We have a Candidate with a powerful message, money, attracts new voters, and yes, He's Black!

[FrenchieCat]

There are many on this site who are scared to death of having Barack Obama as our nominee...for no other reason than the fact that he happens to be Black.

These folks don't want to see that Obama will have more than enough money to combat the opposition, can swell our ranks with new voters, and is charismatic and articulate as all get out. But more importantly, he has great positions, is progressive, and know exactly how to communicate to make all Americans think.

These folks are really fucking scared, till they don't know what to do.

So to these poor frightened people, I say.....this really is 2008. Folks really would rather support an anti war leader than one so dumb as to have supported this horrid debacle that has cost us dearly in so many ways. They don't really care as much as you that he happens to be Black. In fact, you care more than most.

Barack Obama is a very powerful and capable candidate (probably one of the best we have had in years), and I can tell you, if he is given 1/2 a chance from you, he will transform how folks even look at race. You can see the confidence in his face. He is a very strong man. He is no lightweight. This is a Columbia and Harvard graduate with a keen intelligence and a sharp sense of what is right. He has a beautiful family (and yes, they are Black too)and looks absolutely amazing; captivating, in fact. Has the kind of face that people want to look at, and speaks in a way that people can't help but listen to what he has to say. And best, but not least, he has a smile that is infectious. A wit that is only excelled by his authenticity.

Y'all need to get over this way of thinking...because it is the politics of fear that you are frozen in.

America is entering into another era with or without you. And just like you see Black Presidents being played on TV, we can actually get this done.

There are more than enough voters in this nation who actually care more about themselves, their family, their future, this environment, this nation and this world than they do about the skin color of one man. You just need to calm down, and start seeing the man. With millions of voices accompanying yours, we can change this nation, and by so doing, we can actually change the world for the better.

We can do this. Yes, we can.

You are who you have been waiting for.

[andyrowe]

1. Let me be the first to

K&R!

[Syrinx]

2. I'm president of Alabama Rednecks For Obama

And I voted for him Tuesday. And you know what, it felt good!

[NMMNG]

3. Oh yeah, I'm so scared of the black man

:scared: :eyes:


BTW, do you have a personality disorder? You use the F word too much.

[FrenchieCat]

4. Do you have a thread disorder? You seem to appear in an awful lot of them

without having a damn thing to say.

If you are for the war supporting double talking lobbyist moula accepting status quo wife of the former President candidate, than continue on.

[NMMNG]

7. You seem to start a lot of them

without having a damn thing to say.

[sandnsea]

8. I fucking like what she fucking has to say

If you've got a fucking problem with that, don't come into her fucking threads. How fucking hard is that?

[NMMNG]

12. She routinely attacks people I care about without a care in the world

Then she turns around and plays the victim. AFAIC she needs to suck it up unless she wants to start acting like a civilized human here.

[sandnsea]

15. The fact is

there has been daily posts for months that we were going to lose if we elect a black man or a woman. Her post is legitimate. And I think it's a little strange that you, of all people, would attack her about attacking people. There was nothing wrong with her post and YOU jumped into this thread in attack mode, even if you can't see it.

[FrenchieCat]

and I consider it a priviledge that I have as a member of this community.

I have heard that if you put me on ignore, you won't see my threads. In addition, there is a little X button at the end of each thread title that allows you to hide the thread, if you don't want to see it. I suggest that, as opposed to pissing in my threads saying nothing just because you can. It would be different if you actually had something to say, but thus far, it doesn't seem to be part of your MO.

[NMMNG]

13. Fuck it

This place used to be a decent forum until the Obamatrons came and started turning it into a cesspool with the "Unity for everybody--unless you don't support us and our candidate".

Jesus fucking Christ. Welcome to my Ignore list and fuck Obama.

[Dogmudgeon]

16. Relax, Buffy. Remember *The Wizard Of Oz*

Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain!

--p!

[NMMNG]

22. I'm paying no attention to it any more

:hi:

[andyrowe]

19. Fucking A!!

Tell 'em Frenchie!

