I am seriously thinking about referring to her as Mrs. Bill Clinton from this moment forward.

[Perky]

Bill is everywhere now...but the repuke mantra of co-presidents is going to rear it head again and they are going to use that to a) unite and b) kick her ass in November.


For God sakes! Stand on your own two feet woman or get the hell out of the way.

[Harper_is_Bush]

1. Ah, ok. The spouse of the candidate should not be out there?

Is that what you're suggesting?

Your comment is sexist. what if I suggested I call Barrack "Mr. Michelle Obama", just because I've noticed his wife out there commenting and being seen as well?

Attack candidates on their positions/policy instead of cheap personal attacks like what you've done here.

EDIT: and don't be so shit-scared of the "repub mantra". For God sakes! Stand on your own two feet and don't wither before the repukes!

[asthmaticeog]

3. Michelle Obama hasn't already been a divisive president that galvanized the right.

But hey, apples, oranges, whatever.

[Harper_is_Bush]

8. That's bullshit. The spouse is now the spouse, and the OP is saying something else anyway

besides, are you afraid of the right being "galvanized"? Why? Because of the Clintons?

If you understood the American political scene today you'd know the right is pretty much incapable of being "galvanized".

This isn't 2000.

[asthmaticeog]

82. "the right is pretty much incapable of being 'galvanized'."

When you underestimate your enemy this drastically, you lose. This isn't 1996.

[billbuckhead]

9. Mrs Obama has been a divisive force inside the Democratic party

"Black Americans will wake up and get it," Obama said. "But what we're dealing with in the black community is just the natural fear of possibility. When I look at my life, the stuff that we're seeing in these polls is played out my whole life: always been told by somebody that I'm not ready, you know, I can't do something, my scores weren't high enough."
-------------snip----------------
<http://rawstory.com/news/2007/Michelle_Obama_Black_America_will_wake_1112.html>

[kickitup]

19. How About This

So if Hillary (or Bill) Clinton makes a similar comment substituting "female" for the word "black," would you consider her a divisive force?

[ShortnFiery]

65. Well, at least in the UK, Mr. Thatcher KNEW that he was not part of Maggie's power players. eom

[jackson_dem]

31. Bill Clinton's approval rating was 69% when he left office. Divisive?

right-wingers hated him but only because Bill Clinton was so successful.

[Perky]

34. ANd Hillary's nuber hover at 50% nationally

what is your point?

[Harper_is_Bush]

37. More importantly, what is YOUR point?

Spouses should fuck off and die during an election?

Or just male spouses?

Or just the spouses of candidates you don't like?

[Perky]

49. No We do not want to relive the frigging 1990s again

Why would anyone want that type of divisiveness again??????

It is Lunacy to think it will not be front and center every dayof the fall campaign. Should they win, some new stink will emerge every day.. that will drag down her ability to get anything accomplished. Beginning with getting out of Irwa.


It is lunacy to think that is not going to happen.

[Harper_is_Bush]

54. Ah, OK! So YOUR POINT is that woman cannot be something other than their husbands!!!

Thanks for clearing that up.

[Perky]

61. No...Hell no.

A woman can do anything she sets her mind to. But That is not what Bill and Hillary are doing. It is not about her It is about them.

I could get behind her if she was able to stand on her own....But it is becoming increasingly obvious that she can't.

[Harper_is_Bush]

67. You're intellectually dishonest.

You're claim that "it is about them" has nothing to support it, anymore than a claim that Obama's run is about him and Michelle instead of just him has support.

You and what you're attempting to do here represent the absolute worst of the Democratic party.

Shame.

[jackson_dem]

39. Bill wasn't divisive. How much higer than 69% can someone realistically go?

[TwilightZone]

50. Bill left office with the highest approval rating of any post-WWII president.

Can't expect a whole lot more than that.

