Another Hillary lie?

[Upton]

Ohio Hospital Contests a Story Clinton Tells
By DEBORAH SONTAG

Over the last five weeks, Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton of New York has featured in her campaign stump speeches the story of a health care horror: an uninsured pregnant woman who lost her baby and died herself after being denied care by an Ohio hospital because she could not come up with a $100 fee.

The woman, Trina Bachtel, did die last August, two weeks after her baby boy was stillborn at O’Bleness Memorial Hospital in Athens, Ohio. But hospital administrators said Friday that Ms. Bachtel was under the care of an obstetrics practice affiliated with the hospital, that she was never refused treatment and that she was, in fact, insured.

“We implore the Clinton campaign to immediately desist from repeating this story,” said Rick Castrop, chief executive officer of the O’Bleness Health System.

Linda M. Weiss, a spokeswoman for the not-for-profit hospital, said the Clinton campaign had never contacted the hospital to check the accuracy of the story, which Mrs. Clinton had first heard from a Meigs County, Ohio, sheriff’s deputy in late February.

A Clinton spokesman, Mo Elleithee, said candidates would frequently retell stories relayed to them, vetting them when possible. “In this case, we did try but were not able to fully vet it,” Mr. Elleithee said. “If the hospital claims it did not happen that way, we respect that.”

Although Mrs. Clinton has told the story repeatedly, it first came to the attention of the hospital after The Washington Post cited it as a staple of her stump speeches on Thursday. That brought it to the attention of The Daily Sentinel in Pomeroy, Ohio, which published an article on Friday.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/05/us/politics/05woman.html?_r=2&ei=5090&en=7824b4f8ea3b363d&ex=1365134400&partner=rssuserland&emc=rss&pagewanted=print&oref=slogin&oref=slogin

[easy_b94]

1. WOW..I don't know what to say

[DJ13]

2. Oh boy.... maybe it would be easier to track when she actually tells the truth

It would be a far shorter list.

[C_U_L8R]

3. Well it's certainly not true but

now we'll have to endure a Hillarian reinterpretation of what that possibly means.

[Upton]

4. Will it be "misspoke" or "misheard?"

she's used both to justify what were really lies.

[C_U_L8R]

8. Snipers in the operating room

of course they could not "vet" the story... because they made it up !

[quantass]

70. .

[dchill]

5. "..we did try but were not able to fully vet it,” Mr. Elleithee said.

But that didn't stop Clinton from repeating AND embellishing the story.

Indeed, saying that the story haunted her, Mrs. Clinton repeatedly offered it as a dire example of a broken health care system. At one March rally in Wyoming, for instance, she referred to Ms. Bachtel, a 35-year-old who managed a Pizza Hut, as a young, uninsured minimum-wage worker, saying, “It hurts me that in our country, as rich and good of a country as we are, this young woman and her baby died because she couldn’t come up with $100 to see the doctor.”

[Upton]

6. It brings up the question

if they were unable to fully vet it, why were they using it?

[dchill]

10. That is my point.

HRC(tm) feels that if you don't vet it, you don't know it ISN'T true, so you can use it however you want, and it's OK!!!

And always remember George Costanza - "It's not a lie - if YOU believe it."

[ORDem]

11. No one's going to get turned away from the emergency room.

In fact, she was seen, as the hospital staff said.

Visits to the emergency room are what passes for universal health care in the U.S., as stupid, wasteful, dangerous, and pathetic as that is.

:dem:

[dchill]

14. Tell me about it. In my town, it IS the pre-eminent...

health care plan. It's mine, too.

[Yael]

38. Pizza Hut pays their managers minimum wage?

Ouch.

[jobycom]

7. All this look so much like Gore in 2000 I don't know what to say.

Jesus Christ, if she opens her mouth some goddamned Obama supporter will say she lied. Maybe the hospital is covering it's own ass, or maybe Clinton got the story from someone who believed it was true, like with Gore and the Kailey Ellis story.

Another reason I detest Obama. If he had any character at all, he would stop this crap. Then again, he admitted on the Daily Show that he had to say things that were untrue, because that's how the game was played. So anyone who says he doesn't lie is calling him a liar.

[dchill]

16. So, you pretty much detest Obama because YOUR candidate...

lies repeatedly. NO ONE can be turned away from hospital emergency care for lack of money. The story is proven untrue and as been EMBELLISHED by Clinton. It is a PROVEN pattern which has nothing to do with Barack Obama, his supporters - or YOU. It just IS!

