Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

It is June the 5th. Let's take a moment to remember a great progressive who was shot on this day

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU
 
draft_mario_cuomo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-04-07 11:42 PM
Original message
It is June the 5th. Let's take a moment to remember a great progressive who was shot on this day
Edited on Mon Jun-04-07 11:43 PM by draft_mario_cuomo


Imagine how different America and the world would be if RFK had been elected in 1968 instead of Nixon. We could have truly become one America if he had lived.

==His brother, Senator Ted Kennedy, eulogized him with the words, "My brother need not be idealized or enlarged in death beyond what he was in life, to be remembered simply as a good and decent man, who saw wrong and tried to right it, saw suffering and tried to heal it, saw war and tried to stop it."==


"Some men see things as they are and say 'Why?' I dream things that never were and say, 'Why not?'"--RFK
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
CaliforniaPeggy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-04-07 11:45 PM
Response to Original message
1. He would not recognize what has happened to his country...
He would be appalled....

RIP, Robert F. Kennedy......:patriot:


:cry:

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
polichick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-05-07 07:05 PM
Response to Reply #1
10. His daughter Kathleen was on Hardball tonite...
And said he would be disappointed.

I too feel like crying.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Art_from_Ark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-04-07 11:58 PM
Response to Original message
2. I remember hearing of his death
Summer vacation had just started. I went over to a friend's house in the morning, and all his sisters were gathered around the TV, crying. All the registered voters in his family were going to vote for Kennedy. Instead, they ended up voting for Wallace, like so many others in the South.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Liberty Belle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-05-07 12:33 AM
Response to Original message
3. A dear friend was there the night RFK died. He worked on the campaign.
We watched the movie "Bobby" together recently and cried. Such a tragedy and travesty.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Common Sense Party Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-05-07 01:22 AM
Response to Original message
4. Help me out, I was just getting born in 1968.
How would we have "truly become one America" if RFK had lived?

What, exactly, would be different?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-05-07 03:12 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Bobby was a "Cold Warrior", even moreso, indeed, much moreso, than his brother,
JFK (who did some rather remarkable things as president, such as refusing to support the CIA invasion of Cuba, defusing a potential nuclear holocaust with Soviet Russia, and, finally, toward the end of his life, signing executive orders to start withdrawing U.S. military "advisers" from Vietnam). Bobby had been part of Joe McCarthy's red-baiting committee in his early career. But, after his brother was assassinated, Bobby changed--dramatically and genuinely. He turned against the Vietnam War (which Johnson had escalated into a full scale war by then). He became an advocate of the poor--not just here but also in South America. And he had been strongly committed to civil rights as JFK's Attorney General. He was a "Cold Warrior" on the way to becoming a true populist and a true peacemaker. And perhaps that is the key to Bobby--his ability to CHANGE, to grow, to learn, to be innovative, to be MOVED by those he met, from all classes, his intelligence, his open-heartedness, his desire for new information, and his ability to absorb it and to formulate new thoughts and goals.

His death was a blow like no other--because, only three months before, Martin Luther King had been assassinated, and it was only five years from the seering wound of his brother's assassination. This triple blow effectively beheaded the progressive movement in the U.S. It never recovered. About a million people had been slaughtered in the Vietnam War to that point. Another million more would be slaughtered by that lying bastard Nixon (who campaigned in 1968 promising "peace with honor" and claiming to have a "secret plan" to end the war, and, once elected, ESCALATED the war into Cambodia and Laos--for five more years of utter horror in Southeast Asia).

It is a judgment of character--with regard to RFK--that tells me, and all those who were politically awake on the progressive side at that time, that he would have ended the war. He was sincere. But even more than this, the horrid slaughters that were to come in South America would likely not have occurred either. He had genuinely connected with aspirations of the poor, there and here. Just like his brother, he had an aura that transcended politics. He spoke HONESTLY--something very rare in politics, and almost non-existent since the Reagan Era.

Had his brother lived, and had he lived, we would be a far, far, different country in every way. What was needed was a re-thinking of the "military-industrial complex"--as Dwight Eisenhower, rather amazingly saw, at the end of his presidency. The war industries that had sucked at the government tit in the post-WW II era needed to be demobilized. Swords into plowshares. That never occurred. And soon they were MANUFACTURING war--in Vietnam--to feed the beast. It needed a VISIONARY president--with the kind of high-minded, visionary capacity that both JFK and RFK possessed--combined with their practical political skills and great charisma, to start turning the U.S. economy toward peaceful ends. (JFK's space program was one such early effort.) Another need was curtailment of the CIA--which both JFK and RFK considered an enemy. That's who probably did them both in. If RFK had won the 1968 election--which he was well on his way to doing when he was cut down--and if he had been able to stay alive as president, I am certain that he would have fought an internal war with the CIA, and would have, at the very least, gained enough control over them to stop some of their nefarious activities (assassinating foreign leaders--often democratic leaders--installing horrible rightwing juntas, etc.). (And who knows? --maybe he would have been able to ferret out those who killed his brother.) In any case, U.S. policy would have been aimed at social justice and at WORLD PEACE.

