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soothsayer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 01:09 PM
Original message
Bush says Gonzales to remain in job regardless of outcome of
the Senate hearings. Just heard on Sirius 146 (talk left). The actual quote was "The WH maintains that the firings were entirely proper even tho they were mishandled, and a spokesowman says as far as Bush is concerned, Gonzales will keep his job regardless of the hearing's outcome." That was from AP's Mark Smith, traveling with the president.
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Robbien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
1. not surprising
What happens if Gonzo doesn't quit.

I see nothing happening.
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Hieronymus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-20-07 01:21 AM
Response to Reply #1
26. I'd have been shocked if Bush said anything else.
Bush has to believe that he's the "decider".:eyes:
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grasswire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
2. even if he's charged with perjury?
That would be interesting.
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dflprincess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 01:12 PM
Response to Original message
3. Gonzo kept Bush's DWI from going public back in Texas
I imagine he knows where a lot of Bushco's bodies are buried and they're worried about him talking.
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AndyA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 01:12 PM
Response to Original message
4. In other words...
George Bush: "Fuck you, America. Fuck you, Congress. Fuck you, Constitution. It's just a G*d damned piece of paper anyway. I'll do whatever the hell I want to do, and I dare you to try and stop me.

I may be a miserable little shit but I've managed to screw things up royally for most of the world. Congress don't have big enough balls to take me on! Bring it, Congress. Bring it on...I'm ready and waiting, and Dick is locked and loaded..."

:sarcasm:

Congress needs to take action. SERIOUS ACTION. We cannot continue to wait.
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calimary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 01:19 PM
Response to Reply #4
9. I hope you're calling at least one or two congresscritters about this.
Edited on Thu Apr-19-07 01:19 PM by calimary
Yours and maybe somebody else's too. Doesn't matter which side of the aisle, either. Please note the convenient TOLL FREE Capitol Hill switchboard numbers in my sig line below... won't cost you ANYTHING except a couple of minutes of your time.
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AndyA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 01:24 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. Oh yes, I call pretty regularly.
It doesn't do a bit of good to call my reps, though. Jim Inhofe, John Sullivan. One or the other of those two is sniffing *'s butt at any given time. They are both "Loyal Bushies."

I call and write others as well, and they always tell me as a courtesy they will forward my message to my rep. I now tell them in my message to just skip the courtesy, that I have no representation. And I truly do not.
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calimary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 07:42 PM
Response to Reply #11
17. Not so that it does no good to call your reps. Even if they're among
Edited on Thu Apr-19-07 07:48 PM by calimary
the enemy camp, it's VERY good to call them and help them start to get a clearer view of just how seriously surrounded they are.

A republi-CON with a tight sphincter is a lovely thing. And a few of them (not yours, most likely, considering who they are) may wind up being this era's Barry Goldwater (Goldwater being the point man taking "that" message to richard nixon - to resign or be impeached, because the last of his support in Congress had utterly collapsed). In fact, I called that coburn guy today, I could tell the staffer who answered my call reluctantly agreed with everything I said. I could tell by the tone of voice and the begrudging agreement with my points. That's one staffer who will not rest very easy tonight. And those staffers do share what they've heard and seen, in fact they probably each have to write up a report of some kind on what kind of phone traffic they had that day. This staffer will share a disquieting conversation that she would probably have given anything not to have to hear, especially if she found herself deep-down sharing my view (that gonzo has to resign, that he's making the whole party look bad, helping to make them look bad enough to lose more momentum and all hopes of regaining the majority - in the next election).

