Things our "Goldwater Girl " Evidently Didn't Support!

[stravu9]

These are the Accomplishments of the Presidency Of Lydon Johnson.
Hillary campaigned against him as a "Goldwater Girl".
Ergo, she must not have supported these things.

War ON POVERTY,Medicare, Medicaid, Civil Rights,National Endowment for the Arts and well, lets see...

* 1964: Civil Rights Act of 1964
* 1964: Urban Mass Transportation Act of 1964
* 1964: Wilderness Act
* 1964: Nurse Training Act
* 1964: Food Stamp Act of 1964
* 1964: Economic Opportunity Act
* 1965: Higher Education Act of 1965
* 1965: Social Security Act of 1965
* 1965: Voting Rights Act
* 1965: Immigration and Nationality Services Act of 1965
* 1967: Age Discrimination in Employment Act
* 1967: Public Broadcasting Act of 1967
* 1968: Bilingual Education Act
* 1968: Fair housing Act


Say what you will about LBJ he was a GREAT DOMESTIC PRESIDENT!
Which is JUST WHAT WE NEED TODAY ,
And what we would HAVE with
JOHN EDWARDS!

[Evergreen Emerald]

1. and what was obama doing while Clinton was involved in politics?

smokin crack?

[cali]

9. gee, you really think a three year old was smoking crack,

genius? Your post is as silly and offensive as the OP's. And spreads an ugly rumor. Good going!

[beberocks]

17. Obama was into drugs when he was young, and the RNC won't be ignoring that info

Too many DU's seem to think Obama's extensive drug use is old news or will be overlooked by the voters. Most people weren't paying attention when those facts about Obama came to light, and I don't think they'll be willing to vote for him after the RNC makes his drug use front page news again. Just saying that you should take a closer look at Obama too, since all you seem to want to do is bring up very old garbage against HRC.

[neutron]

26. Jeez. Obama whines that Clinton uses

his kindergarten record, then does exactly the same.

Even worse, he's in Dailiy Kos screaming that Clinton rigged
the NH Primary. He got a recount - and it turned out
Clinton got even MORE votes.
Now he's screaming that she cheated the NV caucuses.

How can we elect this dude president. He goes ballistic when
he loses a state primary.

[TheWraith]

36. Oh excuse me, could you show me the Obama press release about this?

Oh wait--you can't, because nobody in the Obama campaign has stooped to using another candidate's teenage years against them. Unlike some people, who keep sending the order out to their surrogates to push the drug smear.

And to correct your other falsehoods, Obama has nothing to do with the Daily Kos, which prints what it wants to. Obama also has nothing to do with the recount in New Hampshire--the Kucinich campaign requested that. And nobody ever said that the Clinton campaign cheated the caucuses. The complaint was that they tried to get the strip caucuses shut down after the unions endorsed Obama instead of Clinton.

Nice smear job, though. Try to actually get some facts next time, eh?

[proud2BlibKansan]

18. LOL!!

[TheWraith]

30. Wow. Incredibly racist, false, and Rove-style smearing all in one. You got the trifecta.

You should count yourself lucky that I'm not a moderator. If I were, a statement like that about any of our candidates would get you tombstoned in less time than it would take to tell you to go fuck yourself.

[MADem]

38. You haven't read Obama's book. He did use drugs as a teenager.

What's "racist" about a snarky remark mentioning it? The worst you can say is it's a cheap shot, but DU is chock-a-block FULL of those. Look at this thread--it's a major cheap shot.

So, the remark isn't racist, it isn't false, and if it isn't either, well, it isn't "Rove-style smearing." You get the trifecta for being wrong, dead wrong, and wrong again.

Good thing you aren't a moderator--you're reasoning skills are wanting.

And the "go fuck yourself" comment? That's against DU rules.

