We were all deceived about Obama's anti-gay Gospel Tour

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

A lot of middle-of-the-road people at DU were sold a bill of goods. One side (supporters of human rights) was telling the truth while the other side (the Obama campaign) was spinning distortions about how the Obama fund-raiser was not a anti-gay event... no big deal... all blown out of proportion by some gay malcontents. The story that was peddled was that this was a staff error... an oversight... nobody knew McClurkin was a virulant bigot.

People in the middle went, "Gee... I can't immagine Obama would do that, so I will dismiss what the pro human-rights crowd is saying as just a bunch of supporters of other candidates lying about a good man."

Except we were not lying. McClurkin was chosen on purpose BECAUSE he is an outspoken bigot. The event was INTENDED to be an anti-gay event. It was DESIGNED to court the bigot vote by driving a wedge into the heart of the Democratic party. Obama is NOT a paragon who is above the very worst of the politics of wedge issues, division and courting hatred and ignorrance. DUers who did not follow tis story closely, digging into the details from the start, have been deceived.
_______________________

http://www.americablog.com/2007/10/obama-supporter-blasts-gays-at-gospel.html

UPDATE: Per the NYT, the anti-gay activist turned the entire final half hour of the concert into an anti-gay harangue:

The whole controversy might have been forgotten in the swell of gospel sound except Mr. McClurkin turned the final half hour of the three-hour concert into a revival meeting about the lightning rod he has become for the Obama campaign.

He approached the subject gingerly at first. Then, just when the concert had seemed to reach its pitch and about to end, Mr. McClurkin returned to it with a full-blown plea: “Don’t call me a bigot or anti-gay when I have suffered the same feelings,” he cried.

“God delivered me from homosexuality,” he added. He then told the audience to believe the Bible over the blogs: “God is the only way.” The crowd sang and clapped along in full support....

Mr. McClurkin’s support for Mr. Obama could signal to some black evangelical voters that race and religion are more important than Mr. Obama’s support for gay rights.

New York Times:
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/10/29/obamas-gospel-concert-tour

Surprise, surprise, surprise. Obama's anti-gay religious right activist used the opportunity Obama gave him last night to preach his hate to thousands of African-Americans. That's just great. And the white preacher who Obama picked to help explain to the audience that gays aren't minions of Satan? CNN reports that he said nothing at all - just a short little prayer, then he left. As for Obama, he did a taped introduction in which he praised McClurkin, the religious right activist, as one of his favorites. That's nice, because the way to help combat homophobia in the black community is to make sure the gay-basher is first endorsed by someone as high-ranking as Obama, who then chooses to say nothing about the gay-bashing.

So, in the end, Obama let his "best" and "favorite" artist slam gays to thousands of African-Americans, in his name, and neither he nor his hand-chosen white gay preacher said anything in response. Class act, that Obama campaign. For them, creating a "dialogue" means the gay-basher gets to spread his bigotry to thousands while the candidate and the token gay STFU.

And let's give a special shout out to the white gay preacher, Rev. Andy Sidden, who was supposed to be there defending our team. Here's how CNN reported his brave act of courage:

Sidden is the white, gay pastor added to the concert bill as a last minute compromise by the Obama campaign. Sidden's appearance was notably brief and anti-climactic: He said a short prayer to the auditorium at the very beginning of the program, when the arena was only about half full, and then he left.

Obama, while not present, appeared on a videotaped message to the crowd, saying, “The artists you’re going to hear from are some of the best in the world, and favorites of Michelle and myself.” McClurkin said during the concert that he had been introduced to Obama by Oprah Winfrey.

Wow, we could have invited a brick to give that heartfelt defense of gay people. Did Obama's people plan for Sidden to give his prayer when no one was there? Was Sidden asked by the Obama people not to say anything in defense of gays? Or did Sidden wimp out all by himself?

Atrios / Eschaton:
"Courting the Bigots ... This is just gross."
http://haloscan.com/tb/atrios/7440201094242774680

AmericaBlog:
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/10/29/obamas-gospel-concert-tour

New York Times:
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/10/29/obamas-gospel-concert-tour

CNN:
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2007/10/29/obama-supporter-god-delivered-me-from-homosexuality/

[William769]

1. K&R! for the hypocrisy of Obama and his supporters.

[OKNancy]

5. hey, don't do that

Obama supporters had nothing to do with it.

[William769]

8. They have plenty do do with trying to defend such a stupid action here on DU.

[OKNancy]

35. Maybe this post will make a difference

as I read down-thread, I think so.
I thought is was mismanagement and a bad campaign staff.
I've always been leery of Obama's "preachiness", but never did I think he would do something like this.
( I'm not an Obama supporter..never was)

[nvme]

156. Not again

Fcuk every mfing time! I had hopes with slick willy. Then came "don't ask don't tell". I saw the marriage thing in Hawaii, Then came DOMA. I had hopes for Obama. I sent money, Attend his things in Miami,sent more money,encouraged my friends to open their mind to Barak. I raised hell and started writing and avoiding all sponsors of RUSH Show When He played, "Barak the magic Negro". I cringed When I read about Mc Clurkin on his tour. Now I am Devistated, To read this closet queen is spouting gods cure(let me tell you: It wont be long before she is popped doing the senator Craig soft shoe tap dance), I just can't take this utter-disillusionment.
I just wanted to be able to get a fiancee VISA for my Venezuelan partner. I just want to be an American in the same line as everyone else. I dont care about hetro relationships. I promise not to let my gay juices or oils that i secrete from my skin leech into the water supply.
I Promise i wont rub off. Just let me live in peace. I will drink from a seperate fountain. just let me get spousal benefits. I will give up my seat to the hetro couple. If I can get survivorship rights. I will use the rear entrance(no pun intended, but hey, it works) if i can just have my lover at my side. I will not engage in lewd behavior in the middle of restaurants. I will confine my faerie dust to my own household, just let me be.
I feel more and more like bacteria that CAN be cured. GOD BLESS AMERICA

[NMDemDist2]

185. darling

:hug:

you need do none of the above to deserve all of the above

this old 50something white married hetro lady is working for your rights

you are not alone shouting into the wilderness :grouphug:

[nvme]

225. Thanks.

I needed that hug.

[YOY]

57. You do realize who you're replying to...

n/t

[MethuenProgressive]

184. But, but... Obama danced with Ellen!!

That means he likes the gays again, right?
:sarcasm:

[JackBeck]

201. Look over here:

dangling shiny keys.

[ShortnFiery]

50. K & R for the shamelessness of Obama's rivals.

:thumbsdown:

[Nedsdag]

75. So supporting Obama makes me anti-gay?

Well, supporting Hillary makes you a hypocrite. It was Hillary who had an African American minister weigh in on his feelings towards gays. It was Hillary's husband who signed DOMA and "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" and she kept quiet.

If I'm a hypocrite William769, then you are a complete "Uncle Tom" in the gay community.

Flame away at me if you must. I DON'T CARE!

[William769]

76. You got that right.

[Name removed]

92. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[William769]

98. And how am I a hypocrite?

I would love to hear this one.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

106. Please don't rise to the bait. Let this post stay unlocked.

If it becomes a flame-war it will get locked and evening folks will miss the message, so please let the few fire-starters go un-answered.

Thanks

[William769]

109. Well when attacked by a bigot I tend to take the offense.

[Nedsdag]

124. I'M NOT A BIGOT!

But how can you support a woman who has REFUSED to refute DOMA?

I'm waiting.

[William769]

127. Thats funny.

http://sweetness-light.com/archive/hillary-clinton-tells-gays-bush-is-worse-than-nixon

[Nedsdag]

130. Typical Hillary doublespeak:

"Clinton went on to defend both DOMA and her decision not to speak during the marriage amendment debate this past June, and in fact linked the two. She said that without being able to point to the U.S. law which bars federal recognition of gay marriage and allows states to similarly refuse to acknowledge such unions from other states, many more members of Congress would have voted to amend the Constitution, especially when that effort had its first vote two years ago."

The more things change, the more things stay the same.

[William769]

131. You call it doublespeak.

So what do you call Obama?

[Nedsdag]

136. You know it's sad when Giuliani shows more tolerance

for the gay community than "your girl" has.

[William769]

137. Care to back that up?

[CTLawGuy]

157. Hillary's statement is a load of crap

If we could have stopped DOMA, then we would not have been able to stop an amendment, that requires a greater % of yes votes????