DO IT ANYWAY. Because you WANT the enemy unnerved. You WANT their sense of security, stability, and invulnerability shattered, their nerves rattled, their sleep fitful. You WANT them tied up in knots. You WANT them reverting to a few extra drinks, a few more valium, a few more Maalox. You WANT their stomachs angry and filled with acid all the time. They have a LOT of defense - REALLY SERIOUS defense to play (serious enough to be talking about some pretty heavy legal trouble, perjury, obstruction of justice, maybe even doin' time..., and worst of all, losing elections!). But playing defense this extreme takes FOCUS. LOTS of it. And if they're stressed out, not sleeping well, and scared to death about 2008 with the handwriting already on the wall that they don't want to face but can't help reading, then they CAN'T focus. And they'll further blow their game. You DEFINITELY want them upset, stressed out, nervous, despondent, discouraged, fighting with the spouse/lover/kids/neighbors/roommates, filled with a sense of dread, nursing some nice new ulcers in the making. You WANT their fingernails gnawed down to the knuckles, tossing and turning in bed at night and waking up in a cold sweat. And starting to panic. And to make more mistakes. They're NOT on top of their game that way, and that's EXACTLY where we want 'em. EXACTLY where we want 'em.

Besides, these staffers and congressional aides ALL talk. Gossip. Cry in their beer after hours together. They ALL talk. This stuff gets around. And if you demoralize one staffer, he or she might turn around and share the dreadful, worrisome stuff they just heard with another colleague, and demoralize THAT person also. So you get two for the price of one. They ALL talk. They ALL go get coffee together, grab a smoke together, go to the cafeteria together or share Chinese takeout after hours together. And word spreads. Might as well help spread the frayed nerves, too!

For the sheer sake of DESTABILIZING THE ENEMY, you should be calling them. ANYWAY. This is the proverbial infrastructure, like a bridge. You're like the resistance fighter sneaking a small bomb under one of the supports of one of the enemy's bridges. Boom! The support fails. Then the whole bridge does. Besides, you never know who you're talking to, and who could be the next defector... with a few songs to sing or a little inside dope to smoke... Either because they've just given up and want to stay out of trouble, OR they have something of their own to protect.

DO IT ANYWAY. Destabilizing the enemy is a MOST worthy effort here, especially now. Especially since we've got SO MUCH raw material to work with, and the momentum and public opinion are both with us.

:evilgrin:
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chknltl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 11:13 PM
Response to Reply #17
20. calimary
Just so you know: :loveya:
(You think outside the box in a way that quite frankly, I admire. This very post is but one example of this! bookmarked)
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calimary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-20-07 01:00 AM
Response to Reply #20
24. Thanks, my friend!
Edited on Fri Apr-20-07 01:04 AM by calimary
Cheers back atcha!

Frankly, we ALL need to think outside the box with these people. They're VERY devious, and they're quite good at it. So we have to out-think them to stay ahead of them, and of course, ultimately to defeat them.

What I always try to remember are the watchwords of the character Mad-Eye Moody in the later Harry Potter books. Mad-Eye Moody is a VERY banged-up veteran of some evidently horrendous wizarding wars. He's got battle-scars all over himself. He teaches Harry Potter and friends the "Defense Against the Dark Arts" class, in one of the books. He frequently exhorts his students, in class and outside of class: "CONSTANT VIGILANCE!!!" I think that's a pretty darn good reminder for US, here, and elsewhere in the progressive underground. We're up against kkkarl rove, the bush/cheney machinery, the richard mellon scaifes of the world, and of course the whole RNC/Pox Noise/limbaugh juggernaut. That's a daunting collection of adversaries. They've been plotting, planning, building, and investing in this take-over quest of theirs for 40-some-odd years. They learn very decisively from past mistakes. Ever wonder why, up til now, some of 'em seldom (if ever, in bush and cheney's case) have agreed to, or bothered to, testify UNDER OATH? It's because they know that's what finally nailed Clinton. Ever wonder why they went to such extremes to bully the media into not showing the soldiers' coffins and body bags coming back to the States from the war, no flag-draped coffins, no funerals, no coverage? Serious penalties if you dared to defy this? That's because constant coverage of that sort of thing during the Vietnam War on the evening news EVERY NIGHT eventually soured the public, BIGTIME, against the war. This regime happens to be FILLED with refugees from the Watergate, post-Watergate, reagan, and bush-1 regimes. People like cheney and rummy saw how Watergate left the presidency defanged and resented the hell out of it, and how the nonstop persecution of Clinton annoyed that administration like a nonstop cloud of gnats.

