Want to know what Dean is trying to change? The implications?

[madfloridian]

Read all of this blog. I did not realize half of this was going on. I will just post some snips...

http://thenexthurrah.typepad.com/the_next_hurrah/2006/11/backstory_on_ca.html

"I was in a good position to argue for the program because in the 1980's while chairing Alan Cranston's campaign here, I had discovered how pathetic many of our state parties actually were. Many were literally bankrupt, the office supplies and machines (typewriters) had been taken for unpaid debt, and padlocks were on the door. The State Committees that had the franchise were held in one or another lawyer's file cabinet, (In Georgia it had been Bert Lance's for about 20 years), and the reason for this condition was frankly racism. The Southern States would not allow the release of the franchise to a newly elected Central Committee or Board, because it would be Black. They could do this because the parties were in bankruptcy, and whatever lawyer had the letterhead in his files was also the court appointed trustee.

When Dean took over the DNC -- this was the condition of about twelve of our State Parties. He actually had to find lawyers to go into court and get the parties out of this kind of "Trusteeship" before he could even begin to reorganize. In fact, one of the reasons some of the Field Organizers Dean appointed are on the staff of the DNC rather than state parties is because it avoids dealing with old trustees and old court judgments.

"One essential difference between Democrats and Republicans, I think, is that we actually conduct elections for Party Chair. How Mehlman morphed to Steel and then on to Martinez, I don't really know, but I do know that kind of "top down" was not how Dean got his job. He got it because he understood that in many places the party was sick -- and he had a plan to bring it back to health.

According to reporting on KO, Hillary Clinton's office is saying they did not "sign off" on the Carville attack on Dean. As Keith said, that is a bit nuanced, and it needs follow up. The language of "sign off" bothers.

Indeed the ultimate question is whether local party organizations can select their own representatives or whether that power will be taken away from the state parties by the DSCC and the DCCC who substitute themselves (as elected officials) for the party organization or the DNC and what creates it. That is what is at stake."

I care because I live in Florida, and I know more than I want to know about the back-stabbing and smoke-filled rooms.

So James,...MYOB and let Dean his job because he is doing FOR us..not you.

[snowbear]

1. Carville needs to shut his chompers...

He's totally losing it...

[LittleClarkie]

5. Good lord. He DOES look like Gollem

Interesting sig you got there.

[creeksneakers2]

2. T here is no evidence

that the Clintons had anything to do with Carville's attacks.

I believe the left is being played by a GOP initiative to divide the party. This whole story about the Clintons and Carville makes no sense at all on any level. Dean isn't even up for reelection this year. He has a four year term. Posters pushing the Clinton/Carville hoax on DailyKos use the word "Clintonistas." I've never seen a real lefty use that term.

The Clintons have no reason to stir up a hornet's nest.

[madfloridian]

3. I did not say there was. That is NOT the point of this post. Not at all.

I happen not to know, but since they have not said anything except Carville did not clear it with them...well, come on.

Rahm did call Dean, and they are going to talk and make some plans for 08.

I agree with KO...it needs more explanation.

But again, that was not my point. This is not my blog...I am not that much in the know.

[LittleClarkie]

6. What is a "real lefty"

And how can you tell from a post on a blog if they are or they aren't? Do they type differently?

[creeksneakers2]

10. Using RW terms

using RW logic. Repeating things Rash Limbaugh said with the assumption that what is being said is unconverted fact. Stuff like that. Wild conspiracy theories with the Clintons masterminding every public event to suit some super-sinister Clinton lusts. Stuff like that.

Do I know a lefty from a righty for sure? No, but there is a pattern going around the net of trying to blame this on the Clintons,with very similar posts. I heard the exact same story on Rash Limbaugh today. I've seen RW propaganda laced into many of these net posts.

Its true that lefties are picking up on some of these ideas. Why in the world would what the Clintons did even be looked into, when there is no evidence at all that they did anything? Its like the old Clinton smears, where the Clintons denials were never enough. They have to prove their innocence once something is made up about them. What sense does that make?

I monitor RW propaganda and I'm convinced they have a plot to start a big fight within the Democratic Party and are using the remarks of one person alone, James Carville, to incite a war. Many are getting sucked in and that is why I am raising such a fuss over one line in the lead post.

Just to make sure I'm not misunderstood, I am in no way accusing the author of this thread of not being anything but a 100% sincere poster.

[madfloridian]

12. Carville started it, no warning...just lit into Dean.

There was no reason for it. However, he and Begala are most definitely now and always have been Clinton advisors or close to them in some capacity.

