How Kucinich Wins

[penguin7]

http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_david_su_070816_how_kucinich_wins.htm

How Kucinich Wins

by David Summerlin Page 1 of 1 page(s)

http://www.opednews.com



Democrats of all stripes should admit an unpleasant truth: the Democrats have put some weak candidates on the national stage.

What's odd is that the party so often puts up a weak candidate in the name of "electability." What was so "electable" about John Kerry? Turns out not much. His voting record is a bit spotty, but truth be told he had only a few shameful votes. In the end the Republicans attacked his record on military appropriations, and rather than offering unequivocal language he gave us the infamous "I voted for it before I voted against it." We lost 2004 when we nominated Kerry.



If the party gives Hillary Clinton the nomination, how will she defend her record? Why aren't "mainstream" Democrats challenging the disconnect between her rhetoric and her service record—now, in the primary season, when we're supposed to discover our own candidates? Where is this elusive "electability" of the frontrunner candidates? They all fall seriously short on the major issues people care about: Iraq, health care, labor rights, civil rights.

Money silences dissent.

A Rassmussen Report from late July claimed that "lmost 40% of all voters, including 40% of Democrats, don't know Congressman Kucinich well enough to have an opinion of him." These same people often dismiss Kucinich as "unelectable," despite knowing little or nothing about him.

Obviously many voters accept the cynical if accurate notion that money wins elections. Let's be honest, money indeed wins a lot of elections. Most of them, it turns out. People usually choose their candidates like they're picking out a pair of shoes they've never even worn. This is the reality of our political context.

But here's where cynical notions of "electability" fall short: the big money candidates of our two-party system can only ever count on the straight-party ticket votes, like mine. My vote and votes just like it on both sides of the isle will only ever ensure that the default results of any general election come in at about 50/50 D and R. That's what the primary wins for any candidate with the D or R brand: about a 50/50 split unless you do something really stupid (and often if you do). What happens beyond the default position depends entirely on the candidate.

And frequently Democrats put up candidates even Democrats have a hard time getting excited about. We put up candidates who sell out labor as readily as any Republican, who are as beholden to corporate money as any lobbyist, who won't even stop the escalation of the Iraq occupation, much less end it. We elect Democrats whose actions on immigration and on the phony "war on drugs" make felons out of would-be Democratic voters. Our Democratic Party doesn't need many enemies. It's doing a splendid job of sabotaging itself and alienating its own base. In the name of "electability." This is insane.

Did you catch Kucinich at the AFL-CIO debate? Who were those ordinary American workers whose raucous cheers gave Kucinich the clear victory that day? Those were cheers from labor, the traditional base of the Democratic Party.

Take just another minute to reflect on the previous paragraph. The "unelectable" Kucinich won the debate, hands down, before the traditional base of the Democratic Party, the working class and middle class people whose labor generates the profits that accrue to the capital that finances the big money, "electable" Democrats who gut worker rights and privatize our communities at every turn.

The traditional Democratic base isn't stupid. They haven't been driven away from the polls because they are lazy or apathetic. They are painfully aware of the huge disconnect between Democratic Party rhetoric and the official behavior of many Democrats. They don't appreciate being lied to, and maybe they have grudging reasons to go to the polls just to vote against some Republican. Maybe they don't. The traditional Democratic base doesn't always turn up at the polls. They need more than transparent rhetoric. They require a real candidate who actually represents their interests.

And they love Kucinich.

That means we who support Kucinich, if we take our work seriously, have two huge tasks before us. We have to educate that 40 percent of the voter base about our guy, and we have to try and convince the Democratic Party that it's on the same losing course again unless it backs the only candidate who inspires and motivates the Democratic base.

That's us, and if we want to pull off the statistically unlikely task of handing our guy the nomination, we can't sit on our thumbs and lament his unfair treatment by the media and the shills who take every opportunity to discourage us. We certainly cannot wish our guy would compromise his principles (our principles) and take some corporate money. We actually have to stay motivated and determined to deliver much more than our single vote for Kucinich. We have to answer "you can't do it" with "you can't stop us." We have to back it up with action. We have to talk to each other and coordinate our efforts, give each other ideas, and encourage each other.

We have to behave like a community that deserves a Kucinich presidency.

[rinsd]

1. The cult of Kucinich has attained a new level.

"We have to behave like a community that deserves a Kucinich presidency."

You have to be kidding me.

[Stuckinthebush]

7. There is a Kucinich cult? Wow....

Is it bigger than the Hillary cult?

[rinsd]

8. Let me know when Hillary supporters declare themselves unworthy of their candidate.

[mike_c]

12. LOL-- the problem is just the opposite....

eom

[mikelgb]

17. won't happen

you all deserve her

[JTFrog]

22. lol

best post of the day

[redqueen]

85. hah

indeed

[L84TEA]

18. agree!

I couldn't believe the group she hauls around with her. I watched all of them speak recently and you would of thought Hillary had a HUGE group of support there. But when she left...so did they! They all got on the bus and headed to her next stop.

Kucinich had the place on their FEET people were tossing their signs and grabbing Kucinich ones!

If he has a CULT...LET ME IN LET ME IN!!! lol

[L84TEA]

19. oops dupe nt

[ProudDad]

27. Right now

NOTHING's bigger than the Hillary cult...

except maybe the Mooney's...

[Truth2Tell]

65. Same financing too. n/t

[vssmith]

69. cult, is that how you spell it?

[Bake]

2. To do what you suggest takes M-O-N-E-Y.

To educate the public about DK, when right now very few take him seriously, would require a huge amount of cash. So somebody'd best get busy.

Bake

[Roland99]

3. Or, at the least, a halfway friendly media that doesn't ignore him at every turn.

[Bake]

5. If Kooch raised $20 mil, the media WOULD take him seriously.

Until then, NOBODY does. I'm not sure he even takes himself seriously.

Bake

[jobycom]

53. If he raised $20 mil, his supporters would abandon him.

Then he'd be mainstream.