[TheWraith]

49. I know all about that, and you should try listening.

Obama has always been open about having used drugs when he was a TEENAGER. In 1964, when Hillary was 16 and supporting Goldwater, Obama was three years old, and I don't think he was doing drugs when he was 3. Kindly notice the direct correlation in the post I was responding to. Like I said, false.

Second, Obama talked about using pot and cocaine. But hey, let's say he was smoking crack instead, because that's a "black" drug, and it feeds into every negative stereotype you can think of. Yes, it IS racist.

Third, I suggest you try recalibrating your smear meter. If a Republican pulled the same trick of saying that they were in public service when Obama was still in the 'hood smoking crack, everyone here would recognize it as slime and race-baiting, pure and simple. Having a Dem do it does NOT make it okay in the least, nor does it make it acceptable to defend such a smear.

By the way, you want to talk about the rules? "Do not post messages that are inflammatory, extreme, divisive, incoherent, or otherwise inappropriate. Do not engage in anti-social, disruptive, or trolling behavior. Do not post broad-brush, bigoted statements." Frankly, if someone's not abiding by that bit, I see no reason to treat that member with respect as the rules request.

[MADem]

51. Sure he has. I don't have a problem with what he did as a teen.

Any more than I have a problem with what Clinton did as a teen.

See, they were TEEN AGERS. Trying shit on for size--like kids do. So you can take your FIRST, SECONDS, and THIRDS and stow them--because I don't have any problem with Obama's teen years. What I do have a problem with is people beating up any candidate for the fool things they have done in their teen years. You seemed to have missed the King Sized Irony in the post you responded to so dramatically. Apparently, those cheap shots against Clinton are "OK" but the ones against Obama are verboten?

Crack hasn't been a 'black drug' for decades--that's a bigoted assertion, if you want to get technical. What, are you watching old Made For TV Movies and perpetuating antiquated GOP-shopped stereotypes? Try watching COPS sometimes--get a load of all those skinny white guys without tee shirts and pathetic pasty-pale women with smeared makeup who have little "rocks" in their pockets.

I suggest you grow a thicker skin, and pull the string back to the ORIGIN of this entire shitty thread. I find it amusing that when your ox is gored, you get all upset, but you completely miss the point that the original post was a cheap and shitty shot at the TEEN AGED BEHAVIOR of a candidate in and of itself.

I stay well within the rules, and you should try it sometimes--my comments to you were simply friendly advice, and NOT an accusation, which is what you are doing, and doing that IS against the rules. My comments were not inflammatory, extreme, divisive, incoherent or otherwise inappropriate. My behavior was not anti-social or trolling. I am discussing a topic on this board, in a reasonable fashion. Discussion is part and parcel of what goes on here--it's the purpose of this forum, in fact. That doesn't mean we can only engage in a Kumbayah chorus. You might want to read for a bit more comprehension as well as context.


Again, this is just some friendly advice, I'm not a moderator and have no authority here--you really ought to review those rules, they'll save you some angst downstream. The specific bit to which I invite your attention is this:

Do not post personal attacks or engage in name-calling against other individual members of this discussion board. Even very mild personal attacks are forbidden.

Do not hurl insults at other individual members of this message board. Do not tell someone, "shut up," "screw you," "fuck off," "in your face," or some other insult.

Cheer up there, Sunshine, and don't take things so seriously.

[CyberPieHole]

43. OUCH!!!

That's what happens when you snort cocaine and write about it...it comes back to bite one on the *ss.:evilgrin:

[TheWraith]

50. Is it just me, or are the Hillary supporters sinking lower than usual today? NT

[TwilightZone]

2. How old was John Edwards in 1964, and what was he doing?

What John was doing as an 11-year-old is about as relevant as what Hillary was doing in 1964.

[stravu9]

8. BULL!

She was an adult, and a young Republican! It is relevant because these are her ROOTS!
It is her "raising" and it is who she is!

