Remember when I said Dean is a quantum leap for the gay movement?

[Brian_Expat]

Well, well, well. . . The Washington Post agrees!

Former Vermont governor Howard Dean's record-setting fundraising first took off in large part because of an outpouring of support from the gay community.

With just one exception, every fundraiser Dean attended outside Vermont in 2002 was organized by gay men and lesbians, as were more than half the events in the first quarter of 2003, according to Dean advisers.

"The early foundation of Governor Dean's presidential campaign -- both in fundraising and organization -- was built by the support of the LGBT community around the country," said Dean finance director Stephanie Schriock.

. . . snip. . .

In 2001 and early 2002, well before he announced his candidacy, Dean capitalized on his signing of the civil unions law and his hero status in the gay community, speaking to branches of the Human Rights Campaign and other organizations across the county.

In other words, as I said earlier, Dean's campaign took off because of us. The GLBT community had an instrumental role to play in helping the likely Democratic nominee for President attain that status! That's a HUGE quantum leap for gay people in this country.

[La_Serpiente]

1. oh great

now the right wing is going to say that Dean is part of some kind of GLBT agenda :eyes:

I don't think that is true by the way. The campaign is an amalgamation of a lot of different groups. However, I do not deny the fact that there has been a lot of support for Dean within the GLBT community.

[Brian_Expat]

6. Let them make their insinuations

People have to stop fearing what the right wing is going to "say" and start focusing on a positive vision for America.

One lesson GLBT people can teach the Democratic Party is that you shouldn't give a crap about the lies and innuendo your opponents will say about you -- because if you're right and stick to your guns, you keep winning. If we ran away in fear with every right wing slur, Anita Bryant would have defeated the movement for equality waaaaaay back in the 1970s.

Democrats should "come out" regarding our principles, be proud, and stand firm in our beliefs! Let the right wing fulminate, groan and whisper darkly of conspiracies while we offer a superior vision for America.

[Loren645]

2. I thought Dean was basically forced to sign the same sex marriage

Bill because the state legislature forced it on him.

But your spin is interesting...

[FubarFly]

3. Dean wasn't forced to sign anything

Where are you getting your facts?

[zulchzulu]

31. Where's the photo of Dean signing the bill?

Can't find any?

Maybe it's because he didn't want to have any photos taken during the event.

Why?

[FubarFly]

36. Do you need a photograph to make it real?

Dean handled the matter sensitively and appropriately. The important thing was that he signed the bill. The smart thing was that he avoided in large part a negative media frenzy which could have torpedoed his career.

[Brian_Expat]

46. Dean is the real "uniter" here

He understood that in order to build support for civil unions, he couldn't be triumphalist about the victory.

That was a wonderful part of his effort to educate voters on equality, BTW. When Dean signed the bill, it had under 40% support. By the end of the gubernatorial campaign, a majority supported it. A lot of those new supporters were people who would have been pissed off with a triumphal "ha ha" signing.

Dean walked the thin line and stood up for us quite well against right wing slurs and death threats.

[FubarFly]

53. I may be a little late, but welcome to DU Brian_Expat

I look forward to reading more of your first hand experiences with Howard Dean in Vermont.

:toast:

[Brian_Expat]

55. Thanks!

And I posted a thread on the Vermont experience on the GD:2004 Primary thread -- it's entitled something like "Setting the record straight on Vermont and Civil Unions." It's all about what a tough fight the civil unions fight was in Vermont.

[FubarFly]

59. I'll be sure to check that out.

Peace.

[zulchzulu]

58. I'm glad he signed the bill

It's just curious that he did the signing "in the closet"; in private and without a public ceremony.

It hardly stands as a model of courage that he did the signing this way.

The Vermont State Supreme Court decision in December, 1999 ordered the Legislature to come up with a law guaranteeing same-sex couples the benefits, protections and responsibilities given to heterosexual married couples.

Dean had to sign the bill.

http://rutlandherald.com/vtruling/story8.html

[FubarFly]

63. Hmm..despite evidence to the contrary you still insist

on distortions. Yes the legislature was ordered to come up with a law, with Dean's input BTW, but if Dean didn't like the law, he didn't have to sign it.

The bottom line is that Vermont has civil unions and is a more tolerant and better place because of it, Dean won reelection, and is now the Democratic frontrunner. Nothing "in the closet" about that.