[thewiseguy]

21. What does this have to do with Obama?

[karynnj]

23. Is Obama questioning the story or saying HRC was not telling the truth - NO

Blaming him is ridiculous. This is a case where the story got back to the hospital via a routine news story that did not question it. They are saying it's not true.

That said - this is not HRC lying - it's her campaign not doing its job in checking to see if the story was accurate. (this does bring back the waitress story in Iowa where some of HRC's details were denied by the woman.) My guess is that EVERY campaign has a hard time with this - the candidate is told a heart breaking story, they know adding these stories make points that are harder to make with just policy statements - so they use them. Here, it was her staff not doing the back up that could have protected her.

The problem with HRC is that the real damage of the Bosnia story is that it leads people to assume that she has a tendency to lie or distort. (It's like some columnist wrote - had Bill Clinton spelled potato with an "e", it would have gone ignored - because it doesn't match a BC stereotype.)

[OzarkDem]

33. Blaming the patient for their own death?

Something about the hospitals story doesn't sound right. This woman's case needs to be fully investigated.

Obama and the news media trying to use a tragedy typical of our failing health care system to score political points is wrong on every level.

[dchill]

41. Good job! Every single aspect of your post...

I completely tangential to the truth! Wonderfully obfuscational! *****

[karynnj]

55. No one is blaming the patient for her own death

The point is she was not turned away for lack of $100. Again, what has Obaam said about this? Is it typical that a person would be turned away from an emergency room for lack of ability to pay? Actually, it's not - as you can see with the coverage when it has happened.

[Zhade]

62. Right, because a proven liar like clinton deserves to be believed over the hospital.

Tell us, what is it like to be so blindly loyal to a proven liar?

[guruoo]

26. From the same people that say Hillary is the one that will do "anything to win"

RIP, Ron Brown:


USAF MH-53J Pave Low helicopter over wreckage of the USAF CT-43A approximately
3 kilometers north of the Dubrovnik Airport in Croatia, 4 April 1996.

[jgraz]

32. Just pathetic

Like your candidate, you will take ZERO responsibility for supporting someone who has been repeatedly proven to be lying. It's simply incredible that you think this is somehow Obama's fault.


Remember when they used to call Obama supporters a cult? :crazy:

[Yael]

39. Maybe that because 90% of the time, when she opens her mouth she IS lying?

[proud2BlibKansan]

43. So it's okay for Hillary to lie and lie again and lie again

After all, no way will the republicans use that against her!

:sarcasm:

[PseudoIntellect]

45. Nice job blaming Obama for Clinton's misinformation.

...even though he had absolutely nothing to do with it. Good plan there.

It's okay for Hillary to lie, lie, lie, but pointing it out is just inexcusable by the other side.

[SOS]

51. What crap?

It's an article in the New York Times and has nothing to do with Obama.

[StevieM]

53. He really is running a Bush vs. Gore campaign against her (eom)

[anigbrowl]

60. No. That's what you're trying to do, and failing.

Clinton mentions this incident in Ohio frequently in her speeches.

Washington Post mentions it in an article. Is the WaPo part of the Obama campaign?
Daily Sentinel in Ohio poicks it up because the story is about Ohio. Are they part of the Obama campaign?
NYT picks it up because it's notable. Is the NYT part of the Obama campaign?

Just where do you say the Obama campaign got involved?

[Zhade]

58. Considering her numerous proven lies, she has no one to blame but herself.

You should really be angry at her for making shit up and expecting you to cover for her.

[anigbrowl]

59. Yeah, the NYT and the hospital should just shut up

Her spokewoman says the campaign was unable to verify the story but decided to run with it anyway because it sounded good. Well, that's just brilliant. Good thing it was just one woman's tragedy and not WMDs. :sarcasm:

[JackORoses]

9. "we did try but were not able to fully vet it"

just another example of the Clinton blab first, ask questions later technique

[dchill]

17. Yes, but let's be clear...

"blab" = lie. She just makes shit up. And she'll take your stuff, too.

[JackORoses]

35. indeed

Lie first, then if necessary, explain away your lie later.

[Muttocracy]

12. there goes her credibility on health care a bit lower...

[Zhade]

63. What credibility? Her planned sop to Big Insurance?

NT!

[Colobo]

13. Another lie?

[Andy823]

15. Sooner or later

All these lies are going to get at least some of her supporters upset with her. You can only take so much BS before you open your eyes and see that this woman is not honest, and will say or do anything to get the job of president, and that's a lot like the guy we already have, and that is not good!

Now maybe her die hard supporters her on DU won't mind more lies, but what about the super delegates? And what about the voters in the remaining states that hear this? I think she is in big trouble, and the more she lies, the worse it gets!