[cali]

13. ridiculous. she was NOT an adult. she was fucking 16 years old

for 10+ months of 1964, and good for her for being involved in politics at such a young age. So what if she was raised in a repuke household? Stupid OP, and this post is not better.

[TwilightZone]

15. Yes, people never change.

The conservative mantra.

[neutron]

29. Liberals evolve. Conservatives don't

Hillary's not a conservative.

[TwilightZone]

34. Agreed on all counts.

Liberals learn from their experiences and adapt.

The right calls that "flip-flopping". I call it growth.

[Tom Rinaldo]

23. Hillary's roots were supporting Gene McCarthy in 1968...

...working for George McGovern in 1972, and helping staff a House of Representatives committee working to impeach Richard Nixon in 1974. Her roots included civil rights activitites such as these:

COLLEGE: "In 1965, Rodham enrolled in Wellesley College, where she majored in political science.<15> She served as president of the Wellesley Young Republicans organization during her freshman year.<16><17> However, due to her evolving views regarding the American Civil Rights Movement and the Vietnam War, she stepped down from that position;<16> she characterized her own nature as that of "a mind conservative and a heart liberal."<18> In her junior year, Rodham was affected by the death of Martin Luther King, Jr.,<8> and became a supporter of the anti-war presidential nomination campaign of Democrat Eugene McCarthy.<19> Rodham organized a two-day student strike and worked with Wellesley's black students for moderate changes, such as recruiting more black students and faculty... Rodham was invited by Representative Charles Goodell, a moderate New York Republican, to help Governor Nelson Rockefeller’s late-entry campaign for the Republican nomination.<20> Rodham attended the 1968 Republican National Convention in Miami, where she decided to leave the Republican Party for good; she was upset over how Richard Nixon's campaign had portrayed Rockefeller and what Rodham perceived as the "veiled" racist messages of the convention."<20>


LAW SCHOOL: "Rodham then entered Yale Law School, where she served on the Board of Editors of the Yale Review of Law and Social Action.<30> During her second year, she worked at the Yale Child Study Center,<31> learning about new research on early childhood brain development and working as a research assistant on the seminal work, Beyond the Best Interests of the Child (1973).<32><33> She also took on cases of child abuse at Yale-New Haven Hospital,<32> and volunteered at New Haven Legal Services to provide free advice for the poor.<31> In the summer of 1970, she was awarded a grant to work at Marian Wright Edelman's Washington Research Project, where she was assigned to Senator Walter Mondale's Subcommittee on Migratory Labor, researching migrant workers' problems in housing, sanitation, health and education;<34><35> Edelman would become a significant mentor to her.<35>"

It seems to me that Hillary Clinton's views constantly evoloved in a progressive direction from the time when she as a teen ager supported Barry Goldwater, and I say more power to her for that.

If you really want to look at Hillary's roots, she was born into a very conservative Republican family and she had the strength of character and will to go against their grain and develop her own political identity as a progressive democrat. I wish that happened more often:

"Raised in a politically conservative household,<11> at age thirteen she helped canvass South Side Chicago following the very close 1960 U.S. presidential election, finding evidence of vote fraud against Republican candidate Richard Nixon,<12> and volunteered for Republican candidate Barry Goldwater in the U.S. presidential election of 1964.<13> Her early political development was shaped most strongly by her energizing high school history teacher, like her father a fervent anti-communist, and by her Methodist youth minister, like her mother concerned with issues of social justice; with the minister she saw and met civil rights leader Martin Luther King, Jr. in Chicago in 1962.<14>"


Reading expands the mind
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hillary_Clinton#_note-8

[stravu9]

16. waiting for his Mom to come home from the mill.

.

[dsc]

3. You must be a racist

since giving LBJ credit for those things is racist. I know that because Obama's supporters tell me so.

[MADem]

4. He WAS a great domestic president. He sucked dead dog balls on the WAR though.

Which is probably why she wasn't on his team.