[redqueen]

86. AAHAHAAHAHAH... surely you're joking!

what, you think his supporters are like indie fans, flocking to him as they would to the latest unsigned band? fuckin insane...

his supporters see that he's the only one not kowtowing to corporatocracy. the only way they'd abandon him is if he abandoned the idea of doing the right thing for the people of this country, in favor of kissing up to big donors. like the mainstream candidates.

:hi:

[Radical Activist]

110. That's exactly what I see.

Obama is "mainstream" so he must be bad. Obama gets media coverage and raises money from wall street so he no longer passes the purity test. I see those kind of posts on DU all the time. I think some people are so used to backing a losing progressive in election after election that they start to assume anyone who can win must not be good enough.

[redqueen]

111. no... obama hasn't said he'll cut the profit out of universal healthcare

and i wonder about his answers re: nafta/wto/etc.

[Radical Activist]

114. There will always be something

that you can use to disqualify any and all candidates if your criteria is a purity test. Kucinich's campaign is an effort to always move to the left to be "the only candidate who..." Honestly, I'm kind of tired of that shtick.
Issue campaigns are fine but even electing Kucinich won't get us single-payer without a lot more public education. Do you really think Obama would veto a single-payer plan?

I'm glad Obama voted against CAFTA and would change America's trade policy.

[redqueen]

116. it's not a purity test... it's one of the biggest problems this country faces

think about it... this is the ONLY western country that STILL kowtows to insurance

i'm sick of it... guess you're not

peace

[Radical Activist]

117. Will campaigning for Kucinich get America universal single-payer?

No, I don't think so. One, because Kucinich doesn't have the organization or personal characteristics of someone who can run a winning campaign (even if he was more moderate on the issues that would still be true). Two, because just electing a President doesn't automatically make it happen.

Yes, I'm sick of it, and no you can't tell me that supporting Kucinich is the best or only way to make it happen.

[redqueen]

121. fuck 'winning campaigns'

this is a chance to get what we want

do you see the republicans running for president?

sorry, but we're gonna have to agree to disagree about what makes a candidate 'electable'... especially this time around

[Radical Activist]

109. Just like they abandon a progressive like Obama.

Obama raises money and gets media coverage so he must be bad, right? Its a losers mentality from people who don't really believe a good candidate can win so they prefer playing the role of righteous martyr.

Guess what people, the fact that Obama raises money and gets in the news is a sign that he's a GOOD CANDIDATE who has his shit together, unlike Kucinich. It doesn't make him an automatic sell-out. Its kind of a catch 22 that a big chunk of progressives will abandon one of their own candidates as soon as he starts doing the things a candidate needs to do to win.

[redqueen]

112. not ONE word about nafta or jobs on his website

and again, no single-payer healthcare

[Radical Activist]

118. There's a lot about jobs on his website.

And his campaign is more than a website anyway.
http://www.barackobama.com/issues/fightingpoverty/

[redqueen]

120. oops!

i didn't find the more detailed pages

thanks...


another thing that worries me about obama is his vote for the oman trade bill... would like to know the logic behind that

[ProudDad]

28. 100,000 people

at $100 each...

$10,000,000 dollars...

A good start.

I'm sending him my latest $100 today....

[TreasonousBastard]

4. I'll take tilting at windmills for $500, Alex.

[redqueen]

87. i'll take voting for what we want over voting for more of the same.

:hi:

[mike_c]

6. I wish I could recommend this thread a thousand times...

...but I can't so I'll ENTHUSIASTICALLY recommend it once. This is the disconnect I don't understand-- most democrats support Kucinich's positions on most issues, and most democrats DO NOT fully endorse the positions of any other candidate on those same issues, including the ones that affect us all directly, like health care reform, yet so many say they will vote against their own interests and elect someone other than Kucinich.

We've said a lot about the need to educate republican centrists who repeatedly vote against their own interests because someone sells them a bill of goods based on popularity, jingoism, and charisma. Well, guess what-- the democratic party is apparently no better at educating its voters to stand up for what they believe rather than for some vapid sound bite that sells them out every damned time.

Kucinich is the real deal. If Americans want to save this country from the path to destruction the reptilian party-- and its democratic enablers and allies-- has put us on, Kucinich is the ONLY one of the current candidates who wants to work for them.

[lonestarnot]

9. Once is good enough, since that's all we are allowed.

:toast:

[salib]

47. One person one vote. A lot better than one dollar one vote.

What do all the big money candidates think of that one?

[Double T]

10. The current front runners are a good indication that 'MOST PEOPLE'........

are more or less content with 'business as usual'. I'd like to check back with 'MOST PEOPLE' after the economic and financial train wreck occurs.

[mike_c]

11. and yet when surveyed directly, the majority express support...

...for positions that the front runner candidates do not share, and which only Kucinich provides real leadership on. I don't understand it. If one of the "front runners" is given the nomination, it will ONLY be because democrats were duped into voting against their own EXPRESSED interests.

Like I said, we shake our heads in outraged astonishment that red state voters so consistently undermine their own interests, but with the Kucinich campaign we see democrats doing exactly the same thing.

[slipslidingaway]

13. #5 n/t

[Double T]

15. Dennis Kucinich has a radically different approach to government......

which 'MOST PEOPLE' are NOT comfortable with. I believe that Dennis Kucinich and his ideas are exactly what America and Americans need RIGHT NOW. If 'MOST PEOPLE' don't see it NOW, eventually they will.

[mike_c]

21. what part aren't they comfortable with...?

An overwhelming majority of democrats repeatedly identify Kucinich's positions as their own. That suggests to me that they are in fact quite comfortable with his approach to government-- they share it. And what's so radical about that, anyway? That's what disturbs me so much-- most democrats express rock solid support for Kucinich's views, and he is the only democratic candidate providing leadership on those consensus views, yet they withhold their votes and financial support. From the only candidate that is actually working for their interests first and foremost. From the only candidate that most agree with on most issues.

It tells me that democratic voters are little better than republicans when it comes to pursuing their real interests as citizens rather than as sheep to be fleeced on election day.