[MagsDem]

17. Obama is anti-war? Since when?

He has voted against almost every dem proposal to get us out of Iraq, and for every Bush requested bill to fund it. How does that qualify him as anti-war except in Obamaland fantasies?

[FrenchieCat]

24. Obama has been anti this war since before it started.......

Delivered on 26 October 2002 at an anti-war rally

I don’t oppose all wars. And I know that in this crowd today, there is no shortage of patriots, or of patriotism. What I am opposed to is a dumb war. What I am opposed to is a rash war. What I am opposed to is the cynical attempt by Richard Perle and Paul Wolfowitz and other arm-chair, weekend warriors in this Administration to shove their own ideological agendas down our throats, irrespective of the costs in lives lost and in hardships borne.

What I am opposed to is the attempt by political hacks like Karl Rove to distract us from a rise in the uninsured, a rise in the poverty rate, a drop in the median income – to distract us from corporate scandals and a stock market that has just gone through the worst month since the Great Depression.

That’s what I’m opposed to. A dumb war. A rash war. A war based not on reason but on passion, not on principle but on politics.

Now let me be clear – I suffer no illusions about Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal man. A ruthless man. A man who butchers his own people to secure his own power. He has repeatedly defied UN resolutions, thwarted UN inspection teams, developed chemical and biological weapons, and coveted nuclear capacity.

He’s a bad guy. The world, and the Iraqi people, would be better off without him.

But I also know that Saddam poses no imminent and direct threat to the United States, or to his neighbors, that the Iraqi economy is in shambles, that the Iraqi military a fraction of its former strength, and that in concert with the international community he can be contained until, in the way of all petty dictators, he falls away into the dustbin of history.

I know that even a successful war against Iraq will require a US occupation of undetermined length, at undetermined cost, with undetermined consequences. I know that an invasion of Iraq without a clear rationale and without strong international support will only fan the flames of the Middle East, and encourage the worst, rather than best, impulses of the Arab world, and strengthen the recruitment arm of al-Qaeda.

I am not opposed to all wars. I’m opposed to dumb wars.

So for those of us who seek a more just and secure world for our children, let us send a clear message to the president today. You want a fight, President Bush? Let’s finish the fight with Bin Laden and al-Qaeda, through effective, coordinated intelligence, and a shutting down of the financial networks that support terrorism, and a homeland security program that involves more than color-coded warnings.

You want a fight, President Bush? Let’s fight to make sure that the UN inspectors can do their work, and that we vigorously enforce a non-proliferation treaty, and that former enemies and current allies like Russia safeguard and ultimately eliminate their stores of nuclear material, and that nations like Pakistan and India never use the terrible weapons already in their possession, and that the arms merchants in our own country stop feeding the countless wars that rage across the globe.

You want a fight, President Bush? Let’s fight to make sure our so-called allies in the Middle East, the Saudis and the Egyptians, stop oppressing their own people, and suppressing dissent, and tolerating corruption and inequality, and mismanaging their economies so that their youth grow up without education, without prospects, without hope, the ready recruits of terrorist cells.

You want a fight, President Bush? Let’s fight to wean ourselves off Middle East oil, through an energy policy that doesn’t simply serve the interests of Exxon and Mobil.

Those are the battles that we need to fight. Those are the battles that we willingly join. The battles against ignorance and intolerance. Corruption and greed. Poverty and despair.

The consequences of war are dire, the sacrifices immeasurable. We may have occasion in our lifetime to once again rise up in defense of our freedom, and pay the wages of war. But we ought not – we will not – travel down that hellish path blindly. Nor should we allow those who would march off and pay the ultimate sacrifice, who would prove the full measure of devotion with their blood, to make such an awful sacrifice in vain.
http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Barack_Obama's_Iraq_Speech

OBAMA FIRST ADDRESSED THE IRAQ WAR IN COMMITTEE IN JANUARY 2005 AND ON THE FLOOR IN APRIL 2005, FOUR MONTHS AFTER ENTERING THE US SENATE

