I need help responding to a 'democrats have no ideas' post

[tulsakatz]

especially related to the Iraq war. I know many Democrats have offered ideas but I'm looking for specific info if possible.

Thanks.

[wyldwolf]

1. there are many well thought out plans.

We just haven't really decided on one.

[thoughtanarchist]

2. Do I have a link for you!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=231930

Note the title!

Then enjoy the benefits of the contents.

[tulsakatz]

13. thanks!

this is exactly what I was looking for!

[Phredicles]

3. Obama and HClinton have both called for withdrawls according to

schedules (as Murtha has been doing for a long time), while my man Kucinich is saying we should just get the fuck out yesterday.

[Buzz Clik]

4. errr... you need ideas to confirm that Dems have ideas?

Maybe you're the wrong one to be arguing that side of the debate.

[jilln]

10. lol!

[noamnety]

5. I'm confused

Why again is "stay" considered "a plan," while "leave" isn't?

[patrice]

9. Excellent! I'm using that one . . .

for all of those folks who don't really want to hear the details, or for those situations in which giving the details would be difficult if not impossible.

[Felinity]

6. Try a little one-upsmanship

Since every idea, policy, executive order, and war that the Repugs have indulged in for the past 6 years has had a negative impact on our Country, our lives, and our reputation in the world; wouldn't we all be better off if the country had taken a 6 year "idea vacation". So basically, if the Democrats spend four years undoing, repairing, and re-doing everything that * and Co. have fucked up, that would be miraculous.

[Vincardog]

7. When anyone says 'democrats have no ideas' why don't you just

laugh in their face? They have either been dead or plugged into Faux newz.
Either way they are either brain dead or willfully ignorant.

[tulsakatz]

15. actually it's a poster on an email list I belong to......

plus he's a new member and even though he's bought into the talking point that 'democrats have no ideas', he's supposed to lean liberal. So I'd rather not insult him......I'd rather list facts to convince him that he's bought into the wrong argument.

[Vincardog]

16. IF he believes the RW talking points it is only because he is too lazy to pay attention.

Be careful the RW nutz like to keep asking the same tired question and try to force you to disprove their lies. This puts all the effort into your court. They just keep drooling and saying "Huh?" They then repeat the next non sensical LimpBalled talking point.

How can the Democratic elected officials have no ideas when the NeoConvicts are afraid to debate them?

[BOSSHOG]

8. They hate democrats for their ideas and then

repeat the talking points that dems don't have any ideas. Dumbass motherfuckers who support bush don't deserve their citizenship. Please share my idea with them.

[MissMarple]

11. Check out Wes Clark at Securing America.

Click on Issues and Position Papers. The general has a lot of ideas.

www.securingamerica.com

Du's FrenchieCat has a great list of General Clark's ideas on Iran. It's phenomenal. It is also linked on his home page at Securing America.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x3124002

[opihimoimoi]

12. No Ideas are better than BAAAAD IDEAS....esp...Bad Pubic Ideas....

[MissMarple]

14. hmmm...interesting.

:)

[KingFlorez]

17. The first 100 hours in the House is a good example of Democratic ideas

There are plenty of Democrats with ideas and Republicans know that, they just want to pretend.

[ClassWarrior]

18. Tell the freep to do its own research. It's out there aplenty.

NGU.

[FrenchieCat]

19. Well here's an idea!

sign the petition and forward to your friend.....
it's from Clark and VoteVet.....letting Bush know that since Iraq is going so badly, don't even think about Iran! -- http://www.stopiranwar.com/

[Debs]

20. See the thing about that talking points isnt that they want to hear ideas

Look what they have dont to Murthas plan. No, the Dems not putting out official plans they loudly champion, makes the GOP mad because they want something to demonize. They want ANY alternative plan so they can call us traitors for not marching along in total conformity to THIER catastrophic plans. Not that we havent given them ideas, and not that they broke Iraq and have the major responsibility to fix it. Its kind of like we saw a guy who bougt a pick and shovel and we TOLD him not to dig himself into a deep hole. He told us we were unpatriotic and he was going to dig a hole to China we told him it was impossible and he started digging. Periodically we came by and told him as he got deeper and deepre. STOP DIGGING. NOW he is criticising us WHILE STILL DIGGING, for not having a plan to get him out of the hole and that he is going to reach China any minute. The hole is starging to fill with water we have offered a ladder and he still lashes out at us for not already having him out while the water is to his waist and his answer is to dig faster.

[MiniMe]

21. There are tons of proposals and resolutions, the republicans refuse to debate them

[sendero]

22. Here's a good idea..

... don't start wars you can't finish.

[karynnj]

23. There is no one Democratic leader because Bush is President

so there are many plans and have been since 2003. Many were mentioned here. However, compared to Bush's plan - never really explained - just experienced, most of the Democratic plans can be seen as variations on each other. You could point out that Democrats have suggested many alternative plans since 2003.

You can also point out that the Iraq Study group recommended a solution that contained the basic elements of the plans Kerry proposed in 2004, as our nominee and in October, 2005 as the situation deteriorated. After Kerry's speech at NYU where he carefully laid out his plan, the RNC claimed it was "what Bush was doing" - then they declared Kerry had no plan. Bush threw a similar accusation at Kerry in the first debate.

History has since shown that Bush did not have the same plan - Bush did not have the diplomatic summit, did not tell the Iraqis that we did not want permanent bases, did not rapidly use the help of other countries to train the Iraqis etc. Since then, Kerry's position and that of other Democrats have shifted to deal with a constantly worsening situation.

Since Kerry lost, there has been no one leader on Iraq in the Democratic party. Many people have expressed ideas - Clark, Feingold, Harkin, Murtha, Biden, Levin, Reed, Obama and lately Clinton. Many have translated it to legislation. It is not a lack of a plan - we have many - but lack of the power - which only the President has to actually change the policy.