[Joe Chi Minh]

36. Oh, didn't you know? He's a populist! Can't have that. It's supposed to be a

bad thing to have policies people rather than the elite favour.

[druidity33]

43. as a Kucinich supporter

and campaigner, i find that most people tune Dennis out when he starts talking about "the soul" or "spirit" in any way. He's been laying off that kinda talk lately, which is good. I'll be working my ass off for him in the coming months, as he's the only candidate i believe will actually change anything.

peace and goodwill...

[Ken Burch]

46. So it's ok for Republicans to talk about spirituality but not US?

Excuse me, but there are quite a lot of us whose progressive politics are informed by spiritual values. We need to be saying that, and we need to be challenging the myth that "spiritual" equals "right-wing".

Right-wing policies, in many cases, are the most soulless set of ideas you can think of.

It isn't just about the material, y'know. People want something deeper.

[puebloknot]

57. Kucinich's spiritual values are the fuel that runs his actions in the world.

But you don't see him trying to proselytize anyone to his "faith" (a word I'm beginning to gag on).

He hangs out with diverse people: An activist Catholic priest here in New Mexico; all kinds of people from various disciplines. Some of the people who surround him are immature in their enthusiasm for his being a spiritual candidate. That's not his fault.

People were once fearful that a JFK presidency would mean the Pope was moving into the White House. JFK and family attended church, but never attempted to turn America into a Catholic country.

[paulk]

82. Kucinich's spiritual values are what fueled him into being

one of the staunchest anti-abortionists in the entire House during his first six years in office.

That's not proselytizing - that's direct action....

[redqueen]

93. yup, and unlike other candidates, he can admit when he was wrong

in a straightforward manner, without all the pandering BS

and actually CHANGE his actions

[paulk]

123. I don't give a damn that he admits he was "wrong"

he used his legislative powers to enforce his religious beliefs.

Period.

That's what the right wing does; they ignore the divide between church and state - and as a liberal I cannot countenance it in a Democrat. It is the one line I will not cross.

I also find it fascinating that his "epiphany" on this issue occurred on the eve of his first presidential run, at the age of 56. I guess you can teach an old dog new tricks.

For myself, I don't buy it for a second - that his conversion was anything but politically driven. I don't understand why this man is put on a pedestal as the shining light of the liberal left. AFAIC he's either a flake or a fake - or maybe he's just another politician, willing to say whatever he thinks will gain him some measure of public approbriation.

[redqueen]

124. just like i don't buy the BS about how dems voted for the IWR

thinking oh-so-naively and innocently that bush would OF COURSE follow the rules

you have your limits, and so do others...

[puebloknot]

125. Yes, and it is one very black mark against him. But measured against...

...the rest of his record, I can forgive him that.

Do we want to continue to rant about this issue, at the expense of putting into effect the many, many proposals Kucinich has for leading the country into a more practical and compassionate state of being?

[paulk]

126. you use the word "rant" in an attempt to denigrate my thoughts

on this matter. I reject your characterization.

-------------------------

Kucinich's anti abortion past is an unpleasant truth.

Unpleasant because his actions on this issue speak to the very heart of his character, his ideas on the role of religion in government and, yes, his compassion. His "leading the country" cannot be viewed without factoring these flaws in.

[puebloknot]

127. I think the operative word is "past."

John Edwards supported the war, but has recanted. Al Gore failed to stand up to the tyranny of his own stolen presidential election, but he's made up for it to powers of ten with his work on the environment. None of our leaders from the past were flawless.

I think we have to take a hard look at what people are doing *now*! We all "sin and fall short of the glory of God." Sorry, I like that phrase probably as much as you do, but it slipped in from my early and heartily-rejected Fundie childhood.

In Modernese, "Nobody's perfect."

Dennis Kucinich is a lone voice crying out against the Iraq war, among the current Dem candidates.

[Nederland]

39. Exactly

And when "MOST PEOPLE" disagree with you, you loose elections. It's really no mystery why DK polls so low--"MOST PEOPLE" disagree with him.

[mike_c]

45. I think you're not correct....

When people poll on the issues, they choose Kuchinich by an overwhelming margin. "MOST PEOPLE disagree with him?" I don't think so:

http://www.dehp.net/candidate/stats.php


HERE is why Kucinich is not the front running candidate-- political manipulation:

http://www.motherjones.com/mojoblog/archives/2007/08/5255_kucinich_wins_d.html

[Nederland]

88. An online poll? LOL!

I hope we don't need to go into a discussion on the worthlessness of online polling and self selected samples...

[mike_c]

95. it's a LARGE sample size and the results are overwhelmingly...

...unambiguous. Sure, it is likely biased by self selection. But THAT degree of bias is astounding-- you're suggesting that-- essentially-- FAR more Kucinich supporters take online polls than supporters of all the other candidates combined. If true, that's a fascinating statistic in itself.

No, I think it's dangerous to simply dismiss the results of that poll, especially since the respondents were NOT casting votes for candidates at all, but registering their views on the issues. When matched to the existing candidates, those responses overwhelmingly map to Kucinich's positions.

Here's the important part-- reread my comments above if you need to-- I didn't say that most democrats support Kucinich, I said that they OVERWHELMINGLY share his views on the major issues in this election, more than they share the perspectives of any other candidate. So why do you think that democrats are more likely to vote for candidates who don't represent their visions than for the candidate who does, by a huge margin?

Someone is being duped.

[Nederland]

103. Agreed, for the most part

I would point out however that you don't actually know if this is a large sample size or not. It's very easy for a single person to get counted hundreds of times with these types of polls.

[Ron Green]

100. That's bullshit.

MOST PEOPLE don't disagree with him; MOST PEOPLE don't know about his views because they're hypnotized by the corporate media. If they take the time to understand what he's for, MOST PEOPLE agree with those ideas.

[Nederland]

102. I see

So the reason he does so pitifully in the primaries is because voters are ignorant...

Is that your theory?