[Brian_Expat]

64. Anytime someone tells you that Dean was "forced". . .

. . . or signed the law unwillingly, ask them if they were there on the ground in Vermont.

Then ask someone who was there, involved in the campaign for civil unions, what happened. You will get a very different story from both -- and I know who people should trust if they have to choose. :)

[FubarFly]

72. For the record, here's a link to Brian_Expat's previous thread.

I hope you find it as informative as I did.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=38811

[MercutioATC]

70. Why? Because it was a divisive issue in Vermont

and he felt that publicizing the signing would widen the rift.

[Brian_Expat]

4. I've explained why that's not true a number of times

As someone who was fighting the right wing on the ground during the VT election. . . but I don't think that prevents people from repeating the spin over and over anyway. :(

[Hawkeye-X]

23. Wrong

If you had read Howard Dean: The Citizen's Guide of a Man who would be President, you'd get your facts straight from Vermont.

Yes, the Vermont reporters have documented where he has found a middle ground to gay marriage and banning gay marriage, by supporting civil unions, and asked the Legislature to pass something like this, and of course, they did -- and Dean signed into law in private to prevent a GOP photo-op -- smartest thing he ever did.

Hawkeye-X

[LittleDannySlowhorse]

42. Yes Dean was FORCED to sign the bill

He was intimidated by a powerful crime family, the Velvet Mafia.

[Brian_Expat]

65. SHHHHHHHHHH!

Don't let out our secret.

We actually replaced Howard Dean with a pod person, who channels the personalities of Truman Capote and Gore Vidal. That's why he's so brusque! ;)

[LittleDannySlowhorse]

67. It was like

an episode of "Queer Legislation for the Straight Governor".

[Cheswick2.0]

76. ROFL

good one Danny

[Cheswick2.0]

75. nope

you thought wrong.

[ErasureAcer]

5. He isn't even going to do anything for the GLBT community as Pres.

so I don't understand why the GLBT are supporting him.

[Brian_Expat]

7. Because we're all stupid, of course

And we have no clue how to run a political campaign or understand who are friends are. :eyes:

Aieeeeee. Dean is a great friend of GLBT Americans and helped advance equality immeasurably with his campaign during the civil unions campaign.

[Walt Starr]

8. That fact alone is one reason Dean is a great choice

I'm hetero, but growing up there was a gay couple living next door to my mom's house. They were the nicest men I've ever known and that formulated a lot of my opinions.

It always sickened me how these wonderful men were reviled by the rightwingnuts. That experience has never left me, and never will.

[Brian_Expat]

11. Thanks for your experiences :)

As more people meet and work with gay people, things will only get better for America. We're already key contributors and productive members of society. Granting equal rights to GLBT people will only increase the amount GLBT folk can contribute to society as a whole.

And the equality doesn't stop here with us! Let's see legal equality for all -- women, minorities, recent immigrants, people with disabilities, and on and on!

[Walt Starr]

34. My mom raised me right!

:D

[Brian_Expat]

47. Obviously! :) n/t

[ErasureAcer]

13. He thinks gay rights is a state's issue...

how is that helping the GLBT across America?

It isn't.

Gay Rights are civil rights...just like women's rights, people of colored rights and so on.

If you're for GLBT state rights but not national rights...you might as well be in favor of racial rights as a state issue.

This thinking is completely ass backwards.

Dennis Kucinich has the right stand...GLBT are civil rights...HUMAN rights.

State's shouldn't be allowed to discriminate against the GLBT community.

Howard Dean will do nothing to solve this problem.

DENNIS KUCINICH WILL!
www.kucinich.us

[Brian_Expat]

14. He does not

He says that creation of a marriage registry is a state issue, but that the federal government should recognize, for federal purposes, all civil unions/marriages created in various states -- as well as gay marriages in Canada, the UK, Europe and other countries.

He also supports ENDA, open military service, a repeal of DOMA, and DP benefits for federal employees -- all federal issues.

People who talk about "gay marriage being only a federal issue" don't understand the issues involved, and don't help themselves or their candidate by botching those details.

[ErasureAcer]

18. Kucinich means so much more to the GLBT community

including supporting Gay Marriage.

Dean is nothing in comparisson.

Any GLBT issue that Dean supports for State's only...is a disservice to the GLBT community and justice.