1/19/05: Obama Criticized Condoleezza Rice For Not Offering A Timetable, Reiterated That Job Of Senator Is To Confirm That Administration Is Making Decisions Based On Facts. During Condoleezza Rice's confirmation hearing, Obama criticized her for not offering a timetable. Obama said, "And I recognize that you are hesitant in your current position to provide a timetable. On the other hand, constituents and families in small towns all across Illinois need some more satisfactory answer than that. And it strikes me that this whole issue of training troops, turning over security functions to the Iraqi government is critical to that...I guess the comment that I'd like to make is that in the activist proactive strategies that you pursue, it seems to me that this administration often asks that we simply go along and have faith that you're making the right decisions. But I think that from the perspective of my constituents in Illinois, at least, a number of people did vote for George Bush and do trust him. But my job as a senator is to make sure that we're basing these decisions on facts and that I probe and not simply take it on faith that good decisions are being made.

4/14/05: Obama First Addressed The War On The Floor Of The Senate. Obama said on the floor, "The other day I had the opportunity to visit some of our wounded heroes at Walter Reed Army Medical Center. I know that many of my colleagues have made the same trip and I'd heard about their visits, but there is nothing that can fully prepare you for what you see when you take that first step into the Physical Therapy room. These are kids in there. Our kids. The ones we watched grow up. The ones we hoped would live lives that were happy, healthy, and safe. These kids left their homes and families for a dangerous place halfway around the world. After years of being protected by their parents, these kids risked their lives to protect us. And now, some of them have come home from that war with scars that may change their lives forever -- scars that may never heal. And yet they sit there in that hospital, so full of hope and still so proud of their country. These kids are the best of America. They deserve our highest respect, and they deserve our help."

2005: Obama Spoke Out Against the War Repeatedly. During 2005, Obama continued to criticize the war, saying that security was "horrible", that the war never should have been waged, and that the US should get out of Iraq as "soon as we can."

2006: Obama Spoke Out Against the War Repeatedly. During 2006, Obama continued to criticize the war, saying that we should start phasing down troops soon and calling for an "expeditious yet responsible" exit from Iraq.


RHETORIC: "Yet, like most democrats, Obama voted to keep funding the war until last year."

REALITY: EVERY SINGLE DEMOCRAT HAS VOTED TO FUND THE WAR IN IRAQ

2005-2007: Since Obama Came To Washington, Every Single Senate Democrat Has Voted For Every Bill Funding Operations in Iraq and Afghanistan Until President Bush Vetoed A Timetable For Withdrawal – Including Both Emergency Supplemental Bills And Defense Appropriations Bills. Since Obama came to Washington in January of 2005, every single Senate Democrat has voted for every bill funding operations in Iraq and Afghanistan until President Bush vetoed a timetable for withdrawal – including both emergency supplemental bills and defense appropriations bills that included bridge funding with the expressed purpose of continuing operations in Iraq as well as Afghanistan.

---

[MagsDem]

33. Sorry, that's just bullshit

You can't claim the mantle as the anti-war candidate when you have voted against dem anti-war bills, including dem bills to require a timetable for withdrawal, and voting against a dem bill that would have required Bush to get congressional authorization to send more troops to Iraq.

The moral of the story, it's real easy to be against the war when your only competition is against Alan Keyes, a complete right wing nut, in the state of Il. Not so easy when running a national campaign as president, and you're afraid to be called on your votes.

He's full of crap on this issue, and every single time he makes that bogus claim that he was against the war in 2002, and fails to mention he has voted all for it since being in the senate it reinforces to me that he is a calculating cowardice when it comes to standing up for principles.

[MagsDem]

34. Sorry, that's just bullshit

You can't claim the mantle as the anti-war candidate when you have voted against dem anti-war bills, including dem bills to require a timetable for withdrawal, and voting against a dem bill that would have required Bush to get congressional authorization to send more troops to Iraq.

The moral of the story, it's real easy to be against the war when your only competition is against Alan Keyes, a complete right wing nut, in the state of Il. Not so easy when running a national campaign as president, and you're afraid to be called on your votes.

He's full of crap on this issue, and every single time he makes that bogus claim that he was against the war in 2002, and fails to mention he has voted all for it since being in the senate it reinforces to me that he is a calculating cowardice when it comes to standing up for principles.