[Hello_Kitty]

71. High job approval is not the same as popularity

Bill's "likability" and personal approval ratings were actually pretty low when he left office. A lot of Americans were pretty pissed off at him for his personal foibles, despite thinking him a capable chief executive. That's a big reason Al Gore distanced himself from him back in 2000 and picked Lieberman as his running mate. A lot of Democrats make the mistake of thinking Bill Clinton is this beloved national treasure because of those job approval ratings and because most people view him favorably compared with Bush. Big mistake. An even bigger mistake is believing that the relatively benign view that Americans take of Bill will translate into affection for his wife.

[creeksneakers2]

35. There are complaints here that contradict one another

They say Bill Clinton was a corporatist who gave the right everything they wanted, or at least compromised with them on everything.

Now you are saying Bill is at fault for galvanizing the right.

Which is it?

[asthmaticeog]

81. Riddle me this:

Was Clinton NOT a corporatist, and did he NOT galvanize the right? He was and he did. The apparent "contradiction" dissolves in a vat of FUCKING REALITY, mate.

[Perky]

5. Of course it is sexist.. Women should be strong on their own merits

Bill is on TV as much as she is. He talks about himself and it somehow morphs into hoc Hillary will be a great president. It's called projection.

[robbedvoter]

7. 'That you, Tweety? Funny, until now I didn't know which DU-ers were guys/which

were women. Soon, no need to use he/she

[Harper_is_Bush]

10. Well then, Michell Obama should go crawl into a hole someplace

cause I've seen too much of her, and it's making me feel like Barrack isn't a strong man who can stand on his own merits.

[TwilightZone]

2. Yeah, spouses should just shut the hell up and stay out of the race.

Including Elizabeth Edwards, Elizabeth Kucinich, and Michelle Obama, right?

Barack Obama, John Edwards, and Dennis Kucinich should just stand on their own or get the hell out.





In case it isn't ridiculously obvious, this is sarcasm.

[jlake]

4. Tell it to Michelle & Elizabeth.

What is the problem you have with Bill?

[robbedvoter]

6. Fine. I loved Bill. Also hate sexism. That'll help me make my mind for her really fast

If you want to help the supporters drive, go ahead!

[JAbuchan08]

84. THat's it vote for spite.

[Perky]

86. brilliantly thought threw wasn't it???

[Harper_is_Bush]

11. This topic is cheap flame-bait. n/t

[Perky]

14. And Obama adores Reagan isn't??

[Harper_is_Bush]

16. WTF do I know about that topic? Is it mine?

no, so don't give me that.

[durrrty libby]

12. He has freedom of speech. Deal ya whiner

[Perky]

15. Who's coattails is your candidate running on anyway?

[durrrty libby]

20. Spouses campaign. Deal ya whiner

[Harper_is_Bush]

43. You assume that poster is voting for Hillary. Why?

Because they object to you're ignorant topic?

Bad assumption

[Perky]

13. The Constitution only allows a president to be re-elected once

He has every right to support her put loud... But if you look at what he is saying he point back to the his tenure and his acoomplishments and what he believes way too much. It it not nearly so much about the candidacy as it is about him.

The way Bill is talking these days I think there is some oval envy going on and I think she is enabling it to the detriment of the Party.

[Cha]

18. How about just

billary?

[Perky]

24. We might as well get used to that as well...Because that is precisely how they are going to put

Humpty Dumpty republicans back together again.

[Cha]

32. Only if their lies take them back to

our white house..and that's why we're here and all over the country.

[SaveOurDemocracy]

17. Maybe you should change that 'P' to a 'J'

...just a thought.

[Harper_is_Bush]

21. ZING! n/t

[Perky]

22. another addled response from "team inevitability"

[AntiFascist]

23. Bill Clinton was recently in Sacramento promoting 'worldwide Americanism'

on behalf of Hillary. Shades of PNAC. This should tell us something about their foreign policy.

[David Zephyr]

25. It's sad looking at Bill reduced to such a low level now.

Still, I guess it's his way of making up for betraying her with Monica. Sad.

[Perky]

30. .....

man....I never would have posted that.....ouch David....cold very cold.