What are now called Johnson policies--the Civil Rights Act, the Voting Rights Act, and the so-called "War on Poverty" (Johnson's phrase)--were actually, one and all, Kennedy policies. Johnson pursued them (which is why he is not universally hated), but the horror and cost of the Vietnam War quite overwhelmed efforts at social justice. Look at the situation of most black citizens today, and you can see that already, in the Johnson era, the rich were plotting chronic poverty and disenfranchisement. If RFK had lived and become president, there would have been a much stronger progressive tide to make social justice goals REAL and PERMANENT, and the awful economic drain and demoralization of the Vietnam War would have been halted, and our resources put to positive use.

I don't want to make a "saint" out of RFK. I didn't even vote for him in the California primary in 1968. (I voted for Eugene McCarthy who STARTED the antiwar movement within the Democratic Party leadership--merely by doing well against LBJ in the New Hampshire primary. LBJ then quit the race for his reelection. I knew Bobby was going to win the Calif primary and the election. I voted to reinforce the antiwar message.) He wasn't a "saint"--but he did have SOMETHING. He roused people up. He attracted huge support. Young people rallied to his cause. It was a very inspiring campaign. He was a STRONG LEADER (which Eugene McCarthy was not).

I felt...numb...the night he was killed. I had worked on his brother's campaign for president, when I was 16. Bang-bang, shoot-shoot. I had been a civil rights worker in MLK's voting rights campaign in Alabama in 1965. Bang-bang, shoot-shoot. I had also suffered some shattering personal tragedies during those same years, one by gunshot. It was too much for me. And I'm probably pretty typical of my generation, in the cloud of grief that hung over us during the Nixon presidency, and that lingers to this day. We know in our hearts that things would have been different. Not just policies. But EVERYTHING. The mood and hopefulness of the country changed radically for the worse, as one popular leader after another was cut down. If Bobby had lived--even if he had lived and somehow lost that presidential race--not likely, but if..., the TENOR of the country would be different and much more progressive and hopeful. Even if he had lost, Bobby would have run again, and eventually won. He was the LEADER of the great progressive American majority, which is still with us, but so demoralized, now, and so disenfranchised. And that was the beginning of our demoralization and disenfranchisement--that third assassination. The first two broke our hearts. The third broke our movement.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
intheflow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-05-07 04:34 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. This is a very stirring, eloquent account.
Edited on Tue Jun-05-07 04:35 AM by intheflow
Thank you for sharing it. :hug: I was four when RFK was assassinated, and coming from a Republican family, I never even knew about it until I was in college in my mid-twenties.

That last paragraph, particularly the last line that Bobby Kennedy's death broke our movement, makes the case for focusing on combating domestic terrorism rather than believing that terrorists are "over there." This is the very thing that conservative rhetoric means when they say people hate "us" for our freedoms. The irony they don't get is that the people who hate "us" (progressive Americans) come from their ranks (regressive Americans). This triad of deaths is a perfect illustration of domestic terrorism that served the terrorists and quelled our freedoms. You really can make the case that this act broke the left, laying the groundwork for the Constitutional crisis we are now faced with.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Straight Shooter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-05-07 03:29 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. Peace Patriot, you've done it again.
You and H20 Man have the gift to summarize complex perspectives with a few paragraphs, based on reason but bearing the hallmarks of personal experience.

Great post.

By the way, without going into complicated specifics, one of my friends who is a bit closer to the story of RFK's assassination swears on his life it was the CIA which effectively pulled the trigger, that Sirhan Sirhan was "programmed" to kill Bobby. We may never know .....
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
CRH Donating Member (671 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-07-07 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #8
17. Posting late and knowing this will never be read, ...

for no more than record of the archives it should also be noted:

your comment below ...

"By the way, without going into complicated specifics, one of my friends who is a bit closer to the story of RFK's assassination swears on his life it was the CIA which effectively pulled the trigger, that Sirhan Sirhan was "programmed" to kill Bobby. We may never know ....."

All witnesses at the Ambassador were consistent, not one would state that Sirhan Sirhan was ever behind RFK. At all times he was in front of RFK.

There is no doubt Sirhan was there to do harm, but there was no way he possibly could have, for a very good reason.