[urgk]

250. This isn't doublespeak, it's plain as day --

From "All in the family - Hillary Rodhan Clinton supports Defense of Marriage Act"
Advocate, The, Feb 15, 2000
"She broke ranks with her husband by opposing his "don't ask, don't tell" policy, but when it comes to gay marriage, first lady Hillary Rodhan Clinton is standing by her man. Clinton, who is seeking the Democratic nomination for the U.S. Senate from New York State, said January 10 that she opposes same-sex marriage. She also said she would have voted for the Defense of Marriage Act, a bill passed by Congress in 1996 that prevents federal recognition of same-sex marriage. "Marriage has got historic, religious, and moral content that goes back to the beginning of time, and I think a marriage is as a marriage has always been, between a man and a woman," Clinton said."

[mark414]

113. because Hillary has 'shown off' her support from anti-gay ministers as well

[William769]

114. Link.

And please don't show the lame link where she attended a function that was hosted by someone else that was to help the inner city.

[mark414]

121. here you go

the author, quite obviously has an agenda, but everything that is said is supported with facts

http://www.thebarackobamareport.com/the_barack_obama_report/2007/10/is-human-rights.html

[William769]

128. You link to a Obama fan site?

Forgive me If I need something a little more concrete given recent revaluations.

[NYCGirl]

135. Here's a link:

http://www.hillaryclinton.com/news/release/view/?id=2857

[William769]

139. And?

[orleans]

233. and here's another link

(i just want to toss this one in here--i think it's rather "telling")

[mark414]

187. which links to numerous reputable news sources

to prove something called "facts"

[mondo joe]

223. It more likely means you just don't take anti-gay shit too seriously.

Surprise!

[OKNancy]

2. Six "recs" and no responses

I think I know why. As I read your post, all I could think of was "Oh dear".

[Dhalgren]

6. There really isn't anything to say. We said it all last week and were

talked down to by Obama supporters like we were children. We got it then and we get it now. We know who Obama is and how he operates - there isn't much more to say...

[ccpup]

3. the more I learn about this

the more disillusioned I become. That an allegedly progressive Democrat would do this is ... ? I can't even think of the word.

It's the Republican Politics of Hate and Religion from the Democrat who promised us the Politics of Hope.

[jahyarain]

129. It's the Republican Politics of Hate and Religion from the Democrat who promised us the Politics of

GOD DAMN, IF THAT DIDN'T SUM IT ALL UP! and the reason dems will lose progressives and real liberals. at least we know the piggies r lying 2 us. dems still pretend they're not while going along their merry way not doing a FUCKING thing 2 stop what the piggies do. they're just as bad and the reason dems will lose. fuck the pigs. and fuck the dems. third party or Revolution.

[dsc]

4. great post

I am beyond disappointed.

[Basileus Basileon]

7. Sad to watch Obama do this. nt

[LeftCoast]

9. This makes me ill

Has Obama condemned this yet? This is just outrageous.

[yardwork]

14. Condemned it?! He announced McClurkin as his favorite singer!

McClurkin - and his message of hate - was the spotlight of the entire event.

[merbex]

120. To say McClurkin was one of his favorite singers is like saying

Leni Riefenstahl is someone whose Directing ability we admire ...

It's hard, if not impossible, to separate the "artistic" ability from what they represent.

Bad, bad, move by Obama.

[MNDemNY]

20. He sponsored it. Condemn it? Not Likely.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

21. How could he condemn it?

Seriously... this event was planned as an anti-gay event. If Obama condemns it for being what he designed it to be it would just be piling lies upon lies.

[MNDemNY]

26. Here-Here!!!

[Dhalgren]

10. Just to clarify this for everyone:

This isn't a Clinton/Obama issue. Not at all. This is a human rights/civil rights/equal rights issue. Obama made this bed all by himself. I do not support Clinton, but I have now written Obama off, completely...

[William769]

17. I have been accused numerous times that I am going ape shit over this because I support. Hillary.

Let's forget the fact I am a Homosexual. That has absolutely nothing to do with the issue at hand. :sarcasm:

[youthere]

45. Well, I can tell you I am not a Hillary supporter..

and was leaning Obama, and I am extremely disappointed by this.

[rateyes]

252. Hillary is NOT the best friend that gays have in this race...

by any means. Neither is Obama.

[libnnc]

78. That's exactly right. And Obama should have known better.

This argument that it was handled poorly because he and his team "didn't know" or "weren't aware" is bull fucking shit. Obama's not dumb. He knows that the black church isn't the same as it was 30+ years ago.

Dr. King's church and vision isn't the message that gets put on the tee-vee anymore.

That message of civil and social justice doesn't make the big bucks. TD Jakes and "sinner-centered" preaching is what sells CDs and books and air time on the television.

If Obama is going to play the "church as the historic purveyor of social justice card", he needs to PICK THE RIGHT CHURCH TO ALIGN HIMSELF WITH.

[Karenina]

119. Amen.

[helderheid]

247. My feelings exactly

[yardwork]

11. I was not deceived. I recognized bigotry and spoke out about it.

Some folks on DU owe some of us apologies this morning. But that's not really important. What's important is to redouble defense of human rights.

Efforts to soft pedal bigotry will always fail because bigotry is wrong. It's ugly, it's mean, it's life-destroying, it leads to violence and extermination. It's indefensible.

Bigotry is always indefensible. Don't forget.

[Dhalgren]

13. I wish I could recommend your response!

:thumbsup: :applause:

[yardwork]

16. Thank you! I feel the same about yours just above mine!

[JackBeck]

22. An apology?

Good luck! I've asked and I am still waiting for one from DUers who said that the NJ civil union decision was going to help the Democrats lose in 2006.

[Froward69]

77. Thank you

I ranted about bigotry a few days ago.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=404x2434

[avrdream]

163. I just never expected that the bigotry would come from Obama himself.

I understand your post about doubling our efforts but I'm also quite disappointed about this.

[Karenina]

12. VERY. BAD. DECISION-MAKING.

[geek tragedy]

15. Disgusted Obama supporter checking in.

I really don't know what to say, except that I am extremely angry at his campaign right now.

Either they have the most incompetent asses in the history of modern campaigning running the show in SC or, well, I don't know.

[yardwork]

19. Thank you.

[MNDemNY]

23. I think you do know.

This was a conscious decision by BHO.

[Dhalgren]

25. Thanks for checking in. Showed guts.

We have to stand together on human rights, period. :thumbsup:

[RandomKoolzip]

30. Yeah, me too. VERY disgusted Obama supporter here.

As of this morning, Obama can go screw himself. THis is bullshit. Up until I read this, I assumed Obama himself might distance his campaign from McClurkin's moral ugliness - it is not so, and frankly, he has lost my support completely now.

[denem]

59. Sincere comiserations

All I would add is that the determination and joy that you, I and others feel a political campaign is real. It is by no means wasted. It is not lost as it springs from the best roots of our humanity.

[jonnyblitz]

32. I appreciate and will remember your honesty.

I guess it gets to a point where it is futile to keep spinning positive a bad situation. I also understand why you wanted to think the best of your candidate. PLease don't take it personal that i am so PISSED. :hi:

[Bumblebee]

34. It wasn't incompetence -- it was pandering. They wanted it to be

subtle (wink, wink, if you do not approve of homosexuality, we kinda understand) but lost control over it -- that's the incompetent part. I was never an Obama supporter (I did think he was too inexperienced) but I liked him a lot, and now I am afraid I don't like him as much. This was unforgivable.

[JackBeck]

36. They lost control because us "uppity queers" and our supporters

Saw right through to the heart of what really was going on.

I liked the man, too, and hopefully he's learned something from this event.

[Bumblebee]

40. Hope so too -- but he needs to say something very dramatic and even

if his handlers object to it for many of us to believe that he really did learn something from it.

[FedUp_Queer]

147. Yes, how DARE we?

All us faggots have the unmitigated gall to call a wolf in sheep's clothing what he is...a WOLF! I don't support Hillary (DOMA, DADT) or Obama. Looks like, as so often, we are going to come around to the all inspiring realization that: "Well, Candidate X (the Democrat) is better than Candidate Y (the Republican)." Wow, I am so inspired. Wow, I can't wait to hit the pavement. Wow, I can't wait to be able to have hope of sponsoring my partner of 7 years. Gee, I am absolutely beside myself with glee. Is there a principled candidate in the house? Buehler? Buehler?

