DID WE ELECT ENOUGH TRUE PATRIOTS TO IMPEACH A TYRANT?

[Jeffersons Ghost]

Perhaps the time has come to review a couple of articles from a near-sacred oath taken by U.S. Presidents, which arise from a rich tradition dating back to the Founders: "I do solemnly swear to preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution of the United States." In this oath the president must also "take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed," a duty directly imposed by the U.S. Constitution.

With his numerous attempts to dismantle the Bill of Rights and flagrant violations of not only Constitutional Law but also any rules governing human decency, isn't it time to draw up articles of impeachment? Since the oath is obviously broken; what more do they need? Let's get real. If the tyrant is EVER put under oath, several key questions will cause the stuttering shrub to purger himself in ways that will make Clinton look like a saint.

A better question, in the wake of media comments indicating that newly elected or re-elected Democratic leaders feel America wants them to work arm-in-arm with a bunch of traitors, thieves and liars is; did we elect the right people to fix our Democracy?

On this question, it appears there is good news and bad news:

On September 23, 2006, during a debate with Senator-elect Jon Tester (D), Senator-sunk Conrad Burns(R) in Butte, MT, said:

"He wants to weaken our families, weaken our security and to basically cut and run" from the war in Iraq, This statement by Burns was one of many in a campaign theme that presented Tester as soft on terror. Burns said he also supports programs monitoring telephone calls with minimal oversight and no warrants.

"He wants to weaken the Patriot Act," Burns added, while attacking Tester.

Tester sought to clarify, saying:

"I don't want to weaken the Patriot Act, I want to repeal it. What it does -- it takes away your freedom ... and when you take away our freedoms, the terrorists have won!"

Tester went on to say, "With things like the Patriot Act, we'd damn well better keep our guns."

While some Democratic candidates lost races by vacillating to hedge bets and appear strong on terrorism , Tester presents the kind of guts Americans admire. Some Democratic hopefuls foolishly made excuses for their wise votes against USA Patriot Act II, which severely inhibits basic civil liberties of ALL U.S. citizens. Tester won by showing spine and offering straight-talk. Whether, left, right or center, Tester embodies the kind of representation we ALL want in D.C.

The Tester comments are even more significant because he was not running for a Senate seat in deep-blue states like Vermont or Rhode Island; he won with those words in Montana, which went for Bush by a 20 point margin (59-39) in the last presidential elections.

Remarks by Tester bring back memories of a very popular current leader, Russ Feingold (D) WI, who is the only Senator to vote against the ORIGINAL U.S.A. Patriot Act.

oh yeah and the bad news... While I hope to be proven wrong, it appears that we did not elect enough real patriots to save America. Then again, are the people REALLY through speaking?

[Vorta]

1. Love the graphic eom

[Jeffersons Ghost]

6. check out the one further down... I saved a bunch of these type graphics for a series I'm doing...

I've put a few strong OPs out in the General Forum over the past few days on closely related topics. This one is still VERY active:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=2719120&mesg_id=2719120

[MethuenProgressive]

2. Like the SofL drawing...

...and no, the Dems in power don't have the balls to pursue Impeachment.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

3. we'll see, I don't count Nancy out! She may just be biding her time...

Not only character but also impeccable strategy mark her stellar political career. There's a lady, not unlike the caricature in the OP, who's locked and loaded for bear.

There are other impeachable issues I did not mention...

[RC]

4. Pursuing impeachment is a waste of time and resources.

Undo the damage he has done the last 6 years and make him sign or publicly veto the bills.

bu$h is like a big bill board. Keep him in the public view to remind the public of the damage he and his merry criminals have done while we repair the damage.

With bu$h gone all that will remain is the right wing spin machine. The facts will get lost in the noise again.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

8. that is an excellent point, still, doesn't something deep inside you scream out for justice?

[Jeffersons Ghost]

9. on second thought... if DUers dropped an issue whenever it was deemed a "waste of time"...

We would not have even voted in the last elections, with all the Diebold propaganda floating around these boards... I wish I had a dollar for every time someone at DU said a positive goal was a "waste of time" only to be proven wrong.

[RC]

20. bu$h&feinds will get theirs right after the war crimes trials.

250 years to life.

[Bitwit1234]

5. Impeachment

Who here thinks that you could get 2/3's of the congress to vote for impeachment. There is no way the republicans would vote. So if the democrats bring impeachment charges and the republicans fail to add their votes to get the 2/3 majority and you know as well as I do they won't, then how is that going to play out in the next election.

[razors edge]

7. Maybe the people who gave then

the power to impeach Bush will be grateful for the effort. How will those people feel and vote if the democrats don't use the power they were given.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

11. there you go DiktatrW... that's a US Marine Icon on your avitar isn't it?

Did you serve?

[razors edge]

13. VMFA 212 Kaneohe bay HI.

swing with the wing, Hawaii Marines.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

17. cool attached to a squadron too... I was with VP11 in '72... USN...

but don't hold that against me I quit telling Marine jokes years ago, except a few last week on a Veterans Day OP. LOL

<on edit> We took our oaths to "defend and protect" more seriously than punks who went AWOL from ANG didn't we?