[izzybeans]

57. Her have some Kool-Clinton-aid

[cali]

32. Flat out NOT TRUE

put up or shut up. Obama has voted FOR virtually EVERY dem proposal to withdraw troops and get out of Iraq. His voting record in that regard is exactly like Ted Kennedy's. Flat out fucking lies are disgusting. Some of us can't be fooled by them, because we know better.

Here, chew on this:

Senator Obama's votes:

12/18/2007 Iraq Withdrawal Amendment NV
11/16/2007 Supplemental Appropriations for the Department of Defense and Timeline for Withdrawal from Iraq Y
11/16/2007 Emergency Supplemental Appropriations for the Department of Defense N
10/24/2007 Permanent Residence for Certain Undocumented Immigrants Y
10/01/2007 National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2008 NV
09/21/2007 Iraq Troop Reduction Amendment Y
09/19/2007 Time Between Troop Deployments Y
07/18/2007 Iraq Troop Reduction Y
05/24/2007 Emergency Departmental Supplemental Appropriations Bill of 2007 N
04/26/2007 Emergency Supplemental Appropriations Bill of 2007 with Iraq Withdrawal Timeline Y
03/27/2007 Iraq Withdrawal Amendment N
03/15/2007 United States Policy in Iraq Resolution of 2007 Y
09/28/2006 Habeas Review Amendment Y
09/28/2006 Military Commissions Amendment Y
09/28/2006 Oversight of CIA Interrogation and Detention Amendment Y
09/28/2006 Military Commissions Act of 2006 N
09/06/2006 Cluster Munitions Amendment Y
06/22/2006 Troop Redeployment Amendment N
02/02/2006 Military Funding and Tax Cuts Amendment Y

Defense
(Back to top)

Date Bill Title Vote
01/22/2008 Defense Authorizations Bill NV
12/18/2007 Iraq Withdrawal Amendment NV
12/18/2007 Inclusion of Iraq and Afghanistan Military Operations Funding with the Consolidated Appropriations NV
11/16/2007 Supplemental Appropriations for the Department of Defense and Timeline for Withdrawal from Iraq Y
11/16/2007 Emergency Supplemental Appropriations for the Department of Defense N
10/01/2007 National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2008 NV
09/21/2007 Iraq Troop Reduction Amendment Y
09/19/2007 Time Between Troop Deployments Y
07/19/2007 Sense of the Senate on Guantanamo Bay Detainees NV
07/18/2007 Iraq Troop Reduction Y
05/24/2007 Emergency Departmental Supplemental Appropriations Bill of 2007 N
04/26/2007 Emergency Supplemental Appropriations Bill of 2007 with Iraq Withdrawal Timeline Y
11/15/2005 Status of Detainees Substitute Amendment Y
11/15/2005 Judicial Review of Detainees Amendment Y
11/10/2005 Detainees at Guantanamo Bay Amendment N
11/08/2005 National Commission on Detainees Amendment Y
07/26/2005 National Defense Authorization Act - Cloture N

Military Issues
(Back to top)

Date Bill Title Vote
12/18/2007 Iraq Withdrawal Amendment NV
11/16/2007 Supplemental Appropriations for the Department of Defense and Timeline for Withdrawal from Iraq Y
11/16/2007 Emergency Supplemental Appropriations for the Department of Defense N
10/24/2007 Permanent Residence for Certain Undocumented Immigrants Y
10/01/2007 National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2008 NV
09/21/2007 Iraq Troop Reduction Amendment Y
09/19/2007 Time Between Troop Deployments Y
07/18/2007 Iraq Troop Reduction Y
05/24/2007 Emergency Departmental Supplemental Appropriations Bill of 2007 N
04/26/2007 Emergency Supplemental Appropriations Bill of 2007 with Iraq Withdrawal Timeline Y
03/27/2007 Iraq Withdrawal Amendment N
03/15/2007 United States Policy in Iraq Resolution of 2007 Y
09/28/2006 Habeas Review Amendment Y
09/28/2006 Military Commissions Amendment Y
09/28/2006 Oversight of CIA Interrogation and Detention Amendment Y
09/28/2006 Military Commissions Act of 2006 N
09/06/2006 Cluster Munitions Amendment Y
06/22/2006 Troop Redeployment Amendment N
02/02/2006 Military Funding and Tax Cuts Amendment