[C_U_L8R]

22. I know a bunch of folks who switched

after the Bosnia lies. They were passionate loyal Clinton people,
but the Bosnia lies tipped them right over the edge. Bald face lying
like that, total confabulation, is an unforgivable offense for most people.

[Andy823]

42. I don't know anyone who

Was supporting her to begin with, except those on the internet. I have heard some claim that they are switching to Obama now, and for many it was the same as you said, the Bosnia lie!

Around my area some used to support Edwards, as I did, but now support Obama, as I now do. Most of them just could not vote for Hillary from the start. Others tried to get behind her, but they just could not find anything they really liked about her.

[Zhade]

64. Why the fuck AREN'T they mad already?

It's not like her lies are hard to prove - the documents and video prove her lying.

[Darth_Kitten]

18. I wanna hear Obama's life story again........

tit for tat.

[Nailzberg]

19. "the Clinton campaign had never contacted the hospital to check the accuracy of the story"

Why start now?

[thewiseguy]

20. Yet another lie...

:puke:

How are we suppose to believe her from now on?

[QC]

24. Because no hospital would lie about sending the poor out to die in the streets.... n/t

[anigbrowl]

61. Especially a not-for-profit hospital. Everyone knows you can't trust them.

Never mind that they probably have all the documentation of her treatment there. After all, doctors and nurses are well known for faking medical records.

[Taxmyth]

25. Obama slime machine

in action.

[Upton]

27. Not interested in addressing the story, huh?

[Taxmyth]

28. Not at all

It is a bullshit story, one dug out of the dregs of the Hillary attack files and completely meaningless. Smear Clinton and you think Obama wins the White House by default? ROFLMFAO. GOP plant.

[Upton]

29. I guess Kos must be in on it too, because here it is

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/4/5/111812/9868

[Taxmyth]

34. Kos sucks

although this place is getting to be quite the same. Still not a lot of positive information about Obama from his supporters. Good luck getting our votes. GOP plant.

[Yael]

40. She has been using this "bullshit story" in her stump speeches for 5 weeks

What does that have to do with Obama?

HINT: Not a thing.

[Zhade]

66. Repeating a lie about a hospital that DIDN'T turn the mother away is meaningless?

Reputations have been tarnished by this falsehood. Is THAT meaningless?

How would you like someone to lie about you and fuck up how people view YOU?

[Taxmyth]

73. So don't vote for Hillary

Doesn't equate to a vote for Obama. If you are tearing apart one candidate and totally ignoring the other in the race then you are either not very bright or a GOP Plant.

[SOS]

52. LOL

The "Obama slime machine" wrote today's edition of the New York Times?

[anigbrowl]

65. Washington Post - Daily Sentinel - NYT - according to you, this is the Obama Slime Machine

Got any evidence to suggest the Obama campaign pushed this story into the headlines?

If you do a search on the woman's name plus 'Obama', all you get is multiple reprints of this blog posting on talkleft.com: http://www.talkleft.com/story/2008/4/5/133021/9712 which complains 'Clinton derangement syndrome' on 'an Obama blog' - daily Kos, where the article simply includes a link to the NYT story.

So now linking to an NYT story constitutes an attack on Hillary Clinton. Of course, if you look at the comments on the talkleft.com link above, apparently the mere existence of Barack Obama is an attack on Hillary Clinton.

Furthermore, the woman's name was NOT released by the hospital. It was mentioned by the Daily Sentinel newspaper in Ohio: http://mydailysentinel.com/articles/2008/04/04/news/news00.txt because her death made the local news at the time.

Looks a lot more like the Clinton damage control machine in action - blame Obama and blame the hospital for a story that the newspapers put together themselves in the course of normal journalism.

[OzarkDem]

30. The hospital needs to prove their story

The source was a sheriff's deputy, who is also reliable. Hospitals are pros at covering up for these kinds of mistakes and screw ups. Rather than accept this as a mistake on Clinton's part, the story needs to be fully investigated.

In this day and age, women supposedly under the care of obstetricians don't just up and die along with their newborns. Something went terribly wrong in the health care provided to this woman.

And while she may or may not have been "insured", demanding cash payment up front for co-pays is a growing practice and could have led to a barrier to timely care. Blaming the patient for their own death, while convenient for the hospital, isn't right and seldom stands up under scrutiny.

[revolve]

36. How can the deputy be reliable

when he doesn't know the name of the hospital and only heard the story from the womans relatives?

[TLM]

48. Never hillary's fault...

"The source was a sheriff's deputy, who is also reliable."