[rockymountaindem]

Whereas Goldwater wanted to use nukes in Vietnam

in 1964. Yep, sounds like the peace candidate alright :sarcasm:

[tabasco]

22. Pwned.

LMAO.

[MADem]

25. That's what LBJ said--in a single ad.

I'm not suggesting he was the "Peace" candidate. But he was considerably more of an isolationist than LBJ was.

What was your candidate doing during that time? Hmmmm? Too young, eh?

How about at that AGE?

If you're going to go after candidates for what they did as kids, I'm sure there's plenty of Oppo research out there to shit on everyone.

Do be careful what you wish for.

[rockymountaindem]

39. Wrong, wrong, wrong

LBJ's "Daisy" ad was not about him wanting to use nukes. It was a "if you don't vote for Johnson, the Sovs are gonna use nukes on whatever weak successor you elect in his place".

I don't have a candidate. Right now I'm feeling pretty uninspired myself, but I'll say this... If I had a candidate, I hope they wouldn't have been going around supporting nuke-happy arch-conservatives as a kid, but that's just me.

[MADem]

40. No it wasn't. The Daisy ad was "Goldwater is a batshit crazy mutha who will

pull us into war."

That ad wasn't a foreign policy discussion about a WEAK leader. It was an assertion that Goldwater was "NUTS ENOUGH" to push the button. I remember those days all too well.

Here, a refresher from BG's obit: http://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/1998/05/29/goldwater.obit/

Goldwater said he knew the Vietnam War would be one of the major issues in the campaign, and called on President Lyndon Johnson to do what was necessary to win. He made his views on the war clear then and 25 years later when appearing on CNN's "Larry King Live."

"If I had inherited the mess that Johnson got into, I would have said to North Vietnam, by dropping leaflets out of B-52s, 'You quit the war in three days or the next time these babies come over there going to drop some big bombs on you.' And I'd make a swamp out of North Vietnam ... I'd rather kill a hell of a lot of North Vietnamese than one American and we've lost enough of them," Goldwater said.

But Johnson painted his opponent as a right-wing kook who couldn't be trusted to have his finger on the nuclear button. Johnson's still haunting 'Daisy' campaign ad -- with images of a little girl counting daisy petals giving way to those of a nuclear blast countdown -- only ran once, but Americans got the message. <'Daisy' Ad, 2MB>

Would you support a candidate who supported Gene McCarthy?? Hmmmm?

This thread is pretty fucking idiotic, but it was put on this forum with the express goal of shitting on Clinton by bringing up a NON-ISSUE. If Edwards stays in, I'm flipping a coin, but I find these kinds of childish "accusatory" threads reprehensible, and people who initiate them deserve to be called out as immature punks who care so little about the real issues that they amuse themselves by stirring up horseshit with their bare hands. It says alot, and none of it is good.

[rockymountaindem]

41. That's news to me about the daisy ad, but still

I'm not saying Clinton deserves all the flak she's getting for having been a Goldwater girl, or whatever. I think it's overblown. However, don't defend Goldwater or cast aspersions about LBJ as a means of defending Clinton. Let the Republicans do their own work.

[MADem]

45. From his lips to your ear! There's plenty of footage of him in archives

hither and yon where he plainly articulated his policy views. He wanted to "bomb them into the stone age" and then come home. His priority was AMERICAN lives. He never said the N (for NUKE) word, but he didn't really NOT say it, either. Of course, those were the days when "neither confirm nor deny" were tattooed on everyone's ass. We liked the idea of the threat, back then, slightly more than we do now.

Goldwater was a rather complex conservative. I don't "defend" him, but I think I understand him better than some here. He was pro-abortion (not the government's business), wouldn't have a problem with gay unions (not the government's business) and actually held a lot of philosophies that are near and dear to people who call themselves progressives. His grand(?) daughter did a film about him that is truly EXCELLENT. It's more than a biography, it's a biography AND a personal memoir. If you can find it in the video rental store or on the Indy channels, I urge you to take the time to watch it. It revealed a lot about the fellah that surprised me. A very three dimensional portrait, that work.