See Senator Kennedy's voting record here:
http://www.vote-smart.org/voting_category.php?can_id=53305

[MagsDem]

36. Oh yes, very true

"Obama had always opposed the Iraq war, one of the left's biggest issues, but in his first two years in the Senate, he did not make it his focus. He gave few speeches on the war and voted for funding it while opposing timetables for withdrawal -- both stances that he has reversed since he started running for president."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/08/26/AR2007082601446_pf.html

That's what I call cowardly and politically calculating.

[FrenchieCat]

39. Cowardly is voting to give carte blanche authority to Bush to go to war,

lying about the true construct of the Levin Amendment, and never apologizing for one's wrong vote. That is the sign of a true coward.

[MagsDem]

42. has Obama apologized for his pro war votes?

No, he sure hasn't. But he lies about them by ommission in almost every speech he gives.

[FrenchieCat]

43. You are a fool......

Funding the troops are not pro war votes.

Hillary doesn't think so,
and McCain surely doesn't think so.

Who are you voting or have for, magsDem?

Who's the pacifist?

[MagsDem]

47. Not for Obama, that's for damn sure

Voting against timetables for withdrawal and voting against dem proposals to require congressional authorization to send more troops are not votes about funding. And I am not going to vote for a guy who takes on this mantle of being anti-war, uses it to bash other dems when he wasn't even in the senate at the time, and pretends he has some perfect anti-iraq war voting record.

No candidate that lies that blatantly to bash another dem is ever getting my vote. Period. His entire campaign is built on that bullshit.

[cali]

50. There are

no pro war votes to apologize for, Hillshillbot. He's voted for every piece of legislation to withdraw from Iraq.

Keep spreading the hillpropaganda there, little cultist.

[MagsDem]

52. So voting against a dem timetable for withdrawal

prior to deciding to run for president wasn't a pro-war vote? How is it an anti-war vote? Please explain. Please also explain how voting against a dem proposal to require Bush to get congressional authorization to send additional troops is not a pro Bush war vote. I can't wait to hear your explanation.

[cali]

55. wrong. and you are insisting on

promulgating bullshit in the face of PROOF that YOU are worse than wrong, shillbot.

Put up or shut up. Post links to votes where he voted against a dem timetable for withdrawal.

[cali]

48. Pathetic. Beyond lame.

You completely ignore his voting record which is not even remotely what YOU, little shillbot, claimed. You said he voted against legislation mandating getting out of Iraq. He did the opposite.

You clearly belong to that select group of "people" that believe that the big lie is the best lie.

Repulsive.

[MagsDem]

51. No, I'm NOT ignoring his voting record

YOU are ignoring his voting record. Which is why you don't include any record of his votes before his presidential calculations came into play. You simply want to pretend they don't exist. But they do. Or is the Washington Post lying as well? LOL.

[cali]

54. Go back to 2006 and 2005, shillybot

It's the same thing. He voted for virtually every piece of legislation mandating out of Iraq and troop withdrawal. I provided the link. Are you so fucking pathetic that you can't even click it and go back to 2006 and 2005? Of course you are. And you provide NO links, no evidence. Just crap you pulled out of your butt.

[mihalevich]

5. Yes We Can!!!

YES, We need Change, we need Hope! We need to start to think positive, and with Obama we CAN. Yes we can!

"Y'all need to get over this way of thinking...because it is the politics of fear that you are frozen in. " Time for change!

[EdwardWilbur]

6. Please read these two threads:

One is by me: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4453100&mesg_id=4453100

The other is by an Obama hater (a Hillary Clinton supporter who has said she would never vote for Obama even in the GE): http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4453667&mesg_id=4453667

Please read every reply.

Can you tell the difference?

[mihalevich]

11. It's not about any of that

It is about Hope!

