Clinton says she does NOT view Ohio as a MUST-WIN.

[mod mom]

Clinton at OSU: "The people of Ohio get me."

Thursday, February 14, 2008 11:28 PM
BY JOE HALLET
The Columbus Dispatch
Sen. Hillary Clinton last night said she does not view Ohio as a must-win firewall to keep Sen. Barack Obama from winning the Democratic presidential nomination.

-snip
http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/local_news/stories/2008/02/14/hillaryvisit.html


She must have gotten wind of the turn-outs at the Obama Organizing Meetings around the state!

[JackORoses]

1. oh dear, you mean Ohioans don't know they have to vote for Hillary?

ahahahahahaahahahaha!

[NMMatt]

4. Do they not count pre-emptively this time. Now that would be bold. -nt

[DJ13]

2. "She must have gotten wind of the turn-outs"

Or she's going full bore on winning the nomination by bribing more super delegates no matter how the primaries turn out.

[sloppyjoe25s]

78. Probably figures it's Easier to go after Super-Dels than real voters...

can't wait for the rats to start jumping ship...

[NMMatt]

3. Wow... she better win Ohio

I imagine this is expectations lowering spin, but it is hard to see how the bottom doesn't fall out if she doesn't win Ohio other than some Quixotic notion that she will somehow sway super delegates to support the clear loser.

[Cha]

14. Do you know if this has ever

happened in the past of our political history?...A candidate taking the nomination away with "super delegates" from another who has won the popular vote?

[NMMatt]

37. No

But "Super Delegates" are a rather new invention. In the modern primary era, we've never had an election this close either.

However, it would be a political nightmare for the Democratic Party, and politicians like to avoid political nightmares. I would also like to point out that Clinton's so called super delegate lead maxed out sometime around Super Tuesday and has been eroding slowly, but steadily since. It appears that most Clinton loyalists have already made their views known, and that remaining delegates are either lean Obama more or less (why the lead has been eroding a bit) or waiting to decide. Now why would you wait to decide and then decide in favor of the Primary season looser? If some do, why would a clear majority side with the looser when doing so would be the more damaging option to both the party and the super delegate's own electorial chances (remember that half the super delegates are elected Reps, Senators and Governors)?

The ONLY way it might happen is if there were some kind of anti-Obama scandal, or perhaps if Obama were getting trounced in the polls vs. McCain by the time of the Convention. I'm assuming that there would be some kind of non-binding agreement long before the Convention which gave us a winner by June at the latest, and the presumed nominee would be Obama.

The other possibility is if Clinton made it close enough or took a popular vote lead, versus delegate lead by June that it really is viewed as a tie. In which case, who knows, but I still imagine that the DNC would try to get the super-delegates to weigh in well before the convention.

[Cha]

44. Thanks, that was

very enlightening! It's so edge on the seat!

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

74. 1968

[dansolo]

88. 1984 - Mondale over Hart

[Cha]

105. Yeah, that didn't

work out too well.

[RiverStone]

32. yep --- you summed it up well!...n/t

[NJSecularist]

5. This is probably just her expectations-lowering spin

She knows she has to win Ohio to stay alive.

[Kahuna]

87. I'd be absolutely floored if she doesn't win Ohio. I put this one in

the bag for her.

[NJSecularist]

98. I wouldn't.

If Obama wins Wisconsin, I think he has a good chance at winning Ohio.

Similar type of demographics.

[ORDem]

99. Demographics almost exactly the same as Missouri.

He won Missouri and since then has greater momentum. It's going to be a nail-biter in OH.

:dem:

[NJSecularist]

101. Yup.

Ohio is Wisconsin with a much larger black population. In essence, Ohio is very much like Missouri in its demographics.

I'd be more shocked with a Wisconsin win than an Ohio win, for the simple reason that this is a state that Hillary should dominate. 5% African American population, 90% whites, a good majority of them low-income, this is Hillary's base.

[JimGinPA]

6. Move The Goalpost!!!

Hopefully she'll run out of field soon.

[jenmito]

17. Even Carville said she HAS to win OH and TX or it's over. I'm sure most people believe that, too,

including superdelegates.

