Obama loses Florida Clinton wins, NEW Rass Poll McCain 53 Obama 38

[sunonmars]

Obama is in TROUBLE

Clinton 45 to 44 for McCain

Obama 38 McCain 53

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/election_20082/2008_presidential_election/florida/election_2008_florida_presidential_election

The battle over Florida’s convention delegates may be taking its toll on Barack Obama’s prospects in the Sunshine State. For the second time in three months, John McCain enjoys a double digit lead over the Democratic frontrunner.

The latest Rasmussen Reports telephone survey in Florida shows McCain attracting 53% of the vote while Obama earns 38%. Last month, amidst talk of a possible Florida revote, Obama had closed to within single digits of McCain. In February, however, Obama trailed McCain by sixteen points.

If McCain is matched against Hillary Clinton, the race is a toss-up—Clinton 45% McCain 44%.

[GarbagemanLB]

1. Lucky for Obama his GE win doesn't go through Florida. Hillary's does.

[Cameron27]

2. No one's lucky if Obama's the nominee.

He's got so much baggage he should think about hiring a porter.

[GarbagemanLB]

5. and Hillary doesn't? If he requires a porter, she requires a fucking train for her shit.

[NDambi]

13. ha ha...Hillary's campaign is fucked..train or no train, lol she's dead in the political waters

[Cameron27]

18. It sure doesn't look that way now.

We'll see how this primary plays out. :-)

[NDambi]

24. Yeah Keep Hope Alive..lmao...Hilda is fucked..she's done..she ain't gonna be the nominee..and

Hallelujah for that..now she can crawl back into her hole with grab bag hubby Billy Gruff

[Bake]

30. So now it's "Hilda?"

Is that as in, "Hildabeast" or "Hildebeest"? I see you've been listening to Rush reruns again.

Bake

[Lerkfish]

7. its OPPOSITE day!

LOL!

and clinton has no negative baggage....riiiiigh?

[SoonerPride]

10. Well then you better start wokring on helping us out, because he is your nominee

Hillary is fucking toast.

[galloglas]

28. "hiring a porter" ????

You are either (consciously or not) introducing racism into this or have the misfortune to have picked the poorest possible analogy in the English language.

Lemme see, what would that "porter's" name be? "Stepandfetchit"?

The "porter" you just introduced into everyone's mind sure as Hell is not Guinness. You owe an apology to everyone here. If not for malice, then for sheer bad luck.

We're waiting...




edit:spelling

[Cha]

31. Sez you with the BOSNIAN SNIPER LYIN' DODGER

in the avatar.

"Why Hillary’s Lies are Important"

- March 24, 2008, 9:53PM
Hillary Clinton has been caught in a series of lies and misrepresentations during the primary campaign. To some of her supporters, these lies may seem trivial and insignificant and even politics-as-usual. However, please consider the serious impact of these lies by placing them in the context of the past seven years of the Bush Administration and the legacy of expanded executive power that he leaves behind. In particular, consider the dangerous message that the Clinton campaign sends by employing similar tactics to achieve her political goals.

1. The Florida and Michigan Primaries / The Delegate Count
Hillary agreed to honor the DNC’s decision to strip Florida and Michigan of its delegates after their primaries were moved up into January in express violation of the DNC rules. She did not change her position on the validity of these primaries until she found herself unexpectedly behind in the delegate count and desperately needed to claim the delegates that she had won in these unsanctioned contests. As her chances of winning the nomination became increasingly slim in recent weeks, we have been presented with threatening and desperate lines of reasoning for why these primary results should count as is. At the same time, Clinton and her surrogates continue to propose different metrics for determining who should win the nomination even though there is and has been a clearly defined process in place for several decades.

Please think about the implications of changing election rules after the fact. We have suffered through at least one stolen presidential election and the manipulation of untold numbers of Congressional and state elections through various vote tampering and voter intimidation schemes used by the Republicans and their allies. The American people (and especially Democratic voters) have lost faith in the integrity of the election process. The Clinton strategy to continually change the rules for determining the Democratic Party nominee sets a dangerous precedent that could lead to increasingly un-Democratic elections in the future if it is allowed to succeed. If anything, we need more transparency and methods of accountability in our elections in order to repair the damage done in recent years and to restore our confidence in the Government.

2. The Bosnia Fabrication / Exaggerated Experience Claims
Hillary fabricated a story about a dangerous, life-risking visit to Bosnia in order to gain stature as an experienced negotiator in international conflicts and war. While this type of embellishment can seem almost comical, it represents a willingness to distort reality in order to influence the public perception. This is the same type of distortion that the Bush administration used to justify the war in Iraq, although the magnitude of the lie is certainly on a different scale. The Bush administration falsified reports, cherry-picked intelligence, used unreliable sources, and employed fear-mongering tactics to convince the American public that our safety was at risk and as such, you were either with us or with the terrorists. The lies used by President Bush and Vice President Dick Cheney are impeachable offenses and should be condemned by all Americans. Sadly, the Clinton campaign seems to have shown a shocking willingness to employ the same tactics to create a more favorable reality and to rely on divide-and-conquer rhetoric to weaken opposition. Her attempts to frighten the American people by conjuring up 3 AM phone calls are bad enough, but her vote of confidence in John McCain over Barack Obama should be seen as treason against the Democratic Party.

