Bill Clinton: "I'm not making this up.".....Yes you did Bill

[Armstead]

MTP showed an excerpt of Obama's remarks about Ronald Reagan, followed by the criticisms by Edwards, Hillary and Bill.

Edwards' cricitism was a distortion, but he didn't lie.

Bill and Hillary, on the otehr hand, did outright lie by saying that Obama said Reagan and the GOP had "good" ideas and "better ideas" over the last 10-15 years.

Bill Clinton, in his usual slippery way concluded with "I'm not making this up folks..."

Yes Bill you ARE making it up.

Obama did NOT say reagan and the GOP had "good" ideas or "better ideas." He gave an objective analysis that said that the GOP had more ideas, and that Reagan recognized that the country was in the late 70's looking fore a change from the negativity and problems that had enmeshed the country, and he presented a break from the status quo that people were frustrated by. And by doing so Reagan set the country on a fundamentally different course.

One can agree or disagree with Obama's assessment. (I happen to agree with it.) But it is a total lie to say he endorsed those ideas, praised them or supported them.

However, I guess Bill was so busy recalling how he had opposed the War in Iraq from the beginning that he didn;t really hear Obama clearly.....Depends on what the meaning of "good" is I suppose.

[Evergreen Emerald]

1. please. That was exactly what Obama was saying. And he should not have.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

9. and why should he not say it?

most americans feel the same way that Reagan did have ideas, not necessarily good ones, but he did have them.

Frankly, the democrats have made many of us despair because our cupboard has been rather barren. The triangulation of Clinton only served to embolden the GOP. What is the latest, great idea that any candidate has?

Health care? it is a matter of nuance, not a great leap, (ignoring Kucinich).
Taxes? no Dem. will touch that issue.
Iran? Iraq? Hillary was in bed with the GOP. Edwards at least admitted he erred.

There has not been any major progressive program planned or promoted by us. and that is a shame, and one of the reasons that we are in the trouble we are.

[Evergreen Emerald]

11. He can say it--if he wants to diss democrats who have been fighting

to overcome what "change" Reagan did to our economy and to the middle class. He can say anything he wants. But, there are consequences for it.

[Armstead]

18. Those Democrats who truly have been fighting don't deserve to be dissed

But unfortunately they get dissed by the DLC/Clintonists.

Paul Wellstone, for example, one of the most democratic Democrats there was had to spend as much time defending himself and his ideas from Democrats as he did against Republicans. he was "too far left" for fighting for average people against the Corporate elite.

Same with Kucinich, Edwards, Ted Kennedy..etc.

[grizmaster]

21. Anyone who was paying attention knows raygun was a war criminal

who sent paid thugs to murder and rape nuns. Who LIED and took Credit for the Hostage release that Carter secured. Who declared war on the poor in America. Who declared war on workers being allowed to organize. Who armed, funded, and trained the Taliban and Al Qeada.

And when raygun shenanigans killed part of Carters deal to get the last of the hostages released, raygun (against SPECIFIC laws Congress passed to prevent it) took the profits from his drug trade in Latin America and gave weapons to the Ayotollah.

If you find anything to praise or emulate in that brief and extremely truncated list of rayguns "optimism" please let me know.

[cali]

16. It wasn't what he was saying. As ususal you can't do anything

but remain slavishly devoted to the Clintons even when they err. It's sad.

[cali]

19. Bill Clinton is a know liar. It's that simple.

I think he lies as easily as he breaths.

[Evergreen Emerald]

22. stop cali

we are all having a discussion and you attack me personally. Perhaps you need to go for a walk. We can discuss the issue like adults without you getting ugly.

[Windy]

25. Evergreen, you are always on the attack. When someone attempts to call you on your spin

and the untruths you espouse about other candidates or other posters on DU, you immediately resort to condescension. Its getting old.

Bill Clinton is a known liar. His actions over the last few weeks have been despicable. In the general, against McCain, I don't think that it will serve his wife's candidacy well.

He comes off as extremely desperate to return to the Whitehouse and a seat of power. And its not for the good of the country. By the desperation in his actions, one can clearly surmise that it is a very personal crusade that he will win by any means.

Hillary should send him away until November 2008.

[Evergreen Emerald]

27. He has been a stanch supporter of democratic ideals.

He told the truth--despite what the media tried to spin and despite what the Obama camp wants to hear: Obama is running on a fairy tale.

[Evergreen Emerald]

31. ya know Windy

if you don't like me...don't read my posts. But, to condemn me for sticking up for myself after Cali attacks, is not appropriate.

[Renew Deal]

38. So Ronnie is Hillary's favorite president?

I knew it.

[boston bean]

2. You are mixing two statement up and together

I believe bill was talking about how Obama said the republican party was the party of ideas for the last 10-15 years.

