DU disturbing lately

[frankenforpres]

Hillary lost the debate because she was mean? what the fuck kind of nonsense is that? has everyone been so corrupted by cable news that they think this is the criteria for deciding who won or lost a debate. did you guys think bush beat gore in the debates? i mean, bush made more jokes, he said "funny" things like fuzzy math


Obama is probably going to win, so ill have to get on that train soon enough, but DU of all places, no one talks about the issues.

john edwards's biggest accomplishment is getting his ass vetoed (seriously this is the best thing he could come up with). but his dad worked in a mill. Big Fucking Deal, so did mine until it shut down.

i still dont know what Obama did? he at least understands cap and trade, so i give him points there

DU always talks shit about Chris Matthews, but then judge debates the same way he does. who has the sunshine on their face, and other nonsense


man, i dont know. id rather have the wonky Hillary. I just cant figure it out

[Herman Munster]

1. neither can I

It's the Oprah American Idol culture. All style, no substance. It seems the presidency is the only job in the world where experience doesn't seem to matter.

[TwilightZone]

4. It's a personality contest.

As much as I want to believe otherwise, there's just too much evidence to the contrary.

Nearly half of the country voting for Bush twice, for example. Anybody with half a brain had to see that the guy was a frat boy and an idiot, yet he's been president for seven years. Gack!

[Lex]

6. Good point.

Very good point.

[frankenforpres]

7. bush "beating" al in debates

that says all you need to know about "analysis" right there

[TwilightZone]

11. But, but...Al rolled his eyes! And he's too smart!

It's the jocks vs. the nerds. High school never ends.

[madrchsod]

16. it always has been

this is nothing knew. if we went by who has the best plans and ideas well that would be dennis. we all know that no matter how good a candidates plan is they have to sell it. who`s ever is the best sales person wins

[countmyvote4real]

2. That sounds like alcohol talking. Try some weed. n/t

[Joe the Revelator]

3. Hillary lost the debate because she lost her cool and came off as "Loud and Mean spirited"

I put "Loud and Mean spirited" in quotes, because what she actually was, was shrill and catty, which is a much better description then "mean" but I was asked to use different words.

[Cameron27]

9. Who said Clinton lost the debate?

I thought it was her best one ever.

[Lex]

5. okay

[TwilightZone]

8. *snort*

Nice picture. I love cats.

[Name removed]

10. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Joe the Revelator]

12. bookmarked.

[Vickers]

13. Barack Hussein Obama?

Welcome to DU, yadda yadda yadda...ya silk-wearin' buttercup.

[Alexander]

14. Wow. You equated Obama with Hitler and you have a low post count.

You mentioned "Hussein". And you really seem to hate the Democratic front-runner.

Maybe this site will be more your style.

http://www.freerepublic.com

[Name removed]

22. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[gateley]

15. We know his middle name. You don't need to inform us, unless you have a motive for doing so? nt

[I was just saying...]

18. er, uh, are you implying that Hussein isn't his middle name?

well, hold the vegetable juice, 'cos IF Barack H.(Hussein) Obama is the democratic nominee,
his middle name will be as good as a subliminal message. Not saying its a good thing, but
I'm not a Obama supporter, so...there.

On second thought, are YOU ashamed of his middle name. Think about it...you brought it
up. I'm only being factual.

[gateley]

24. Read my post. I know his name. I'm just wondering what your motive is for posting

a favorite RW jab, as inane as it is.

Nice meeting you.

[Name removed]

25. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[gateley]

26. .....

:eyes:

I'm done. Again, nice meeting you.

[Blue-Jay]

17. OMG! Hussein! Everybody panic!

[I was just saying...]

19. Enough people will panic in the general election, enough to

lose it by a wide margin. You can't be serious if you don't believe the republican
will not bang this home every time they mention his name. Unlike John 'Fitzgerald' Kennedy,
Barack HUSSEIN Obama is too scary by half.

To finish my original post; will get past these lilly white states with they are subconsciously
bending over backward to 'be cool - cool enough to vote black, how cooool is that' crowd, to
the more populous, more 'serious' states where there is much more at stake, like winning
this damn thing.

[Blue-Jay]

21. In English, por favor.

[NMMNG]

29. What?!?

His middle name is Hussein?

[Yuugal]

20. Do you still have a good job?

"but his dad worked in a mill. Big Fucking Deal, so did mine until it shut down."