Did Hillary say... "a sheriff's deputy told me a story about a young girl who etc." OR did Hillary say this happened, as if it were a true proven fact?

"Hospitals are pros at covering up for these kinds of mistakes and screw ups."

So you are claiming the hospital DID refuse treatment, and the woman and her infant died because of it, THEN the hospital committed fraud to cover it up?

Where's your proof?


" Rather than accept this as a mistake on Clinton's part, the story needs to be fully investigated."


Hillary lied again... and the story should have been checked out BEFORE she started using it on her stump speech.


Now this lie isn't as bad as her sniper lie, because she knew for a fact that her sniper lie was a 100% fabrication when she told the lie 4 or 5 times, even after being called on it. And like Bill did not back off her lie until irrefutable proof was presented.

This lie, she just didn't bother to validate when she told it, and retold it.

[XOKCowboy]

50. Wake Up! The campaign should have vetted this story..

or never told it. Not only told it but embellished on it at numerous events. This looks very, very bad for the Clinton campaign unless they can show it's true. Otherwise it's the second lie she's been caught telling.

How can you still think she's a credible candidate?

[Zhade]

67. That's not how it works. The burden of proof is on the accuser, not the accused.

That's basic logic. I'm surprised you don't understand that.

[dchill]

72. "cash payment up front" is illegal in Ohio...

and the woman DID have insurance - she was a MANAGER at a Pizza Hut, not a minimum-wage employee.

[TexanDem]

31. If Hillary wants to be credible -- stick to facts or else...

... say this is an example of what can happen. How dangerous could it be for a president to pass off rumors or a lousy memory for facts! The story seems insignificant in itself, but this pattern of behavior could be horrific.

[Zachstar]

37. Everyone PLEASE get this story to the major networks and TV/Radio in PA!!

Its time to expose Clinton!!

[chyjo]

44. Candidates are bound to get confused

when they can't go through a hospital in the USA without encountering SNIPER FIRE!

[Liquorice]

46. This all sounds so familiar...

In 2000, republicans did the exact same thing to Al Gore.

"Again, Al Gore has told a whopper," the Post wrote. "Again, he's been caught red-handed and again, he has been left sputtering and apologizing. This time, he falsely took credit for breaking the Love Canal story. … Yep, another Al Gore bold-faced lie."

The editorial continued: "Al Gore appears to have as much difficulty telling the truth as his boss, Bill Clinton. But Gore's lies are not just false, they're outrageously, stupidly false. It's so easy to determine that he's lying, you have to wonder if he wants to be found out.

"Does he enjoy the embarrassment? Is he hell-bent on destroying his own campaign? … Of course, if Al Gore is determined to turn himself into a national laughingstock, who are we to stand in his way?"

http://www.consortiumnews.com/2000/020100a.html

I'm sickened by this despicable tactic of painting Hillary Clinton as a liar. You don't like her; she is the "opposition" in your mind because you support Obama. That's fine. But there is no reason to go to these lengths and analyze every single word she says for truthfulness and try hard to brand her a liar for political points. It was incredibly brutal when repugs did it to Al Gore, and to me, it's simply beyond the pale for dems to do it to Hillary.

[TLM]

49. Then she should stop lying....

She should stop saying she was under sniper fire, when she was not.

She should stop saying she was instrumental in peace and political processes as first lady, when she was not.

She should stop using emotionally shocking stories to manipulate people, when she hasn't bothered to make the ONE FUCKING PHONE CALL it would take to find out the story wasn't true.

The sad fact is that Hillary is a liar, just like Bill. They are calculating Machiavellian politicians.... and always have been. Gore caught caught in their mess because he made the stupid mistake of trying to emulate their political style.

[Cheap_Trick]

47. did she get a "tear" in her eye

as she spun her web of lies?

[quakerboy]

54. Eh

Ohio already voted. They already counted, so why does it matter?

[Zhade]

68. Lies matter. Liars who want to be president matter.

We already have an illegitimate prez who lies as easily as breathing, we don't need another.

[quakerboy]

71. Yeah,

I can see how that was a little too dry for text. My bad.

on rephrase: Even the states that count don't count now.

[OzarkDem]

56. Update: Hospital is changing their story

Now saying she didn't die there, but they had treated her. She died in a hospital in Columbus, about 75 miles away.

So if she didn't die at their hospital, how can they say they gave her care? If she had insurance, how did she get sent to another hospital 75 miles away?

[Zhade]

69. Any evidence, or are you just making shit up like your candidate does?

NT!

[Zhade]

57. At best she repeated an unconfirmed story that tarnished the hospital workers' reputations.

AT BEST.