3. NAFTA
Hillary lied about her position on NAFTA and used her lies in a calculated way to influence the Ohio primary. Recently released White House documents confirm that Hillary had been an active proponent of NAFTA prior to its passage, and she has continued to support it publicly in her speeches and memoir. However, while campaigning in Ohio, she claimed to have been privately against NAFTA during the Clinton presidency and believes that it should be rewritten to protect American jobs and workers. This type of maneuvering is reminiscent of the behind-closed-doors policy-making that the Bush administration has used during the past seven years. Specifically, Bush and Cheney have made policy decisions without providing transparency to Congress or the public, and President Bush has repeatedly ignored the rule of law by issuing signing statements and disregarding the parts of the laws that he doesn’t agree with. If we cannot trust Hillary to be truthful about her positions on critical legislative issues now, how can we trust that she will be truthful as president?

These are just three examples that illustrate the concerns we should have with a candidate who demonstrates a sense of entitlement to the nomination and is willing to lie, misrepresent, threaten, and divide in order to obtain the nomination. President Bush and the neoconservative movement have greatly harmed this country by the creation of an imperial-like presidency. This election is not just about whether a Democrat or Republican wins but if the checks and balances are restored to the three branches of government. The framers of the Constitution were in such fear of an imperial president that mechanisms for impeachment are prominently and explicitly included in the Constitution. If Hillary Clinton is willing to use lies and deceit to win the Democratic nomination, what assurances do we have that she will not continue to use them once she is president?
http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/2008/03/why-h ...

<snip>

"Her response to being caught lying to a military audience, when she invented a story about being under sniper fire in Bosnia, was to say it wasn't surprising she got some things wrong, seeing how she spoke millions of words every day. What a magnificent idea, that if you say lots of words some of them are bound to be fantastic lies. So if you listen carefully to horse-racing commentators they say things like "And it's Teddy's Boy still leading three furlongs out as they come up to the fourth last fence with Nip and Tuck two lengths behind by the way I fought a tiger once, punched it clean out and they're all safely over."


<lots more>
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/opinion/article3 ...

"It's not that lying to pad the resume, avoid Indictment or to advance her political fortune is anything new for Hillary Clinton. She famously said she was named after Sir Edmund Hillary (debunked); she told New Yorkers she was a Yankee fan when she lived in Chicago (debunked); she told rural New Yorkers that she was a "duck hunter" (debunked); she claimed that her daughter Chelsea was jogging around the World Trade Center at the time of the 9/11 attack (debunked by Chelsea herself.) And, those subpoenaed Rose Law billing records just happened to show up one day on a hallway table in the most monitored home in America!"

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

[BzaDem]

19. Lucky? Lucky that instead of going through a swing state, it goes through several solidly republican

states?

The delusion about the electoral math on this board is astounding.

[bowens43]

3. meaningless tripe.

we're not in the GE, Obama isn't running against McCain yet.

[dchill]

4. Here's the thing you don't want to discuss.

Obama has yet to campaign in Florida. As the nominee, he will.

[leftofcool]

8. Sure, I'm sorry I didn't want your votes counted in the primary

but please vote for me anyway

[Cameron27]

9. Obama ran campaign ads in FL,

he did more campaigning there than HRC.

[Texas Hill Country]

27. they were national ads, but yes, they ran in FL... no other candidates ads did.

[goldcanyonaz]

6. Clinton hasn't even campaigned there either.

:woohoo:

[MattNC]

11. No

but she was already a known quantity there. All Floridians have gotten from Barack is news coverage. It's well established how much his polling improves after he spends notable time in a state. Still, I doubt he wins Florida. Hillary indeed gives us a better shot there, but I still see it going red again.

[goldcanyonaz]

17. He's very well known now and should be polling much better.

[NDambi]

12. Hillary will not be the nominee..post all the polls you want..she's over like

Michael Jackson..and shant return to winning form. She's made her last hit record...the people have spoken and they don't want her as the nominee..or she'd be leading..

[indimuse]

14. K&R!!

Go HIllary!! :woohoo:
:applause:
:woohoo:
:applause:
:woohoo:
:applause:
:woohoo:
:applause:

[BeyondGeography]

15. Helps her make up for being 9 points down in Michigan, where Obama's winning

[CreekDog]

16. actually 45-44 is not a win

statistics are a tricky thing. (the MOE thingy matters)

[sunonmars]

21. looks a hell of a lot better than 53 - 38

[CreekDog]

26. true in that one state

what about all the others?

[BzaDem]

23. Um, it is within the MOE. Obama is far out of the MOE. And McCain already gets 53% with Obama.

Obama could get ALL the undecideds in Florida and still lose 53-47, outside the MOE.

Statistics are tricky things.

[CreekDog]

25. okay since you are looking at the bigger picture

then what about all the other states? when all states are considered, who on balance is ahead?

[Maribelle]

20. I'm surprised Obama is getting as high as 38% - - it must be up in northern Florida

I cannot tell you how many democrats I know here in the southern part of the state that are so angry at Obama, Dean, Brazile and the DNC - - mostly all of them.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

22. FL is full of old bigots. Who knew?

:eyes:

[DemGa]

29. Holy crap, Obama's getting pummeled!!

[BlueIdaho]

32. Repeat after me...

The general election is in NOVEMBER. These polls mean NOTHING. I would say the same for HRC or Obama.