Dean thinks states should have the power to control their own marriage/civil unions legislation.

What I'm saying is that doesn't get anything done...that isn't justice being served.

As I said before...if GLBT want equality...they should support Kucinich.

Dean isn't doing much for the GLBT community. He is making people go out to a different country to get married just to be recognized by the government.

That's not a leader standing up for what's right, that's not a person proud of the GLBT community...that's a person playing politics.

Playing politics with human rights is a disgrace.

[Brian_Expat]

29. Kucinich doesn't mean more to the GLBT community. . .

Dean fought for us in a unique way and helped make history. That's hard to forget.

I have respect for Dennis and his positions, but to tear down Dean's real fight against the right wing in Vermont is not going to help Kucinich.

[LittleDannySlowhorse]

48. "people of colored rights"

I think you need to brush up a bit on your PC terminology there, my friend.

[Cheswick2.0]

77. Dennis Kucinich will also pass legislation to try 13 year olds as adults

How liberal is that?

[Gloria]

9. Clark supports gays in the military....openly in the military.....

Excellent.

[Brian_Expat]

10. Who amongst the Dem candidates doesn't? n/t

[blm]

81. Yes, and now Dean camp is in serious discussions with Sam Nunn

according to a MSNBC report I saw the other day for his "defense" experience. Too bad Nunn was the one who pushed Don't Ask, Don't Tell on Clinton while Kerry and Clark were advocating FOR gays to serve openly.

If Dean were TRULY the beacon for gays that he purports to be during the primaries, he would NEVER even be CONSIDERING Nunn. There would be NO overtures to Nunn made AT ALL.

[tedoll78]

12. Any of the nine candidates will be good for equality's sake.

It's the Supreme Court that matters most. Imagine Bush appointing two or three Scalia-types who decide that they want to imitate Rehnquist and sit on the bench for 30 years each. Why this doesn't scare the crap out of more liberals baffles me.

[Brian_Expat]

15. That may be true

But this article demonstrates how Democratic candidates who chose not to embrace the GLBT movement closer hurt themselves and may have lost the nomination as a result.

[tedoll78]

17. You bet.

In fact, if a candidate in a heavily-divided field can wrap-up >60% of the gay community, that increases his/her chances of having double-digit polling numbers; in a crowded race, this would get attention.

Gay voters were about 5% of the general election's participants in 2000. They were about 10 to 15% of primary participants. If a candidate captures 60% of that group, that's a base of 6% - a pretty good base. And not only is it a good base.. it seems to be a pretty cohesive base also. The gay people I know (myself included) read the same magazines & newspapers, watch similar television shows, etc. It wouldn't be too hard to reach-out to us media-wise..

[Brian_Expat]

26. That's right. . .

I'm looking forward to the "Dean for America Atlantic Cruise" personally. . . :evilgrin:

[Bill of Rights]

16. Many gays DO NOT like Dean

Thanks for posting the article about GLBT organizations that propelled Dean into a front-runner. I KNOW he doesn't have a lock on the gay vote. NONE of my gay friends are fans of Dean. Granted, most of them are lesbians, but they are turned off by his persona. The way he carries himself. The way he speaks. The way he looks. A couple of days ago I was browsing DFA and read a hilarious post by some hetero guy who thought that gays would never leave Dean's side to vote for someone else. To him, gays were an example of votes that were non-transferrable. I had to restrain myself from writing something on their blog.

Personally, I am more impressed with Clark's gay record than Dean's. We all know how Dean signed the civil union legislation in the darkness of night. We all heard about how he told reporters that the subject of homosexuality made him uncomfortable. Just these two incidents, alone, make me feel he is really not that enlightened. Clark, on the other hand, was considered to be trustworthy by stressed-out gay officers who confided in him information that could ruin their careers. Also, the manner in which Clark speaks about gay rights is heart-felt and sincere. Most of the other Dem candidates give off similar vibes, but Dean does not. Even Lieberman feels more real than Dean with this issue.

[ErasureAcer]

19. I agree

Dean's aura comes off as a "constepated football coach" according to my roommate(who just switched to Iowa State...sad...he was a good roommate)...and ex member of the US armed services(he served in S Korea, Bosnia and Afghanistan).

As I said in other posts in this topic...Dean isn't even for equal human rights for the GLBT community.