[David Zephyr]

33. They are a tragic couple. I feel sorry for her.

I still must admit that I feel badly for her.

What Ken Starr and the Republicans was vile and overkill and an ugly chapter in our nation's history.

But, what Bill did to Hillary was tragic and very, very selfish.

[Proud2BAmurkin]

26. Mrs. Bill Clinton vs Barack Hussein Obama?

bring it on.

[Perky]

27. I bet you watch a lot of pro wrestling don't you?

[Zynx]

28. First that stupid mandate nonsense and now this?

[ursi]

29. When Bill is campaigning for her in Nevada, he says things like "when we"

get in the White House, etc.

[creeksneakers2]

36. That's a plus for me

And that makes it OK for them to say we. They are going to fix the country together. A double benefit of voting for Hillary.

[Perky]

38. I rest my case.

[Harper_is_Bush]

40. You have no case. You're topic is one large vat of shit.

[Perky]

46. I think the Jury is still out on that.

I would say its running about 50-50

[Harper_is_Bush]

52. The negative back-and-forth flaming pretty much settles it.

If you're topic was anything but a pile of shit, it would result in intelligent engagement/discussion.

Instead, it's a bunch of pissed off people.

Face it, you've succeeded in disrupting the forum, nothing more.

[Perky]

57. Here are two interesting threads

they went no where fast thjat asked people to condider the consequence of supporting Hillary

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topics&forum=132

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4070975

[Harper_is_Bush]

58. Are you attempting to excuse your own actions with the actions of others?

That is small.

[Perky]

62. Read the OPs....Look at the author

[here_is_to_hope]

47. So, since your 'case' is rested, are ya gonna

ease up on the Clinton bashing?

[Perky]

55. This is actually one of the few bash threads I have ever written on Clinton

I think it is all unseemly....But I raised it in the tine that I did because I think it was necessary to draw out the argument a bit.

It is an important on I wish more people would think about

[here_is_to_hope]

87. You mean within the hour?

Because when this was posted, it was an hour after your previous bashing thread.
I am lazy so I didnt look any further.
Not picking on you.
Just sick of these threads...
You should be to, it must be hard work after all.
As for me and my candidate, I have none in this fight, thank goodness.

[Perky]

92. I have no history of Bashing Clinton

I might Bash the Bashers. But I have no history of Bashing Clinton. I oppose her but I have alwasy spelled out the reasons why and stayed around to defend my thoughts. There are alot of folks who sling poop. I am very rarely one of them.

[Yael]

42. HES NOT RUNNING

sigh

[global1]

I Mentioned This Before - A Friend Of Mine Told Me That Bill Doesn't Really Want Hillary To Win.....

so she doesn't overshadow his accomplishments. So when he is out on the campaign trail - either unconsciously or consciously he is doing and saying things that subvert her campaign.

I was told that this could be another reason that Gore kept an arms length from Bill when he ran in 2000.

Hillary should really keep Bill out of her campaign. Whether he is doing it unconsciously or consciously or just by association(he's created enemies that don't like him and therefore Hillary) he's going to drag her down.

[Yael]

41. 35 Years of Experience!!

Sorry. Wrong thread.

:P

[Bitwit1234]

44. Wonder why Hillary can still be flamed here.

[Nimrod2005]

45. I like that, I will from now on...nt

[caligirl]

48. Unlike the other spouses he has a high profile and its undercutting his wife badly

in the eyes of many many Americans. Go look around at comments on democratic blog sites. He went after one of our tv station reporters(KGO) in Oakland today concerning the lawsuit in Nevada. It was a very aggressive tone he took. The comments were all negative about the way he is handling himself on the campaign trail and how it was hurting Hillary.I found myself asking exactly who is really running for the WH here. Him or her? Or is this a primary or his chance to finally vent for the injustices of his prior press coverage.