[ellisonz]

92. It's nearly 2 months between Mar 4 (OH/TX) and April 22nd in PA.

I like how the pundits ignore that fact.

Wyoming is Mar. 8 and Mississippi is March 11. Total of 58 delegates with both favoring Obama.

[PresidentObama]

7. Are you new to politics? It's called lowering expectations.

They all do it.

Even Obama.

[Political Heretic]

12. It's called, she's in real trouble.

[Cha]

16. I hope so..nothing better

at this point could happen to our country. We deserve after the 8 year nightmare.

[John Q. Citizen]

22. If she's lowering expectations now, then I expect she's lost. Just this week her campaign claimed

the exact opposite.

That Ohio was crucial.

[Iktomiwicasa]

33. glub glub glub

[tridim]

24. Please cite an example of Obama lowering expectations..

I really can't think of any because I don't think he has.

[jgraz]

42. Obama's been doing quite the opposite

They did everything but a touchdown dance the day before the Potomac Primary.

[tridim]

61. Every time I see a "But Obama does it too" post I ask for a cite

To date I've yet to see any examples, just silence. It's a very effective thread ender.

[Extend a Hand]

80. It was true after Super Tues.

http://www.suntimes.com/news/elections/781824,CST-NWS-camp07.article

"I'm always the underdog," Obama said at the Four Points Hotel near Midway Airport. "Sen. Clinton remains the favorite because of the enormous familiarity people have with her and the institutional support and the political insiders who lined up early behind her candidacy before they had a sense of how strong I might be."

Is it disingenuous for him to continue to portray himself as an underdog after so many wins?

"I'm never disingenuous," Obama deadpanned. "Here's a fair way to put it: I think we're less of an underdog than we were two weeks ago. . . . I think two weeks ago we were a big underdog. Now we're a slight underdog."

I think he was smart to try keep the underdog label for as long as possible. I didn't hear him refer to himself as the underdog after the last couple wins though. ;)

[mod mom]

26. Then why did Clinton lackey Carville call it a must win?

[JackORoses]

29. you can't lower expectations, when those same expectations are your only hope

She has to win TX and OH with at least 60% of the vote.
There is no way around this.

If she doesn't believe she will do this, then she should drop out now and let the Democratic Party unite behind its candidate.

[NMMatt]

40. No but she can get more out of a victory if she does -nt

[JackORoses]

48. the only way for her to get anything is for her to get 60%. Anything less and she is finished.

This won't be an ordinary contest, where a win is a win.

This is now sudden-death. She has to meet a certain percentage or her campaign is over.

[tridim]

66. She has to win AND beat the spread..

In three states, with negative momentum.

Good luck! :evilgrin:

[Extend a Hand]

83. oh no

I'd rather see it play out until the very end so the RW attack dogs are held at bay for as long as possible.

[quakerboy]

85. But

If she manages to lower expectations, and then win something she had to win anyway, it becomes a win, instead of a holding on win. I dont see any downside for her in lowering expectations.

[mod mom]

36. From Deep Red Cincinnati-700+ Volunteers show up for Obama w short notice:

Cincinnatians who signed up on the Obama website were emailed by the campaign early today. The campaign wanted us to know that they had secured a location for their Cincinnati office, and, apologizing for the extra-short notice, wanted to let us know they were having their first official Organizational Meeting tonight, at 6:00 p.m. Since they were still having the heat turned on at the new headquarters, and expected big attendance, the meeting was held at Friendship Baptist Church, about 5 minutes from downtown.

When I started to get close to the church, maybe two miles away, I hit ridiculously heavy traffic. It's an urban area and it's normally congested at rush hour, but this was ridiculous. When I got about five blocks from the church, it was pure gridlock, and I could see that all the side street parking was filling up, so, being late and irritated, I grabbed a spot and decided to trek through the ice and snow. So many people had that idea that we all started walking up the hill, and chatting, and the crowd just got larger. When I made it inside, it was already standing room only with TV crews and all. A very festive atmosphere!