[eridani]

224. Well, yes, as a matter of fact

Dennis Kucinich supports full marriage equality and has for many years. The frontrunners are the frontrunners because they aren't too threatening to the MSM or the white/hetero supremacy (and pro-corporation) philosophy that far too many registered voters still adhere to.

One day we will have the people-powered on the ground organization to do an end run around them--don't give up on building it now.

[theHandpuppet]

237. Exactly my feelings, too

I voted for Kucinich in the last primary and it looks as if he will get my vote again. The rest of them are a pack of pandering liars. I was hoping this crop would be better. What a joke.

[kenfrequed]

255. I agree

Dennis is the most progressive candidate running on all counts.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

38. Classy response, and it's cool (in my eyes) to support him

My issue is the presentation of Obama as something other than a politician... being on a moral plane above the other candidates.

They are all ambitious people who compromise moral values to win. Hillary voted for Kyl?Lieberman because she expects a nail-biter race against Guliani in Florida. John Edwards is running around encouraging people to trust their "instincts" as to whether a black or a woman can win.

These people are ALL ruthless, ambitious politicians. That's the name of the game. Looking for moral superiority in politicians is like looking for humanity in trench warfare. It exists, on occasion, but is not the point of the exercise.

[geek tragedy]

39. I'll give the campaign a chance to respond to this.

McClurkin is enough of a narcissistic asshole that I can believe this was entirely improvised.

But, the campaign needs to throw his ass under the bus.

[Bumblebee]

52. I totally agree with your analysis but here's the sad part. While

Obama was never my choice, my two daughters who are barely of voting age are (were?) Obama girls. They assumed that he was cool, and very progressive, and not your traditional politician. I was hoping he wouldn't disappoint them but now my heart aches for their sake -- and for the sake of all the other idealistic young people who thought they finally found the candidate they could so enthusiastically support.

[goodgd_yall]

146. As an older person

I certainly remember putting candidates on pedestals. It can take quite a few elections before you start understanding the pandering that goes on in every election campaign---moreso the higher the stakes. I just have to decide which values are the most important to me and what are deal-breakers. But that is what upsets me the most about Obama---the image he projected of progressiveness and the promise of bringing something new to the executive office. This type of thing (McCurkin's inclusion) engenders cynicism. I'm sorry your girls are learning this hard lesson so soon.

[Cameron27]

43. Well if the campaign responds

I'll listen, but the time for condemnation was before he let this guy MC.

[emilyg]

118. Agree.

[ShortnFiery]

48. I'm present and absolutely disgusted. Its so much easier to slime than to

laud your candidate's accolades. Tells me a great deal about who our opponents are and it's not all positive. Yet, if they win, they'll wonder why we don't fall all over ourselves to kiss and make up with "the victor."

Power and campaigning with "blunt force objects" such as whisper campaigns and smears doesn't make one's opponent more attractive. I suspect that I know the source of these smears and they all hold "hidden agendas" for a rival candidate. :(

[William769]

74. And you never smeared another candidate?

Yea right! :eyes:

[Cameron27]

82. Don't fall into the trap William.

A smear is a lie, and this is a condemnation of a real event.

[ShortnFiery]

88. Well, yes I have. However, I've not made it a "dedicated hobby" like many non-Obama supporters ...

yet, I'm not without the "sin of smear." ;)

However, I find it unfortunate that my learned opposition expend extensive amounts of energy on such tactics.

There is such a thing as being a "sore winner." In my not so humble opinion. :blush:

[William769]

95. Have you ever heard of a pissed off Queen?

Well if you haven't, all you have to do is look at my posts about this subject. When someone attacks me personally (yes I took this personally), they are going to receive nothing but my wrath.

And who's a sore winner? The Bigot spoke, he was applauded and the fight goes on.

[Nedsdag]

101. Well, I'm taking you on.

Be a pissed off Queen all you want. Obama has a good record on all issues yet you're taking ONE issue and hammering him on the head on this.

Go ahead. Vote for Hillary. If you don't think she's taking the gay vote for granted then you're horribly mistaken. She'll do something in office that will piss you off so bad then when it's time for re-election, you'll be voting for her again. Mark my word.

[William769]

103. Go ahead take me on.

If she ever did what Obama did. I would disavow her in a heartbeat!

Your appeasement of what Obama has done says volumes about you. Playing the African American card here won't work.

[Nedsdag]

126. Neither is playing the "angry queer" card.

If you supported someone like Kucinich or even Biden, then I would show you some respect.

You lost my respect with your support of Mrs. Clinton and her support of Rev. Mayberry.

[William769]

133. I believe it's the other way around.

Did she tour with him? Is she using him at concerts to make money? Is she using him to pander to Christian conservatives?

[Nedsdag]

138. She pandered when she took the photograph with him.

She pandered when she praised him.

[William769]

141. What photohraph?

What did she praise him for?

[urgk]

251. "Is she using him to pander to Christian conservatives?" Yes.

His endorsement is on her website. Which, it seems, people in this thread keep trying to ignore.

"Senator Clinton has an excellent concept about how she plans to address issues surrounding crime and education. She described how she has partnered with leaders in New York to create a charter school specifically for African American men and notes that the Allen Cathedral AME Church charter school in Jamaica Queens, New York could be used as a model of how to help educate African American young men. Her mentioning of the school shows that she's aware of outstanding successful examples of education in this country. The way she addressed the need for the federal government to partner with inner cities suggests that she's not just focusing on international issues but that she's concerned with domestic ones - particularly crime and violence in our communities. I want a president who knows how to strike a balance between addressing international and domestic challenges facing this country," said Reverend Dr. Harold R. Mayberry, Senior Pastor of First African Methodist Episcopal Church and Chairperson of Network for Interfaith Action.

http://www.hillaryclinton.com/news/release/view/?id=2857

[ShortnFiery]

102. Wow, Just "WOW"

I have no idea where your anger from the above post comes from, but I don't even want to scratch the surface of uncovering why you choose to take it out on a very honorable candidate.

Damn - there's something under the surface that has NOTHING to do with Obama's Campaign - even that nasty people who are homo-phobic.

Something more - and I don't want to know.

I hope you are able to see through this and have a good day.

BUT I'm OUT - here! :wow: :hi:

[William769]

104. Calling Obama honorable?

If I was you, I'd be outta here also.

[Tellurian]

169. Just to let you know William..

CNN just did a rehash of McCloset headlining Obama's Gospel Tour. They conceded McCloset had no affect on drawing a larger crowd than wouldn't have attended in the first place. If this flap hadn't become such an issue at primarily a Democratic event, I believe the upshot of it all was Obama was hoping to draw a majority of Republicans as crossover voters.

I'm convinced, the whole event was staged to appease Republicans in hopes of garnering their votes even at the expense of Obama's GLBT Community of supporters.

[BronxBoy]

188. I have a little bit different take on this....

Keep in mind that Obama has in no way, shape or form solidified Black support behind his campaign. And the reasons for this are being discussed in depth within the Black community. There have been several high profile endorsements of candidates other than Obama from prominent Black officials. I'm not a political strategist but it would seem that if Obama were to be successful in his quest for the nomination, he would have to handily carry the Black vote. So if this was some sort of political machination and I don't know if it was, it was more likely aimed at Conservative BLACK voters and not republicans. He has to shore up support among a constituency that he really needs and regardless of how you may feel about it, the Black church still holds a lot of sway over recommending who their congregations should vote for.

I still maintain that the real story here is not McClurkin per se but the exposure being put on Black intolerance for homosexuality. Keep in mind that there is pretty much universal support within our community for Obama's decision and quite frankly, for McClurkin. When I heard this issue being discussed on Black talk radio, there was either overt approval of the decision to have him appear or a pooh-poohing of how Gays felt about this matter. I think that is the larger issue.

[Tellurian]

191. I appreciate your viewpoint..

I was reiterating what was reported on cnn as the "word" on the effect or non effect of McClurkin's headlining and mc'ing Obama's weekend Gospel Tour. McClurkin was a guest entertainer for a Bush event in 04' and seemed to be a necessary component for Obama's gospel weekend (because he refused to remove him in spite of protests from the gay community). In other words, McClurkin was a representative example Obama was promoting as the Republican version seen as acceptable of the GLBT Community to garner the Republican crossover vote. imo...Obama's plan backfired because as reported by cnn, the crossover Republicans never materialized at the event.

[Karenina]

196. Thank you, BB.

It would seem Obama DECIDED to step on this third rail. I grew up in NYC and we, as kids, KNEW that with one false move the "cover" would not protect us and in that event, we'd be FRIED.