[razors edge]

26. Damn straight.

Worked on the wayward Orion P-3 and Navy F-4 from time to time, no problems with Navy from me, They are actually the only force the founding fathers trusted to be funded on a permanent status. (Madison, federalist papers 40 or 41 I think)

[enough already]

10. I'm pretty sure the chances are zero if we don't even try

Impeach the nazi prick on day 1. The people want it.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

12. you tell um! enough already is a name you just earned! thanks for posting!

[Ravy]

14. Agree with me or you are not patriotic just doesn't play as well now

as it did 4 years ago. Sorry. Even in all caps.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

15. I'm sure that I'm not the only one here that has totally missed what you are trying to say...

could you please clarify? Did you stop reading right after the headline? LOL Back when I worked in media all caps is a way headlines often appear and that has not changed. All that said, what's your point?

[Jeffersons Ghost]

16. I've just been looking back through your history of comments at DU Ravy... quite interesting...

here was your last remark "We should elect you... since you know why every person voted
the way they did." A bit caustic isn't it, even if you do disagree with an OP? I also wonder why you so strongly support a very great man who has categorically stated he is not running for the office of president. If Gore ran I'd get behind him in a big way but I feel the guy is as honest as the day is long, so I'll sadly accept what he said

[Jeffersons Ghost]

19. hey ravy... we're all still anxiously awaiting your reply... cat got your tongue?

[Ravy]

22. Why do I want Gore?

I think he will run.

Why do I say things like "you know why people voted the way they did" to a poster called "God Almighty?" I think that should be obvious.

If the real question you want to ask is: Why did I reply to your post in such a way? I don't like it when someone says "If you are a TRUE patriot you will do this, or you will do that". I don't like litmus tests- particularly calling someones patriotism into question.

Why did I not respond sooner? The fact that you went back to research my posts doesn't impress me in the least, and I didn't feel it was worthy of a comment.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

23. good, you've finally addressed my first query... why would you need to go check posts? I saw no OPs

If someone's OP is board-clogging right-wing crap, why not let it fade quickly from view instead of kicking it up with controversy? Now to my OP: WHERE DID I SAY ANYTHING LIKE: "If you are a TRUE patriot you will do this, or you will do that". If you are going to attack an OP, at least show the wisdom to first read the copy.

by the way, this is rich! lol

[Ravy]

24. "DID WE ELECT ENOUGH TRUE PATRIOTS TO (insert litmus test here).."

certainly implies that representatives who do not agree with impeachment are not "TRUE PATRIOTS".

Like I said, that tactic/rhetoric is overdone. As far as the "WHERE DID I SAY ANYTHING LIKE: "If you are a TRUE patriot you will do this, or you will do that?" ", parsing/denying words is overdone, too.

[Oldenuff]

18. Whats more important....

Impeachment pales in comparison to demanding our freedoms back.

Repeal the Patriot Act.
Repeal the Real ID act.







Tester sought to clarify, saying:

"I don't want to weaken the Patriot Act, I want to repeal it. What it does -- it takes away your freedom ... and when you take away our freedoms, the terrorists have won!"


Tester went on to say, "With things like the Patriot Act, we'd damn well better keep our guns."

[Jeffersons Ghost]

21. AMEN TO THAT Oldenuff, it's my theme of the week... will you also say that here?...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=2719120&mesg_id=2719120

[onenote]

25. how many candidates made impeachment a part of their platform?

Approximately next to nobody (and of the few that did, virtually all lost). So how do you propose a member of congress justify making impeachment a centerpiece of his/her agenda if he/she didn't make it even a footnote of the campaign?

Greater oversight and investigations were part of the platform of a number of campaigns and that's why those actions are appropriate. But talking about impeachment now, when no one talked about in campaigns that ended a week ago is a particularly piss poor move strategically.

[leesa]

27. They'll have to be forced. Too many people have forgotten the lesson of

Iran/Contra and Vietnam even though we are suffering the consequences of not prosecuting those criminals for the crimes they committed.

"It's too hard!" "It'll be a waste of time!" "Let's focus on this or that."

If we make the mistake of allowing these crimes to go unpunished once again they will come back bigger and badder the next time.

[understandinglife]

28. "If we make the mistake of allowing these crimes to go unpunished once again they will come back ...

... bigger and badder the next time."

True.

Historically, an entirely valid observation.

And, it is rather hard to imagine exceeding the crimes already committed by Bu$h and his neoconster minions.


IT IS TRIBUNAL TIME IN THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. --- as I've stated many times before.

It is for "We the People ...." to clean house if we ever want "the law" to mean anything, ever again, in the USofA.


BE THE BU$H OPPOSITION - 24/7

[Ravy]

30. Iran-Contra investigaton thwarted prosecution of Oliver North

Please don't assume critics that don't want to see the Democrats impeach Bush want him to go unpunished.

Would impeachment for war crimes (whether he gets removed from office by 2/3rds of the Senate or not) prevent him from being tried again for the same crime (double jeopardy) or extradited to another country that has filed charges? Do you want to leave that question up to our current Supreme Court?

[Donald Ian Rankin]

29. a) not wanting to impeach doesn't mean you're not a patriot; b) we don't have the votes to impeach.

Attempting to impeach would achieve nothing except bringing the Republicans back to power.

Implying "if you don't support impeachment, you're not a patriot" is exactly like saying "if you don't support praying for George Bush to be struck by lightning, you're not a patriot".