Edward's point is that it was corporate greed in the form of nafta and the like which killed off most of the manufacturing jobs here and will take even more jobs in the future as our white collar jobs are exported next.

"id rather have the wonky Hillary. I just cant figure it out"

Her and Bill and their DLC friends have already wonked most of my family's jobs right over the border. They will get yours eventually. Corporate interests want to see us all hungry and willing to do whatever they want for cheap. Its Richie Rich vs everyone else and we are losing. Since the only people who can run for office in this country are the rich, it behooves us working class people to at least try to get the rich guy who talks about helping us, into office. Thats not Hillary, she is DLC, the same people who brought you NAFTA.

There is a good shot we will be running against Huckleberry and he is coming out strongly against shipping our jobs overseas with these treasonous "trade" agreements. The last thing the Dem party needs to do is run the NAFTA candidate against the crazy religious populist.

[frankenforpres]

23. i have a great job

and my dad has an ok job. my job comes thanks in large part to pell grants and subsidized student loans. clintons helped in that area


i disagree that huck will get the nod from the gop

[Raejeanowl]

27. Spin, Spin, Spin, Children

Remember that old Ken-L-Ration jingle? My dog's better than yours? Or "my Dad can beat your Dad," etc.? Sandbox politics, and it's depressing. Why is all the talk here about who's candidate is the right one, the golden child, instead of developing our consensus of what we're going to demand of our candidate and President?

I would even accept "Who Is The Right Candidate?" as long as it wasn't accompanied by the inevitable, "Mine, of course, and yours is a loser, neener-neener-neener."

However, we don't have a contemporary lock on superficiality. It started back in the days when JFK-looking cool and fresh and handsome next to Nixon's sinister, sweaty, five-o'clock shadow-swung the perception of a nation, and the vote followed.

I, too, would rather have the mean and wonky Hillary; much as I dislike her, I have to respect her mind and her abilities. Meanness is sometimes a good and necessary thing in a national leader. Charm and popularity make for short honeymoons.

[avrdream]

28. I hear you.

This place sucks right now (and I know that sounds childish - that's the way it has been here for me, childish).

[Hippo_Tron]

30. Nixon lost the debate because he had no makeup and five o'clock shadow

It's called television, and you are judged by how good you look as much if not more so than your substance. Get used to it.

[Tactical Progressive]

31. That was the very first TV Presidential debate

We're supposed to be alot more discerning after fifty years of television.

Anyway, Hillary looked better, sounded better and performed far better in the Nashua debate than Obama. So it's more that just that.

This is, as the OP says, about a Presidential election turned into a celebrity contest. The problems are the typically vapid American electorate that still thinks Saddam is about to nuke America even though he's dead and never had nuclear weapons, plus vile, psychotic media personalities like Chris Matthews, plus a mainstream media in general disdainful of, and antagoistc towards, the efficacy of Clinton politics from the left, looking to prevent a Hillary candidacy, or in broader terms, any successful Democratic change in America (I don't think they like Edwards for similar reasons). Add to that a bunch of shallow twenty-somethings who actually believe that they understand politics because they've been snarky on the internet for the last few years.

And what do you get? A good cross section of the worst of America's depraved pathologies rolled into one election.

[Hippo_Tron]

32. Supposed to be more discerning doesn't mean that we are

First of all, Stephanopolous was dead on when he said that the candidates were all exhausted except for Edwards. As I've said earlier Edwards brought his A game that night and clearly won that debate.

When the camera flashed over to Hillary while she was not answering a question she looked mean and nasty, which is the exact perception she has been trying to avoid. I'd probably look mean and nasty too if I'd barely slept for the past two weeks too. But voters don't have sympathy for you because you haven't slept in a while.

Hillary may have not lost the debate, but she didn't do what she needed to do, which was swing the momentum away from Obama and back to her. If you watched the pre-debate spin, all of the pundits were saying that Hillary would spend the debate tearing down Obama in an attempt to catch up.

In order for that strategy to have been a success she pretty much would've had to have had a "Senator you're no Jack Kennedy" moment and those are extremely rare. And not only did she do exactly what the pundits said she would do, she looked mean while doing it. Edwards also sided with Obama, something that she should have been prepared to deal with. All Obama really had to do to counter Hillary's strategy was smile as though to imply "Oh Hillary, you're just bitter because you lost Iowa."

When you don't factor in superficial factors and spin, Hillary's performance seems a lot better. But our politics is pretty much all about superficiality and spin and we are going to need plenty of both to beat the Republicans in November.