They learned. And they carefully built this HUGE, awesome machinery, this infrastructure of media control, across-theboard power, and all kinds of ways to outthink us, surround us, and keep us on the defensive. They've invested in big-ass think tanks where their most shrewd and devious minds can hide out during the periods when they're out of power, and churn out lots of things like books and position papers and other published crap that then allows them to go on radio and TV and write op/eds and guest commentaries in major newspapers and magazines, to further spread their message. Meantime, those think tanks are also busily grooming the next generation of jackals all well-trained, well-scripted, well-funded, well-connected, and well-motivated, ready to run for office, take over institutions, get nominated for appointee positions from which they can jump to bigger and better things. Kinda like those armies of clones in one of the "Star Wars" films. Publishing all that crap then gives them "credentials" that build on their "reputation" as "experts" - thus further elevating them in respectability. Their richard vigueries and ralph reeds worked from the bottom up, starting YEARS ago, starting foundations and study groups and funding infrastructures and grassroots organizing, trying to win itty bitty victories like obscure little school board seats and local stuff - FROM WHICH THEY COULD BUILD, AND GAIN GROUND, AND GAIN CLOUT, AND GO HIGHER. Happily enough, Howard Dean is now doing that for OUR side with his 50-State Strategy. It works. Look what happened last November, just for starters.

They're big, strong, daunting, intimidating, with mucho bigtime firepower and all the money of Midas. They seriously remind me of the Empire in "Star Wars," seemingly invincible with all those terrifying weapons and huge, imposing Death Stars and unbelievable powers. Or maybe Goliath. But even Goliath had a weakness. So did the Death Star.

And then there's us. They may be the big, fearsome Death Star, alright, and we may be teeny, but we also have maneuverability, we can stop on a dime, accelerate in a heartbeat, with a turning radius that you can wrap around your wrist. They may be Goliath, but WE are David. And we all know who won that one.

They are COUNTING on us not calling their bluff. They are COUNTING on us being afraid. They are COUNTING on us being intimidated. They are COUNTING on us to cave and write ourselves off as losers before we even suit up. They're COUNTING on us to believe the bullshit and the smoke and mirrors and all their manufactured PR and give up before we even try to fight. We win one from them already if we refuse to play that game - of THEIRS. I don't want to do that. I'd rather play MY game. OUR game. For myself personally, I don't have a lot of money or position or connections, but what I can do is strategize how psy-ops, even on a small, individual scale, can win even one teeny little battle. I don't mind being the termite that starts chewing into the huge, reinforced, water-proofed wooden dam. If enough of us get to work on it, eventually that
dam starts looking like a piece of swiss cheese. And then it fails. You use what you have. Hate to quote scummy rummy, but okay, maybe you do go to war with the army you have, not the army you want or wish to have. So we work with what we've got. And even if we're little, there are STILL things we can do - that start to add up. We just need to KEEP working, stay creative so we can outthink the enemy, and maintain that CONSTANT VIGILANCE. Howard Dean said the only way we lose is if we give up. And funny enough, as of last November, we suddenly weren't all that little anymore, were we?

:evilgrin: :hug:
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Diane R Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 01:13 PM
Response to Original message
5. He said that about Rumsfeld, too.
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louis-t Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 01:15 PM
Response to Original message
6. That's the 'Kiss of Death'.
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kestrel91316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 01:16 PM
Response to Original message
7. Told ya so not half an hour ago. NONE of these criminals will resign or
be fired. NOT ONE.
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fooj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 01:17 PM
Response to Original message
8. In other words...
Hey Senate...Go f*ck yourselves.
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State the Obvious Donating Member (561 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 01:21 PM
Response to Original message
10. So...after the hearings, Congress should vote to impeach Gonzales.
Then what will Bush say?...... Congress can't do that because he (Bush) is " the Decider"? :crazy:
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indepat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 01:41 PM
Response to Reply #10
13. Congress can impeach, but 'puke senators will stay loyal to der fuhrer if they know what's good for
them, so conviction is not in the offing no matter how compelling the case.
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State the Obvious Donating Member (561 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 02:26 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. OK....but......
If Congress at least goes through the process of TRYING to impeach Gonzalez, (even knowing they cannot do it because of Republican loyalty to Bush)....... they will have SHOWN the American people who wanted Gonzalez removed that it was the Republicans (many of whom will be up for election) who kept him in as Attorney General.