Oprah may have "endorsed" him, but so far her "peep" hasn't done him any favors. I am unable to see the whole debacle as anything other than DELIBERATE, calculated pandering to the most ignorant, brainwashed, self-righteous, bigoted segment of the community. AND I am LIVID at his ill-use of Andy Sidden while reinforcing the "invisibility" of the black LGBT community. Talk about a DOUBLE GOLDEN SHOWER!

[bullwinkle428]

"Sore winner"? I'm sorry, but I think that's a load!

The way things played out, I think EVERYONE on the Democratic side of the fence LOST! One of our brightest stars, in the eyes of most, was willing to throw a significant segment of the base under the bus to score some cheap pandering points, and it's all out there for the world to view...

[Chovexani]

168. Seriously

"Winner?" WHo the fuck won in this except the bigots and homophobes?

[Bluebear]

123. I'm impressed by this, gt.

This took major guts on your part to post and I appreciate it.

[tekisui]

18. Obama let us down.

So much less than he claimed to be. I ignored this for awhile, hoping it was a distorted story, but it is clear now. Obama let the ex-gay preach for an hour, talking about how the lord can deliver you from homosexuality. THis is far worse than Richardson thinking its a choice.

Obama---you dropped the ball.

[MNDemNY]

27. Kicked the ball...out of bounds.

[tekisui]

29. Well said.

[jenmito]

24. Well, I'd like to say I'm sorry to all those who felt thrown under the bus by ME.

Unless Obama speaks out against what McBigot did by preaching that BS, I'll be very disappointed in him. I really thought he'd ONLY be singing.

[NMMNG]

55. Thank you

:hi:

[jenmito]

56. No problem! When you're wrong you're wrong...

and I was wrong.

[Mark Twain Girl]

28. "The artists you’re going to hear from are some of the best in the world"

"The artists you're going to hear from are some of the best in the world, and favorites of Michelle and myself."

That is what's getting me. Somewhat wrote that this bigot was chosen for his bigotry, not in spite of it. I tend to agree.

Oh, and this:

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2007/10/29/obama-supporter-god-delivered-me-from-homosexuality/

"Meanwhile, Obama staff were inside and outside the building, working the crowd and trying to register new voters."

[acmavm]

31. Barry didn't/doesn't disappoint me one little bit. I expect this shit

from the guy.

[wndycty]

33. This is why I felt regardless of the adjustments McClurkin should have been dumped outright. . .

. . .while I maintain my support of the Obama campaign and I will defend Obama's overall record on gay rights, I continue to be disappointed in how this controversy was handled.

I knew McClurkin would exploit the fact that he felt persecuted.

[AndyA]

37. Shame on Barack. I would have expected a black man to be more sensitive

to hatred, bigotry, and discrimination.

But apparently not.

He will not get my vote if he gets the nomination, and I suspect this ill conceived move has lost him a great deal of support.

If I wanted another anti-gay bigot in the White House, I'd vote Republican!

[Karenina]

41. Your expectation was unreasonable.

[AndyA]

54. Yeah, heaven forbid I would expect a BLACK DEMOCRAT

to want fairness and equality for everyone!

Bad me.

[Karenina]

64. Expecting someone who has experienced such and such

to understand so and so is not reasonable. It is a conclusion I've drawn after many stunning disappointments. Some do, and SOME. JUST. D/Won't.

[Bobbieo]

62. I don't support any of the top three candidates But

if Obama gets the nomination I will not vote at all or vote for the Repuke.

[Froward69]

80. That is the opinion of

A huge number of undecideds as well!

[soleft]

42. I was inclined to support Obama until this.

I also think that Hillary's big throw us under the bus moment could be in the offing at any moment.

Should Obama or Hillary get the nomination, I will vote for them to prevent the republicans from keeping the White House.

Also, I think the Ameriblog headline is misleading. I'm not sure McClurkin can be characterized as a campaign spokesman. Unless he's been called that by the campaign.

[NMMNG]

44. K&R. I knew this was going to happen

Anything for the votes. Screw the LGBT community. They aren't important.

To hell with that. :puke:

[bicentennial_baby]

46. Will they ever listen to us?!

x(

:hi:

[NMMNG]

61. I don't know

But I won't shut up. :hug:

[JackBeck]

49. Many of us did know.

And we will continue to shine a light on every instance of bigotry, regardless if others "get it".

We're "uppity" and "hysterical". Gotta live up to the characterizations.

[MuseRider]

60. "Uppity"

I say hooray for the "uppity" LGBT's. You gotta be. If you are not "uppity" this kind of shit wins. From now on I will consider myself and "uppity ally" and screw anyone who does not like it. Like you I suspected this was going on but wanted to believe otherwise. Obama had to know, he HAD to know that his "equality" platform would never hold after something like this. If he did not then the man has been given too much credit.

[NMMNG]

66. Well, as we've been told

We need to fight for our rights, so that's what we'll do.

[Politicub]

171. Another uppity and hysterical queer here

and proud of it! :)

:hug:

[jonnyblitz]

65. I wonder if that nasty DU Obama supporter who wanted to

"spit on us" is going to eat crow or if she is going to keep on making excuses for this shit.

[JackBeck]

69. Could it have been this one?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=user_profiles&u_id=209769

[jonnyblitz]

71. nope, but THAT is good news, too, though.

the tombstoned one was particularly vile

right here:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=3653335&mesg_id=3653806

[Clintonista2]

81. Oops I thought you were talking about this one:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=3653335&mesg_id=3654026

[JackBeck]

87. Yikes!

I believe I've had a few run-ins with that one. Wonder if they've got anything to say today about this sordid affair.

[emilyg]

122. I have, too. Put that one on ignore.

[yardwork]

150. That should be alerted on as a Generalized Attack on many DUers

That post was against the rules before, and in light of today's news, is completely beyond the pale.

[Cameron27]

73. Oh thank god.

She was one nasty piece of work.

[JackBeck]

215. And there we have it.

Glad I'm not alone in my assessment.

[Lucinda]

174. That is one tombstone I Am VERY glad to see

I wasn't aware he/she had gone bye-bye. Good to know.

[JackBeck]

216. You and me both.

Good riddance.

[Sapphocrat]

70. I guess we'll never know.

:nuke: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=user_profiles&u_id=209769 :nuke:

[jonnyblitz]

72. although THAT is a beautiful sight to see. i was referring to

this. :hi:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=3653335&mesg_id=3653806

[William769]

152. Thanks for the link.

[NMMNG]

83. I won't know

I'm ignoring that one.

[Name removed]

158. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MNDemNY]

161. Oh, go take an obama.

[AtomicKitten]

165. go out and take a big breath of fresh air

and open you eyes

This is a much bigger world than just sniveling on the internets.

[Cameron27]

47. K&R

[iconoclastic cat]

51. It was down to Obama or Edwards for me. I guess I've had my choice made for me. nt

[Cameron27]

53. Well Edwards is someone I can't support in the primary,

so it's down to Biden, Clinton or Dodd.

[FredScuttle]

58. Atrocious decision-making

I don't know how many votes Obama thought he would get by pandering to the bigots and proudly including this ass in his fundraiser, but he lost my vote. "Audacity of Hope", my fucking ass.....more like "Audacity of Audacity"

[Froward69]

84. I Agree.

Obama is the best orator of the pack. but his actions are questionable. He can make me cry with patriotism. then again so could Hitler. not to draw those two together politically. but to point out Hitler was a great orator also. both have the power of persuasion.

[Elidor]

91. I think Atrios said it best:

"The audacity of homophobia."

[msongs]

63. does obama get a kickback from increased mcclurkin cd sales? nt

[CyberPieHole]

67. Kick and recommend #28 n/t

[AndyTiedye]

68. Not Only Did He Throw Gays Under the Bus, He is Doing Great Damage to the Democratic Party

There has been a very well-organized and well-funded campaign to turn the black community against gays.
(Organized by whom? We can only guess, but it smells like Rove's handiwork).

Blacks and gays have been core consituancies of the Democratic Party for years, and we need both to win.

It is beyond disappointing that Barak Obama is actively participating in driving a wedge between blacks and gays!

[Bluebear]

117. Truly, you should post that as a separate thread.

It is insightful and true, the damage that has been done or attempted is disgraceful.