[Proud2BAmurkin]

51. Thank you for your concern.

:hi:

[ShortnFiery]

69. I saw the video. Bill Clinton was coming unglued.

Both Clintons seem outright angry that HRC has not been anointed yet. :thumbsdown:

What's sad is that they blame "everyone else" for their struggle. UNWISE.

[paulk]

53. that "repuke mantra" worked so well...

oh wait, it didn't.

[Harper_is_Bush]

56. This is a despicable attack on a Dem candidate, imo. thx.

[Perky]

59. Why is it despicable?

Please articulate it.

[Harper_is_Bush]

66. You are intellectually dishonest sir. It has been articulated.

You are not interested in anything beyond superficial and empty attacks.

If you were, you'd know by now what you're mistakes are.

[Perky]

72. I'm intellectually dishonest? Wow ok

I don't think you are able to come up with a refutation other than the OP was sexist. Could you deal with the substance as well as the superficial? It is the really 800 lbs Gorilla in the room.

Until Clinton backers start dealing with it they are the ones being intellectually dishonest.

read the OPs links I sent to you.

[Perky]

80. Ok lets break this down a little

What if he OP sunject was "For God sakes! Stand on your own two feet woman or get the hell out of the way"

And there was no referernce to "Mrs. Bill Clinton" would you be just as upset?

Would you have considered it legitimate criticism? Even if you disgreed with it?

[Perky]

83. Perhaps we can continue this tomorrow?

[Perky]

85. Please answer my question

[Harper_is_Bush]

60. "For God sakes WOMAN" IMPLICATION: GET BACK IN THE KITCHEN

[Perky]

64. Read the rest of the OP

I am encouraging her to stand on her own two feet.

[Harper_is_Bush]

68. You're lost. n/t

[ShortnFiery]

63. Not only is "Big Dog" everywhere, he's nasty and dismissive toward anybody who dare

QUESTION the motives of anyone within "the circle of cronies" who will fill all viable positions within the DLC's Clintonian Executive Branch. :crazy:

The fix is in: Woof! Woof! How dare you question the barking *Big Dog?*

[Essene]

70. i support this. im so sick of her... i dont care to even be respectful. she doesnt deserve it

[bvar22]

73. As someone who opposes a Hillary nomination,

leave Bill alone. He is doing a wonderful job......for the Hillary opposition.

Every time he steps in front of Hillary, grabs the mike, and pushes her out of the spotlight to defend her (like she can't defend herself), or reminisce about what a wonderful President HE was, he drives another nail in her Primary coffin.
Using Bill to testify for your honesty is NOT a good endorsement.
If Hillary were really smart, she would send The Dog packing and run her own campaign.

Keep up the good work, Bill.

[Yael]

78. Indeed! Leave Bill alone!

<insert picture of Brittney-Spears-fan-creeping-out-the-world here>

Not that I am too lazy to google it, I am just sick of seeing it.

:hi:

[Skip Intro]

74. Oprah much?

[Perky]

75. Oprah never.

[Bluebear]

76. Shall we call Barack Mr. Oprah Winfrey?

[Perky]

79. I think Michelle might object

[AtomicKitten]

77. I get the idea he's not entirely convinced he isn't running.

:crazy:

[Avalux]

88. LOL - I know! He really needs to take a vacation and let Hillary campaign.

This whole thing is really bizarre, he almost seems pathetic.

[AtomicKitten]

90. It is quite the spectacle!

I vacillate between being amused, saddened by it, and just annoyed at his presumptuous insinuation of himself in the campaign.

[wyldwolf]

89. I am seriously thinking about referring to him as Barrack Hussein Reagan Obama from now on

[cali]

91. Go for it, wolfiewitz

if that's what floats your boat, have a blast. Btw, I think the OP is dumb too, and trudges off into the sexist.

[Perky]

93. that is so sophmoric.

but go right ahead.

[incapsulated]

94. People already think this way

If you think most people hate Bill and don't want him back in the white house, you aren't paying attention.

This works for her.

It's a plus to me. It was a plus for him when he ran the first time and said "two for one".