[MagsDem]

9. Realism is not fear

1. He's not an anti-war leader. He has voted against almost every dem proposal to get us out of Iraq, and for every Bush requested bill to fund it.

2. His healthcare plan does not even come close to stacking up to Hillary's and he clearly doesn't have the guts to puruse a policy where all uninsured Americans can get coverage.

3. You see confidence in his face -- I see arrogance, entitlement, and an unwillingness to gain experience on a national scale.

4. Are you serious? We should vote for him because he is good looking. LMAO!!!!

5. Racial politics in this country make him unelectable until such time as we can win without a single southern state. The racial politics of Latinos makes his candidacy doubtful even in some blue states.

6. I "see" the man. I see the reluctance to speak in details about the issues, I see him ducking controversial votes that might hurt his political ambitions, and I see policy ideas he is billing as new that have been part of the democratic agenda for decades.

7. I see a guy who panders to rethugs

[Dogmudgeon]

14. But you're not sexually attracted to him, either

A lot of people have very deep emotional attachments to Obama.

He's running for president.

Since when do people get so emotionally wrapped up in politicians? Check history for the times it has happened. It is not a pleasant exercise.

--p!

[MagsDem]

20. I know -- it's pathetic

I cannot seriously believe someone posted that we should vote for him because he is attractive. God damn, that just beats it all. And Obamaites claim he is not a media creation. LOL!

[FrenchieCat]

25. To believe a candidate is fascinating to observe has nothing to do with sex

you pig.

Get over your superiority complex. It doesn't match your intelligence, from where I sit.

[MagsDem]

27. Is that like Bush looking into Pootie's eyes?

[FrenchieCat]

30. It's like you sounding like a

dumbass.

[MagsDem]

38. Now, really, how is that possible

YOU said we should vote for him because he is attractive, and I said that ridiculous. And I'm the dumbass???? LOL! I don't think so.

[FrenchieCat]

45. That's not what I said........

That is one of many attributes I listed.

But if you choose to pinpoint that one quality out of the 10 or more that I mentioned,
then yes, your dumbass is showing.

[MagsDem]

49. I rebutted you point by point -- that was just the most ridiculous one

Absurdly ridiculous in fact.

[Dogmudgeon]

62. Hope is calling people you disagree with pigs. I get it.

It's the rhetoric of the self-pitying self-righteous -- "how DARE you attack me! I'm a Special Person!"

If you are so sensitive about people thinking you have a crush on Barack Obama, don't write about him in those terms.

From where you sit, the world is a simple place in which you are the Empress. Just because some of us won't bow down to you doesn't make us pigs. Save the back of your hand for the mirror.

--p!

[FrenchieCat]

21. What is realism, really? It is whatever we decide is possible.

1. He is anti this war, no matter that he funded the troops. To have done otherwise would be irresponsible, and would be only be playing a game, since it is Bush who decides....if you haven't noticed.

What I do know is
REALITY: OBAMA FIRST ADDRESSED THE IRAQ WAR IN COMMITTEE IN JANUARY 2005 AND ON THE FLOOR IN APRIL 2005, FOUR MONTHS AFTER ENTERING THE US SENATE

1/19/05: Obama Criticized Condoleezza Rice For Not Offering A Timetable, Reiterated That Job Of Senator Is To Confirm That Administration Is Making Decisions Based On Facts. During Condoleezza Rice's confirmation hearing, Obama criticized her for not offering a timetable. Obama said, "And I recognize that you are hesitant in your current position to provide a timetable. On the other hand, constituents and families in small towns all across Illinois need some more satisfactory answer than that. And it strikes me that this whole issue of training troops, turning over security functions to the Iraqi government is critical to that...I guess the comment that I'd like to make is that in the activist proactive strategies that you pursue, it seems to me that this administration often asks that we simply go along and have faith that you're making the right decisions. But I think that from the perspective of my constituents in Illinois, at least, a number of people did vote for George Bush and do trust him. But my job as a senator is to make sure that we're basing these decisions on facts and that I probe and not simply take it on faith that good decisions are being made.