[yardwork]

153. I agree. We see that wedge appearing right here on DU.

[Clintonista2]

79. Note the absence of McClurkin apologists from this thread. nm.

[jenmito]

89. Maybe because there are no McClurkin apologists...

I apologized, however, above, to those who felt thrown under the bus by my support of Obama's choice...

[Clintonista2]

96. Umm, sure there are

Some of them aren't even Obama supporters. One in particular goes around to every thread saying "McClurkins quotes have been taken out of context!"

[jenmito]

105. Oh, OK...

I missed that.

[goodgd_yall]

143. Well....there used to be

Kind of hard to be an apologist now, I would think.

[MNDemNY]

90. Nuthin' but crickets chirp chirp........

[Clintonista2]

115. Even crickets wouldn't support Obama's handing of the McClurkin fiasco

[SaveElmer]

85. I was fooled...

I was certain all along that it was a poor campaign operation not a deliberate strategy...which is why I have criticized Obama's campaign, but not his views towards gays on this...

Guess I was wrong!

[FlaxieB]

94. Hillary Supporter - Expected nothing less from you. Well you need to feel the same way about

Mulberry and Hillary then.

[Clintonista2]

97. What campaign event of Hillarys did Mulberry MC?

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

108. Please don't rise to the bait. Let this post stay unlocked.

If it becomes a flame-war it will get locked and evening folks will miss the message, so please let the few fire-starters go un-answered.

Thanks

[SaveElmer]

107. Surely you can see the difference...

I didn't criticize Obama for accepting the support of someone like McClurkin...of course the party needs to engage those that disagree, and those we may find offensive in some ways...I have no problem with that as it allows us to expose them to a different view...

However to put someone like McClurkin in such a high profile position, representing your campaign to a group of voters in such a public way is an entirely different thing...and I think you realize that...

I initially viewed this as a campaign error and improper vetting...

That apparently is not true, Obama...unless he comes out strongly against this, is clearly pandering to the anti-gay bigotry of a sector of the party for their votes...

No different than Republican strategy to pander to the racism of southerners in the 1960's and antu-gay bigotry of the 90's and 2000's

[CyberPieHole]

86. Great post...

I hope Obama is pleased with himself. I, for one, never believed McClurkin was "just going to sing one song". But it never even occurred to me that he would MC. And then to use the stage to preach his bigotry and homophobia?!!! Well, he was probably preaching to the choir.

[FlaxieB]

93. Let me get this right a person is a bigot is he states he is no longer gay

DAMN. That is something I never heard of before. That is Deep Shit.

“Don’t call me a bigot or anti-gay when I have suffered the same feelings,” he cried.

“God delivered me from homosexuality,” he added. He then told the audience to believe the Bible over the blogs: “God is the only way.” The crowd sang and clapped along in full support....

[Bluebear]

99. What is deep shit is if you are trolling here for sympathy for your bigoted campaign.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

110. Please don't take the bait

This is a valuable thread. Don't let a few fire-starters turn it into a flame-war

[jonnyblitz]

111. you know, I doubt I could ever be so obsessed over a fucking

politician so damn INTENSELY as to get so pathetically CRAVEN as some of you do in your support. There is NO WAY you can make excuses for this mess no matter how hard you try to grasp at straws. Give it up soon unless you don't mind looking like a complete FOOL. Thankfully not all Obama supporters are so DAMN far gone and admit this is NOT good.

[Bluebear]

116. It's total Bush-cultist style mentality.

This poster should recognize the symptoms and seek help.

[SaveElmer]

132. Promoting the notion that someone can be "cured" of their gayness...

Is straight out of the right wing playbook. Convince someone it is a disease, or a mental illness, or some form of abnormality rather than what it actually is, the innate way some people are born...then you have a built in excuse to continue discrimination...

[yardwork]

154. If you don't understand how deeply offensive that is, then you probably think

that racial cleansing is just fine, too.

[Maat]

100. This PFLAGer knew about McClurkin from the beginning ..

and knew what he would do; I believe Obama was fully aware of what he would do.

Take action! Support the organization that addresses the 'ex-gay' nonsense: www.truthwinsout.org !!

Take action! Support the only candidate who has stood strong for marriage equality, Dennis Kucinich. Dennis K needs money to run his campaign. Donate now!

[trotsky]

112. Completely destroys what many had offered as a defense of the whole debacle.

"He's only there to sing"

"Obama isn't going to speak"

"See? Inclusion of the (white) gay minister makes it all better!"

I'm terribly sad that the worst of our fears played out. I had held out hope that maybe Obama's defenders were right, it wasn't going to be so bad. So much for that.

[emilyg]

125. K&R - from straight but not narrow.

[goodgd_yall]

134. And plenty of DUers were saying McCurkin would just be singing gospel

A true bigot who thinks he's under "God"'s directive to convert the LGBT community is NOT going to waste his big moment to preach his message of hate. And Obama gave him that moment of opportunity.

[zazzle]

180. Yes - that's why I support John Edwards!!

and denounce all those who've spread the lies that he called gays "those people."
Democrats are some of the most easily influenced - and Bob Shrum who wrote that about Edwards per his 1998 senate campaign - is part of the DC Hillary establishment!

[goodgd_yall]

140. Sidden was a useless addition

Is this performance going to other towns? It will be interesting to see if Obama's people make some changes in the show after this opening debacle. Whatever...what's done is done. Bye, bye, 'Bama.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

142. I can't believe Sidden spoke to a half-empty hall then left

That's barely even tokenism... it's more like a technicality. "It was inclusive. We had a gay performer during the sound-check."

[autorank]

144. Obama is a loser but his supporters should not be judged to this point.

It's the politics of personal loyalty.

People see hope in someone, like Obama, who is charismatic and has a good grab and pitch. He/she may or may not be the real deal. In Obama's case, he was anti-war, damn, that's a great recommendation. So people project their hopes and values on to the icon and away we go. The Obama supporters here were hoping that he was "the one." And they provided information, for the most part, that they were given. I'm sure that there are some Obama staffers here but most are good people who made a judgment that didn't work out (the personal loyalty to politician judgments never work out).

I like this post a great deal when it comes to the obvious lies Obama tells, the worst kind.

But his supporters deserve the benefit of the doubt.

K*R

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

148. The legit supporters are cool

The few intentionally hateful smear-and-distract damage control operatives are a another matter entirely, but they have ended up hurting their candidate more than any opposing campaign ever could, so there is some justice in that.

[Bluebear]

151. Not his supporters who wanted to "spit in some faces" here.

[urgk]

159. Obama on McClurkin.

I present the following:

“I strongly disagree with Reverend McClurkin’s views and will continue to fight for these rights as president of the United States to ensure that America is a country that spreads tolerance instead of division,” Obama said in a statement.

http://blogs.reuters.com/trail08/2007/10/23/obama-takes-heat-from-gays-on-gospel-tour/

[Bluebear]

162. Yes, that was 10/23. Then he turned around and had McClurkin MC!!!

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

166. “I strongly disagree with Reverend McClurkin’s views and will continue to showcase them

[Politicub]

173. Having your cake and eating it too

Isn't that how the saying goes?

[urgk]

245. Is Obama's political record his cake or the eating it part?

(according to http://lesbianlife.about.com/od/lesbianactivism/p/BarackObama.htm)

Barack Obama's Political Background: Barack Obama was elected to the Illinois State Senate in 1996. He served for eight years and ran for United States Senate in 2004. His speech at the Democratic National Convention that year brought America's attention to this liberal political newcomer. He won the election easily over arch-conservative Alan Keyes.
Barack Obama in the Illinois Senate: Barack Obama was known as a liberal who was not afraid to build bridges across party lines during his term in the Illinois State Senate. He gained a 100% rating from Planned Parenthood for his support of family planning and abortion rights legislation.

Barack Obama and Gay Rights in Illinois: Barack Obama supported gay rights during his Illinois Senate tenure. He sponsored legislation in Illinois that would ban discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation.

Barack Obama in the United States Senate: Every two years the Human Rights Campaign, the largest national gay and lesbian organization, issues a scorecard for members of the Senate based on their sponsorship and voting on key issues of importance to gay and lesbian citizens. Barack Obama scored 89 out of 100% in the 2006 scorecard. Here's how HRC rated Barack Obama:

Barack Obama on Hate Crimes: Barack Obama co-sponsored legislation to expand federal hate crimes laws to include crimes perpetrated because of sexual orientation and gender identity.
Employment Non-Discrimination: Barack Obama supports the Employment Non-Discrimination Act and believes it should be expanded to include sexual orientation and gender identity.