I decided to go up front and lean against a wall, when a very nice young gentleman got out of his folding chair and gave it to me. I looked around at all the people... young and old, fathers and daughters, mothers and sons, black, white, Asian, Latino, gay, straight... and even some rather out-of-place Republican-looking men in suits. I noticed that the back of the church was now filling up, people were crowding in, and many were practically jammed against the doors. People just kept on coming. The room was overflowing and buzzing and cheerful.

The meeting was called to order and a lovely young woman named Bettina Tsongas (yes, Paul's daughter!) came up to the microphone. She practically had tears in her eyes. She said of all the states she'd been to, this was the most amazing organizational crowd she'd ever seen. The campaign staff all came up to the mic and talked about how overwheliming we were, they sincerely seemed touched.

I won't go into the details of the meeting, but when it was wrapping up, Bettina told us that they had made 700 copies of signup sheets, and they had run out. It goes to show you that people in Ohio have been chomping at the bit to get into this thing, when they can get that kind of turnout in super-short notice. It also seems from my perspective that the now-legendary Obama Ground Game Operation is for real.

http://www.buckeyestateblog.com/just_got_back_from_the_first_obama_organizational_meeting_in_cincinnati

[hogwyld]

70. That is FANTASTIC!!!!

Good luck in the next few weeks.

[CreekDog]

49. Not this low

:rofl:

[cottonseed]

67. ONE day for Obama's ground game and she's allready backpeddling.

Not looking good for Hillary's campaign when after only the first day of his ground game in Ohio, it's suddenly another state that doesn't matter. There's not a sombrero in the world big enough to hide this disaster.

[Major Hogwash]

72. If she lowers the expectations much lower, they will declare her campaign dead and pull the plug.

Her campaign is on life support now, in case you didn't notice.

[southern_dem]

73. It's too late for that

She has to win both Texas and Ohio to have any possible reason for continuing her campaign. If she doesn't, the superdelegates will jump ship in droves and she becomes the Democrats' Huckabee.

[BeyondGeography]

8. Carville was right (for once)

She loses either Texas or Ohio and she's done.

[TexasObserver]

20. True. Very true. She loses either one, and she's done. She's probably done anyway.

[mkultra]

she couldnt find it on a map

So she figures that it doesnt matter

[SKKY]

Good god....

...I tend to thing she shuddered when that picture was released.

[hogwyld]

71. I wonder how much and how often

she's been Botox'd

[Mother Of Four]

91. You can tell she's done a good deal of work on herself...

Whats funny I think is all these people screaming sexism...

Hillary gets work done = "Wow...doesn't she look great!?"
Kerry got some work done = "What a loser"

Hillary gets High AND lowlights done = "Wow...she looks so vibrant...glowing!"
Edwards gets his hair done people scream about a 400 dollar haircut.

Hillary wearing enough eyeliner to stop a truck "Wow...her eyes are SO blue...they just POP!"
Kerry gets a little powder and he's a "Meterosexual"


It's sexism, but not against females this time folks...it's against the guys. Makes me wonder how many of the ones who are screaming for equality will step up to the plate and start insisting the guys get compliments for "Looking so good" too?

[CreekDog]

51. She can so find it on a map, but that's what she pays Mark Penn to do

Gotta get somethin' for the 5 mil.

[Political Heretic]

9. My gods.... this is becoming dellusional.

She might as well say, I don't need to win any state from now until the convention, because I am god and I will be anointed the leader of the world.

:wtf:

I would like a reporter to ask, "so you have consistently dismissed every state primary and caucus you've lost as unimportant, and your own campaign spokespeople are on the record saying that Texas and Ohio were must win states. Now they're not. What states DO you feel you need to win?

[Cha]

23. "None!" "What I need is

to make sure the clinton political machine bribes and bribes good..all the super delegates I need." "That's all I need"..plus one muchacho paquito."

[CreekDog]

52. Wait for them to say they don't need pledged delegates --they will win on the second ballot

Thus, no states are needed at all.

[bunnies]

10. Of course. She's counting on those super delegates.

Pledged delegates be damned. She's in it till the end.

[Radical Activist]

11. Her internal poll numbers show her losing.

That's the only reason she would say this. She isn't sure she'll win.