All bullets that entered RFK, entered from the rear, confirmed in the autopsy. Sirhan was the one meant to get caught.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
stevedeshazer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-05-07 07:00 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. That's an outstanding summary of what RFK meant to us who were there
It deserves a post of it's own, but I'll just insert my two bits worth here.

On May 26, 1968 RFK came to my little town in Oregon. I was thirteen years old.

At the time, I was handing out buttons and bumperstickers supporting the re-election of Senator Wayne Morse, one of the only two US Senators to vote against the Tonkin Gulf resolution of 1964, the one which drew the US into the war.

My parents were Gene McCarthy supporters, and were mortified when the local newspaper printed pictures of the event, one of which showed me holding a sign reading "I (heart) Bobby)".

I'll never forget the night he was murdered. I was asleep, and my dad woke me up with the news.

A part of me died that night, too. I've been trying to get it back ever since.

The kind of hope and optimism we then-young people had at that time was smashed to bits that night 39 long years ago.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-05-07 09:27 PM
Response to Reply #5
13. What HE said.
:thumbsup: :hi: :cry: :grouphug:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
chieftain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-06-07 11:03 AM
Response to Reply #5
15. Excellent synopsis of a great man and a turbulent period.
I was in college in 1968 and President of my school's Young Democrat Club. I was working for McCarthy and more than a bit dubious about Bobby's entry into the race. The day after he announced in DC, he flew to Kansas to give a scheduled speech at Kansas State University. They added an appearance at Kansas University in Lawrence. I went to that speech and though I stayed loyal to Gene, I knew that our real hope for change was RFK. His speech outlining exactly what the GNP said about our country was one of the best explications I have ever heard about the pernicious impact of military spending. His passion for those who had been left behind in America was palpable. The crowd of middle west, middle class, middle Americans went wild.
I was at a graduation party the night that he was shot. I left the party right after he said " now its on to Chicago and let's win there." By the time I reached home the phone was ringing with the terrible news that he had been shot. It is not melodramatic to say that a piece of all of us died that night.
I still tear up when I think of him and what might have been. I am grateful to Emilio Estevez for returning Bobby to a wider and younger audience.Those of us who survived 1968 lost, at least to some degree, our conviction that politics could make America live up to its ideals rather than living down to its fears. But the movie and the remembrances should help to rekindle the spirit that Bobby embodied.
Thanks for the OP and all the replies.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JNelson6563 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-05-07 05:28 AM
Response to Original message
7. It sickens me
but of course he had to be whacked. He and his brother with their views that the little people actually counted. No room for that kind of schlock in the New World Order.

:grr:

Julie
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-05-07 09:23 PM
Response to Original message
11. I remember exactly where I was when I heard about his murder....
as I remember where I was when I heard about JFK being shot.
Lifetimes ago...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dflprincess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-05-07 09:26 PM
Response to Original message
12. The quote at the end of the original post
"Some men see things as they are and say 'Why?' I dream things that never were and say, 'Why not?'" is actually from George Bernard Shaw. I mention this only because Bobby always credited the original author.

I remember reading in one memoir of the last campaign that RFK used it so often to end speeches that his dog learned to head for the bus when it heard the words "As George Bernard Shaw said..."

My niece went to see "Bobby" with me when it came out. Up to that point all she really knew about RFK was that he had been killed when he was running for president. After the movie, she told me she didn't know there were politicians like that (outside of Wellstone whom she had met). When Wellstone died (almost 5 years now) one of my nephews asked me how long I was going to be sad about it. I told him I could still cry over Bobby Kennedy so he could plan on it being a long time.

Thirty-nine years and I'm still crying.




Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
draft_mario_cuomo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-06-07 01:55 AM
Response to Original message
14. Thanks for the replies
I was born well after 1968 so I appreciate hearing about him from those that remember the 60's. I do know, from my understanding of our history, that RFK was a great man and the nation and world would be far better off today if he became president in 1968. He would have brought all Americans together and finished LBJ's work in eliminating widespread poverty. The passion he displayed for the disenfranchised and weakest among us is all too often checked at the frontporch by today's candidates who cater exclusively to the concerns of the wealthy and middle-class. RFK stood for all Americans equally. RIP RFK :cry:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
marlakay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-06-07 11:51 AM
Response to Original message
16. What timing!! Watching xfiles and smoking man killed them
in it. Watching the fictional scene in year 4 (i am watching the whole series again, I own all of them) it is almost believable. How could they in the 90's have predicted a government just like Bush's.

Because Gore is right and its not just Bush....it has been happening for a very long time.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Fri May 03rd 2024, 04:24 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC