"If he uses a fist, you use a bat. If he uses a knife, you use a gun."

[Herman Munster]

http://www.tnr.com/politics/story.html?id=6e01fdce-ad97-4dab-a07d-bf98dc52f681

Reporters who have covered the hyper-vigilant campaign say that no detail or editorial spin is too minor to draw a rebuke. Even seasoned political journalists describe reporting on Hillary as a torturous experience. Though few dare offer specifics for the record--"They're too smart," one furtively confides. "They'll figure out who I am"--privately, they recount excruciating battles to secure basic facts. Innocent queries are met with deep suspicion. Only surgically precise questioning yields relevant answers. Hillary's aides don't hesitate to use access as a blunt instrument, as when they killed off a negative GQ story on the campaign by threatening to stop cooperating with a separate Bill Clinton story the magazine had in the works. Reporters' jabs and errors are long remembered, and no hour is too odd for an angry phone call. Clinton aides are especially swift to bypass reporters and complain to top editors. "They're frightening!" says one reporter who has covered Clinton. "They don't see as a healthy part of the process. They view this as a ruthless kill-or-be-killed game."

...

Many political reporters feel similarly conflicted about Wolfson, the public face of Hillary's press operation. But everyone agrees he is a fearsome operator. As communications director for the 1998 Senate campaign of New York Democrat Charles Schumer, Wolfson would fire up his aides by riffing on a famous line from The Untouchables: "If he uses a fist, you use a bat. If he uses a knife, you use a gun." During Hillary's 2006 reelection campaign, he constantly taunted her GOP opponent, John Spencer, for once joking that he'd like to kill a federal judge and a governor with whom he'd feuded.

[BootinUp]

1. We need a candidate

that knows how to keep the fickle and biased press at a distance during a campaign.

[bain_sidhe]

2. Good.

The media have felt far too free to beat up on Democrats for far too long. 'Bout time somebody made them rethink that strategy.

[JNelson6563]

3. They send one of ours to the hospital,

we send one of theirs to the morgue.

Amen. Motherfuckers.

[LoZoccolo]

4. Sounds good to me. n/t

[Jim Sagle]

5. Fuckin' hypocritical swine.

Did they ever bitch about Republican hardball? No, they only unload on Democrats.

[dionysus]

25. Thats the point a lot of ppl in this thread are ignoring...

this isn't targeted at the repukes, but at other dems... sad

[MadHound]

6. Wow, and this sort of tactic is considered to be a good thing by her supporters?

Gee, this is the sort of shit Democrats and liberals bitched about Nixon and Bushboy using. Now that Hillary taking a similar antagonistic, secretive stance regarding the press. Don't you think that we've had enough of this? Is this sort of attitude really healthy for the Presidency that Hillary aspires to?

I am sure that every single one of you who has praised this stance Hillary has taken against the press has also at sometime over the past seven years bitched about how Bush has done the very same thing. Yet here you are condoning it, all because it has a D behind the name, what gives?

I know, I know, you're going to point the Clinton's treatment at the hands of the press during the ninties, you have a valid complaint there. But two things, first of all, Bill made things worse in our media by allowing to consolidate further under his tenure. Second, do you really think that casting a pall of secrecy and paranoia over the press, and by extension the rest of the country is any way to run the country? We've seen that it is detrimental more than once, do we really need to recreate that failed experiment once again?

You wonder why the left sees little difference between the Democratic and Republican party, and why they despise Hillary as the epitome of that fact. It isn't just because of big things like the war or her corporate connections. It is more minor things like how she is going to communicate, and how much is she going to communicate with the press and the American people. This antagonistic stance of hers will simply persuade more people to avoid her.

I know that this isn't a popular opinion amongst Hillary supporters, but really, take a step back, be objective and ask yourself if this is really appropriate, if this is something that you can live with in a candidate, in a president. We've all complained about this during the Bush administration, and for those of you my age, during Nixon. Do we really want to see this pall descend over a Democratic administration? I thought we were supposed to be better than that.

[DURHAM D]

10. Maybe you should start reading the Daily Howler ...

[MadHound]

14. So you endorse these tactics eh?

A secretive campaign, a secretive administration. How do you justify this? Or is it simply winning at all costs, and don't care what goes on so long as it has a D behind the name? A fine way to sell us all down the river for a handful of magic beans.

Perhaps you should read your history, and realize that such secrecy in office has never accomplished anything good.

[dionysus]

24. sadly, it seems a lot of people treat this as a sports game...

rah rah team, win at all costs.

For example, no matter which dem becomes president, it would make me sick if they sent out a pack of spokesliars like ari, scotty, snowjob, and that cappucino lady...

do we really want that shit to continue?

[sandnsea]

12. And we don't even get progressive policies

If she was using these tactics to get a real living wage or real universal health care, I'd say great. Unfortunately she only cares about keeping people away from her, or destroying other Dems. I cannot understand why anybody wants 8 more years of this shit.

[avrdream]

15. Two words to remind you all:

Tim Russert.

Enough said about these tactics. We (Dems) will need everything we've got.

[MadHound]

17. The trouble is, this isn't about just Tim Russert,

This is about another president having a secretive and paranoid relationship with the press, and by extension the public. How can you square this sort of attitude, which has been rightfully condemned when done by those on the right, when it happens with a Democrat?

I understand Hillary's reaction to the press, but rather becoming another super secretive candidate and president, she should show them up for who they are.

Secrecy in a candidate isn't a good thing, for it means secrecy when in office. And we all know that only bad things happen when presidencies keep information from the public. Haven't we all suffered to much under secretive administrations to elect in one more?

[lynnertic]

21. I'll say it again: Hillary, in trying to beat Republicans at their own game, reveals

how very closely she resembles them.

[nancyharris]

7. you left out

"if you're not with us, you're against us"

[DURHAM D]

8. Good for her -

after the way they have slapped her around for 16 years they are not to be trusted in any way. Fuck 'em.

[ljm2002]

9. I am not a Clinton supporter...

...but the title of this thread caught my attention because I thought "Oh hooray, at long last someone who knows how this stuff works is advising our party leadership."

Alas, it was limited to the Clinton campaign. But I must say, I do not fault the Clinton campaign for this position at all. Not even a little bit. In fact, the press has earned that and more from the Democratic candidates overall.

[Stinky The Clown]

22. I pretty much agree with everything you said ...... and would add ....

... while I like very much that *some*one is taking a tough stand, I really, really, really dislike Wolfson. He snarls too much and *appears* like a thug. Better are the thugs who are likable on camera. Carville was such a thug back when he was a good guy.

[blm]

30. I'd LOVE it if they used it against Bush the last 7yrs, but they WOULDN'T.

In fact, they were using that talent to undermine Democrats opposing Bush.

[sandnsea]

11. Yet they haven't once aimed at Bush

with this fervor.

[Broke Dad]

13. Re: So we are all okay with more of the same from the last 16 years?

Excuse me while I go outside to puke on the wiretap on my phone and computer!

Nixon himself would be proud of Hillary!

I had friends who applied for appointed positions in the Clinton Administration in 1993. The White House would approve them, and them Hillary would get veto over appointees who were on her "enemies" list. It sucked when Bill played good cop and Hillary played bad cop.

Now all we have is the bad cop intimidating anyone who dares to report the truth about non-tips, planted questions, instant flip-flops.

The only way to reverse the damage done by W is to be transparent. Update the Freedom of Information Act. Let the sun shine into the secret slush funds, no-bid contracts, etc. It will not happen on this woman's watch if she becomes president!

I am only a little precinct chair in Iowa, but I say NO and HELL NO!!!!!

[avrdream]

16. Yeah, and your ray of sunshine is going to win us back the White House.

Get real.

[JTFrog]

20. I'll be puking with you.

:puke:

[dionysus]

26. and they probably won't, either :(

[blm]

29. TeamClinton saved their dry powder to undermine other Democrats - Bush went

uncountered by TeamClinton for 7 years. Democrats like me helped FUND the Clinton machine for the last 15 years and how did they choose to repay us? By supporting Bush more than our Democratic lawmakers who stuck their necks out to oppose Bush the last 7 years.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/06/19/clinton.iraq/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dk1k0nUWEQg

Shameful.

[gateley]

18. K&R nt

[DemocratSinceBirth]

19. That Line Was Said By One Of The Good Guys- It Was Jim Malone

Eliot Ness' sidekick


"You wanna know how to get Capone? They pull a knife, you pull a gun. He sends one of yours to the hospital, you send one of his to the morgue. *That's* the *Chicago* way! And that's how you get Capone. Now do you want to do that? Are you ready to do that? I'm offering you a deal. Do you want this deal? "

It used to be my sig... I like my new sig better...Campaigns are blood sports...If you believe in something you better be prepared to fight for it...

[riqster]

23. Being civil sure has worked out well, now hasn't it?

Fuck it. Break out the bazookas. The Reeps have been beating up on the world for too long, it's about time they got a taste of their own medicine.

I have been in exactly three fist-fights in my life: one in Elementary school, one in Junior High, and the last in High school. Everybody likes to pick on the geeks, ya know.

This geek took it for a while, then fucking laid out a tormentor. I had no problems for the rest of my tenure in each building.

Packs of bullies understand NOTHING of kindness or ethics, or virtue. What they understand is pain. Break their nose, loosen some teeth, jack their eye. THEN they'll listen. Too bad, but that's the way it is. Bullies are cowards, and they run in packs because they feel stronger, safer, more powerful than on their own.
Being a class clown took care of most individual bullies, and I vastly preferred that approach. But ultimately, the "four-eyed funny guy who had a wicked right cross and even worse right boot" was much safer than just "the four eyed funny guy" when those individual bullies got together.

Also, knowing the hard-assed geek was around made them think twice before beating on anyine else in my presence. THIS IS CRUCIAL: it isn't just about Hill being a nice person, or Dean being polite, etc. There are people around the world who are depending on the Dems' taking America back.



Kick 'em in the nuts, Hill. You can borrow my boots if you like.

[sundancekid]

27. yep, babs bush was right - her and poppy have adopted a son in BC, and now

we should send a congrats card because from the looks of the playbook, they're getting a two-fer

[blm]

28. Why didn't they show up to counter Rove and Bush's 'machine' the last 7 yrs?

Was TeamClinton saving all that dry powder for her primary race to use on other Democrats?


http://www.depauw.edu/news/index.asp?id=13354


http://www.tpmcafe.com/blog/coffeehouse/2006/oct/07/did_carville_tip_bush_off_to_kerry_strategy_woodward



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dk1k0nUWEQg