It is a shame the GLBT are supporting a person who isn't doing much for them.

[Brian_Expat]

22. Yes, we're all stupid because we don't support your candidate.

Now THERE'S a winning line that will get you support in the future!

[ErasureAcer]

30. Whatever dude...

I know Dean's platform is very centrist...and he is blatantly distorted my candidate's record.

[Brian_Expat]

33. Most GLBT people are centrist as well

Most gay people are fiscal moderates and social liberals. Lots are social moderates as well. The notion that we're all waiting to vote for an extreme-left candidate is an old myth.

[ErasureAcer]

37. hey...it's your rights

that you're denying.

You only get for what you ask for...and you're not getting much with Dean(if anything).

I have family members myself who are Gay and Lesbian and they seem pretty progressive...not Dean centrist B.S.

You'll be sorry when you have nothing gained...but even then Dean isn't going to win the GE anyhow...so you'll have nothing anyways.

[Brian_Expat]

40. Hee hee hee

I love it when a non-gay person lectures me on how I don't care about my rights. Makes me think THEY'RE the GLBT activist or something and not someone just trolling for my vote. :evilgrin:

[ErasureAcer]

45. my mother is a lesbian

and I love her very much...so I am a GLBT rights activist.

You implying I'm not a GLBT activist is an insult...and you should be ashamed because I'm fighting for people like you.

The sad part is...you're not.

[Brian_Expat]

51. No, I'm not a gay rights activist

I just have a history of fighting for gay equality wherever I am.

If you desire a pissing contest, I shan't satiate that desire. But I do find it hilarious that you're trying to declare who is or isn't a gay activist based upon what presidential candidate they're supporting.

Lots of activists support Gephardt (including David Mixner). Lots support Kerry. Lots support Dean. To you, all of those people are "stupid" and "not fighting for gay rights" because they're not stumping for a Dem candidate who attracts only between 1 and 4 percent of the vote.

I like Dennis, but I don't think he's a ticket to victory. That doesn't make me "not an activist." The successful activist wins victories in real life, not just "moral" ones.

Further, Kucinich's position on gay marriage as a presidential candidate is his only differentiator from other candidates -- and as president, he has no ability to influence marriage any more than any other candidate.

Using your logic, also, people should have supported Ralph Nader over Al Gore and weren't activists if they didn't support him. Support for Dennis, no matter how great he is (and he is great) is a similar Quixotic quest, IMO.

[ErasureAcer]

56. moral victories are the only things that matter

voting for candidate "A" that doesn't believe in the right thing...while not voting for candidate "B" who does believe in the right thing....that's just a sad state of affairs...

as I said before...your candidate might win...but you're not going to get anything from that candidate.

sure the president is only one person.

I believe Dennis as the nominee and as president would tour the country and talk to the people about why GLBT equal rights, including marriage, is important for equality and justice in this country.

While Howard Dean as the nominee and president might repeal DOMA...but what is repealing DOMA when there are only a couple of states that acknowledge gay unions.

Dean isn't fighting for what is right...and I won't support him if he is the nominee....a lot of the people I know won't support him either.

I don't like centrists. I don't like people who support 400 billion defense budgets. I don't like people who don't support gay marriage. I don't like people who lie about other candidate's campaigns.

To put it short...I don't like Howard Dean and I'm not alone.

[Brian_Expat]

60. Moral victories are nice fluff

A "moral victory" won't let me adopt, protect my family, or ensure my partner gets the house and bank accounts if I unexpectedly die. Sorry.

Real victories are what get us those, and they take a combination of principle, fighting spirit, negotiation, articulation, and courage. Dean's got all of those and used all of them well for the people of Vermont.

That practical victory is leading to more partnership laws across the country.

[tedoll78]

61. Why am I reminded of Veruca Salt..?

"I want the world.
I want the whole world.
I want to lock it
all up in my pocket -
it's my bar of chocolate.
Give it to me - NOW!"

It's not a coincidence that people who think like Veruca Salt are never happy politically.

[ErasureAcer]

66. I'm happy knowing

I stand up for what is right in the world...

those who compromise and lie and don't fight for justice and equality are doing not only themselves but the rest of mankind no good.