[babylonsister]

13. Lowering expectations, again? I thought this was a 'must-win' state.

Guess not. She's either supremely confident or shaking in her booties, and I'll wager the latter.

[jefferson_dem]

15. "Everybody in politics lies, but they do it with such ease, it’s troubling.”

Yup.

[Skidmore]

18. Ohioans must not count either.

So much of this nation doesn't count.

[CreekDog]

54. It's true some states don't count, but parts of those states do count

Unfortunately from your avatar, I can see that the part of your state that you are in...does not count. Moving on... :yoiks:

[SoFlaJet]

19. Read as;

we just received the internal poll numbers and we are basically fucked in The Buckeye State

[Lerkfish]

21. oh dear, the preemptive excuse machine is already turned to "on".

Would this the hallmark of a Clinton presidency? premptively excusing every bad thing that happens?

[SoxFan]

25. Heeeere we go!

[SKKY]

27. We saw this movie about a month ago...

...we know how it will end.

[TexasObserver]

28. Tin Soldiers and Hillary's coming.

How very Nixonian of the pretender to the throne.

If she's saying that, it means (1) she knows she may lose Ohio, and (2) she has really lost touch with reality. When a campaign has no one who has the guts to tell the candidate it's over, this kind of delusional thinking prevails. The fact that no one told her when they were out of money shows something very important. It shows that she is a boss who can't hear bad news, so underlings won't tell her bad news.

[jefferson_dem]

31. Can you say "bunker mentality"?

:scared:

[jackson_dem]

30. Has Obama said he views Ohio as a "must win" in order to knock Hillary out?

The only folks who say a state is a must win are those who plan on dropping out of they lose (Thompson, Giuliani being recent examples).

[EmperorHasNoClothes]

41. That doesn't even make any sense

Hillary doesn't just have to win Texas and Ohio, she has to win big just to even up the delegate count with Obama.

Conversely, Obama would have to lose big in Texas and Ohio and a few other states in order to lose the delegate race to Clinton.

So I suppose he could say he views Ohio as a "must not lose by a 60-40 margin"?

[jackson_dem]

76. Only Obamites say that

There are plenty of states left in March, April, and May. March 4 isn't the end of the road. She does not need 70% of the vote there.

[EmperorHasNoClothes]

84. She needs an average of 57% in every one of those states to win

If she loses Ohio, or any other state, she'll need even more than that in the remaining states. So in that sense, every state is a "must win big" for her at this point.

[Adelante]

34. Jesus Christ, they're making my head spin

What are they DOING??

[elixir]

35. They must have sprayed "Obama gas" over the crowd.

[CreekDog]

57. I guess so, because Clinton gas makes you not worry about things

You should be worrying about.

[JVS]

38. So, should we just ask the super delegates now if they want to make her the nominee?

Because if she's unwilling to try to win delegates, they're her only path.

[Hepburn]

39. Hmmmmmm......

....tells me that she thinks she is gonna lose another one to Obama.

JMHO

[CreekDog]

43. This is why insignificance is so useful

You really can apply the term to Anyplace, USA.

:applause:

[CreekDog]

45. Senator Clinton says winning nomination not viewed as a must in winning the nomination

:eyes:

[jgraz]

47. Sadly, that's pretty close to the truth

[harun]

58. No kidding, is Karl Rove their advisor or what?

[Major Hogwash]

75. Hahahahahaha - post of the day!

Hope she has the receipt for that crown she bought for herself for this year's convention.
She won't be needing it any more.

LoL

[jgraz]

46. She clearly plans to try the MI/FL/Superdelegate strategy

Otherwise known as the "rip the party apart for personal ambition" strategy.

[madrchsod]

50. maybe she is`t fit for command

when a commander in chief thinks that a large pivotal state is`t a must win then what does that say about judgments

[loveangelc]

53. But it is. Everyone knows TX and OH are must wins.

people will be calling on her to drop out if she loses either one of those or doesn't win them by wide enough margins. the media will practically make it impossible for her to lose either and go on, unfortunate for her...

[elixir]

55. This is big news. Maybe you should post this again?!!!

[intaglio]

56. Her Campaign's internals must be very bad n/t

[DrFunkenstein]

65. My Thoughts Exactly

Otherwise she'd be talking about how it represents a broader coalition of salt of the Earth Americans than any of those commie pinko caucus states.