LBJ's domestic agenda (in addition to the "Goldwater is fucking CRAZY" theme that was pervasive at the time) was what persuaded me to support him, despite the war. I don't know where you get the idea that I "cast aspersions" about him. He did fuck the war up, mightily. That said, at the time, I supported him. However, I grew up in a Democratic household where FDR and JFK were cannonized, and wasn't a teenager trying to please my stern Republican father, either. It wasn't a stretch for me to go with the Democratic flow.

I'm down to two candidates, and if JE can't bring it in SC, I'm down to one and won't be flipping a coin. I'll merrily defend either one of them against scrurrious shit like this. I agree that the GOP can probably get some fabulous 'oppo' ideas from this forum, at times. You get way too much of that "lowest common denominator" bullshit here in primary season, and it's a treasure trove for vicious strategies.

[stravu9]

10. Bull She Was a Gold Coast Republican

Like her Daddy before her!
Apples and Trees, not falling far from and all!

[MADem]

21. So stinking rich she needed LOANS to get through school!

You have a right to your own opinion, but not to your own facts, there, Bright Eyes.

[stravu9]

27. To Attend Wellsey and Yale!

IVY LEAGUE AND 7 SISTERS!

[MADem]

33. It's Wellesley, and yes, they're high-end schools. NT

[stravu9]

44. My MSW comes from Wash U, , My Niece just turned down WELLESLEY for Cornell.

.

[MADem]

47. Your niece should be congratulated for getting accepted to both. NT

[havocmom]

5. Have you learned anything since you were young? Ever changed your mind?

:eyes:

Hey, I prefer Edwards over Clinton, but the argument that a person can't grow, learn, change their mind over DECADES of living is just friggin lame.

[stravu9]

11. No, I'm a LIFE LONG DEMOCRAT

got in my Mother's milk!

[havocmom]

48. Me too, but I am wiser than when I sucked.

One would hope others are too.

[beberocks]

12. Yep! I'd rather have a candidate who has made a few mistakes and learned from them. n/t

[Dogmudgeon]

6. She wasn't eligible to vote until October 26, 1968

:eyes:

The malice and stupidity around here NEVER stop ...

--p!

[stravu9]

14. Who Did She Vote For ,Pray?

.

[Tom Rinaldo]

24. Here, figure it out for yourself:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hillary_Clinton#_note-8

[ElizabethDC]

31. Well, she volunteered for Eugene McCarthy's campaign in '68

so draw your conclusions from that.

[MADem]

35. Awww, you harshed someone's mellow with THAT post!! Stay Clean for GENE!!

Those were the days!

[msongs]

7. excellent piece of faulty logic nt

[OHdem10]

19. This is really stretching--Hilary was a kid. Can we not find

some ratioanl arguments.

I am an Edwards supporter who will support Clinton if he has
to drop out.

Edwards will go farther not choosing sides.

[Occam Bandage]

20. A 16-year-old was attracted to an idealist ideologue? OH NOES!

[TheWraith]

28. That's rather unfair. She was, after all, I think 15 years old, and her parents were Republicans.

You can't hold it against somebody if their views changed since they were a teenager.

[Bonobo]

32. 90% of the responses are: "What was YOUR CANDIDATE DOING!?" LOL! LOL!

[ElizabethDC]

37. Good Lord, she was 16/17 years old in 1964, soooo

I think we can chalk it up to youthful misguidance, likely from her staunchly Repulican father.

[donheld]

42. Oh for crying out loud. What the hell is this shit!!!1!!!!

You're going back 44 years into Mrs Clinton's past to slam her? Talk about totally pathetic and stupid!
:grr::spank::mad::banghead: Will the Idiocy never stop?

[THUNDER HANDS]

46. people can change their minds, you know

especially when they get to college. It happens all the time.