[Ron Green]

104. Yeah, they're ignorant.

Doesn't mean stupid, it just means they (unlike active members of DU, who are keenly aware of political workings) are ignorant of public issues other than what the TV tells them. They're busy trying to make ends meet through the very system of corruption, addiction and slavery that their Democratic "front runners" make vague promises to fix, but in fact are almost as much a part of as are the Republicans. And Dennis Kucinich, the "funny-looking" guy with a 1 or 2 percent share, is just that, as far as they know. They're simply ignorant - it's part of the Plan.

That's my theory, yeah.

By the way, if you think these poll numbers are based on anything more substantial than name recognition and simplistic media-driven popularity and "horse-race" issues, you're in error.

[redqueen]

113. but name recognition & popularity contests are "the way"

there is no other way

do not try to change the course

everything is fine

:sarcasm:

[jgraz]

14. "Most people" just don't have enough time to truth-check the M$M

That's the real problem -- one that seems almost insurmountable.

[slipslidingaway]

16. So true n/t

[salib]

49. Remember, it is the insurmountable problems that we as Dems try to fix.

If it were easy and profitable, we would not be here.

Those are the challenges to really sink one's teeth into. Those are the important tasks.

[Rainbowreflect]

23. Most people I know who are supporting democratic candidates

other that Kucinich actually agree with Kucinich more than the candidate they are supporting. That makes no sense to me. Someone who is a bit better than the republicans is not good enough for me. At least not in the primary.

I also don't agree that it takes a lot of money. It takes each of us talking to and emailing everyone we know about what Kucinich stands for and what he can and will do for this country.

Why settle before we absolutely have to. If we don't now, maybe we won't have to in November 2008 and beyond that.

[DeeDeeNY]

20. Gotta love the Kooch

Unfortunately, the press does not give him his due.
The article was wrong about Kerry -- we did not lose 2004 when Kerry got the nomination. If the votes had been correctly and fairly counted, he would have won.

[BigDDem]

24. "How Kucinich Wins"

Hilarious!!!
Thanks for a much needed laugh!

[redqueen]

90. Thanks for the unnecessary, smartass bullshit!

:hi:

[paulk]

25. how to not win friends and influence people

"Democrats of all stripes should admit an unpleasant truth: the Democrats have put some weak candidates on the national stage."

well, I guess the 97% who are supporting someone other than DK are just a bunch of dumbasses...

[ProudDad]

29. Nice to hear you dumbasses admit it (n/t) :)

[BigDDem]

33. Hey, wait!

When did he move up to 3%?

[Ken Burch]

48. Not dumbasses...and nobody's insulting them...

They are supporting candidates other than the candidates they actually agree with because they've bought the myth that bland centrists hacks(like whoever you support)are the only kind of Dems that can win. You'd have thought '00, '02, and '04 would have blown this theory out of the water.

If you ever want to debate on the merits of the issues, everybody here would be more than glad to hear what you have to say, I think. But knock off the "I'm just going to insult people because I'm above having to deal with the actual questions raised here" tone, wouldya?

[paulk]

62. who appointed you the arbiter of what DU wants to hear?

mighty big head you got on your shoulders there, kenny boy.

not to mention a keen sense of what the supporters of other candidates are thinking...


LOL

[Ken Burch]

64. The polls show most voters support Kucinich's stands on the issues.

The logical thing would be for Hillary or Obama to embrace those stands. There's no reason they shouldn't.

This is not about my ego at all, paulkster.

And you're hardly the Maven of Modesty your self.

[MonkeyFunk]

26. So the author thinks educating the 40%

that don't know him well enough will help him win?

If 60% DO know him well enough, and he polls at a 3%, then educating the other 40% will bump him up to 4.2%.

[cobalt1999]

32. You are using logic and math with Kucinich supporters.

You should know better than that. :)

How does Kucinich win? Here's how. All the serious candidates are having a debate and a meteor strikes the building leaving him as the only remaining living democratic candidate.

[redqueen]

91. Kucinich haters are so nasty.

Hope you guys are happy with yourselves.

:hi:

[ProudDad]

30. This part deserves repeating here!

"And frequently Democrats put up candidates even Democrats have a hard time getting excited about. We put up candidates who sell out labor as readily as any Republican, who are as beholden to corporate money as any lobbyist, who won't even stop the escalation of the Iraq occupation, much less end it. We elect Democrats whose actions on immigration and on the phony "war on drugs" make felons out of would-be Democratic voters. Our Democratic Party doesn't need many enemies. It's doing a splendid job of sabotaging itself and alienating its own base. In the name of "electability." This is insane.

Did you catch Kucinich at the AFL-CIO debate? Who were those ordinary American workers whose raucous cheers gave Kucinich the clear victory that day? Those were cheers from labor, the traditional base of the Democratic Party.

Take just another minute to reflect on the previous paragraph. The "unelectable" Kucinich won the debate, hands down, before the traditional base of the Democratic Party, the working class and middle class people whose labor generates the profits that accrue to the capital that finances the big money, "electable" Democrats who gut worker rights and privatize our communities at every turn.

The traditional Democratic base isn't stupid. They haven't been driven away from the polls because they are lazy or apathetic. They are painfully aware of the huge disconnect between Democratic Party rhetoric and the official behavior of many Democrats. They don't appreciate being lied to, and maybe they have grudging reasons to go to the polls just to vote against some Republican. Maybe they don't. The traditional Democratic base doesn't always turn up at the polls. They need more than transparent rhetoric. They require a real candidate who actually represents their interests.

And they love Kucinich."

[5fingersurfer]

31. Only politician worth my vote

Kucinich is the only politician in the presidential race who I will currently cast a vote for. If he can actually buck the status quo if elected in to office is another story. He seems to be the only candidate willing to take that on and actually try to govern for the regular people of this country. Gravel seems to be of the same mold, but I haven't heard any definite plans from him. Edwards seems to be coming around a bit. Only a candidate with a penchant for governing for the people of this country will ever get my vote. Kucinich is currently the only candidate whose voting record and rhetoric match. If Hillary , Obama, Edwards get the nomination - they will only get my vote if I see them steering in this direction in a definite way. Until that time Edwards (not as likely), Obama (as likely), and Hillary (too likely) - will let the current status quo stay as is, which is not good for this country or the people who live in it.