[Yael]

59. Well, there you go. Ohio doesn't count. Michigan and Florida, however...

[Botany]

60. This means Hillary knows Obama will run strong in OH

No way can she not win in Ohio and stay in the race.

[Yurem2008]

64. What??!!

She is definitely delusional if she thinks that Ohio is not important. Texas will be a draw, and once Obama campaigns in Ohio it is sayonara for Hillary. when she comes up empty in Texas

[Botany]

68. I live in Ohio

I really doubt if Hillary wins Ohio.

Obama will win Wisconsin and Hawaii along with picking up major endorsements
before Ohio so he will have the momentum on his side. Also the demographics
of the democratic vote here would seem to favor Obama too.

[David Zephyr]

62. Is this Clinton-speak for "Ohio is not a 'signifcant' state"?

The Clintons have insulted so many states that it's a wonder any of the super delegates still associate with them.

[cottonseed]

63. Hillary better vote Obama. If anyone needs hope...

it's Hillary. I mean, if she's not even going to try anymore, why even play the game. Someone wrote an OP the other day asking for her campaign's "jump the shark" moment. I think we're there.

[Vinca]

69. Add Ohio to Clinton's "doesn't count" list. Sorry, Buckeyes. nt

[AtomicKitten]

77. Keep moving those goalposts, Hilly!

[shenmue]

79. Gee, she doesn't want to indulge in silly media slang terms for the election process...

Guess that means she doesn't care.

Disparaging smears are all the Obama campaign seems to consist of. Never talk about your own candidate, just post silly little jabs at the other one. Hee hee hee.

Really adult of you.

What people don't like about you is the bullying.

[nomorewhopper]

81. sounds like the bottom is falling out....

if she's lowering expectations, it must not look good?

[rodeodance]

82. I think her words are much better than the Misleading OP and opening paragraph:

http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/local_news/stories/2008/02/14/hillaryvisit.html

“I really don’t think about it like that,” Clinton told The Dispatch following a 35-minute speech to 2,600 in Ohio State University’s French Field House.

“I think about doing the very best I can. I’ve got a good campaign here. I’ve got wonderful, broad support across the state and we’re just going to work like crazy to get as many votes as we possibly can and hopefully we’ll do well.”

Sharpening her contrasts with Obama, Clinton accused him of misleading Ohio Democrats with a direct-mail piece that misrepresented her position on the North American Free Trade Agreement, signed into law by her husband, former President Bill Clinton.

“He’s running a campaign where he is obviously taking shots at me,” Clinton said. “He’s got some mailer I’ve heard about here in Ohio, going after me on NAFTA. I wasn’t in the Senate, I didn’t vote on NAFTA. I’ve obviously got a record where I’ve taken on the trade issues time and time again. So we’re going to be drawing comparisons and contrasts.”

[workinclasszero]

86. Hillary is desperate now

Her last ditch effort must be underway. Browbeating superdelagates into ignoring the will of the people and forcing the seating of the MI and FL delegates.

I have never seen such a brazen, naked power grab in my life! Hillary could have given Nixon some lessons!

I thank God Obama has run such a strong campaign this year or nothing would be standing in the way of a Clinton takeover.

[Jazzgirl]

89. I tell you what....

In Texas I haven't completely committed to who I am going to support in the primary but I'm leaning toward Barack. Nope....it isn't because I drank some "Koolaid" or am "delusional". I want a change too. Very interesting......

[Az_lefty]

90. she thinks she can win over the super D's and steal this thing...

she's got a big surprise coming...

[bigtree]

93. does the truth matter at all to you? She doesn't see the state as a 'firewall'

. . . that's what she said, NOTHING about 'win-win' or 'must-win'. Tell the truth.


"Sen. Hillary Clinton last night said she does not view Ohio as a must-win firewall to keep Sen. Barack Obama from winning the Democratic presidential nomination.

“I really don’t think about it like that,” Clinton told The Dispatch following a 35-minute speech to 2,600 in Ohio State University’s French Field House.