It would logically follow then..... if you wanted Gonzalez impeached.....and Republican voted to keep him...... then DON'T VOTE FOR REPUBLICANS IN THE NEXT ELECTION!

(OK...it is a round-about way of getting things done.....but, all I am saying is Democrats shouldn't "fold up their tent" too soon.)
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indepat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 04:02 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. I'm all for this and calling the 'pukes' hand/exposing the 'pukes at every possible opportunity:
expose their corruption, mendacity, duplicity, disingenuousness, anti-American unconstitutional stances and acts. This can be done in part by introducing legislation to overturn everything bad 'pukes have passed these last six years and let the people see how 'pukes and dinos vote and what W vetoes. Then tell the people how it is and has been in every campaign speech. This is a war to save our Republic so send the 'pukes to proverbial hell/political oblivion.
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damntexdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 01:40 PM
Response to Original message
12. Why it's so easy for Dubya to say this:
1) the more Gonzo is shown to be incompetent, the better Dubya feels about him; and
2) Dubya is capable of saying this and then turning around in a heartbeat and dumping Gonzo.
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flpoljunkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 01:51 PM
Response to Original message
14. The Emperor has decreed that his consigliere will keep his job. They have no shame, no integrity.
Edited on Thu Apr-19-07 02:07 PM by flpoljunkie
If Gonzales had a shred of self-respect, he would resign. Unfortunately, he apparently does not.
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YvonneCa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 07:56 PM
Response to Original message
18. President Clinton disagrees...
...I'll go with Clinton. :7
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depakid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 08:08 PM
Response to Original message
19. Why shouldn't Bush say and do that?
The Democratic "leadership" has backed down and rolled over on just about every single thing that's come before them.

If I were Bush, I'd call them on their bluffs again. No reason not to.
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Canuckistanian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 11:18 PM
Response to Original message
21. Good! They can go down together.
That's right, Bunnypants. Just secure that millstone around your neck.
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minnesota_liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-19-07 11:51 PM
Response to Original message
22. Can you impeach an entire administration and all of its appointees?
The whole lot of 'em are corrupt and unworthy. And to think that our country was once a beacon of hope for the world.
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HuckleB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-20-07 12:22 AM
Response to Original message
23. Bush said the same thing about Rumsfeld, three days before Donald resigned.
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drp146 Donating Member (11 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-20-07 01:03 AM
Response to Reply #23
25. I was about to post the same thing and noticed you beat me to it
except for the quote, that is.
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Eurobabe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-20-07 01:58 AM
Response to Original message
27. Fuck Bush n/t
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radfringe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-20-07 04:54 AM
Response to Original message
28. mmmmmm...me thinks he doth protest too much
sounds like a cut/paste statement about his support for Rummy...just before Rummy "resigned"

the big difference is bush isn't running for re-(s)election.... but many of the republics in congress are....

There are indications the republics are "concerned" about the decider's support for Gonzo - from what I was able to read on the DU running commentary, and various articles - the republics at the hearing did not limit their questions to the "what's your favorite color?" variety.

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DFW Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-20-07 06:50 AM
Response to Original message
29. When Bush says that Fredo is doin' a heck of a job...
Then it's time to tune in for his successor's confirmation hearings.

They'll try to stonewall, but as it stands now, I'd give him about as
much chance of being Attorney General in six weeks as I'd give him to
being Prime Minister of Sweden.
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-20-07 08:02 AM
Response to Reply #29
30. Yup...the KISS OF DEATH is what Bush did to Gonzo
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L. Coyote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-20-07 08:39 AM
Response to Original message
31. Rumsfeld is doing a great job and has my supreme confidence. He will stay. n/t
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primative1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-20-07 08:43 AM
Response to Original message
32. Russer Actualy pegged it ..
Said Gonzo was trying to walk the line between being corrupt or just incompetent
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