Kucinich definitely got my vote when he said the first thing to go is NAFTA and WTO.

[BigDDem]

34. Good luck with that!

[NoPasaran]

35. This plan is doomed

There are no magic beans involved.

[BigDDem]

37. Yes, but here's a good Plan B:

Lovingly hold a crystal in each hand, close your eyes and
visualize the Dept of Peace. Use "President Kucinich" as
your mantra.

Go for it!

[rucky]

42. You're so right.

I think I'll support Hillary now.

[frylock]

60. she's the bestest!!!11!

a-number 1!

[Truth2Tell]

66. This plan is doomed

Rupert Murdoch isn't on board.

[bobthedrummer]

38. He wins when we vote for him and those votes are honestly counted. eom

IMPEACH CHENEY FIRST.

[Broke Dad]

40. I supported Kucinch and then Dean in 2004 . . .

But not this time.

I said it in another post, Dennis is like John the Baptist in the desert. When he gets on a roll, he is like a prophet. He speaks an unvarnished truth to a lot of the problems we face in America and the causes. That said, he doesn't seem to care if anyone supports him, or agrees with him, or joins him in his quest. The president is not a prophet, they are the leader of our country. To be effective, they must bring people to see and accept their point of view. They must build coalitions and forge compromises to achieve change. Dennis didn't do this in 2004, he hasn't done this in Congress, and he hasn't done it in 2007-2008. I think Dennis adds a lot to the national discourse on where we go from here, but he is not the person who can or will make it happen. No amount of money or cult support from DU members is going to change that.

The good news is that Dennis is the perfect antidote for the corporate triangulation DLC crap being peddled this cycle by Hillary and her drones. The best thing that Dennis and his supporters could do in 2007 and 2008 to make this a better country is to bird dog Hillary Clinton and expose every one of her lies and flip flops and double crosses.

[eridani]

52. The Kucinich candidacy makes all the others more receptive to a populist agenda

Look at how much more specfic Edwards has gotten since the last cycle--I think that Kucinich had a lot to do with that.

[redqueen]

92. what difference will that make?

hillary's supporters ALREADY know she's kissing up to offshoring giants

they ALREADY know she'll swallow whatever lies are used to push us into "the new war"

[Ron Green]

101. I think perhaps her supporters DON'T all know this.

Some of them are just so excited about a woman in the White House, and someone other than Bush, and isn't she smart and pretty, and it's a woman in the White House, and it's just like American Idol, and it's so exciting....

They don't think about her intercourse with corporate giants, they just like her.

[rucognizant]

106. Yesterday,

while talking to a woman in the State capital who works with a support/aid group to small business start-up for women. I had observed that older people have a better work ethic. She told me a story that made my teeth curl. She was interviewing a student applying for an intern job. The student ACTUALLY ANSWERED HER CELL PHONE, in the middle of the interview! [There's a vote for Hillary!}

[LWolf]

41. Good post, thank you.

I'd love to see more of the "you can't stop us!"

I need more than transparent rhetoric. I need a candidate who actually represents my interests. If Kucinich is on the ballot, I'll be there.

[eridani]

44. The project of getting more people to pay attention to the public sphere--

--and getting the obscene amounts of money out of it, is much more long term than a year and a half of presidential year campaigning. The Kucinich candidacy is just one step on the way to re-empowering the traditional supporters of the party.

[Douglas Carpenter]

50. you can help make Congressman Kucinich a top-tier candidate right NOW!!

By donating right NOW and going to his website below and getting involved right NOW!!

to donate:


you can do it RIGHT NOW on DU/Act Blue.

If those who care about the issues Mr. Kucinich raises donate NOW – HE WILL BE

A TOP-TIER CANDIDATE!!


I'm not addressing those who do not support Congressman Dennis Kucinich

and do not agree with him on the issues. I'm addressing those who DO

support Congressman Kucinich and/or do agree with him on the issues:

Donating to the Kucinich 2008 campaign through DU/ACT Blue is very fast.

It's very easy. Do it now!

link:

http://www.actblue.com/entity/fundraisers/12518
---------

Some are supporting Congressman Kucinich because they strongly believe he can win. Others are supporting him because they support his agenda (or at least most of it) and want those issues brought to the center of public debate.

Mr. Kucinich does not have the funding of the top-tier candidates. Corporate lobbyist seeking government favoritism for their special interest won’t be writing their $2300 checks paying for access like they do for other candidates. But small donations DO add up very, very fast. That's how the Dean campaign became a significant force in 2004.

So whether or not you are convinced that Congressman Kucinich could possibly win...if you want the issues only Dennis Kucinich raises brought to the public square, if you believe his message of Strength through Peace is important, that the whole question of corporate control of government is important, that single-payer universal health care is important, if you believe American needs fundamental changes; his campaign needs a lot more money then it has in its coffers now.

IF anywhere near half the people who agree with Congressman Dennis Kucinich on the issues sent him a donation -- he would be a major top-tier contender very, very fast:

Donating through DU/ACT Blue is very fast. It's very easy. Do it now! I did...

link:

http://www.actblue.com/entity/fundraisers/12518

He won't be getting a whole lot from the corporate lobbyist buying access for their special interest and paying for favoritism... so ...

PLEASE DONATE NOW ! you can do it RIGHT NOW on DU/Act Blue.

It's fast. It's very easy. Do it now! I did…..

link:

http://www.actblue.com/entity/fundraisers/12518

---------

Congressman Dennis Kucinich on the Issues:




http://www.dennis4president.com/go/issues/


-------

NEW Website:

http://www.dennis4president.com/home/

GET INVOLVED!!

Kucinich 2008 Action Center:

http://action.dennis4president.com/


.