4/14/05: Obama First Addressed The War On The Floor Of The Senate. Obama said on the floor, "The other day I had the opportunity to visit some of our wounded heroes at Walter Reed Army Medical Center. I know that many of my colleagues have made the same trip and I'd heard about their visits, but there is nothing that can fully prepare you for what you see when you take that first step into the Physical Therapy room. These are kids in there. Our kids. The ones we watched grow up. The ones we hoped would live lives that were happy, healthy, and safe. These kids left their homes and families for a dangerous place halfway around the world. After years of being protected by their parents, these kids risked their lives to protect us. And now, some of them have come home from that war with scars that may change their lives forever -- scars that may never heal. And yet they sit there in that hospital, so full of hope and still so proud of their country. These kids are the best of America. They deserve our highest respect, and they deserve our help."

2005: Obama Spoke Out Against the War Repeatedly. During 2005, Obama continued to criticize the war, saying that security was "horrible", that the war never should have been waged, and that the US should get out of Iraq as "soon as we can."

2006: Obama Spoke Out Against the War Repeatedly. During 2006, Obama continued to criticize the war, saying that we should start phasing down troops soon and calling for an "expeditious yet responsible" exit from Iraq.


RHETORIC: "Yet, like most democrats, Obama voted to keep funding the war until last year."

REALITY: EVERY SINGLE DEMOCRAT HAS VOTED TO FUND THE WAR IN IRAQ

2005-2007: Since Obama Came To Washington, Every Single Senate Democrat Has Voted For Every Bill Funding Operations in Iraq and Afghanistan Until President Bush Vetoed A Timetable For Withdrawal – Including Both Emergency Supplemental Bills And Defense Appropriations Bills. Since Obama came to Washington in January of 2005, every single Senate Democrat has voted for every bill funding operations in Iraq and Afghanistan until President Bush vetoed a timetable for withdrawal – including both emergency supplemental bills and defense appropriations bills that included bridge funding with the expressed purpose of continuing operations in Iraq as well as Afghanistan.

---

[MagsDem]

26. Every single dem has not voted against troop withdrawal timelines....

and against the dem bill to require Bush to get congressional authorization to send even more troops in. Obama did. Every single dem did not campaign on the promise of voting against the patriot act extension, then turned right around and voted FOR it. Obama did.

Look, maybe you find him too "attractive" to actually pay attention to the fact that his votes don't match his rhetoric, but not all of us are so afflicted.

[FrenchieCat]

31. You are gonna have to offer up facts, instead of spouting your opinions...

which, if you didn't know, are not considered facts.

[MagsDem]

40. I offered facts

The facts are he opposed timetables until he decided to run for president. The fact is he campaigned on repealing the patriot act, then when elected to the senate voted for it. The fact is he voted against a democratic proposal to require Bush to get congressional authorization to send additional troops to Iraq. Those are absolute facts about your "anti-war" candidate.

[FrenchieCat]

46. Vote for Hillary then.......

she voted for the exact same things and then some!

Or better yet, Vote for McCain!

He'll be in Iraq for 100 years.

Show us your Candidate's initial jugdment on that War, that has cost us trillions and killed hundreds of thousand. let see the bravery and insight that your candidate had.

I'll be waiting.

[MagsDem]

53. I plan to vote for her -- no question

And I don't think she did vote against the timetables for war like he did, actually (prior to deciding to run for pres, naturally). He also will not commit to starting redeployments immediately after being elected. She does. Mostly though, she is not a complete and total bullshitter like he is.

[FrenchieCat]

58. Please....you don't need to rationalize your vote.

Hell, you could even vote for her because she was a woman. I wouldn't care, or try to tell you that you shouldnt.

But I disagree, I think she sells bullshit everytime she claps and points.

[MagsDem]

10. Realism is not fear

1. He's not an anti-war leader. He has voted against almost every dem proposal to get us out of Iraq, and for every Bush requested bill to fund it.

2. His healthcare plan does not even come close to stacking up to Hillary's and he clearly doesn't have the guts to puruse a policy where all uninsured Americans can get coverage.

3. You see confidence in his face -- I see arrogance, entitlement, and an unwillingness to gain experience on a national scale.