Don't Ask, Don't Tell - Gays in the Military: Barack Obama believes we need to repeal the "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy and allow gays and lesbians to serve openly in the military. His campaign literature says, "The key test for military service should be patriotism, a sense of duty, and a willingness to serve."

Co-Sponoring Legislation: Barack Obama, in line with HRC, co-sponsored legislation to bring Medicaid coverage to low-income, HIV-positive Americans and the Local Law Enforcement Enhancement Act which would expand federal jurisdiction to reach serious, violent hate crimes perpetrated because of the and;actual or perceived race, color, religion, national origin, sexual orientation or disability and; of the victim. He did not co-sponsor Uniting American Families Act that would amend the Immigration and Nationality Act to provide same-sex partners of U.S. citizens the same immigration benefits legal spouses of U.S. residents enjoy.

Barack Obama and Gay Marriage: Although Barack Obama has said that he supports civil unions, he is against gay marriage. In an interview with the Chicago Daily Tribune, Obama said, "I'm a Christian. And so, although I try not to have my religious beliefs dominate or determine my political views on this issue, I do believe that tradition, and my religious beliefs say that marriage is something sanctified between a man and a woman." He said he would support civil unions between gay and lesbian couples, as well as letting individual states determine if marriage between gay and lesbian couples should be legalized.

"Giving them a set of basic rights would allow them to experience their relationship and live their lives in a way that doesn't cause discrimination," Obama said. "I think it is the right balance to strike in this society."

[Politicub]

249. Thanks for the background

as it shows a great example of Obama having his cake and eating it too.

You and I both know that he's pandering to anti gay bigots by including MuClurkin on his tour. It couldn't be any more plain than that.

I admire his voting record and most of what he says (I take issue with his seperate but equal marriage stance), but detest his campaign's choice of having McClurkin emcee the SC events.

I'm not naive enough to believe that I'm going to agree with all of a candidate's positions, but the McClurkin thing cuts me and other GLBT people to the core. With all of the bullshit we have to deal with, it feels like a sucker punch for an exgay to be involved with the Obama campaign.

[urgk]

253. Nope.

"as it shows a great example of Obama having his cake and eating it too."

Um, no it doesn't. It shows Obama's voting record for gay rights. Which, unless Obama is gay, shows him (to beat the phrase to death) giving other people some cake.

Semantics aside, I understand being angry with his choice of emcee, but that doesn't automatically clear Hillary's record ("Marriage has got historic, religious, and moral content that goes back to the beginning of time, and I think a marriage is as a marriage has always been, between a man and a woman," Clinton said.) or make her the better (or more socially progressive) candidate of the two. Considering the polls (and Edwards' wishy-washy record with regards to the same issue), that's the choice we're going to have to make.

Me, I'd take Kucinich.

[Politicub]

257. I'm not here to compare Obama to Hillary, etc.

I just want a dem to get elected. What upsets me is Obama's wet kiss to a bigot. And you're right, it doesn't erase the good he's done, but it doesn't add to the list either.

[yardwork]

181. I don't want "tolerance." I want the same rights every other American has.

I'm sick and tired of this "spread tolerance instead of division" mealy-mouthed crap.

I. Don't. Want. Tolerance.

I don't care a flip what anybody thinks about me and the fact that I'm a lesbian. I just don't want them to be able to fire me from my job because of it, or kick me out of my house, or arrest me, or deny my partner the right to visit me in the hospital.

What is so difficult to understand about that?

[urgk]

248. I hear you.

I want the same things for you.

But.

I. Don't. Want. World. War. III.

Nor do I want a theocracy. Or any part of a "liberal" who runs in religious-based social circles with Senator Brownback (who has called her " a beautiful child of the living God.") and Tom Delay.

From The Advocate, Feb 15, 2000: All in the family - Hillary Rodhan Clinton supports Defense of Marriage Act - Brief Article

"She broke ranks with her husband by opposing his "don't ask, don't tell" policy, but when it comes to gay marriage, first lady Hillary Rodhan Clinton is standing by her man. Clinton, who is seeking the Democratic nomination for the U.S. Senate from New York State, said January 10 that she opposes same-sex marriage. She also said she would have voted for the Defense of Marriage Act, a bill passed by Congress in 1996 that prevents federal recognition of same-sex marriage. "Marriage has got historic, religious, and moral content that goes back to the beginning of time, and I think a marriage is as a marriage has always been, between a man and a woman," Clinton said."

So, I posted on this thread to help quiet the anti-Obama fervor. Especially in light of all the rabid Hillary supporters who have jumped on this like hypocrisy is solely the provence of everyone else's candidate.

[autorank]

226. Clarification: I think they all have a lot lacking (the leading contenders)

Clinton is an agent for the worst elements of the political process. Here's proof:

- Hillary embraces the National Prayer Breakfast - http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15157545/
- Here's who they are - http://www.alternet.org/story/16167/

Edwards almost makes it but never quite. He refused to contradict Clinton and Obama about their very
strange notion that we'll still have troops in Iraq in 2013 if they're elected president.

Go for it Edwards! But he seems like he just can't. It's strange. He's smart enough to figure it out
but he just can't let it rip.

[Baby Snooks]

145. God is the only way?

You have to ask whose God? That should settle the question of Obama.

[FlaxieB]

160. I thought there was only one God

[MNDemNY]

164. One , three, forty-six, or none. That is YOUR OPINION.

Not a fact, nothing but your opinion, and you have shown alot of bad opinions of late. IMO

[Robbien]

149. Obama is not going to be the Democratic candidate

This along with Obama's stance on social security made me realize Obama is going no where except back to the Land of Lincoln.

[CTLawGuy]

155. It was stupid to let him talk.

no defense from me.

That said, Obama is still the best of a bunch of flawed candidates.

[yardwork]

176. I don't think that it was a misstep - I think it was deliberate on the part of Obama's campaign.

Obama's campaign is clearly reaching out - reaching out to homophobes in the south. I believe that this was a deliberate campaign strategy. That sickens me.

That means that Obama is NOT the best of a bunch of flawed candidates. It puts him somewhere in the middle of the Democratic field.

Kucinich is the best candidate declared for the presidency.

[autorank]

227. Like when Southern Democrats get those pictures surrounded by Sheriffs

Means one thing to us and another to someone else.

[Chulanowa]

167. As a mild Obama supporter, I'm sorry, folks

He's dropped out of the running, as far as I'm concerned. I'd had little issue with McClurkin at the event - but like others, I had assumed he would be singing, not preaching.

I can't, however, proclaim that I will abstain from voting, or god fucking forbid go Republican if Obama wins the primaries. I promise you guys... Rudy, Fred, or Ron will be even worse for human rights than Obama, boneheaded move or no.

[yardwork]

177. It just shows what a mess this country is in - look at our options. Not good.

I'm not excited about ANY of the Democrats running for president, but the worst of them is better than any Republican.

It's one thing to acknowledge that we're going to have to vote for some Democrat, however flawed, and quite another to defend bigotry. I've seen some atrocious excuses made for bigotry over the past few days. We still have a long way to go.

[Chulanowa]

179. I'm pulling harder for Kucinich as each day passes

So what if he's sort or looks funny. I'm more concerned with the contents of his head than the shape of it. I have yet to see anything of this sort come from him.

[Karenina]

183. He is the only one telling the "unvarnished" TRUTH

:shrug:

[Politicub]

170. The choice of McClurkin bothers me so much

I thought so much more of Obama. I hate when anyone drives a wedge. I expect this kind of behavior from the GOP, but it is heartbreaking when someone like Obama is hammering the wedge between people.

These campaigns aren't stupid. They micromanage everything down to the last detail. The selection of McClurkin is a choice that someone on the campign made, that someone else signed off on, and on down the line.

I don't know what this says about me, but I'll still vote for Obama should he be the dem nominee. It's just I won't be as elated by that choice as I once was.

I hope we can get past the anti-gay stuff one day. But I'm not holding my breath.

[happygoluckytoyou]

172. GO GO GOP GO GO GOP GO GO GOP GO GO GOP...

CLINTON BLAH BLAH BLAH

OSAMA BLAH BLAH BLAH

...THE GOP SMEAR AND WEDGE MACHINE IS IN HIGH GEAR HEADING INTO 2008....

SCREW LABOR...... EDWARDS HAS AN EXPENSIVE HAIRCUT..... CLINTON WAS RUDE.... OBAMA SAID BLAH BLAH.....