[puebloknot]

58. Keep it up. It's working! Next paycheck, Kucinich gets my $100. nt

[AtomicKitten]

51. Not gonna happen.

We went through this in 2004. I organized two fundraisers for Kucinich when he visited my former home town, Santa Cruz, CA, so I'm not a hater, I'm a realist.

The very same enthusiastic, optimistic spin has been put on this. But with Kucinich at, what, 3% of the vote now?, he can't win the nomination.

Chastise me for having the audacity to say so; consider it tough love.

[Douglas Carpenter]

63. Jimmy Carter was at 4% in late Jan 76 -- Hart was at 3% in September of 1983/

Granted Sen. Hart did not win the nomination or the Presidency but he sure shook up the races and came extremely close. My realism about the Kucinich race is to see Congressman Kucinich's campaign shake up the race and broaden the range of discussion. Since Mr. Kucinich is addressing issues other candidates do not want to touch.

If one looks at where candidates were at in the September or October of the year before election or even late January of election year over many election cycles, things quite often developed very differently:

"As late as January 26, 1976, Carter was the first choice of only 4% of Democratic voters, according to the Gallup Poll."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Carter
______________

September 1983 Poll

"The poll, whose margin for error was plus or minus five percentage points, reported that 37 percent of the Democrats questioned favored Mr. Mondale, 26 percent were for Senator Glenn, 9 percent were for Mr. McGovern, 5 percent were for Senator Alan Cranston of California, 3 percent were for former Gov. Reubin Askew of Florida, 3 percent were for Senator Gary Hart of Colorado and 1 percent were for Senator Ernest F. Hollings of South Carolina.

The poll was taken Sept. 9-12. The results were based on interviews with 673 Democrats."

link: http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D0DE4D6173BF93AA35753C1A965948260
___________

BTW: on a personal note, I lived in Santa Cruz from 77 to 81. REALLY nice place, kind of utopic. But I hear that the property prices have shot into the stratosphere.

[redqueen]

94. chastise you? why?

you're not being an ugly fucking asshole, like the haters

you're just discussing

:hi:

[porkrind]

54. In my mind, Kucinich is the only serious candidate.

K&R
:dem:

[jobycom]

55. So basically, Kucinich wins, except for all those voters out there who choose someone else?

And Kucinich sure does wish he could get his message out, but he's against doing what it takes to get his message out?

Sorry. If he wants my vote, if any Kucinich supporter wants to sway me, then don't start off by insulting me for not supporting him. The OP wants people to hear Kucinich. Let Kucinich hear the people. He's polling around 3%, with a margin of error of about 4%. People are talking to you, too, Dennis, and you aren't listening any more than we are.

[superkia]

56. Its not just the sheeple, its Duers as well!

Not only do the sheeple controlled by their tv dismiss Kucinich as unelectable, if you look at many of the posts here, you see the same result. I think many people have their favorite candidate they are pulling for and they would never bail on them for someone like Kucinich even if he supported their own views more than their favorite candidate. I originally was leaning to Obama but its too hard to go against a candidate like Kucinich that represents so many things I believe in. I dont care what another person tells me about him being unelectable, if he stands for what I want in a president, I will vote for him just like many others could. I'm lucky, I can vote for whoever looks to be the best for me not just the going trend or media king or queen.

[Jim Sagle]

59. How Kucinich REALLY Wins

All the other Dem candidates read this thread and die of laughing fits.

:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:

[Imagevision]

61. Too many people aren't aware of a Kucinich approach to leadership...

duh!

[go west young man]

67. Heard Dennis on Ed Shultz today.

I think he made many a fan there as C-Span was filming the show. He talked about the impeachment of Cheney and lying about the war. He will be on the show in person on September 13th I believe. I agree with everything in your piece. The Democratic party could have rolled with Howard Dean last time and this time they seem to be doing the same thing with Dennis Kucinich. Their fear is what causes them to lose elections. They are afraid to roll with the most honest candidate and the end result of that fear is we lose.

[comtec]

68. Kucinich V Ghouliani.... BATTLE OF THE FERRENGI!!!!!

LOL I'm sorry I can't help myself!
Look I think Dk is great...I will vote for him, and I will lobby my family to vote for him.. however...
I think WE should lobby the DNC and Dean to make this guy VP Kucinich!

I hate to agree, but he probably won't win the Primary, even though he IS the best person for the job. I think as the VP canidate he could do great things. he REALLY knows how to think on his feet, and has great come backs. he is a good man, and honest. Not presidential material at the moment, but I think as VP he'll be largely ignored which is also not a bad thing. He can get in and whisper common sense in HRC's ear. He will also have Bill to whisper into who can whisper in HRC's ear.

Hillary's main problem (and I like her for the most part) is she is a little too stubborn. I know a Doctor who was on her committee years ago. he said Hillary's biggest problem is she tends to want to do things HER way, punt, EOM. He said he and other doctors recommended things that would have improved her health care plan. Mind you it still would not have passed because it was HER plan and the gop could not have that!!!

But it's funny.. We are really looking at Yankees (finally) running for office of pres. God I hope this is a trend. These southern good ol boys are fucking up the country something fierce. I loved Bill, but he did his part to screw things up. His plan only worked as long as the economy was strong. Which it was, and would have stayed (though tired) when Gore took over.

I think K is the perfect VP choice. He has sense, LOADS of it, and I think after HRC's 8 years of mediocre performance, he will be able to take the reigns and do even more good.

MY one concern with all this however... which ever Dem gets in as P and VP, WE LOOSE GOOD PEOPLE IN CONGRESS!

That is the MAJOR problem with the current group. They are all decent people (the worst polled is still LEAPS ahead of the gop 's best) and we WILL loose good people in the Congress. All we can do is pray they are replaced with Dems equally as good, or maybe even better. With Kucinich in the Congress, we still have a very strong leader for human rights, et al, if he gets elected to Pres. or VP, we loose his power and influence in the Congress... something which I can not stress enough is IMPORTANT!