My politicians may not win...but I know I'm not the one supporting the candidates who want 400 billion defense budgets...I'm not the one supporting Israel's domination in the middle east...I'm not the one supporting nuclear waste being sent into the yucca mountain range...I'm not the one denying gays and lesbians equal rights(including marriage)...I'm not the one who wants to deny healthcare to even 1 american...

yes...I'll stand up for what I believe in. If the american public doesn't agree with me...fine...that's the beauty of our government.

I'm not the one ruining the country, and the world...the people who DON'T agree with the moral, ethical, equality solutions are.

[tedoll78]

49. Nothing gained?

I'd bet good money that Rehnquist will be stepping-down after the next election. And Stephens' health is not very good; he's in his 80's. Then there's the possibility of O'Connor getting tired of it all.

BTW.. where'd you get that crystal ball? I've always wanted one of those.

[Cheswick2.0]

79. dude, DK is not a liberal

he is a Naderlite centrist. He is all concerned with big global issues but unable to see the trees for the forest. DK has a 40% rating from the ACLU because he is a typical male authoritarian leftist (unconcerned or just plain wrong about the issues of women and children) than where most of us stand which is to the libertarian left.

[Loren645]

52. :) Nicely said ErasurAcer

Dean, good for gays???
Whatever...

[Brian_Expat]

57. Dean is clearly WORSE for gays!

Not only did he sign the civil unions bill under duress (submitting only because Elizabeth Birch threatened to show him naked pictures of Dr. Laura if he didn't), but he also throws darts at pictures of lesbian couples. Occasionally, he gets his house repainted by gay college students, who he stiffs at the end of the job. And did I mention his love for gay-bashing? Why, my cousin'g neighbour's brother's best friend's cousin's boss' customer's associate saw him cruising Burlington Vermont's massive gay district with a baseball bat! :eyes:

[Brian_Expat]

20. Dean is overwhelmingly the front-runner amongst GLBT people

1/3 of gay Democrats support other candidates -- then again, 1/3 of all gay voters are Republicans.

We all know how Dean signed the civil union legislation in the darkness of night. We all heard about how he told reporters that the subject of homosexuality made him uncomfortable. Just these two incidents, alone, make me feel he is really not that enlightened.

This is just shameful and repulsive spin -- an insult to those of us who actually campaigned in Vermont for this law and know what happened.

Why is it that people who have never worked hard for GLBT equality are suddenly coming out to criticize hard-working people who worked tirelessly against the right wing, including death threats, in order to beat the odds?

Personally, I am more impressed with Clark's gay record than Dean's.

Most gay people are not. Most gay people supported and continue to support Dean because when the going got tough, he stood by us. Clark remains, amongst all the Democratic candidates, largely untested on gay issues. He's never had to publicly risk his position and take a stand on an unpopular gay issue. All the other Democratic candidates have.

His platform is great, but will he stand up for us? Remains to be seen. I think that most of us prefer to stand with someone who has stood for us and risked his career for us -- hence Dean, who commands tremendous respect in the community.

[tedoll78]

32. If I recall correctly..

Gore got about 70% of the gay vote. Bush got about 25%, and Nader got the remainder.

I used to have gay GOP friends. They were all too willing to sell-out their humanity so that they'd supposedly pay fewer taxes. Yes, I unabashedly look-down upon them. Like chickens voting for Col Sanders, or Jews voting for Hitler. Stupid.

[Brian_Expat]

35. Actually, Bush did much better than Dole

It was a wonderful PR exercise by the Republicans. I remember when the Log Cabin Republicans put pictures of Al Gore with Fred Phelps and claimed that was proof that Gore is homophobic. Sick.

However, the Republicans captured more gay votes because Democrats didn't do enough to show their support for us. After Al Gore boasted that he signed and supported DOMA and continued to in order to claim "independence from gay interests," that hurt him with gay conservatives who would other wise vote Democratic.

The GOP then said "well, if Bush and Gore are the same on gay stuff, why not get a tax cut." Egads.

[tedoll78]

44. For gay folks considering the GOP..

I refer them to Rehnquist, Thomas, and Scalia.. *shudder*

[Brian_Expat]

62. I agree

But I do meet gay Republicans frequently, especially in the securities/financial services industry. The common thread is that they're prosperous enough not to care about common rights because they feel they can "buy them."

[Loren645]

25. "Clark,..., was considered to be trustworthy by stressed-out"

That's interesting stuff.
I'd like to know more, but I don't want to pry.