--------AND ALL THEY HAVE TO DO IS GET YOU TO SAY "I HATE SO-AND-SO BECAUSE OF THIS VOTE OR THAT STATEMENT"... AND THEY HAVE WON

..............WHEN WILL THE LIBERALS OF THE WORLD LEARN THAT THE GOP AND THEIR MEDIA LOVES TO WATCH US IMPLODE UPON OURSELVES!!!

they love it.... LOVE IT..... THEY TAKE UP AN ISSUE AND HANG IT OVER THE FIRE... WATCH US RUN AROUND LIKE ANTS... WASTE OUR ENERGY FIGHTING OVER HE-SAID SHE-SAID.... BECAUSE THEY KNOW WE THINK AND WE TALK... AND THEY WANT TO CONTROL THE TOPICS.....

THE BEST-BEST-BEST GOP CANDIDATE IS WORSE THAN ANY DEMOCRAT ON THE TICKET.....

A SINGLE DEMOCRAT IN THE WHITEHOUSE... A MAJORITY IN THE HOUSE AND SENATE... A COUPLE LIBERAL JUDGES... AND WE HAVE IT ALL....

--------AND THEN WE CAN DIVIDE THE SPOILS..... AND THEN WE CAN GET OUR WAY....

----------------------BUT LEAVE THE CANDIDATES ALONE AND QUIT FANNING THE FLAMES.... THEY NEED TO WALK STRANGE CENTRIST LINES, TO COURT THE VOTE, TO SPEND THE OUTLANDISH MONEY.... TO WHORE THEMSELVES TO WIN THE ELECTION......
((((((((AND THAT IS JUST THE PLAIN GODS HONEST TRUTH..... NO DIFFERENT THAN GORE HAS TO SPEND FOSSIL FUEL TO GET OUT HIS MESSAGE))))))) ........ HOW ABOUT QUIT THE DEM-WHINING.... AND GO KICK RUDYS ASS

[Sapphocrat]

175. Can you possibly...

...STOP YELLING?

[zazzle]

178. Yet another reason I support John Edwards!

and no - he never called gays "those people - another lie spewed by Hillary's DC insider Bob Shrum - and spread by Hillary and Obama supporters.

[Divine Discontent]

182. YOU HAVE GOT TO BE KIDDIN' ME. I cannot believe this happened, disgusting

say goodbye to Obama's candidacy!

Sorry about ol' Donnie McClurkin's desires of wanting a man in his bed getting in the way, and his self-hatred rearing it's ugly head and the OBAMA camp allowing him the stage at an OBAMA event to spew anti-gay filth. If he want's to do this, as a GAY man, on his own time, great, but to allow it at an OBAMA event tells me there's no way EVER I'd vote for OBAMA now. He might as well say he's a Republican after throwing us to the back of the bus and allowing the stage to be given to a self-hating sanctimonious pig to tell us that we're sinners for being who GOD made us. I don't want to be Donnie before GOD, I'll gladly answer for myself and beg again for my place with the LORD, but I feel nothing but pity for the swine that is Donnie, and his self-hatred being so strong that he has to attack other gay people to make himself feel like he's accomplishing something in his own life - which is trying to erase his being gay.

You poor sick miserable man.

And Senator Obama, you went from being my backup to Sen. Edwards to being the bottom of the barrel with Tancredo and their ilk.


Shameful that his people allowed this travesty to occur at the OBAMA event.

[Divine Discontent]

186. lest we forget...

and I haven't mentioned this video or the comments made, or the inappropriate laughter from it, since the week it occurred, but it sure says a lot to me with this new much worse slap in our faces...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZzWYCxjdnY

This is the inappropriate laughter from the Black crowd when Biden, addressing the fears in the Black community and stigma about it, says he knows Barack got tested, then says he got tested for AIDS, and they crack up, then, when Obama could have ignored the laughter of the immaturity of the crowd and told them how serious this issue was - he instead goes on a line of joke telling which made me very upset with him then, but I forgave him, and made him my backup to Edwards, but this newest, far worse issue, has sealed the deal with me - Barack is a bigot. No sorry about it. You would tell your staffers to not even have him speaking beyond his few minutes of singing, and not allowing him to MC the event and go off on a rant about how he has been attacked for what he IS.

[OnionPatch]

189. So I guess this is the end

for Obama? I can't imagine what he was thinking when he arranged this. Did he think he was only going to lose the gay vote over this? I'm not gay but I will NEVER vote for anyone who is bigoted toward gays. Obama has just been crossed off my list of possibilities. Too bad. We finally got an African-American and a woman running and I find myself having to vote for the white guy. :(

[jenmito]

190. Why?

McClurkin's not running. HE'S the bigot. Not Obama. Obama made a STUPID choice but he is not a bigot which is why I'm still supporting him.

[Karenina]

202. PLEASE DO continue to support him.

He's making history and needs all the support he can get. Please do try to understand why this event is a deal-breaker for others.

[jenmito]

204. Oh, I WILL!

I FULLY support him. He has a great record on gay rights, civil rights, and constitutional rights, as well as having so many other positive qualities I would no way let a poor choice of entertainers and HIS bigoted views stop my support of him. :hi:

[Karenina]

210. And if you ever get a chance

to speak to him up close and personal, tell him Tante K. across the big pond REALLY wants to know, WHAT THE HELL HE WAS THINKING! ;-) :hi:

[jenmito]

213. I won't get a chance...

but you could probably ask him via e-mail or send him a question to answer in one of the upcoming debates. :hi:

[calteacherguy]

192. Your post is so fool of bullshit it's making me gag. I used to respect you. Not anymore. nt

[Forkboy]

193. If anyone would understand the taste of bullshit in one's mouth....

[Bluebear]

194. Yeah, but it's usually making an exit, not an entrance.

[...of J.Temperance]

197. Hey you!

Haven't come across you today, until I just checked this thread.

Do you have a sore head today huh? Congratulations to your Red Sox....of course, I WAS rooting for them....see how SWEET us Cardinals fans are ;)

Note: Rest of people reading thread, this ISN'T a *gasp* thread-jack....I was just determined to grab Mr. Bluebear today and tell him I'm happy that the Red Sox beat those silly Rockies :)

[Bluebear]

198. Thank you my dear!

We are very happy in evil, liberal New England today! :)

XOXOX

[...of J.Temperance]

200. Fab!

Yeah, ya evil, liberal New Englanders you! :P

XOXOX

[jonnyblitz]

195. thanks for your input, Zandor!!!!!1111

[wiley]

231. What happened to all the talk and dialog this hate fest would prmote?

[democratsin08]

199. IM ASHAMED OF OBAMA

lets all hope this man can be more understanding of others

[Jacobin]

203. Obama is basically doing a "McCain"

He does not have the judgment necessary to be the democratic nominee.

Church/State/Separate.

There is NO other way.

[Ninja Jordan]

205. Just playing devil's advocate here; but what EXACTLY was bigoted about what McClurkin said?

In actuality he shares the same views as most mainstream American pastors. The Bible preaches against homosexuality etc etc. In his religious view, God was able to deliver him from this behavior. It all logically fits within his religion. I haven't yet read where he's said that gays are abominable, worthless, of the devil, should have no rights etc etc. Only about HIS personal experience vis a vis Christianity. If he is a bigot for believing homosexuality is wrong, then an extremely wide net is being cast here. Plenty of pastors, with whom I'm sure Hillary has appeared, share a similar view.

[Sandaasu]

207. Yes, it is a wide net.

There is a lot of bigotry against us, and religion is no excuse for it. Christianity has been used to defend, slavery, racism, and sexism. It was being misused then, and it's being misused now.

McClurkin calls homosexuality a curse, and tries to lead others to attempt to change their sexuality. This is dangerous, even deadly, and to us, it is hate speech.

[Ninja Jordan]

208. Why the sudden double-standard?

Will you also condemn Hillary, Edwards and other candidates who likely appeared with pastors who hold the exact same views? How s this different?

[Sandaasu]

217. It's simply not the same thing.

Going to see such pastors, speaking to their congregations, isn't the same as setting up a stage and putting them on it to speak their views. They haven't yet put such a person up as a headliner in a major campaign event. Not just something they happened to attend, something they themselves arranged, and picked the participants of.

If they were to do something that actually was comparable, I'd be on them for it too. They haven't done that yet though.

[mondo joe]

229. If Hillary or Edwards go on tour with someone who says such thing and gives

them a platform on which to say those things, I'll have the same response.