[Armstead]

7. Listen to Obama's interview and listen to Clinton

The only thing I disagree with Obama about on that is that the GOP was the party of ideas since 1980.

The Democrats have been on the defensive. The only ideas have been attempts at counterspin and co-opting the GOP agenda.

I or Obama are not saying the GOP had good ideas. But the fact is that the GOP successfully pursued and sold a clear agenda of basic ideas. They have proven to be bad ideas, but they were ideas.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

10. bingo!

you said it better than I.

[karynnj]

33. Very nicely said

[lumberjack_jeff]

3. They didn't come to power with ideas, they came to power with an attitude. n/t

[Armstead]

8. An attitude basd on ideas.

[grizmaster]

23. An attitude based on LIES, war crimes, and oppression of the poor

[Armstead]

36. True but your interpretation is shallow

I don;t want to be in the position of defending the Reagan revolution and the GOP because I think their ideas are truly awful.

However, they did set forth a clear set of ideas, and knew how to sell them to the public well enough that we are still under their yolk more than 25 years later.

[jefferson_dem]

4. The only thing missing was an angry finger wag.

Bill is full of it again.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

5. actually you are distorting facts. when bill clinton said he was not making it up

he was talking about another incident altogether.

he was talking about union leaders saying that they would change schedules of workers who wanted to caucus for hrc.

[ccpup]

14. pretty cool how the Obamatons completely ignored your Post

wish I could live in a fact-free bubble like they do. :eyes:

[Armstead]

15. I maybe have mixed my catchphrases up...But the gist is the same

[La Lioness Priyanka]

30. your 'mix up' is making bill sound angry about a completely different issue

he should be outraged if union leaders are coercing workers to caucus in a particular manner

[karynnj]

34. The caucus results refute the idea that there was wide spread

intimidation.

What I thought disengenuous was Mark Penn, with a background in mathematics, said that the at large rule would give Obama a gain of 5%. Now, those caucuses controlled just 6% at maximum of the delegates. Obama would have needed abot 95% of the at large caucus vote, which wasn't going to happen, for this to be true.

[Armstead]

35. He was "angry" about Obama and Reagan too

As for the union person, the operatiove word is "if"

And "if" that one is true, I'd be angrier if I were an Obama supporter that a supporter would be acting so stupid as to let Bill see him or her saying that to union members in earshot of Clinton

[Barack_America]

28. That Clinton distorted Obama's words has been a topic on many....

...of the morning shows. So I guess that they're all wrong too, right?

Oh yeah, I forgot about the "media conspiray" against the Clintons. :eyes:

[La Lioness Priyanka]

29. why are you against the facts. i watched MTP and this NOT what clinton said

in the context it was quoted.

[janetblond]

6. Obama made a very profound statement about the ..

Reagan presidency which was true.
Shows he KNOWS his history and he's very smart.
Of course, you can always count on the media to distort the facts.
I feel sorry for Obama.
He's been thrown to the wolves.

[MH1]

13. I don't feel sorry for Obama, he's fighting the good fight

and can feel very good about it.

It's the American people I feel sorry for. And the rest of the world.

[janetblond]

24. I too feel sorry for the American people ...

when did they become so gullible and stupid?
must be something in the water ....
thus the expression, "they drank the kool-aid".

[Windy]

26. the last eight years are evidence of that. n/t

[janetblond]

17. OMG! On CNN just now ....

wolf blitzer asked john edwards about obama's comment re; reagan ....
he pulled a clinton! damn it!
reagan DID change the trajectory of america ...
we are now a right-wing fascist state based on corporatism.
WHEN do you think that started?
helloooo!!
?????
jeezus people are so stupid!

[noiretextatique]

37. it was neither true of profound

he said the country was ready for reagans's change...it was not. he also said the republicans were the party of ideas that challenged conventional wisdom for the past 10-15 years...that's not true either.

[MH1]

12. Clinton lies, and the American people know it all too well.

They will just make a pragmatic decision about which liar they'd rather see in the White House.

Oh, wait - Bush isn't running this year. Ouch.

[MADem]

20. Yeah, sure...he meant more sucky rotten ideas that would incline people NOT to vote GOP

Please.

You can parse the words until the cows come home, but you can't parse the meaning, and you certainly can't if you watch the tape.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

32. also bill did not even say that in the context he was quoted.

[Cha]

39. bill clinton makes up shit all the time..

where did he learn all this lyin' to fit his storyline..did he come by it honestly? Is he pathological?

[robbedvoter]

40. GOP was the party if ideas means dems had none. (or none worth mentioning)

Spin it all you want - it's what he said.

[peoli]

41. Clinton campaign = a lie a day