But it's interesting stuff.

[Brian_Expat]

28. I do want to know more

Clark's stand on various GLBT issues is ambiguous to me.

Also, I am leery of shadowy friends of candidates who swear that such-and-such a candidate is a big pro-GLBT person. Log Cabin Republicans during Election 2000 were running around saying that Bush had lots of gay friends and told them all that he'd never do anything that would hurt them -- and yet here he is, supporting an anti-gay constitutional amendment.

[Loren645]

39. Yes, I've heard your official party line Brian_Expat

Now I'd like to hear from other folks.
You needn't repeat the same sales pitch over and over.
It's suffocating.

[Brian_Expat]

41. In other words

I don't have a right to an opinion because you disagree?

[Loren645]

50. "Remember when I said Dean is a quantum leap for the gay movement?"

That's starting to feel like a command.

Don't order us around.
Let people decide for themselves, unless you're
afraid they'll make the *wrong* choice.

[Brian_Expat]

54. A "command"?

I must say I don't understand your logic. But I won't shut up about GLBT issues just because you don't like it, sorry. :)

[Hawkeye-X]

27. Guess your lesbian friends hasn't looked into this website:

DykesforDean.com

Hawkeye-X

[Cheswick2.0]

78. I guess we will have to take you word on all of that

I just guess we will. :shrug:

[dsc]

21. We won't be dissed again

Nothing like propelling a wildly sucessful primary campaign to get respect.

[Brian_Expat]

24. Correction. . .

We won't be dissed by WINNING candidates again. People who insist that gays are "stupid" or "don't understand the reality" of their own political equality are going to hurt themselves and their candidates' chances. :)

[zulchzulu]

38. Kerry has a strong record of support for GLBT community

More info:
http://www.johnkerry.com/communities/glbt/

Kerry: For the Record

Workplace Discrimination:
Co-sponsor of the Employ-ment Non-Discrimination Act, a bill that would ban workplace discrimination based on sexual orientation.
 
Hate Crimes:
Co-sponsor of a strong hate crimes prevention measure, the Local Law Enforcement Enhancement Act.
 
HIV/AIDS:
Co-sponsor of the Early Treatment for HIV Act, which would expand Medicaid to people living with HIV, and supports science-based prevention programs.
 
Gay Civil Rights Bill:
Authored the Senate version of the Civil Rights Amendments Act of 1985,a comprehensive gay civil rights bill that would have covered discrimination in employment, housing and credit.Born in a military hospital in 1943 to a World War II serviceman and his wife, John Kerry has had a lifelong affiliation with the U.S. military. As a decorated veteran of the Vietnam War, Kerry made a distinctive stand in support of gays in the military during early '90s hearings before the Senate Armed Services Committee.

Three-Term Senator Has Stellar Record

October  27,  2002
Human Right Quarterly
By Mark Shields

"I think that any American ought to be able to serve their country if they are physically qualified and able," said the Massachusetts senator in a recent interview with HRC Quarterly. "There were gay people who served in Vietnam. There were gay people who served in World War II, Korea and World War I — and great acts of heroism have been per-formed by people who are gay."

Kerry is among the early front-runners in the bid for the 2004 Democratic presidential nomination. A Yale graduate, Kerry was elected lieutenant governor of Massachusetts in 1982. He was elected to the Senate in 1984, and has consistently supported, sometimes at great political peril, civil rights for the gay community.

In addition to his support for gays in the military, he was one of only 14 senators to vote in 1996 against the anti-gay Defense of Marriage Act, or DOMA. "I thought it was rank gay bashing; it was pure political exploitation," said Kerry.

Today, Kerry supports the idea that gay and lesbian relationships should enjoy rights and privileges equivalent to those of marriage. "I'm for civil union and partnership — and I would make sure that every federal entity works to make those provisions available," he said.

Kerry says his record over the years on a range of issues sets him apart from other candidates. In 1985, he authored the Senate version of the gay civil rights bill — a measure that, if passed, would have covered discrimination in employment, housing and credit. His average score on the Human Rights Campaign's congressional scorecard, begun in the 101st Congress, is 96 percent — with a perfect score for the last four congresses.

