hate them bastards over at democrats.com

they suck and I will continue to focus all of my Hell-energy their way.


They tolerate no opposing view ever, its a fascist environment over there.

I hate them with the white-hot intensity of a thousand suns.

[Lisa0825]

44. I am unsure of where I stand on it.

The railroading of Clinton angered me so intensely that a once uninvolved, uninterested Democratic voter became a lefty activist and donor (even on my limited budget).

I don't want impeachment just for the sake of revenge. I DO want it because of the multitudes of lives lost, the billions of dollars spent, and the loss of worldwide respect this idiot has caused us, all because of lies and manipulation.

HOWEVER, I DO NOT want it, if it will be railroaded through like Clinton's was, causing even more seething hate, and motivating our opposition against us the way it motivated me. I am much more interested in using our energy to repair the DAMAGE Bush has done and to show hopefully FORMER Republicans that life is better with Democrats in charge.

If using the threat of impeachment can get us a lot of things that we need to have done, I will be fine with that. And I do believe that some of the new leaders in our House and Senate, if they choose not to impeach, will use the power that threat holds to it's full potential.

[WestHoustonDem]

45. I say investigate and let the chips fall where they may.

If Dubya and Darth are guilty of high crimes and misdemeanors against this country, impeachment is appropriate and in fact required.