Why would they phrase their answer that way...that he had not cleared it with them? Was it a joke? I have not seen the actual quote...just what I read.

Carville is connected to the Clintons. Rahm is intrinsically tied to them. Rahm called Dean to distance himself from the Carville remarks, and he even had his own problems with Carville earlier.

It is not just "lefties" who are concerned about what is going on in the party. It is not just RW either. A lot of us in the middle are very concerned.

There was no reason for this attack on Dean, we had just won huge. It is important to be honest now, no more spin. There is too much at stake. Iraq was the turning point. Many of us now believe that the former White House residents know that Saddam was no threat. Many of us believe the invasion could have been stopped if it had been desired. That's a tragic and sad thing to feel about your party and leaders. I blame not the ones who were caught in the middle in congress...I did, but I am getting over some of it...I blame the ones who knew and did nothing.

Joe Lieberman said he did not want any digging around into who did what in 2003, and I wonder if that is why most of the major Democrats who had pushed for the war...not the ones caught in the middle...worked for Joe to win.

He has a role to play. But I digress. There are serious things going on, things that have gone on since October 2002.

[creeksneakers2]

13. The most likely reason to phrase it

"didn't sign off on" is Carville calling up the Clintons and asking their permission and not getting it. That's how it looks to me, anyway.

[blm]

19. Interesting, since HILLARY used a RW lie to scold Kerry and you stayed silent

and didn't see any cause to note that WITH HER OWN VOICE she used that lie when every ONE of us KNEW BushInc and the media were lying outright.

I saw no concern from you worried that RW spin was effecting feigned outrage from Democrats and their bullshitting camps.

[paulk]

20. you left out that there are

a lot of Democrats who trash other Democrats for their own reasons - mostly having to do, at this time, with the upcoming 2008 Presidential election. And they're perfectly willing to use right wing propaganda in these efforts.

[blm]

18. Baloney - Carville wouldn't have even attempted it without talking to Clintons.

And no one I know here on DU uses the word Clintonistas - it's almost always the Clinton team or Clintonites, just as they say Clarkies or Deaniacs or Kerrycrats.

To say that Clinton didn't know what Carville was going to do is like saying Bush didn't know what Rove was doing.

UN - BE - LIEVABLE.

[MichiganVote]

4. Carville is the Gollum of the Democratic party

[Cha]

7. I like that KO is investigating

this whole carville shooting off his mouth and not "signed off" by hillary episode.

Don't make any mistakes in the media, though, Dean or hillary will come out and say "It's inappropriate".

[W.E.B. Du Bois]

8. Is it possible for us to be building up the base when there is NOT an imminent election?

Just a thought.

[madfloridian]

9. The plan is to leave the directors in the states.

And to keep on building. That is why the Democracy Bond idea is so important, so they know what they have to work with.

That's the plan I think.

[cadmium]

11. This is Extremely Important: Dean is right.

You can't get votes counted properly if the other side controls the local election machinery. Dean is 100% right to focus on county, state, local party work as well as national.

[bemildred]

14. Dean is attempting the overthrow of the existing political order

in this country, nothing less. Peacefully, democratically, of course.

[MaineDem]

16. I agree with you

The Democratic Party in many states - most states - is now much more powerful than it has ever been because of the 50-state strategy. States now have more structure and the ability to grow substantially going into the 2008 cycle. The "exisiting olitical order" of the large presidential campaigns is being challenged by this. Carville is afraid of losing his edge.

And I have it on excellent authority that Hillary has indeed not "signed off" on Carville's tirade. Bill --- I'm not so sure.

[madfloridian]

15. This post has many fascinating comments...

I just took time to read some of them, very interesting.

http://thenexthurrah.typepad.com/the_next_hurrah/2006/11/backstory_on_ca.html

[mandyky]

17. Carville even said he longed for decisions made

in smoke filled rooms right atfer Dean was elected Chair. This new attack is just more of the same, but I dare say the State Party Heads won't let the DLC or Democratic machinery oust Dean, as long as results continue the way they did this year.

[xxqqqzme]

21. early in '07, in California anyway, CDP will have caucuses

to elect executive board members to the state committee (every odd numbered year). Our local Central Committee members were elected in the June Primary - I was elected then - 2nd highest vote count among the candidates, thank you very much. California is different in that each county elects 12 members per State Assembly District, The State charter mandates the members be 6 women and 6 men.