But Kerry has opposed HRC on three measures — an amendment that sought to restrict schools from using materials that "promote homosexuality;" an amendment that sought to levy a $10,000 fine and lengthy prison term on health care providers who know they have HIV and perform medical procedures without telling patients; and an amendment barring the permanent immigration of people who test positive for HIV/AIDS.

Meanwhile, Kerry has strong words about the current administration's policies on HIV/AIDS, which favor abstinence-only programs over scientifically based prevention programs. "It's embarrassing for the United States to have this kind of
zealotry getting in the way of common sense. ... I'm going to reverse as many of those particular directives as possible, and I'm going to set us on a path of common sense and decency."

"I think that tolerance is what this country is built on," said Kerry. "That's what America is about. That's our journey."

[Brian_Expat]

43. Sure he does

But as I noted, he turned down the opportunity to embrace the GLBT grass roots and Dean ran with it instead. Kerry didn't view us as a catalyst to jump-start his campaign, he didn't do a cover story with the Advocate, etc.

We could do a lot worse than have Kerry for a nominee on GLBT issues.

[Loren645]

68. "Remember when I said Dean is a quantum leap"

Remember?!
My sides still hurt from laughing.

[Brian_Expat]

69. Keep laughing

Gay people have come a long way, regardless of what you think. :)

[ErasureAcer]

71. I doubt that's not why this person is laughing

Gay people have come a long way...not so long ago...homosexuality was treated as a disease...people were put in mental hospitals and whatnot...why some religious fanatics still may see homosexuality as unholy...it has come a long way...I agree..

what the person is laughing about...is that Dean has somehow made some quantum leap for gay rights...he hasn't.

considering the bill in vermont came at the end of his term, and was ordered by the supreme court there...Dean really didn't push for civil unions(which isn't even equality).

The bill also came near the end of his term in Vermont politics...his 4th term I believe as Governor.

Why didn't he push for this in his first 3 terms? The answer...Dean really isn't a "Friend" of the GLBT community. It was only when he was forced to sign it that he did(and he did that behind closed doors).

Dean isn't a quantum leap...I'm not laughing, oh no...I'm shaking my head at the suckers who think Dean is some friend of the GLBT community. I feel sorry for those who actually think they're going to get something out of a Dean administration. Who think that compromising on their rights, on gay marriage, and having GLBT issues be state issues is somehow a quantum leap.

That isn't a quantum leap...that is politics being played...while justice goes unserved.

[Brian_Expat]

73. You're missing the point

Dean's success is due to his early embrace of the GLBT community.

That the GLBT community's support for their candidate, Dean, helped catalyze his campaign into the unquestionably leading candidate represents a quantum leap for gay people.

Before, we were peripheral to Democrats' campaigns. Now, we are a major reason for the leadership of the likely nominee.

[Tinoire]

80. This is too sad for New Year's Day

Once again, it seems people are projecting their own desires onto Dean. One of the important reasons I've gone for Kucinich is Gay Rights and now I hear that the GLBT community is pushing a candidate that won’t push for a federal law granting marriage rights to gays and lesbians. There's something horribly wrong with this picture.

Addotionally, I'm really dis-heartened at the comment about "Palestinian children jumping up and down with glee on television over the fact that 3,000 Americans have been murdered" when that story was long ago de-bunked when the cropped parts of the footage of Israeli soldiers giving those kids candy were shown.

I'm sticking to Kucinich- the only candidate who's made clear promises about his intention- and that's where my money and vote are going. Same thing with my Gay friends in California- they're more Progressive than fiscally conservative. You can't have it all in this world.


MONTPELIER — Gov. Howard Dean told a national television audience Sunday that if he’s elected president, he won’t push for a federal law granting marriage rights to gays and lesbians.

“I believe each state has to come to grips with civil rights,” Dean said on NBC’s “Meet the Press.” “I think that gay and lesbian people are entitled to the same legal and civil rights that everybody else has, but think that every state has to come to grips with that in (its) own way.”

<snip>

“Nothing that Osama bin Laden did can be forgiven or rationalized. But what disturbs me greatly, and what I was talking about in that quote, is the Palestinian children jumping up and down with glee on television over the fact that 3,000 Americans have been murdered,” he said.

http://rutlandherald.com/hdean/50316

[robbedvoter]

74. "I am as uncomfortable as anyone else" (with civil unions)

Misplaced enthusiasm.