“I think about doing the very best I can. I’ve got a good campaign here. I’ve got wonderful, broad support across the state and we’re just going to work like crazy to get as many votes as we possibly can and hopefully we’ll do well.”

[mod mom]

94. I used the entire quote from the article " in the OP. Maybe she should get Carville

not to go public with statements about it being a must win. Did you watch Countdown tonight? It's her campaign (ie as Keith indicated her ad in WI and Bill's statement) which is hurting her chances. She has attack dogs like Penn, Carvill and Bill do her dirty work and then expect everyone should treat her kindly and NOT question her tactics? It's her campaign, so either she is directing them or she's NOT in charge. Carville made a comment her comment appears to me to back away from that comment.

OF COURSE TRUTH MATTERS TO ME WHICH IS WHY I'M AGAINST PARSING OF WORDS!

[bigtree]

95. media gossip on a TV show that a minority of Americans, much less voters, watch

why should anyone care WHAT those talking heads say to sell their television show?

[mod mom]

97. Keith Olbermann is a media gossip?

OK that says volumes! In case you missed it, he is practically the only one out there standing up against this criminal administration. Thanks for showing your true colors.

peace.

[bigtree]

100. He's been bashing Clinton lately and pumping up Obama

he's as biased as anyone else. Don't pretend he's impartial.

I like his Bush stuff. Do you really think so narrowly to assume that ALL that he says on his program is gospel? That's a good example of the type of non-critical thinking which folks are criticizing Obama supporters of in their advocacy

AND, YOU CAN TAKE YOUR 'TRUE COLORS' CRACK AND SHOVE IT.

[mod mom]

106. If you actually watched last night instead of speculated you would have heard

talk of his respect for Bill & Hillary but his distain for the factually challenged attacks they are aiming at Obama.

As far as my "true colors", I highly respect what Olbermann is doing! Who else is calling out both sides of the aisle in order to protect our constitutional rights (the neocons as well as the enabling neo-libs who are siding with bu$h)? Sorry if you don't agree, but I stand with Keith in saying there are forces within both parties that are not working in the best interest of this country in adhering to the constitution and the laws that protect our rights.

[bigtree]

111. I watched. My OPINION stands. Shove it with your attempts to marginalize that opinion

into your little biased box.

[KAZ]

102. The mighty oak has fallen.

Boy, I wish these primaries were over with.

[bigtree]

104. His celebrity bashing is crap too. He's a bore when he finishes with Bush and the republicans

That's enough, however, to keep me tuning in. Does ANYONE here have ANY ability to think critically?

[mod mom]

107. He is not just ranting against the GOP but the Dems who are working as enablers.

I guess it's just you here who has the ability to think critically. If that means black and white all R's bad, all D's good, then my guess is you are really not listening to what Keith is talking about. imho

[bigtree]

110. He has some good and some bad on the program. THAT's critical thinking

not the blanket acceptance of everything he says like you're suggesting you practice.

[mod mom]

113. I have found very little to disagree with Keith-it doesn't mean I am void of critical

thinking, as you suggest. Obama wasn't my first or second choice but with the candidates left I believe he is FAR superior to bring change to this country. I would like to vote for a Dem this presdential election but it will only happen if the candidate stands for a definite shift away frm corporatism and imho that means Obama.

[bigtree]

103. oH YeaH, About that lie in the headline . . . NOwhere does she say Ohio's not a MUST-WIN

distract, divert, dissemble . . .

[mod mom]

108. "Sen. Hillary Clinton last night said she does not view Ohio as a must-win firewall to keep..."

[bigtree]

109. THAT'S NOT A QUOTE FROM HER. HER STATEMENT SAY NOTHING OF THE KIND.

THAT QUOTE IS FROM THE WRITER OF THE ARTICLE, NOT CLINTON. SHE CLEARLY SAYS THAT SHE INTENDS TO SEEK EVERY VOTE.

[mod mom]

112. then take it up w the Reporter, Joe Hallet, who quoted her. He was there -were you?

[Moh96]

96. of course its not she got the last 3 wins and all the Momentum NM, FL and MI

and of course super delegates
PLEAAAAAAAAAASE