Dionne: More significant than Clinton's supposed gaffe, is immigration -- the issue Democrats dread

[DeepModem Mom]

WP: The Issue the Democrats Dread
By E. J. Dionne Jr.
Friday, November 2, 2007; Page A21

More significant than Hillary Clinton's supposed gaffe at the end of Tuesday's Democratic presidential debate is the subject around which she tiptoed so delicately: immigration. Democrats fear the issue because it could leave them with a set of no-win political choices....

***

In the short run, Clinton's exquisite calibration of her positions was the issue. But her debate dance reflects a deeper worry among Democrats that Republicans are ready to use impatience with illegal immigration to win back voters dissatisfied with the broader status quo.

The issue is especially problematic because efforts to appease voters upset about immigration -- including a share of the African American community -- threaten to undercut the Democrats' large and growing advantage among Latino voters. For Republicans, the issue is both a way of changing the political subject from Iraq, the economy and the failures of the Bush presidency and a means of sowing discord in the Democratic coalition.

One poll finding this week that shook Democrats came in a survey conducted by Democracy Corps, a consortium organized by party consultants Stan Greenberg, Al Quinlan and James Carville. It asked voters to pick two from a list of seven problems that explain "why the country is going in the wrong direction." The survey found that among independent voters, 40 percent -- by far the largest group -- picked this option: "Our borders have been left unprotected and illegal immigration is growing." By contrast, a lack of action on health care was named by only 24 percent of independents as a core problem, and Iraq by 23 percent.

The Democracy Corps poll, along with a Pew Research Center survey released this week, found Democrats with substantial advantages over Republicans on a variety of measures. But many Democrats fear that the more trouble Republicans are in, the more they will be willing to use immigration to attempt a comeback....

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/11/01/AR2007110101987.html?hpid=opinionsbox1

[TwilightGardener]

1. Well, if they can't defeat us with fear of Mooslim terrists, then they'll

defeat us with fear of taco stands on every street.

[Chovexani]

7. I think taco stands on every street is a winning position for us.

:patriot:

[aquart]

2. Don't answer the immigration question. Talk about jobs.

Immigration is ONLY an issue when JOBS are an issue. This administration talks about immigration because they don't dare talk about jobs. The real question is JOBS. Answer the REAL question.

[silverojo]

4. That's one of the two issues

The other is crime. Where illegal immigration is a problem, crime is a problem. It gets tiresome when you watch the news, and over and over there are people shot and/or assaulted by people proven to be in this country illegally.

A Democrat who could win in a landslide would be a Democrat who is tough on illegal immigration, and is willing to secure our borders. As it is, the public views politicians this way: Republicans are ruining the economy and waging a senseless war, but the Democrats are talking amnesty--despite the fact that poll after poll makes it clear that this is not what the majority of Americans want.

It's not a wedge issue, but a real issue for people living in cities that have been affected by illegal immigration (jobs and crime).

[aquart]

5. Crime also disappears with jobs. The issue is jobs.

All the rest is a distraction from discussing JOBS. Our candidates shouldn't fall for it. Ignore the false immigration issue. Talk JOBS.

Wait. You think the issue is immigrants stealing American jobs? Are you always this easy to sell? I have this really cheap bridge...

The issue is bringing JOBS back to the United States. The issue is creating new JOBS and new industries IN the United States. Not fighting and the pitiful few that remain. Stop being distracted by Republican memes.

Americans have no jobs, THEREFORE immigrants have no jobs. The jobs are elsewhere. They need to be here. THAT is the question that needs to be addressed: Candidate, how will you provide JOBS?

[AzDar]

11. Spot-on, silverojo.

:thumbsup:

[HowHasItComeToThis]

3. THE REPULSIVES MUST HAVE A PAPER ENEMY....

IT IS THE ONLY WAY THEY CAN MOBILIZE THE FEARFUL AND THE BIGOTS SIMULTANEOUSLY.

BET THET THEY USE IT AS THE ISSUE.

[aquart]

6. Immigration is this year's gay marriage.

[DeepModem Mom]

9. I think you just said it all, aquart. nt

[AtomicKitten]

8. It is unfortunate the immigration bill didn't pass last go.

While there were some screaming issues with the bill, it closed the borders which is a security issue Junior should have dealt with 9/12/01 (and the Democrats should have hammered them on), but also because there was a path to legal status for the millions of people here illegally. It was sufficiently cruel enough :( that it was doable in a bipartisan way, but it was a foot in the door nonetheless. Plus, it would have taken the nasty wedge issue off the table for the GOP and left them with their pants around their ankles.

Sigh.

[w4rma]

13. The worker visa caps would have been increased in that bill. That is the primary problem. (nt)

[Didereaux]

10. Illegals can't vote, and latin-Americans DON'T vote= Democrats LOSE

It's time for Democrats to face some hard reality. The immigration issue is the only one which can defeat the Democratic Partyother than a complete surrender of all muslim extremists.

The immigration stance of the democrats is against 3-Three-3 count 'em three demographics.
1. Americans who see the issue as a strictly Constitutional legal question i.e. it is illegal and therefor the law must be enforced.
2. Americans who see it as a move by large Corporations to hold down wages.
3. American bigots who see it in those terms.

The first two categories make up the vast majority of the majority of American voters who DO NOT agree with any sort of amnesty or other granting of privilege to illegal aliens. This is the group who will determine the outcome of the presidential election. Anyone who disbelieves this is comletely ignorant of anything to do with politics in the USA and is merely residing in a fantasy universe of their own wishes.

The third group is relatively unchanging and lacking a third party whacko to vote for can safely counted as republicans.

Congressional candidates are fully aware and are campaigning on exaclty what I have presented. This will result in a Republican president and a very conservative Democratic CCongress. Is your idealism worth allowing such a result? Are you another flavor of Naderite, willing to sacrifice all out of spite? These are serious questions that only you can answer.

[BeyondGeography]

12. Shows you how totally paranoid and stupid many Americans are

The possibility of going broke if they get sick is less important than the people who are coming here to clean their toilets for cheap wages. Guess it takes their minds off of their own servitude.

Democrats need to stand firm and fight the insanity of the Republican fear machine for once in their lives.

[gratuitous]

14. Wrong, Mr. Dionne - Democrats don't "dread" the immigration issue

We dread the demagoguery and the uninformed loud-mouthed blather that accompanies this issue. There is no way, in the current climate fomented by the relentless fearmongering of the Republicans, to have a frank and serious discussion of immigration, the presence of some people who are here without proper documentation (whatever that means this week), and a means of dealing with any of the problems, real or perceived, that flow from the issue. It either gets ridiculously constrained to the point where we wind up hysterically condemning people working long hours for little pay without regard to the slavedriver standing over the worker with a bullwhip, or we quickly find that trying to isolate and pull one thread marked "illegal immigrants" out of the mare's nest of neoliberal economic policies is simply impossible without an attendant discussion of workers' rights, environmental concerns, consumerism, protectionist trade policies, legalized corporate bribery, and oligarchical corruption.

Trying to distill illegal immigration down to one, isolated "issue" is fatuous in the extreme, Mr. Dionne.