Anyway Go Dennis, in some ways I hope you stay in Congress, but I will support you I think...

[DUlover2909]

70. You and Kucinich have won me over

Kucinich should get the nomination. He could win and we could really start a new way forward. I am starting to see that my support for Hillary was based on my fondness for her husband. I thought it would be a wonderful irony if Bill Clinton found himself back in the White House. I don't think a Hillary Presidency would be bad. But I realize that a Kucinich Presidency would be better.

[harris8]

71. "We lost 2004 when we nominated Kerry." - BULLSHIT!

We lost 2004 due to repugnican election fraud.

[cleveramerican]

72. W's campaign strategy

is now being employed by DK?

The two pillars are dire predictions( if you vote for somebody else)
& optimistic assurances( we're turning the corner)


I like the guy and I'm glad he's in the race,
He'd make one hell of a Supreme Court Justice.
He'd make one hell of a secretary of the interior.

he's not going to get elected president.

[Pierzin]

73. Dennis is my hero! i will support him!

Very few politicos in recent memory have stood up for the little person.
Very few have taken a step back and stood for peace and justice.
One of those few people is Dennis. He voted against the war, he stated time after time he wants universal health care.
That's it, I'm volunteering for Dennis!

Kicked and Recommended! Fight the Power!

[Rockholm]

74. Only if every other candidate drops out.

[MethuenProgressive]

75. "40% of Democrats, don't know Kucinich well enough to have an opinion"

So 60% do, but they don't count?
:shrug:

[druidity33]

128. that 60%

has exactly the information force fed down their throat by the M$M, and they think they are informed about the candidates.

We here at DU will explore candidate positions vigorously, and take sides readily. Most "regular" people go by what they "hear". Whether from neighbors, family, newspapers, or TV news... do you think any of those sources will represent DK fairly?

you've seen this poll right?

http://www.dehp.net/candidate/stats.php

over 140,000 respondents, last i checked...

[bvar22]

76. Vote "Hillary" for Homecoming Queen,

but if you Work for a Living, vote Kucinich for President.


The Democratic Party is a BIG TENT, but there is NO ROOM for those
who advance the agenda of THE RICH (Corporate Owners) at the EXPENSE of LABOR and the POOR.

[Vidar]

77. Wonderful article. Thanks for posting,penguin7. Highly recommended.

[Highway61]

78. It makes me sad to see some of the posts here

I am ashamed to admit I was one who never gave him a second thought...
until now. I am in my early 50's and have seen what has happened to our country....it's like a cancer...slow and insidious decay. We are in a dire situation folks and Dennis is the ONLY candidate who offers real solutions, is NOT for sale and doesn't speak out of both sides of his mouth. I don't want to hear the "well, he's a great guy but not electable." That makes you just as complacent as the 20 somethings reading People Magazine for their news and not voting at all.
Bush was "electable"? My God, Alfred E Newman would do better and you know it. But how is it he is where he is now? Because he has ruthless and manipulating forces behind him as well as $$$$.
Well, we CAN make him electable. Get bold and ruthless and get the word out. Email, write letters, educate, spread his message in the communities and above all send $$. If he announced Gore as his VP, folks would take notice then wouldn't they? Remember what he said to Lance and Chris Mathews just recently...he spoke to Kerry and Edwards about his health plan, told them if they proposed this, people will flock to the polls and you would win...hands down. They didn't want to hear it...and here we are now.
Well, I for one will do everything I can to give this man a chance. He is the read deal, he's honest, cares about the little guy and above all he can't be bought. That man has more courage and integrity than I have seen in one hell of a long time and no other candidate can hold a candle to him. He has been behind the scenes for too long and bounces back, dusts himself off every election year as he won't take no for an answer. It's that kind of perseverance and integrity that displays the kind of leadership that will bring this country back.
Sorry about the rant...but I feel a hell of a lot better. Now, If you'll excuse me , I have work to do.

edit spelling

[rucognizant]

119. Here here!

My thought exactly!
He has been behind the scenes for too long and bounces back, dusts himself off every election year as he won't take no for an answer. It's that kind of perseverance and integrity that displays the kind of leadership that will bring this country back. I especially like this phrase! Who was it said above he's been around so long? TAKE THAT AS A GIFT! Al Gore doesn't seem to have that same kind of perseverance!
I have heard him speak, and he is very compelling and has a great ability to pull out just the right words.
And as for his not being able to pull a consensus, thus far and get something accomplished..............for God's sake look what he has been dealing with a bunch of hard headed pro party pervs!

[Highway61]

122. Thanks...by the way

are you from Maine?????

[peace13]

79. If every person that says Dennis is unelectable sent $100

to his campaign he would have the funds to get the job done. I have sent my $100's twice this summer and intend to keep it up as long as I can. We will not get change in this country until the middle class steps forward to make it happen. Only a fool would think that Hillary or Obama will be anything other than business as usual in Washington. We can no longer afford to have our rights and our money thrown away by the 'machine'. Kucinich appears to be the last chance for America. Peace, Kim

[GMFORD]

80. Kucinich

It's not polls that elect people, it's votes. Of all the dem voters out there, Kucinich supporters are the most highly motivated. If everyone who agrees with his message and thinks he is the best choice goes to the polls at primary time, he has a very good chance.

To motivate Dems and Indies to vote in 08, give them someone who has a platform they will cheer for. No other candidate will get out the democratic and independent vote like Kucinich will. And you won't hear people say 'Anyone but Kucinich'.

To naysayers I say: Which candidate has the message you have been waiting to hear since 2000, or even longer? When you say 'I agree with his message but he is unelectable' you are saying 'I don't trust my own instincts about who is the best candidate so I'll just go with the one who seems to be more popular'.

This is our big chance to stop the disastrous agenda of the right wing -- cold turkey, not taper off. Why should we settle for less?