4. Are you serious? We should vote for him because he is good looking. LMAO!!!!

5. Racial politics in this country make him unelectable until such time as we can win without a single southern state. The racial politics of Latinos makes his candidacy doubtful even in some blue states.

6. I "see" the man. I see the reluctance to speak in details about the issues, I see him ducking controversial votes that might hurt his political ambitions, and I see policy ideas he is billing as new that have been part of the democratic agenda for decades.

7. I see a guy who panders to rethugs

[mihalevich]

18. Are you going to ride this wave

or drown in it. Obama is the biggest wave to hit politics in 40 years!

[MagsDem]

23. Says the media pundits

And I always do what Tweety, Cooper, and the beltway boys tell me to do.

Oh wait, no I don't.

Look, to me he is a bullshitting empty suit with almost no experience to qualify him for the office. In addition, his healthcare plan is cowardly, and he's short on details, long on platitudes about almost every critical issue. The topper is his bullshit about the war, which he has funded just as Bush has requested while refusing to back his own party on critical issues regarding the war.

Did you know that he said he would vote to repeal the patriot act, then turned right around and voted for its extension.

See, some of us have actual bullshit detectors.

[mihalevich]

28. Ok

I'm listening, I'm new to the DU. Who should I support?

[FrenchieCat]

29. No. Says me and million of others......

What makes you so much smarter. You just sound more scared is all.

I bet you have never even been onto Obama's website to read his policies.

You are probably no more than a poseur frozen in your own fear who reads by skimming thinking you already know. It is apparent.

[mihalevich]

35. I think it's great

That the DU is so passionate, Negative or positive. We all care deeply about our county and the world!

[MagsDem]

37. In fact I have read his policies extensively - as I noted

You can pretend I'm more "scared" if you want to, though. LOL! Funny, I don't feel scared. I feel like I'm not an idiot that let's the media create a candidate out of thin air, and then votes for him.

[Guava Jelly]

41. Thank you

And as a white man in my early 40's I don't see him as a black man.
I see him as a man who happens to be of color.
Some will always have bigoted feelings toward those who are different.
I believe in the end after this recession sets in people will pull the lever for a black man.

This was a well thought out unsnarky thread
Thanks again for it :thumbsup:

[radfringe]

44. see this post:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4454317

[formercia]

56. Obama's not Black

he's an American.

As long as we keep thinking in terms of color or other distinguishing attributes, it will always be bias.

[FrenchieCat]

59. I realize this. But at some point, it becomes the 800 lb. gorilla in the room.....

I don't believe that Obama has any problem with being an American who happens to be Black. I don't think that we should either.

Sometimes, folks have to hear a point of view on this......that it's quite alright. He's a superb candidate.

[onehandle]

60. You're pulling the race card in reverse.

Cute.

[workinclasszero]

61. Nothin stoppin us now

Thanks for your post, I agree with you.

This establishment opposition is what happens when someone new arrives on the scene that blows away the competition. They are desperate to stop him and resort to such ridiculous charges like calling us a "cult". In their heart they may very well be panicking over a black man in charge. Sad eh?

When dreams finally turn into reality some people would rather retreat back into their safe fantasy world I guess.

[Schema Thing]

63. FrenchieCat, you are talking to the few (@ least on DU)

... and I don't think you are doing your candidate any good by doing so.


Yeah, there are plenty of people in America who won't vote for a black man. Obama knew this before he started this journey. The rest of us can move on w/o them.

Simply telling large swaths of Americans that they *ought* to vote for a black man will not change their mind, but it will put people who are tepidly stepping across racial boundaries they didn't even know they had in the position of wondering if they need to close ranks, "is this gonna become some kinda race thing?", because their entire premise in being willing to vote for a black man is that racism is not an issue for them, and shouldn't be for anyone else.

Now if that last position I outlined bothers me, a white man, I can just imagine how much it bugs the hell out of black people. But, at least imo, that is the basic position of many, many white people who are at this point quite willing to vote Obama. If you want Obama to win, I'd sure as hell make that a battle for another time.

[BigDDem]

64. The cat needs to see the vet.

Obama - All fluff, no spine.