[MessiahRp]

209. Are we talking the New Testament or Old Testament

Since the Old Testament is the Hebrew bible in which Jesus isn't even mentioned and the New Testament is the one that teaches Jesus Christ's teachings of love and tolerance. These so-called "Christians" who use the bible for any form of hate speech they like aren't even following Christian teachings or principles because they quote the wrong bible.

So I call BS on the, "that's his religion" crap because if he knew his religion, he'd have read the right book.

Rp

[Ninja Jordan]

211. Well, the New Testament is pretty clear about homosexual acts.

While Christ teaches unconditional love, the NT still couples homosexuality in with other acts such as adultery and fornication.
See for example 1 Cor 6: 9-10.

[Sandaasu]

218. That's a mistranslation.

There was no such term in any language at the time, so if your bible says "homoseuxals" there, that's a mistranslation by default. The only reason you find that there is because Paul used some odd language which linguists today are still uncertain about, and the translators had an anti-homosexual bias, so they make assumptions that reflect that.

In any case, Paul also wrote some terribly sexist things, shall we follow those writings as well? He said a lot of things that went pretty directly against the teachings of Christ found in the gospels.

[Kurovski]

214. The bible condones slavery, too.

Even gives instructions on how a slave should behave toward the master.

The alarm clock went off in this country 38 years ago regarding lesbians and gays. It's high time for church leaders everywhere to wake up.

I'm done.

[mondo joe]

228. His bible also gives instructions on being, and keeping, slaves.

Just FYI.

[Ninja Jordan]

258. Link?

[Onlooker]

206. Like Hillary, Obama is selling out

They all suck, but they're all vastly better than any Republican, including Ron Paul.

[jonnyblitz]

212. they do all suck. I agree. it is amusing to see supporters of a

candidate think everybody sucks but who they support when they ALL are pretty pathetic and about the same. well, the top tier candidates anyway.

[Scriptor Ignotus]

219. One side (supporters of human rights)

was telling the truth while the other side (the Obama campaign) was spinning distortions about how the Obama fund-raiser was not a anti-gay event.

Let me guess, if you're not pro-life, you must be pro-death. You're either with us or against us!!! Great job buddy, you're doing exactly what the fundies do! You sound just like Bush and his buddies!!

[Sandaasu]

220. Hardly

With this he simply showed more leaning towards that side than I'd like to see from a candidate, so he lost my support. I don't think Obama himself is a homophobe, but he showed his priorities here, and I'm disappointed.

[Scriptor Ignotus]

221. i can understand that point of view

but the OP was using wild, radical language and I don't think it's necessary. they flat-out said the event was an anti-gay event, which is just false.

[Sandaasu]

222. That's valid

That particular language was rather harsh, but the guy was the MC of the thing, and intended or not, this event does serve to put a grater wedge between the groups involved.

I wouldn't say it was intended to be an anti-gay event though, it just ended up becoming that, in a way.

[wiley]

230. K and R. Who is at all surprised by Obama lying and pandering?

"Don't say that I never told ya"

[Major Hogwash]

232. All your rant did here is prove why Obama is now tied with Hillary in Iowa!!

All of your sources are from blogs!
Gee, big surprise there!
Do I need to use the sarcasm smiley?
As if no one on the blogosphere has an opinion!

Atrios is a tool of the DLC and always was!
CNN - already owned by Hill & Co.
NYT - big whoop!
Americablog - nevah heard of it

I guess you guys didn't see Olbermann on Monday night, huh?
I guess you didn't see how he reported that Edwards accused Hill of being the biggest recipient of corporate contributions in this campaign, huh?
Bigger than any REPUBLICAN!

[toughboy]

234. Can't anyone registered to vote in SC vote for any party's candidate?

Snarky tactic by the Obama campaign, I believe. I think the people of SC are better people than that. Obama could really end up cutting into Guiliani's support in SC. Because Guiliani supporters aren't better than that. They're just seriously misinformed, as I suspect a lot of Obama supporters are feeling right now. I really wanted Obama to be an honest contender. An ethical flim-flam is far worse than just about any other political mistake a campaign can make - in my world. Several months ago I was also impressed by him. I thought he was actually going to represent at least an authentic effort to inspire and uplift people's hopes that a good person could run for President and maybe not win, but help heal this country. He could have won and he could have turned out to be a good man. It's over as far as I'm concerned. The absolutely most painful thing about this to me - and I do not belittle or discount the effect Obama has had in inflicting pain and suffering on both young and old people who are Gays or Lesbians or who love or just live with them as neighbors and friends - is the wretched disappointment and despondency that I hear especially from younger Black and Latino people I love. He's actually hurt a lot of people. He could have prevented that. That, I believe, is a sin. I think a lot of people who would have voted are just going to skip doing so. This is so tragic on so many levels.

[hfojvt]

235. Do you have a transcript of this "half hour revival"?

“God delivered me from homosexuality,”

Which you say shows that he "preached his hate". Maybe there's a whole lot of hate in those five words, but it still does not look like a half hour anti-gay rant to me. Nor does it look like the purpose of his show, or the whole purpose of the fundraiser. The main purpose of a fundraiser is usually funds, and secondly there might be some fun involved too.

The things he said also seemed to be a response to the firestorm his appearance created on the blogosphere. If there had been no firestorm, there might have been no comments.

I have this thing about bigotry. I don't think it is a binary thing, either black or white, that people are either perfectly unbiased or totally bigots. There are degrees, and nobody is perfect, not even midlodemocrat. McClurkin has said a few stupid things, but he has not beaten anybody, killed anybody, or celebrated the death or suffering of anybody, or encouraged others to do so. He's only telling his own story, the way he sees it, and preaching his religion.

I don't see how that makes him 99 and 44/100ths evil. Mid 70s I could see, maybe even low 80s. But "virulant bigot" when his whole "sermon" was less that 1/10th of your OP or my meandering pointless post here.

[GOPBasher]

236. I'm not sold on Obama yet, but it's pretty insulting to say

"the pro-human rights crowd vs. the Obama campaign."

[uriel1972]

238. I wrote this in another thread

but I think it belongs here too
<I don't know if its been said before,but the "delivering" from homosexuality is the same formula as Coulter's "Jews must be perfected" line. It implies a wrongness in the original state homosexuality or jewishness. Why accept one bigotry and not another, even if it comes from someone who is ex-*? By giving a platform to bigotry is to own that bigotry and Obama must deny it or accept it. He can pretend neutrality, but that is acceptance by default.>

[Ethelk2044]

239. Posters here on DU trying to sell a Bill of Goods. I am Glad the People in the US

are not like the ones here. They know exactly what Obama was doing instead of the shit they are saying. IT just shows you how for the Hillary and Edwards supporters will try to stoop to get someone to vote for their candidate.

[uriel1972]

241. I'm not sure I understand

are you saying that the people who are criticizing Mr Obama for this event are only supporters of Edwards or Clinton? Because it isn't true in this instance.

[mondo joe]

244. Gay people don't need your permission to know when we've been used.

Thanks anyway.

[SmokingJacket]

240. Well, I was an Obama supporter.

Over the last several months, his failure to kick any kind of ass has left me extremely disappointed, but I sort of excused it, thinking that he learned a lesson from Howard Dean and didn't want to come on too strong, too soon.

But this is unforgiveable. :(

[meowomon]

242. Gee, sorry straight Amerika

I want equal rights. Is that so wrong?

[D23MIURG23]

243. How disappointing

Though I've always seen Obama as a big shiny Rorchach blot - stylistically good, but people are seeing whatever policy they want there because there isn't much record, or substance.

I'm voting for Edwards. No kyl - lieberman vote and no anti-gay bigot rally. (If he appears on my ballot that is - I'm an MI resident)

[Spiffarino]

246. This is why I reneged on my donation

I promised a donation to Obama's campaign several months ago. Then he sat back and waited on the first "Out of Iraq" bill that went through the Senate. Once they saw which way the wind was blowing - that the bill wouldn't pass - he and Hillary voted in favor. That was when I decided to pull my early support and I sent the money I'd promised to MoveOn.

I'll support any Dem over any Repub in the big race, but for now neither Hillary nor Obama will get my support. I support progressives, not panderers.

[LibraLiz1973]

254. I'm completely baffled that he has gotten so much support up to this point

He makes my skin crawl.
There is something about him that has never "sat right" with me.

[Imagevision]

256. If elected Hillary will be repaying back special interests groups her entire time in office...

that William, you can bank on!