[redqueen]

96. "Why should we settle for less?"

good question

judging by the nasty responses here, i'd say most people do because it's the 'pragmatic' thing to do

i'm so looking forward seeing to how much things change after the next dem president is elected

[PATRICK]

81. This is getting

to the discussion progressives should be having. Backing a candidate who represents the real future. Although some of the obstacles are daunting and the current situation contains oppressive facts about each of the short list: Gore, Kucinich, Edwards, one not running, one not taken seriously, one not breaking up the centrist mad tea party(yet), our problem seems worse. Putting passion into political strength with the aim of making the party at least represent its own people and the right agenda. The broad goal is to affect the future political leadership generation. In fact, it is a peanut gallery that the "frontrunners" don't want to take seriously as an influence, a lobbying for progressive reform. Money, activism yes, but the banner has been waved by Kucinich and Edwards and one would think, at least, that the discussion would be to do something about that.

Last election, electability WAS an issue because unseating a sitting president with the peculiar advantages of the sitting GOP ham sandwich needed massive party participation. This time, the sad lessons of fraud learned but no perfect solution advanced make that a daunting issue. Curiously, this does harm the studied naivete and distance of the two "top" candidates and the response of all concerned is either blindness or worried uncertainty. Dean forced the issues in 2004 and guaranteed that the dull centrist screed that calcified the entire Dem process vaporized into passion and at least one of the great confrontations against the war. This time the polarization is less dramatic but just as evident. Kucinich remains a constant. Edwards keeps moving sincerely to the passion of the progressive platform. Gore keeps the cause in his own work outside the primaries. Yet the centrism, without a vote cast, is stifling the primary presentation to the electorate as only the media could dream of, in a predictability they devoutly wish, for once, would show how smart they are.

Now my personal choice is Edwards with part of the reason being that if elected I could envision more of his legislation sweeping through the legislative process. Kucinich remains my second choice should things greatly alter, for the simple reason stated above. Right ideas, right commitment and sincere leadership without the mind boggling thought errors now known popularly as DLC wisdom. Negative campaigning, or stop Hillary movements(don't throw your vote away!) are worse than useless even in their aims compared to the necessity of making our vote heard as an unshakable commitment to what we most believe must be done- including how to win elections by not ignoring fraud. It never got together in 2004, behind Dean or Kucinich, or anyone for that matter. I think we might as well prioritize our commitments to those most committed and best able to lead us to a future and actually more promising hope for good party representation. Then, once we have made our stance clear, we can see our way through this process without surrendering our candidate(s) out of fear of the system we want changed.

No matter the nominee that resolve can be united and the votes that express that resolve need not be thrown away in an empty gesture. Posts like this are a beginning of this resolve, no matter if they shuffle through the usual bickerings and stones flying through glass houses.

[redqueen]

98. "Last election, electability WAS an issue "

yes, well... the haters have found other reasons to insult kucinich's supporters and bash his candidacy

[Rosa Luxemburg]

83. The Democratic Party first has to define what animal it is before any candidate is

before any definition of any candidates is made, first of all the party has to decide what it is and what it stands for. The Democratic Party appears to voters as mostly all over the place. Thats the way the right wing, the media and the corporations want it to appear. Dennis won't see the light of day in this election which is a pity. He actually stands for what the Democratic Party should stand for. The front runners are packaged for victory. This is the US election system and I don't think it is likely to change unless there is a real shake up?

[veniceboy]

84. Too Wimpy Looking-

Dennis cannot win b/c he looks like an elf. Honestly, it's that simple. If he looked like an NFL linebacker and said the exact same things he would rate much higher in the polls. That isn't a media creation- it's an observation of America's preferences. America will NEVER vote for a guy that looks and sounds like this guy regardless of his political positions. Personally, I'd like to see the a Democratic candidate win the presidency. Therefore, I view Dennis as a guy who is contributing to the debate by offering some good ideas, but I recognize it is not only silly to view his as a serious contender, but it would be political suicide to put forth this guy. America will vote for an African American woman before it votes for a short wimpy looking/sounding man with strange teeth.

[mike_c]

97. who would YOU vote for...?

Making sweeping statements about how shallow and stoopid American voters are, well-- are you part of that vapid gene pool? Would you "never vote... for a short wimpy looking/sounding man with strange teeth?" Because THAT is how candidates become "unelectable"-- one voter at a time. Are you part of the herd, my friend?

[peace13]

130. This type of comment reminds me of high school.

If a concerned American actually went to the Kucinich web site and read what the man has been working on for years they would have to give up such ideas as yours. Read, watch and engage...evolve. Peace, Kim

[bdamomma]

89. wouldn't it be wonderful if he pulled ahead of Obama and Hilliary

no offense to either of them, but we need someone who is for US.

[BigDDem]

105. Don't hold your breath!

[Mark D.]

99. A Possible Compromise

Dennis is the best man for the job... If only more Americans
were as bright and informed as we are to know this. They're
not and things like a bad haircut, stature, big ears, and the
funny last name will be used against him by the same fucking:
"I would rather have a beer with Bush than Gore" voting block.

Those neanderthals actually vote. I'll vote for Kucinich, but
I think Edwards has a better shot of winning the general elect.
than the current front-runners (Hillary/Barack) and futhermore,
to balance his moderate stances, he could have Dennis as his VP.
This will at least get Dennis in the WH & he can make a difference.

[Radical Activist]

107. Obama and Edwards are both strong candidates who excite people.

So I disagree with the first basic premise of the op-ed.

[Radical Activist]

108. He would have to stop being Dennis Kucinich.

He would have to start making better judgments about hiring top staff, do more personal fund raising, and stop being a general goofball. He's great on the issue but if he can't put together a campaign with any semblance of organization then how can he run the country?
It takes more than a few cheap applause lines during debates to become President.

[redqueen]

115. a goofball?

let me take a moment to think of some cutesy smartass insults for obama

:eyes:

[EndElectoral]

129. To me he rings as the most honest one of the bunch..he's got my vote

[burrowowl]

131. He is too Green

has highest record of voting for the environment, according to the League of Conservation Voters!
Hey, get out there and talk to DK with your friends, get him hnown!